You know, I'm starting to get sick of the "large complex game" excuse as well. Bethesda has been making these large complex games for years. I don't have a list but many of the bugs can also be directly found in previous games like FO3 and Skyrim. FIX IT.
So what's the solution? Make it smaller and simpler and easier to debug? Expand the QA pool and get even more leaks?
Releasing any ambitious complex game is always a balancing act - there will be bugs in ALL of them. It's perfectly legit to be more bothered or less bothered by them depending on how we feel about the whole experience. Are we having a great time? well then it's "bugs schmugs." Are we having a meh time? "Those damn bugs!" That's just human nature.
It's not making excuses when you know damn well, for a fact, that, especially at release, there will be many bugs in any complex game you play and you find yourself having fun anyway. People who are hypersensitive to bugs should really just never play anything until several weeks/months later
Horrible excuse considering other open world titles don't have anywhere near the bugs Bethesda games have. For freaking sake the Witcher 3 was WAY bigger in scope and world size than Fallout 4 and even it had less bugs at launch (not to mention CD Projekt was quick to patch most of the bugs while Bethesda leans back on modders and expects them to fix their game).
The author of this article is sadly correct-there are way too many apologists when it comes to Bethesda titles. Really quite sad.
As to W3 being bigger in scope... that would be why I asked if you'd played either. That's just pure nonsense.
I've played them both, like them both... and they both had a good chunk of bugs at release. Got any other examples of bug-free open world titles?
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
So what's the solution? Make it smaller and simpler and easier to debug? Expand the QA pool and get even more leaks?
Releasing any ambitious complex game is always a balancing act - there will be bugs in ALL of them. It's perfectly legit to be more bothered or less bothered by them depending on how we feel about the whole experience. Are we having a great time? well then it's "bugs schmugs." Are we having a meh time? "Those damn bugs!" That's just human nature.
It's not making excuses when you know damn well, for a fact, that, especially at release, there will be many bugs in any complex game you play and you find yourself having fun anyway. People who are hypersensitive to bugs should really just never play anything until several weeks/months later
Horrible excuse considering other open world titles don't have anywhere near the bugs Bethesda games have. For freaking sake the Witcher 3 was WAY bigger in scope and world size than Fallout 4 and even it had less bugs at launch (not to mention CD Projekt was quick to patch most of the bugs while Bethesda leans back on modders and expects them to fix their game).
The author of this article is sadly correct-there are way too many apologists when it comes to Bethesda titles. Really quite sad.
And which open world titles are you referring to? Witcher 3 you say? There are quite a few bugs there. In some cases a lot. I'll agree Bethesda is a bit sucky at patching bugs but I can't recall an open world game that didn't have a lot of bugs.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
But in this day and age you are supposed to ignore the bugs and just praise the games. This way developers learn that they can put out buggy, non-working crap and people will still pay a ton of money for it.
I agree that a lot of the bugs should have been fixed BEFORE the game came out, let's hope it doesn't take years to fix them.
What drives me crazy is that I play games like this, have no meaningful bugs, and I see people screaming about why it's a terrible bug filled mess. Other games really do have a lot of bugs. People seem to howl about them whether they are common or not. This is far, far better than New Vegas, and people appear to have no actual sense of proportion.
@ Christopher Coke, excellent article, well written, and as a fan of the fallout series, I too am sick and tired of all the bugs and issues. On a side note I loved how the second comment to your article drove home the point you were making, and NO I do not expect this kind of sloppiness for the money I am paying for this game.
The only solution I see (not going to add to the "problems" list...its sufficiently covered) is simple: DO NOT BUY AAA TITLES ON RELEASE DAY from these 4-5 mega-dev production companies. We know who they are. After my last good burn from buying a nigh-unplayable Dragon Age: Inquisition, which remained so for nearly a month, I have sworn off release day purchases. And from the issues with almost every ultra-hyped AAA titlereleased lately, I am happy with my decision. This can only be fought with our wallets my friends, and if we continue to gobble up their half-finished works like crack whores after a good working night....we have only ourselves to blame.
VIVA LA RESISTANCE!!!! Release-Day Abstinence Syndicate (RAS) now forming!!!
I have long considered Bethesda games anything but spectacular but bugs could never be as bad as SOE.IMO SOE has carried the torch as worst polished game developer of all time year after year.
Want to know the real hilarious thing about game releases?There is a trend that developers are charging MORE to get into these early access unfinished games ..lmao.So you pay more for bugs and less for polish,,makes perfect sense to me. lol.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
The only solution I see (not going to add to the "problems" list...its sufficiently covered) is simple: DO NOT BUY AAA TITLES ON RELEASE DAY from these 4-5 mega-dev production companies. We know who they are. After my last good burn from buying a nigh-unplayable Dragon Age: Inquisition, which remained so for nearly a month, I have sworn off release day purchases. And from the issues with almost every ultra-hyped AAA titlereleased lately, I am happy with my decision. This can only be fought with our wallets my friends, and if we continue to gobble up their half-finished works like crack whores after a good working night....we have only ourselves to blame.
VIVA LA RESISTANCE!!!! Release-Day Abstinence Syndicate (RAS) now forming!!!
I think this really depends on one's temperament.
I (and it seems others) tend to roll with the punches as far as bugs are concerned. Remember, it's not a big deal if it's "not a big deal".
Still, others have less patience for such things. So just know yourself and plan accordingly.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Actually I've been playing the game since launch almost non stop and I have to say I have yet to come across a single bug in the game yet. Though I have a pretty beefy rig and did prepare for launch. i7 6700k with GTX 980 32 gigs of 2133 megahertz DDR4 ram Windows 10 and etc. With that I updated to Nvidias game ready drivers and preloaded the game. On launch day at 12:01am game launched with out an issue and I haven't run into one yet. Excellent job Bethesda, I think this is the first game you've launched that has caused me no issues, at least as of yet.
The only bug that had any effect on gameplay for me in 20hours of play was when one of my settlers ended up on the roof of a house... The Brahmin also ended up on top of the same house which was very annoying because it kept mooing and making foot steps as it walked in place on the roof.
This became a mini game in its own though trying to figure out how to get them down without using console commands. This was my introduction into the building system since I had to make a wooden ladder to get them down.
Good solution! I would have been tempted to just shoot them both or recycle the roof and let them fall.
Haha, that was my first solution. Originally the Brahmin got stuck up there so I decided to blow him up... The rest of my settlers were not so happy about this and started attacking me -.-
From what I understand this is caused by having their beds too close to walls. I saw this on a Twitch stream and placed my beds with enough room on both sides and walk space to get to them and haven't had the problem yet.
With the brahmin I don't know. Check to see if you have a feeding trough too close to a wall maybe? I did notice one of my brahmin mooing and walking into a wall and that was with the trough about 10ft from a wall. They may need more room to wander/path.
The issue with Bethesda isn't that their games have bugs. It's that they do nothing about them and rest on their laurels with a "Screw it" attitude believing we (the consumer) will re-code their game.
Bethesda should fix bugs, modders should mod. They should be ashamed that we have to make their game actually function.
Arthmoor just released his Unofficial Skyrim Legendary Edition Patch.
This mod should NEVER need to exist beyond some of the few design improvements it adds.
Here is the problem as I see it. This "Bug" problem exist across many fields. An Engineer looks at old or someone else's work and can't make heads to tails of it. Their first and possible only solution, is to scrap the old work and start from scratch. To their manager that old work has value, it cost money and scraping it would be a waste of that money, time and effort.
So "Bugs" remain, simply because they are paid for. I wanted to show this as an example of how complex a solution can be.
Bug: 2 + 2 = 5
Solution: 2 x 3 = 6
Why? Because 2 + 3 = 5, and more often the operation is multiplication.
Pardon any spelling errors
Konfess your cyns and some maybe forgiven Boy: Why can't I talk to Him? Mom: We don't talk to Priests. As if it could exist, without being payed for. F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing. Even telemarketers wouldn't think that. It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
Actually I've been playing the game since launch almost non stop and I have to say I have yet to come across a single bug in the game yet. Though I have a pretty beefy rig and did prepare for launch. i7 6700k with GTX 980 32 gigs of 2133 megahertz DDR4 ram Windows 10 and etc. With that I updated to Nvidias game ready drivers and preloaded the game. On launch day at 12:01am game launched with out an issue and I haven't run into one yet. Excellent job Bethesda, I think this is the first game you've launched that has caused me no issues, at least as of yet.
There are gameplay bugs i can reproduce regardless of system spec.
So we are not talking about graphics glitches.
I can break the main quest line at will as soon as you leave sanctuary - just one example. I've submitted this bug already.
The first power armor fight has a game breaking bug as well (boss fails to spawn) - 100% reproducible, again submitted the bug.
Brotherhood of Steel line has a hilarious exploit if you have a specific perk.
Boss fights made completely trivial with a melee bug.
Terrain bugs and pathing are everywhere
None of this has to do with client machine specs.
The game is full of bugs - save often is my suggestion
Well hopefully my luck holds out, I've encountered zero bugs as of yet, which has made me a happy camper. But I'll leave this discussion to you guys having issues, Wanted to share my experience which is a much better launch experience than in previous Bethesda titles. Good luck to you, hope your issues get resolved!
I should make note that bugs don't bother me all that much,only time i ever gort pissed was doing the best Wow quests in one their expansions and 3 of them could not be finished,so i felt like i wasted hours of my time.However as i said aside from that aspect ,small bugs do not bother me, put far mroe weight on a quality game design than a few or even several bugs.
To me it is simple math... crap+polish=wonderful looking crap great+bugs=growing pains
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
The issue with Bethesda isn't that their games have bugs. It's that they do nothing about them and rest on their laurels with a "Screw it" attitude believing we (the consumer) will re-code their game.
Bethesda should fix bugs, modders should mod. They should be ashamed that we have to make their game actually function.
Arthmoor just released his Unofficial Skyrim Legendary Edition Patch.
This mod should NEVER need to exist beyond some of the few design improvements it adds.
I was just thinking about this, im not going to give a pass to them this time. I mean, if in a years time you have to DL "unofficial community patch" that resloves 5 pages of game problems.......
Zenimax had this "great" idea for paying for mods for skyrim. Well, i have much better idea: take that pile of money and give some to people who actually fix your mess and shape your game to pearl that it is after you install crapload of community fixes and mods.
Games which release bug-free and without major issues are the rare exception. So what is a gamer to do? Learn patience, and assume that every game will be bugged and require weeks if not months of actual use in the wild before even the most major problems get ironed out. With online games games this is even more true as abnormal levels of user activity are almost guaranteed to cause technical and network issues during the initial launch. I do not blame companies for these shortcomings as it is simply a limitation of current technology and industry practices. With the prevailing use of early access and higher amounts of public testing these things are changing, however even with early access you need to treat it for what it is, an unfinished product that may if everything goes well one day launch bug free and without major issues.
Eurogamer made some decent comments about how there's so much pressure in the games industry because of i) Bethesda and ii) Fallout, that sites feel obliged to be all 'omg 10/10 amazing!' despite massive bugs and various short-comings.
Comments
What are your other Hobbies?
Gaming is Dirt Cheap compared to this...
As to W3 being bigger in scope... that would be why I asked if you'd played either. That's just pure nonsense.
I've played them both, like them both... and they both had a good chunk of bugs at release. Got any other examples of bug-free open world titles?
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
거북이는 목을 내밀 때 안 움직입니다
Co-Founder of Elder Moot
SotA Founder
Want to know the real hilarious thing about game releases?There is a trend that developers are charging MORE to get into these early access unfinished games ..lmao.So you pay more for bugs and less for polish,,makes perfect sense to me. lol.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
I (and it seems others) tend to roll with the punches as far as bugs are concerned. Remember, it's not a big deal if it's "not a big deal".
Still, others have less patience for such things. So just know yourself and plan accordingly.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
I do see a lot of roaches if that is what you mean by bugs.
Seriously. There are some glitches but there is NOTHING out there like this! This is exactly what I wanted to make myself. Build, craft and adventure.
Only thing I wish was it was Medieval theme
but wtf ppl going to bitch and bitch and bitch and bitch.
If you are interested in making a MMO maybe visit my page to get a free open source engine.
With the brahmin I don't know. Check to see if you have a feeding trough too close to a wall maybe? I did notice one of my brahmin mooing and walking into a wall and that was with the trough about 10ft from a wall. They may need more room to wander/path.
Bethesda should fix bugs, modders should mod. They should be ashamed that we have to make their game actually function.
Arthmoor just released his Unofficial Skyrim Legendary Edition Patch.
This mod should NEVER need to exist beyond some of the few design improvements it adds.
So "Bugs" remain, simply because they are paid for. I wanted to show this as an example of how complex a solution can be.
Bug: 2 + 2 = 5
Solution: 2 x 3 = 6
Why? Because 2 + 3 = 5, and more often the operation is multiplication.
Boy: Why can't I talk to Him?
Mom: We don't talk to Priests.
As if it could exist, without being payed for.
F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing.
Even telemarketers wouldn't think that.
It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
To me it is simple math...
crap+polish=wonderful looking crap
great+bugs=growing pains
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.