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Gender discrimination in guilds
Slowpacedplayer
Member CommonPosts: 20
Lately I've seen a few female-only guilds in the games I play, and for some reason this was bugging me - I didn't feel it was the right attitude to have towards other players.
I'm not talking about ingame character gender, but the real life gender of the player.
I've known about male-only guilds for a long time, and I didn't really like them, something seemed not right about it to me. So I never joined one.
The reason guilds have been for guys only has been explained with it being the best solution to avoid guild drama due when a girl joins the guild, - the guys start drooling at the girl instead of the endgame loot and the guildmaster (he's ofc male) tears his hair out because of the lack of focus from the members and potential jealousy between them.
This seems like a somewhat valid reason, but it really isn't.
And female-only guilds refuse all males because they want to have a sanctuary from pestering guys, sexual harrasment and all of that. Perhaps being able to talk about whatever they like without getting complaints from guys.
Again seems perfectly understandable, but again the handling of it is wrong.
If we are to have really good guilds to be in, they can't discriminate against real life gender. And to do that we have to look at what's really causing the problems, and that means looking at each individual that gets invited or are already in the guild.
For guilds that find it problematic that girls join, they have to look at the attitudes and behaviour of those that start making drama of a girl being in the guild. Although it could ofc be the girl herself, I bet it would in most cases be a bunch of the guys in that guild that can't cope with having a girl there, and hence they should be the ones to go, not the girl.
Same applies to female only guilds, the one who is actually causing the trouble should be the one that has to leave, not the target of the drama so to speak. If a guy behaves badly they have to leave, but to refuse all guys because of some guys being jerks seems unreasonable to me.
And it could of course be that, theoretically, a guy becomes the target of some drama, while the ones causing it are a bunch of girls. That could also happen, for whatever reason.
So what I want to say is that I don't want to have anything to do with neither male- nor female-only guilds, because it shows a lack of leadership responsibility not to deal with the individuals that aren't actually behaving as they should in a guild, while the ones being invited haven't done anything wrong. (ofc it could be that both parts are misbehaving and then they both have to go).
Hence I would suggest that players boycott those kind of guilds. We don't need more discrimination in the world than what we already have, that's the way I see it anyway.
Comments
I self identify as a monkey.
I haven't seen male/female-only guilds alot, but I've seen them a few times advertising here and there.
But just because the actual guilds aren't a majority, the attitudes linked to them are there all over the place. There's already another thread where OP is a female trying to handle different attention from males.
What I'm saying is there needs to be some attitude change, from the people that think excluding a certain gender will solve the problem, and a heads up to those who don't know what to make of these attitudes and behavior.
The question comes down to though -- are you talking all female characters // male characters? For roleplaying reasons there could certainly be guilds like that in games... OR are you talking all female or male players behind the characters (which is something completely different).
I think the latter is against the rules, or should be.
Wasn't really the woman's fault in every case, but the leadership valued the playing skills of male players more.
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That's just the nature of the beast. There's a reason that the stereotype of the average mmo player is an awkward, nerdy, usually pale skinned loser who has had little interaction with women. Not saying everyone is but I've met more fitting that description than not. Gaming is still a wholly male dominated hobby no matter what people say about women making half the population of game players (phone games don't count). Problem is that the few women that DO play these games tend to belong to one of two groups, either they want attention or they want to be left alone, either way they *are* going to get attention and a lot of it. It's unfortunate but that's just what the environment creates.
That's how it's always been, 20 years ago it was no different and in 20 more it will be the same.
it's quite common to form small groups and go by "us vs them" mentality so it's not surprising finding such guilds forming now that mmo's are mainstream and the player base has grown.
to me it's no different than all gay guilds or those that have language and nationality restrictions.
whatever floats your boat.
I had fun once, it was terrible.
None of the bleeding-edge guilds I was ever in allowed females in the raiding party. It was pretty common at higher level play for probably the first decade of MMO gaming, especially WoW. If I ever saw them in EQ they were clerics.
The social rift between children and adults was already a hassle in most games, adding ladies to the mix created chaos.
I have had the pleasure of having many female gamers in the guilds I have been in. Some were very good and some were very bad. Some were drama queens and others not so much.
This can be said for male gamers as well.
It doesn't matter if your male or female, good is good and bad is worse.
Pull your own weight, don't cause drama and boob pics never hurt jk
not really.
Lets see your Battle Stations /r/battlestations
Battle Station
We spend too much time trying to tell other people what they should believe and then trying to punish them for not believing in a politically correct manner.
If someone wants to have a Guild that consists of guys named John that are all born on June 20th... well.. good for them. Crying about who someone else wants to group with is just.... sad.
If a group of females want to have a female only guild called Valkyries... good for them.
Guilds are not necessarily meant to be some all-inclusive group. If they were, why would they exist if everyone on the server was in it? Guilds function to set you APART from the rest of the server. To say " THIS IS US". Trying to control who people identify with is just... sad.
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This is just a rider on the other gender thread, trying to create drama where there isn't much to be had.
These are not the droids you are looking for, move along.
People find what they go looking for.
All-male groups of any kind are sexist, disgusting, and should be prohibited completely.
All-female groups on the other hand, are a step toward equality and women's empowerment.
Or at least, that's what the mainstream media tells us these days.
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I don't really see the problem with this. There are schools that have all male or all female students. Often those students due better because they don't have the distraction of sex to worry about at a young age.
I'm not sure why integration should be forced. It's up to the people playing the game. As long as they don't bother other people by harassing them what does it matter?
Can't say I have seen such guilds in my mmo time, but again having seen first hand how females tend to get harassed I am not surprised that some players would create "female only" guilds.
It's not any more unreasonable than say "Greeks only" guilds or "Italians only" or w/e else. People create guilds to get stuff done and feel comfortable playing a mmo after all.
If someone is being bothered by such guilds, I think it's more to do with the sense of entitlement we all have at times.
srsly lol
My guilds were usually too hardcore for that
Like we'd care if get pwned by a woman or man, only motivates me to get you back next time xD
Nohting like a woman taking on three guys and seeing them cry tho
Well that sucks OP
Sway all day, butterfly flaps all the way!
As I said in the first post, I'm not talking about ingame character gender - in other words the gender of your game avatar-, but the real life gender of the player.
Yes it could be against the rules in some games, but in general I'd like to give a heads up to the entire gaming community that this attitude of excluding people that haven't necessarily done anything wrong isn't the kind of guilds that should get any support.
And yet you are trying to tell people what to do...oh the irony...
There is nothing that can change the fact that if a guild based on a certain gender wants to exclude completely the opposite gender, it is discriminating for no valid reason, by blaming someone for their gender rather than their behaviour.
And you're answer can be seen as a well known way of attempting to silence a subject that by the look of the comments in this thread is highly active...
Well I for one wasn't even looking for a guild, because these girls were spamming in the general chat. But hey, you found this thread?
Do they do better in life as well? How are their social skills? What are their views of the other gender?
I question wether they atually do better, and if they do, should women wear burka so as not to distract men? But I think we're getting off-topic a little bit though...
The problem is that people that haven't done anythig wrong gets kicked out or excluded from a guild solely because of their gender. That's not the kind of guilds or attitude I want to support.
Well language restricted guilds are understandable, because if you can't communicate in that language, there isn't any point in being in the guild, although it's possible to an extent.
But gender doesn't have to affect your gaming whatsoever, so that's an unreasonable requirement for a guild.
I care about it, just like a care about a guild not being allowed to be racist.And no it's definitely not just their own business, because it affects the gaming community, it discrimininates people. And THAT'S a PERIOD!
If discrimination is in the game then it's there, to pretend it isn't is being naive. Or perhaps being accepting of it.
And the rest of the crap you wrote is just an attempt to derail the thread.
Hi!
Guilds are not necessarily meant to be some all-inclusive group. If they were, why would they exist if everyone on the server was in it? Guilds function to set you APART from the rest of the server. To say " THIS IS US". Trying to control who people identify with is just... sad.
If you want to make a guild with open recruiting knock yourself out!
If someone else wants to recruit people who's name begins with J... LET THEM
If someone else wants to recruit only people that are unemployed... Go for it!
Stop trying to control who OTHER people can game with.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Not quite sure what youre talking about there.... PvP? I have no idea of the gender of those players I've PvP'ed with in mmorpg's, so if that's what you meant you missed the target.
I'm not controlling who you game with, you have the freedom to choose witch guild you want to join, and if you want to join one in the first place.
The guild has the freedom to let you into the guild if they want to.
What I'm saying is, they shouldn't be allowed to discriminate based on gender. That doesn't force you to play with anyone anymore than in a male/female-only guild.
Stop trying to DEFEND people EXCLUDING others based on GENDER.
I will DEFEND EXCLUDING anyone that they WANT to exclude. The whole PURPOSE of a guild is to EXCLUDE others. You seems to struggle with that concept with delusions of having to control and judge the thoughts who who OTHER people should game with. A guild, by DEFINITION.. is exclusionary.
This is seriously one of the most ridiculous threads in recent times... A large part of me thinks it's simply a troll attempt and if so, bravo Sir... bravo.
If not....
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
I can understand the female only guilds, to be honest do female gamers have a hard time in certain games and that they want to avoid that is not really a problem to me.
The guild I lead will never do that (or I will fire the butt of anyone doing as fast I I can press the "kick" button, peoples sex, political ideas, sexuality or religion is none of our business as long as they don't bring it up by themeselves.
But I wont complain about what other guilds do as long as it isn't rascist or actually discriminating. If you don' want males or females in your guild it is your loss, if they are good players and nice people point them in my direction instead.