The assumption is always made that the 4-5M players currently involved in WoW are somehow less significant than those who might like to see vanilla servers.
Srsly are you guys get payed for that ?
That whole thing dont make any sense...
I dont play WoW and never have or will, but i totally understand WHY some ppl would rather play the "old" WoW then the new one, even if it would be MILES better.
Its just simply the game they enjoy more, and with the Numbers WoW had in the beginning, that will be more ppl then most ppl think they are.
And most important, some of this ppl wont play Wow like it is now, and IF Blizzard would just do 1-2 "Vanilla "servers, that are easy to maintain/serve, they would get all that money they other wise would not get.
To think they would LOSE ANYTHING, is just stupid, and so far from the reality, its not even funny, and brings me back to the Question, are you Guys get payed for this ?
I'm wondering the same thing. Looks like someone gets a kick back from standing there ground against this. The same assumption is made that the 10-15M players that were involved in earlier WoW somehow became less signigicant to their entire business operation. I was a paying customer on the forums long before my voice ended up on this end of the fight. This didn't swing me to the other side, it just makes me more aware of how important my money is to Blizzard. I'll just give it to another gaming company. If the earlier 10M wasn't important what makes you think your little 5M is more important.
Sedated, I'm sorry but I want to be sure I'm not misunderstanding you.
Are you arguing that if Blizzard put up so called "Vanilla WoW" servers that their subscription numbers would return to 10 to 15 million as they were when the game was first released? Are you arguing that 5 to 10 million people have quit playing WoW because of the expansions? So is the argument that expanding the game is inherently "bad" and will automatically cause a drop in subscriptions so, therefore, every time a game is expanded new servers should be added that do not contain the expanded content to prevent the loss of players?
If you are then I don't agree with you. I watched Mythic put up so called "Classic" Dark Age of Camelot servers in an attempt to appease all the people who allegedly quit that game over the Trials of Atlantis server. (In the interest of honesty I was one of the players who claimed that until I realized the real reason I quit was I no longer had giant chunks of time to spend in game like I had before my wife and I had kids and I opened my own business.) Everyone swore the new servers would restore the subscription base because they all knew people who would "resub if we had classic servers".
So the Classic Servers opened to much fanfare. The classic servers did get a few older players to go back for a bit, but mainly the servers just split an already shrinking player base even more. After two or three months the newness wore off and numbers dropped again and a few of the current players went away with the "come back" players. In retrospect I'd say it hastened the game towards it's current state of one merged server housing the remaining active accounts. Based on that experience I can't imagine that opening Vanilla WoW servers will cause people who quit WoW to resub in significant numbers for any significant time.
Based on Nostralrius numbers I'd say the best Blizzard can hope for by opening Vanilla WoW servers is a 100,000 player bump in subscriptions. That would be a 2% bump in their 5 million player current subscription base. That is the actual number of people who availed themselves of the "Vanilla WoW" option and they did so in an environment where the "Vanilla WoW" was free. This includes the assumption that every single person who played Nostralrius would resub to pay to play Vanilla WoW servers. I don't think those are numbers that would attract Blizzard's attention.
If that's not what your saying then I misunderstood and I apologize.
I will point out that the Pink Elephant in this discussion is that it seems that we gamers scream for new content until we quit the game and then immediately point to the new content as the reason we quit. So new content is great until we quit because that content ruined the game.
Maybe that Blizzard employee wasn't so wrong in telling us what we didn't really want.
No I'm not saying that, as I opened with, is this site getting kick backs to stand its ground? Just referencing this magical 5M or so that remain in game as if they hold more relevance to things. What about the 10M that left complaints before they quit supporting the game? What makes one group of gamers more important than another? Absolutely nothing. Which is why this is two entirely different markets now. Blizz has themselves to thank for that.
Happily playing Vanilla and BC WoW, again, since September 2016.
The assumption is always made that the 4-5M players currently involved in WoW are somehow less significant than those who might like to see vanilla servers.
Srsly are you guys get payed for that ?
That whole thing dont make any sense...
I dont play WoW and never have or will, but i totally understand WHY some ppl would rather play the "old" WoW then the new one, even if it would be MILES better.
Its just simply the game they enjoy more, and with the Numbers WoW had in the beginning, that will be more ppl then most ppl think they are.
And most important, some of this ppl wont play Wow like it is now, and IF Blizzard would just do 1-2 "Vanilla "servers, that are easy to maintain/serve, they would get all that money they other wise would not get.
To think they would LOSE ANYTHING, is just stupid, and so far from the reality, its not even funny, and brings me back to the Question, are you Guys get payed for this ?
I'm wondering the same thing. Looks like someone gets a kick back from standing there ground against this. The same assumption is made that the 10-15M players that were involved in earlier WoW somehow became less signigicant to their entire business operation. I was a paying customer on the forums long before my voice ended up on this end of the fight. This didn't swing me to the other side, it just makes me more aware of how important my money is to Blizzard. I'll just give it to another gaming company. If the earlier 10M wasn't important what makes you think your little 5M is more important.
Sedated, I'm sorry but I want to be sure I'm not misunderstanding you.
Are you arguing that if Blizzard put up so called "Vanilla WoW" servers that their subscription numbers would return to 10 to 15 million as they were when the game was first released? Are you arguing that 5 to 10 million people have quit playing WoW because of the expansions? So is the argument that expanding the game is inherently "bad" and will automatically cause a drop in subscriptions so, therefore, every time a game is expanded new servers should be added that do not contain the expanded content to prevent the loss of players?
If you are then I don't agree with you. I watched Mythic put up so called "Classic" Dark Age of Camelot servers in an attempt to appease all the people who allegedly quit that game over the Trials of Atlantis server. (In the interest of honesty I was one of the players who claimed that until I realized the real reason I quit was I no longer had giant chunks of time to spend in game like I had before my wife and I had kids and I opened my own business.) Everyone swore the new servers would restore the subscription base because they all knew people who would "resub if we had classic servers".
So the Classic Servers opened to much fanfare. The classic servers did get a few older players to go back for a bit, but mainly the servers just split an already shrinking player base even more. After two or three months the newness wore off and numbers dropped again and a few of the current players went away with the "come back" players. In retrospect I'd say it hastened the game towards it's current state of one merged server housing the remaining active accounts. Based on that experience I can't imagine that opening Vanilla WoW servers will cause people who quit WoW to resub in significant numbers for any significant time.
Based on Nostralrius numbers I'd say the best Blizzard can hope for by opening Vanilla WoW servers is a 100,000 player bump in subscriptions. That would be a 2% bump in their 5 million player current subscription base. That is the actual number of people who availed themselves of the "Vanilla WoW" option and they did so in an environment where the "Vanilla WoW" was free. This includes the assumption that every single person who played Nostralrius would resub to pay to play Vanilla WoW servers. I don't think those are numbers that would attract Blizzard's attention.
If that's not what your saying then I misunderstood and I apologize.
I will point out that the Pink Elephant in this discussion is that it seems that we gamers scream for new content until we quit the game and then immediately point to the new content as the reason we quit. So new content is great until we quit because that content ruined the game.
Maybe that Blizzard employee wasn't so wrong in telling us what we didn't really want.
No I'm not saying that, as I opened with, is this site getting kick backs to stand its ground? Just referencing this magical 5M or so that remain in game as if they hold more relevance to things. What about the 10M that left complaints before they quit supporting the game? What makes one group of gamers more important than another? Absolutely nothing. Which is why this is two entirely different markets now. Blizz has themselves to thank for that.
one group is actually paying Blizz/Act ...........the other isnt ...............
The assumption is always made that the 4-5M players currently involved in WoW are somehow less significant than those who might like to see vanilla servers.
Srsly are you guys get payed for that ?
That whole thing dont make any sense...
I dont play WoW and never have or will, but i totally understand WHY some ppl would rather play the "old" WoW then the new one, even if it would be MILES better.
Its just simply the game they enjoy more, and with the Numbers WoW had in the beginning, that will be more ppl then most ppl think they are.
And most important, some of this ppl wont play Wow like it is now, and IF Blizzard would just do 1-2 "Vanilla "servers, that are easy to maintain/serve, they would get all that money they other wise would not get.
To think they would LOSE ANYTHING, is just stupid, and so far from the reality, its not even funny, and brings me back to the Question, are you Guys get payed for this ?
I'm wondering the same thing. Looks like someone gets a kick back from standing there ground against this. The same assumption is made that the 10-15M players that were involved in earlier WoW somehow became less signigicant to their entire business operation. I was a paying customer on the forums long before my voice ended up on this end of the fight. This didn't swing me to the other side, it just makes me more aware of how important my money is to Blizzard. I'll just give it to another gaming company. If the earlier 10M wasn't important what makes you think your little 5M is more important.
Sedated, I'm sorry but I want to be sure I'm not misunderstanding you.
Are you arguing that if Blizzard put up so called "Vanilla WoW" servers that their subscription numbers would return to 10 to 15 million as they were when the game was first released? Are you arguing that 5 to 10 million people have quit playing WoW because of the expansions? So is the argument that expanding the game is inherently "bad" and will automatically cause a drop in subscriptions so, therefore, every time a game is expanded new servers should be added that do not contain the expanded content to prevent the loss of players?
If you are then I don't agree with you. I watched Mythic put up so called "Classic" Dark Age of Camelot servers in an attempt to appease all the people who allegedly quit that game over the Trials of Atlantis server. (In the interest of honesty I was one of the players who claimed that until I realized the real reason I quit was I no longer had giant chunks of time to spend in game like I had before my wife and I had kids and I opened my own business.) Everyone swore the new servers would restore the subscription base because they all knew people who would "resub if we had classic servers".
So the Classic Servers opened to much fanfare. The classic servers did get a few older players to go back for a bit, but mainly the servers just split an already shrinking player base even more. After two or three months the newness wore off and numbers dropped again and a few of the current players went away with the "come back" players. In retrospect I'd say it hastened the game towards it's current state of one merged server housing the remaining active accounts. Based on that experience I can't imagine that opening Vanilla WoW servers will cause people who quit WoW to resub in significant numbers for any significant time.
Based on Nostralrius numbers I'd say the best Blizzard can hope for by opening Vanilla WoW servers is a 100,000 player bump in subscriptions. That would be a 2% bump in their 5 million player current subscription base. That is the actual number of people who availed themselves of the "Vanilla WoW" option and they did so in an environment where the "Vanilla WoW" was free. This includes the assumption that every single person who played Nostralrius would resub to pay to play Vanilla WoW servers. I don't think those are numbers that would attract Blizzard's attention.
If that's not what your saying then I misunderstood and I apologize.
I will point out that the Pink Elephant in this discussion is that it seems that we gamers scream for new content until we quit the game and then immediately point to the new content as the reason we quit. So new content is great until we quit because that content ruined the game.
Maybe that Blizzard employee wasn't so wrong in telling us what we didn't really want.
No I'm not saying that, as I opened with, is this site getting kick backs to stand its ground? Just referencing this magical 5M or so that remain in game as if they hold more relevance to things. What about the 10M that left complaints before they quit supporting the game? What makes one group of gamers more important than another? Absolutely nothing. Which is why this is two entirely different markets now. Blizz has themselves to thank for that.
one group is actually paying Blizz/Act ...........the other isnt ...............
I'd be willing to bet gaming companies are just as interested in what made gamers quit paying them as they are in what makes others continue to pay them.
You CAN'T play the original WoW on the retail servers... they completely changed the world, the quests, the mechanics... nothing but name remains of the former. That is the issue.
And it is not your place or any other person's place to steal their ideas with regard to World of Warcraft. The right to how the game is today is only in the hands of one group: Blizzard. It isBlizzard's right to do what they will with their property. It is no one else's.
Even giving a big long mile here and assuming that these people "coded
their own version of vanilla" (and that really tests the bounds of
credulity), nothing else belongs to them -- not the NPCs, not the
quests, not the creatures in the bestiary, not even Azeroth itself.
That, in a nutshell, is theft of intellectual property.
MMOs are not meant to stay static entities. They are designed to move forward. Vanilla's time is over as far as Blizzard is concerned, at least for the time being. Blizzard is not going to tackle this issue until after Legion launches, if it ever does.
Not as cut and dried as you would like to believe. There are still many precedents to be written as yet when it comes to copyright law
That really doesn't get to the crux of it though, as while fair-use does have it's allowances, the biggest factor is C&D and the inevitable litigation that follows if the company wants to fight against that use.
That's where these Corporations like Blizzard win. Because while the little guy might have an argument under fair-use, they can't handle the financial burden of fighting it. so 9.9 times out of 10, they adhere to the C&D and abandon the project.
Look at MERP as an example, if you're unfamiliar, it was a mega LOTR mod for SKyrim that was essentially recreating middle earth and the LOTR story within Skyrim's creation kit, all original coding/art work yet still shutdown. Even though there was no product it would have been competing against. It was simply a mod.
And thats where Crowdfunding can be Achilles Heal for Big Corps.
It can give the little guy a fighting chance, instead of these big Corps winning by attrition and making a mockery of the legal system.
Because that is what the players want. Games that do not advance, die. Simple as that.
As SBFord has pointed out, Blizzard is FAR more concerned about the 5+ million fans that want to advance than the 100K or so that want to go back to the old game.
Could they make vanilla servers? I am sure they could. If a few guys working in a basement can do it, then Blizzard can too. But not without motivation.
If you want vanilla servers, then give Blizzard a reason to make them. A hundred thousand people canceling their accounts for two days will get their attention, but won't get them to move. A hundred thousand signatures on an online petition won't do anything, unless their is proof that each one is a WoW veteran and not some guy's 8 year old kid making up names.
They see the stats on games; it will take nearly a half million players to prove they are interested in Vanilla WoW for them to even consider devoting the resources to it. With a typical retention rate of 20-30% after the first month for most games, It would take a half million interested folks.
It could be profitable for Blizzard. Many players would pay the sub for regular and vanilla, and some folks who gave up on the game years ago may come back. They could also use the vanilla servers for trial accounts, giving them unlimited access to all features in the server for a week - 10 days, whatever, and giving the ability to transfer these characters to the regular WoW servers if they buy the game.
But it is up to the players to show Blizzard that it is worth their while.
Me, I am not the slightest bit interested in ever, ever going back to WoW. I was burned badly the first time I came back, and nothing less than Blizzard giving me the money I lost then back to me would even get me to consider going back (That ain't gonna happen). I am, however, very interested in the MMO community doing well and growing, and I think Vanilla WoW servers could be beneficial for that.
The world is going to the dogs, which is just how I planned it!
The assumption is always made that the 4-5M players currently involved in WoW are somehow less significant than those who might like to see vanilla servers.
Srsly are you guys get payed for that ?
That whole thing dont make any sense...
I dont play WoW and never have or will, but i totally understand WHY some ppl would rather play the "old" WoW then the new one, even if it would be MILES better.
Its just simply the game they enjoy more, and with the Numbers WoW had in the beginning, that will be more ppl then most ppl think they are.
And most important, some of this ppl wont play Wow like it is now, and IF Blizzard would just do 1-2 "Vanilla "servers, that are easy to maintain/serve, they would get all that money they other wise would not get.
To think they would LOSE ANYTHING, is just stupid, and so far from the reality, its not even funny, and brings me back to the Question, are you Guys get payed for this ?
I'm wondering the same thing. Looks like someone gets a kick back from standing there ground against this. The same assumption is made that the 10-15M players that were involved in earlier WoW somehow became less signigicant to their entire business operation. I was a paying customer on the forums long before my voice ended up on this end of the fight. This didn't swing me to the other side, it just makes me more aware of how important my money is to Blizzard. I'll just give it to another gaming company. If the earlier 10M wasn't important what makes you think your little 5M is more important.
Sedated, I'm sorry but I want to be sure I'm not misunderstanding you.
Are you arguing that if Blizzard put up so called "Vanilla WoW" servers that their subscription numbers would return to 10 to 15 million as they were when the game was first released? Are you arguing that 5 to 10 million people have quit playing WoW because of the expansions? So is the argument that expanding the game is inherently "bad" and will automatically cause a drop in subscriptions so, therefore, every time a game is expanded new servers should be added that do not contain the expanded content to prevent the loss of players?
If you are then I don't agree with you. I watched Mythic put up so called "Classic" Dark Age of Camelot servers in an attempt to appease all the people who allegedly quit that game over the Trials of Atlantis server. (In the interest of honesty I was one of the players who claimed that until I realized the real reason I quit was I no longer had giant chunks of time to spend in game like I had before my wife and I had kids and I opened my own business.) Everyone swore the new servers would restore the subscription base because they all knew people who would "resub if we had classic servers".
So the Classic Servers opened to much fanfare. The classic servers did get a few older players to go back for a bit, but mainly the servers just split an already shrinking player base even more. After two or three months the newness wore off and numbers dropped again and a few of the current players went away with the "come back" players. In retrospect I'd say it hastened the game towards it's current state of one merged server housing the remaining active accounts. Based on that experience I can't imagine that opening Vanilla WoW servers will cause people who quit WoW to resub in significant numbers for any significant time.
Based on Nostralrius numbers I'd say the best Blizzard can hope for by opening Vanilla WoW servers is a 100,000 player bump in subscriptions. That would be a 2% bump in their 5 million player current subscription base. That is the actual number of people who availed themselves of the "Vanilla WoW" option and they did so in an environment where the "Vanilla WoW" was free. This includes the assumption that every single person who played Nostralrius would resub to pay to play Vanilla WoW servers. I don't think those are numbers that would attract Blizzard's attention.
If that's not what your saying then I misunderstood and I apologize.
I will point out that the Pink Elephant in this discussion is that it seems that we gamers scream for new content until we quit the game and then immediately point to the new content as the reason we quit. So new content is great until we quit because that content ruined the game.
Maybe that Blizzard employee wasn't so wrong in telling us what we didn't really want.
No I'm not saying that, as I opened with, is this site getting kick backs to stand its ground? Just referencing this magical 5M or so that remain in game as if they hold more relevance to things. What about the 10M that left complaints before they quit supporting the game? What makes one group of gamers more important than another? Absolutely nothing. Which is why this is two entirely different markets now. Blizz has themselves to thank for that.
one group is actually paying Blizz/Act ...........the other isnt ...............
You seem to be missing the point, but thanks for that Captain Obvious. How many years and thousands of dollars did I give them until they decided my voice wasn't important? Interesting I also have 20-30 people in my gaming circle that feel the same way and never took part in private servers either. How long do you defend Blizz until they shit on the remaining 5M? I was a paying customer.
Happily playing Vanilla and BC WoW, again, since September 2016.
Everything that post said is true...so what was your point other than to prove his?
My point is that some people are taking this whole situation way too personal and acting too emotional about the topic. That thread (which has now been deleted) was full of people freaking out with negative emotional responses. I just found out about this server yesterday when I read it was shut down. I knew nothing about it prior. I absolutely agree with Blizzard shutting it down, but what I don't understand is the venom coming from current fans of the game towards people that want a Vanilla Server.
It's sort of a sore spot? Really? For you? Why? What did any of this do to you or your game? Cheating Blizzard out of their IP? Well I see the point there, but lets not throw too many stones shall we? I mean they did re-appropriate the Warhammer IP for their own when they couldn't get the license from Games Workshop. So those who played on it for free don't get sympathy? I read a few of the posts from people asking for a Vanilla server and most of the posts I read were people just asking for a Vanilla server or wondering why. Many out of ignorance because Blizzard is deleting any new threads rather than consolidating them into a mega-thread for people to read. So people keep making new threads asking the same thing. But I haven't read anyone asking for sympathy.
But this last sentence. "The wounds are still fresh." Wow that sentence really takes the cake. It puts things into another level and just shows the rabid fanbase there. That's fine for them. I don't visit that site often myself. I was just shocked at that level of company worship. No wound was done to the players. This has nothing to do with them. There is absolutely no sane rational for that line of thought. None.
The players that created that vanilla server was in the wrong. The players that played on that server was in the wrong as well. But neither of those people did anything to the current player base. This was only done to Blizzard. The wound (if you want to call it that) was done to Blizzard. Blizzard has made billions off of World of Warcraft. They are still making millions more. They have every right to shut the project down. But I personally think interest is there enough for them to take a second (third?) look at another possible revenue stream for the company. I think the people that were playing on that illegal server think the same thing and are looking for a way to ask Blizzard to reconsider or have Blizzard make a server of their own. Having people jump in accusing those that did this or support this of creating phantom wounds does absolutely nothing but make a situation worse than help to resolve it.
The assumption is always made that the 4-5M players currently involved in WoW are somehow less significant than those who might like to see vanilla servers.
Srsly are you guys get payed for that ?
That whole thing dont make any sense...
I dont play WoW and never have or will, but i totally understand WHY some ppl would rather play the "old" WoW then the new one, even if it would be MILES better.
Its just simply the game they enjoy more, and with the Numbers WoW had in the beginning, that will be more ppl then most ppl think they are.
And most important, some of this ppl wont play Wow like it is now, and IF Blizzard would just do 1-2 "Vanilla "servers, that are easy to maintain/serve, they would get all that money they other wise would not get.
To think they would LOSE ANYTHING, is just stupid, and so far from the reality, its not even funny, and brings me back to the Question, are you Guys get payed for this ?
I'm wondering the same thing. Looks like someone gets a kick back from standing there ground against this. The same assumption is made that the 10-15M players that were involved in earlier WoW somehow became less signigicant to their entire business operation. I was a paying customer on the forums long before my voice ended up on this end of the fight. This didn't swing me to the other side, it just makes me more aware of how important my money is to Blizzard. I'll just give it to another gaming company. If the earlier 10M wasn't important what makes you think your little 5M is more important.
Sedated, I'm sorry but I want to be sure I'm not misunderstanding you.
Are you arguing that if Blizzard put up so called "Vanilla WoW" servers that their subscription numbers would return to 10 to 15 million as they were when the game was first released? Are you arguing that 5 to 10 million people have quit playing WoW because of the expansions? So is the argument that expanding the game is inherently "bad" and will automatically cause a drop in subscriptions so, therefore, every time a game is expanded new servers should be added that do not contain the expanded content to prevent the loss of players?
If you are then I don't agree with you. I watched Mythic put up so called "Classic" Dark Age of Camelot servers in an attempt to appease all the people who allegedly quit that game over the Trials of Atlantis server. (In the interest of honesty I was one of the players who claimed that until I realized the real reason I quit was I no longer had giant chunks of time to spend in game like I had before my wife and I had kids and I opened my own business.) Everyone swore the new servers would restore the subscription base because they all knew people who would "resub if we had classic servers".
So the Classic Servers opened to much fanfare. The classic servers did get a few older players to go back for a bit, but mainly the servers just split an already shrinking player base even more. After two or three months the newness wore off and numbers dropped again and a few of the current players went away with the "come back" players. In retrospect I'd say it hastened the game towards it's current state of one merged server housing the remaining active accounts. Based on that experience I can't imagine that opening Vanilla WoW servers will cause people who quit WoW to resub in significant numbers for any significant time.
Based on Nostralrius numbers I'd say the best Blizzard can hope for by opening Vanilla WoW servers is a 100,000 player bump in subscriptions. That would be a 2% bump in their 5 million player current subscription base. That is the actual number of people who availed themselves of the "Vanilla WoW" option and they did so in an environment where the "Vanilla WoW" was free. This includes the assumption that every single person who played Nostralrius would resub to pay to play Vanilla WoW servers. I don't think those are numbers that would attract Blizzard's attention.
If that's not what your saying then I misunderstood and I apologize.
I will point out that the Pink Elephant in this discussion is that it seems that we gamers scream for new content until we quit the game and then immediately point to the new content as the reason we quit. So new content is great until we quit because that content ruined the game.
Maybe that Blizzard employee wasn't so wrong in telling us what we didn't really want.
No I'm not saying that, as I opened with, is this site getting kick backs to stand its ground? Just referencing this magical 5M or so that remain in game as if they hold more relevance to things. What about the 10M that left complaints before they quit supporting the game? What makes one group of gamers more important than another? Absolutely nothing. Which is why this is two entirely different markets now. Blizz has themselves to thank for that.
Sedated, that leaves me with more questions then. Again, I'm not flaming here. I'm just trying to frame up the argument.
We'll assume that 10 million have left the game. The data supports that assumption.
Do we know that all 10 million left complaints when they unsubscribed?
If they did leave complaints, do we know if they were all of the "I wouldn't be leaving if this was still Vanilla WoW but you kept adding content which is wrecking the game so I quit" ilk?
If every one of those people who left did so because they preferred Vanilla WoW then why doesn't a free option of Vanilla WoW like Nostralrius have 10 million active subscriptions? Its not like free shards like Nostralrius are giant secrets and I'll concede that Nostralrius, by free shard standards, was huge. But compared to live World of Warcraft numbers, which are between 5 to 10 million paying customers and gold farmers world wide, they're kind of insignificant. It does make sense for a company to concentrate its efforts on current paying customers instead of customers who have left.
My personal story is that I played WoW from release for a couple of years. I left because my friends left to go play other games. I liked WoW. I had a lot of fun playing there. But I wouldn't go back to WoW because of any particular game mechanic or server type. The people I want to play games with are playing other games. Its that simple and I don't think I'm atypical in that particular position, but some people seem to that position is atypical. I'm trying to understand why.
Many a small thing has been made large by the right kind of advertising.
The assumption is always made that the 4-5M players currently involved in WoW are somehow less significant than those who might like to see vanilla servers.
Srsly are you guys get payed for that ?
That whole thing dont make any sense...
I dont play WoW and never have or will, but i totally understand WHY some ppl would rather play the "old" WoW then the new one, even if it would be MILES better.
Its just simply the game they enjoy more, and with the Numbers WoW had in the beginning, that will be more ppl then most ppl think they are.
And most important, some of this ppl wont play Wow like it is now, and IF Blizzard would just do 1-2 "Vanilla "servers, that are easy to maintain/serve, they would get all that money they other wise would not get.
To think they would LOSE ANYTHING, is just stupid, and so far from the reality, its not even funny, and brings me back to the Question, are you Guys get payed for this ?
I'm wondering the same thing. Looks like someone gets a kick back from standing there ground against this. The same assumption is made that the 10-15M players that were involved in earlier WoW somehow became less signigicant to their entire business operation. I was a paying customer on the forums long before my voice ended up on this end of the fight. This didn't swing me to the other side, it just makes me more aware of how important my money is to Blizzard. I'll just give it to another gaming company. If the earlier 10M wasn't important what makes you think your little 5M is more important.
Sedated, I'm sorry but I want to be sure I'm not misunderstanding you.
Are you arguing that if Blizzard put up so called "Vanilla WoW" servers that their subscription numbers would return to 10 to 15 million as they were when the game was first released? Are you arguing that 5 to 10 million people have quit playing WoW because of the expansions? So is the argument that expanding the game is inherently "bad" and will automatically cause a drop in subscriptions so, therefore, every time a game is expanded new servers should be added that do not contain the expanded content to prevent the loss of players?
If you are then I don't agree with you. I watched Mythic put up so called "Classic" Dark Age of Camelot servers in an attempt to appease all the people who allegedly quit that game over the Trials of Atlantis server. (In the interest of honesty I was one of the players who claimed that until I realized the real reason I quit was I no longer had giant chunks of time to spend in game like I had before my wife and I had kids and I opened my own business.) Everyone swore the new servers would restore the subscription base because they all knew people who would "resub if we had classic servers".
So the Classic Servers opened to much fanfare. The classic servers did get a few older players to go back for a bit, but mainly the servers just split an already shrinking player base even more. After two or three months the newness wore off and numbers dropped again and a few of the current players went away with the "come back" players. In retrospect I'd say it hastened the game towards it's current state of one merged server housing the remaining active accounts. Based on that experience I can't imagine that opening Vanilla WoW servers will cause people who quit WoW to resub in significant numbers for any significant time.
Based on Nostralrius numbers I'd say the best Blizzard can hope for by opening Vanilla WoW servers is a 100,000 player bump in subscriptions. That would be a 2% bump in their 5 million player current subscription base. That is the actual number of people who availed themselves of the "Vanilla WoW" option and they did so in an environment where the "Vanilla WoW" was free. This includes the assumption that every single person who played Nostralrius would resub to pay to play Vanilla WoW servers. I don't think those are numbers that would attract Blizzard's attention.
If that's not what your saying then I misunderstood and I apologize.
I will point out that the Pink Elephant in this discussion is that it seems that we gamers scream for new content until we quit the game and then immediately point to the new content as the reason we quit. So new content is great until we quit because that content ruined the game.
Maybe that Blizzard employee wasn't so wrong in telling us what we didn't really want.
No I'm not saying that, as I opened with, is this site getting kick backs to stand its ground? Just referencing this magical 5M or so that remain in game as if they hold more relevance to things. What about the 10M that left complaints before they quit supporting the game? What makes one group of gamers more important than another? Absolutely nothing. Which is why this is two entirely different markets now. Blizz has themselves to thank for that.
one group is actually paying Blizz/Act ...........the other isnt ...............
You seem to be missing the point, but thanks for that Captain Obvious. How many years and thousands of dollars did I give them until they decided my voice wasn't important? Interesting I also have 20-30 people in my gaming circle that feel the same way and never took part in private servers either. How long do you defend Blizz until they shit on the remaining 5M? I was a paying customer.
Was .. is the keyword here ..... If you are missing the point...
Blizz/Act have millions and Millions of paying customers , you and your 20--30 friends is less than .0000923% of Blizz/Act paying customers ....
The assumption is always made that the 4-5M players currently involved in WoW are somehow less significant than those who might like to see vanilla servers.
Srsly are you guys get payed for that ?
That whole thing dont make any sense...
I dont play WoW and never have or will, but i totally understand WHY some ppl would rather play the "old" WoW then the new one, even if it would be MILES better.
Its just simply the game they enjoy more, and with the Numbers WoW had in the beginning, that will be more ppl then most ppl think they are.
And most important, some of this ppl wont play Wow like it is now, and IF Blizzard would just do 1-2 "Vanilla "servers, that are easy to maintain/serve, they would get all that money they other wise would not get.
To think they would LOSE ANYTHING, is just stupid, and so far from the reality, its not even funny, and brings me back to the Question, are you Guys get payed for this ?
I'm wondering the same thing. Looks like someone gets a kick back from standing there ground against this. The same assumption is made that the 10-15M players that were involved in earlier WoW somehow became less signigicant to their entire business operation. I was a paying customer on the forums long before my voice ended up on this end of the fight. This didn't swing me to the other side, it just makes me more aware of how important my money is to Blizzard. I'll just give it to another gaming company. If the earlier 10M wasn't important what makes you think your little 5M is more important.
While I appreciate your abilities to change the conversation I'll just repost myself. This was more to do with the question about people receiving kick backs on this site. Do you present the news or do you push your agenda? The more I get involved here the more it feels like a social club rather than a news site.
Happily playing Vanilla and BC WoW, again, since September 2016.
The assumption is always made that the 4-5M players currently involved in WoW are somehow less significant than those who might like to see vanilla servers.
Srsly are you guys get payed for that ?
That whole thing dont make any sense...
I dont play WoW and never have or will, but i totally understand WHY some ppl would rather play the "old" WoW then the new one, even if it would be MILES better.
Its just simply the game they enjoy more, and with the Numbers WoW had in the beginning, that will be more ppl then most ppl think they are.
And most important, some of this ppl wont play Wow like it is now, and IF Blizzard would just do 1-2 "Vanilla "servers, that are easy to maintain/serve, they would get all that money they other wise would not get.
To think they would LOSE ANYTHING, is just stupid, and so far from the reality, its not even funny, and brings me back to the Question, are you Guys get payed for this ?
I'm wondering the same thing. Looks like someone gets a kick back from standing there ground against this. The same assumption is made that the 10-15M players that were involved in earlier WoW somehow became less signigicant to their entire business operation. I was a paying customer on the forums long before my voice ended up on this end of the fight. This didn't swing me to the other side, it just makes me more aware of how important my money is to Blizzard. I'll just give it to another gaming company. If the earlier 10M wasn't important what makes you think your little 5M is more important.
While I appreciate your abilities to change the conversation I'll just repost myself. This was more to do with the question about people receiving kick backs on this site. Do you present the news or do you push your agenda? The more I get involved here the more it feels like a social club rather than a news site.
I think it's a bit of both.
This discussion is growing stale, though. The basic argument against vanilla servers is that they wouldn't be profitable for Blizzard, which is just stupid wrong. Once you understand that's all those opposed have to go on, it's beating a dead horse.
Yes ... Yes you have made such sound arguments , that is a really tuff decision , who do we believe the Multi Billion $ co. with years of data and experience building and maintaining a successful IP for well over a decade, or the vagabond troop of 100k thieves,freeloaders,neckbeards and Xemployees...
cue the Jeopardy music... gonna need to think this one thru ...
Yes ... Yes you have made such sound arguments , that is a really tuff decision , who do we believe the Multi Billion $ co. with years of data and experience building and maintaining a successful IP for well over a decade, or the vagabond troop of 100k thieves,freeloaders,neckbeards and Xemployees...
cue the Jeopardy music... gonna need to think this one thru ...
Yes, the 150,000 players on an illegal, unmarketed, unreliable private server is not at ALL indicative of a larger demand within the Warcraft and MMO community.... /sarcasm
Now Playing: Bless / Summoners War Looking forward to: Crowfall / Lost Ark / Black Desert Mobile
Yes ... Yes you have made such sound arguments , that is a really tuff decision , who do we believe the Multi Billion $ co. with years of data and experience building and maintaining a successful IP for well over a decade, or the vagabond troop of 100k thieves,freeloaders,neckbeards and Xemployees...
cue the Jeopardy music... gonna need to think this one thru ...
Yes, the 150,000 players on an illegal, unmarketed, unreliable private server paying no sub is not at ALL indicative of a larger demand within the Warcraft and MMO community.... /sarcasm
The assumption is always made that the 4-5M players currently involved in WoW are somehow less significant than those who might like to see vanilla servers.
Srsly are you guys get payed for that ?
That whole thing dont make any sense...
I dont play WoW and never have or will, but i totally understand WHY some ppl would rather play the "old" WoW then the new one, even if it would be MILES better.
Its just simply the game they enjoy more, and with the Numbers WoW had in the beginning, that will be more ppl then most ppl think they are.
And most important, some of this ppl wont play Wow like it is now, and IF Blizzard would just do 1-2 "Vanilla "servers, that are easy to maintain/serve, they would get all that money they other wise would not get.
To think they would LOSE ANYTHING, is just stupid, and so far from the reality, its not even funny, and brings me back to the Question, are you Guys get payed for this ?
I'm wondering the same thing. Looks like someone gets a kick back from standing there ground against this. The same assumption is made that the 10-15M players that were involved in earlier WoW somehow became less signigicant to their entire business operation. I was a paying customer on the forums long before my voice ended up on this end of the fight. This didn't swing me to the other side, it just makes me more aware of how important my money is to Blizzard. I'll just give it to another gaming company. If the earlier 10M wasn't important what makes you think your little 5M is more important.
Sedated, I'm sorry but I want to be sure I'm not misunderstanding you.
Are you arguing that if Blizzard put up so called "Vanilla WoW" servers that their subscription numbers would return to 10 to 15 million as they were when the game was first released? Are you arguing that 5 to 10 million people have quit playing WoW because of the expansions? So is the argument that expanding the game is inherently "bad" and will automatically cause a drop in subscriptions so, therefore, every time a game is expanded new servers should be added that do not contain the expanded content to prevent the loss of players?
If you are then I don't agree with you. I watched Mythic put up so called "Classic" Dark Age of Camelot servers in an attempt to appease all the people who allegedly quit that game over the Trials of Atlantis server. (In the interest of honesty I was one of the players who claimed that until I realized the real reason I quit was I no longer had giant chunks of time to spend in game like I had before my wife and I had kids and I opened my own business.) Everyone swore the new servers would restore the subscription base because they all knew people who would "resub if we had classic servers".
So the Classic Servers opened to much fanfare. The classic servers did get a few older players to go back for a bit, but mainly the servers just split an already shrinking player base even more. After two or three months the newness wore off and numbers dropped again and a few of the current players went away with the "come back" players. In retrospect I'd say it hastened the game towards it's current state of one merged server housing the remaining active accounts. Based on that experience I can't imagine that opening Vanilla WoW servers will cause people who quit WoW to resub in significant numbers for any significant time.
Based on Nostralrius numbers I'd say the best Blizzard can hope for by opening Vanilla WoW servers is a 100,000 player bump in subscriptions. That would be a 2% bump in their 5 million player current subscription base. That is the actual number of people who availed themselves of the "Vanilla WoW" option and they did so in an environment where the "Vanilla WoW" was free. This includes the assumption that every single person who played Nostralrius would resub to pay to play Vanilla WoW servers. I don't think those are numbers that would attract Blizzard's attention.
If that's not what your saying then I misunderstood and I apologize.
I will point out that the Pink Elephant in this discussion is that it seems that we gamers scream for new content until we quit the game and then immediately point to the new content as the reason we quit. So new content is great until we quit because that content ruined the game.
Maybe that Blizzard employee wasn't so wrong in telling us what we didn't really want.
No I'm not saying that, as I opened with, is this site getting kick backs to stand its ground? Just referencing this magical 5M or so that remain in game as if they hold more relevance to things. What about the 10M that left complaints before they quit supporting the game? What makes one group of gamers more important than another? Absolutely nothing. Which is why this is two entirely different markets now. Blizz has themselves to thank for that.
one group is actually paying Blizz/Act ...........the other isnt ...............
I'd be willing to bet gaming companies are just as interested in what made gamers quit paying them as they are in what makes others continue to pay them.
I bet they are more interested in the money. Most people who try a game quit. Eventually everyone will stop playing a game.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
Yes ... Yes you have made such sound arguments , that is a really tuff decision , who do we believe the Multi Billion $ co. with years of data and experience building and maintaining a successful IP for well over a decade, or the vagabond troop of 100k thieves,freeloaders,neckbeards and Xemployees...
cue the Jeopardy music... gonna need to think this one thru ...
Yes, the 150,000 players on an illegal, unmarketed, unreliable private server paying no sub is not at ALL indicative of a larger demand within the Warcraft and MMO community.... /sarcasm
Fixed it for you.
If they weren't paying money to play that server it might be difficult to convert those players over to subs. Kind of makes this thread moot.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
Yes ... Yes you have made such sound arguments , that is a really tuff decision , who do we believe the Multi Billion $ co. with years of data and experience building and maintaining a successful IP for well over a decade, or the vagabond troop of 100k thieves,freeloaders,neckbeards and Xemployees...
cue the Jeopardy music... gonna need to think this one thru ...
Yes, the 150,000 players on an illegal, unmarketed, unreliable private server paying no sub is not at ALL indicative of a larger demand within the Warcraft and MMO community.... /sarcasm
Fixed it for you.
If they weren't paying money to play that server it might be difficult to convert those players over to subs. Kind of makes this thread moot.
Not if you've actually been reading the thread. Seems like myself and the other louder voices on this thread weren't even involved in said server. Furthermore, go read some of the folks signing the petition, there is a wide array of some great stories. And the fact that you seem to be giving the same regurgitated response, it seems moot.
Happily playing Vanilla and BC WoW, again, since September 2016.
Yes, the 150,000 players on an illegal, unmarketed, unreliable private server is not at ALL indicative of a larger demand within the Warcraft and MMO community.... /sarcasm
I would say that 150k is the absolute minimum amount of players official legacy servers would bring in.
Sure some of the people playing on private servers wouldn't sub, then you have the millions of ex-wow players who might or the people who missed out on vanilla or tbc who are not playing or ever heard of private servers that want to pay to play on official legacy servers.
Point being the 100k petition or 150k active players on one private server is indicative of a much larger demand, how big I dunno but acting like official legacy servers would only pull in half of what one private server had because it was free is just laughable.
Blizzard just look like arrogant pricks, even with the moral high ground.
Maybe I just think I do but I don't. heh
"You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
I've expressed my opinion about vanilla WoW many times already, so i won't do it again because probably nobody gives a damn anyways. But i will say this: i really hope everyone on this thread played vanilla WoW for a couple of months, then come here and type their thoughts about it. You won't believe how much everyone's mind can change after that experience - the game is very, very fun... for a while. Then it becomes a nightmare.
(Yay 1 hour corpse run and 2 hours dungeons for a blue with Agility for a Warrior.)
HAVING SAID THAT... i would really like to see WoW start from scratch, with the exact same patches they had since the beginning, with all the bugs and stuff, as if we were reliving the moment. Sadly, that won't happen.
Personally do I think all MMOs who made a number of expansions and raised their levelcap a few times actually become worse then the game was at vanilla, and that goes for more games then Wow (EQ comes to mind). There are exceptions, the first Guildwars game made their campaigns really good and made the game better if you had all of them.
But I think Blizzard really should open up a vanilla server or 2, and not just because that would earn them more money but also since so many players want it. It isn't really that expensive.
@Loke666 I think that is the double edged sword of the mmo. This is really the difference between static multi-player games and mmos. MMOs evolve over time. One of the biggest complaints players make, especially in most sub games, is the pace of content updates. How is an mmo supposed to stay both static and provide content and progression? The very nature of progression makes numbers get bigger and requires balance, combat, and class updates and changes.
On top of that one lesson we can take from EQ/EQ2 with legacy progression servers is that it has increased their cost, split resources, and most importantly fragmented the community. At least on a live server version your community is one and complaining about the same things. With two massively different rule sets they are not and it is divisive.
That said I would play a WotLK server (not vanilla) if it were B2P with a cash shop like ESO or GW2.
No. EQ progression servers have made them more money. Most of the active players on those servers are not going to play live EQ. Go talk to some of them. They don't even know what the hell is going on with the live server.
I really enjoy arguing with people on a topic that already has already been determined by a different game.
People have to consider the costs to undertake such a project. Maintaining and devoting resources to a classic server would just distract Blizzard. They would have to pay people to maintain the servers, hire more GMs, hire more support, etc. They are better off just focusing on the future.
You think a company worth 19.8 billion dollars can't do this? Do they want to? No? I find it hard to believe there isn't one figure head up there now hoping to do something to fill this gap. Money aside wheres the "heres a gift to you community for all these years?"
You think money can solve everything? As the past has shown, you can throw hundreds of millions of dollars into an MMO, and watch it flop in less than a month.
Did you know it took just about the entire Blizzard team to work on WoD? Look how that turned out. Worst expansion so far.
They are working on Legion currently. They won't have enough people to spare on this project just to satisfy nostalgia. Most people would end up going back to their original servers after a couple weeks.
However, Blizzard is an exception. They had the right thing at the right time. A phenomenon. To be blunt, they were extremely lucky. They seem to think they can do no wrong, even to the point that they are willing to tell people to their face that they don't want what they think they want. That pride and arrogance will be their death.
::shrug:: If so, it was an epic run. And the wind-down should be good for another decade, at least, just due to the Sunk Costs player base.
How many corporations do you know that do not display arrogance on a regular basis?
Personally do I think all MMOs who made a number of expansions and raised their levelcap a few times actually become worse then the game was at vanilla, and that goes for more games then Wow (EQ comes to mind). There are exceptions, the first Guildwars game made their campaigns really good and made the game better if you had all of them.
But I think Blizzard really should open up a vanilla server or 2, and not just because that would earn them more money but also since so many players want it. It isn't really that expensive.
@Loke666 I think that is the double edged sword of the mmo. This is really the difference between static multi-player games and mmos. MMOs evolve over time. One of the biggest complaints players make, especially in most sub games, is the pace of content updates. How is an mmo supposed to stay both static and provide content and progression? The very nature of progression makes numbers get bigger and requires balance, combat, and class updates and changes.
On top of that one lesson we can take from EQ/EQ2 with legacy progression servers is that it has increased their cost, split resources, and most importantly fragmented the community. At least on a live server version your community is one and complaining about the same things. With two massively different rule sets they are not and it is divisive.
That said I would play a WotLK server (not vanilla) if it were B2P with a cash shop like ESO or GW2.
No. EQ progression servers have made them more money. Most of the active players on those servers are not going to play live EQ. Go talk to some of them. They don't even know what the hell is going on with the live server.
I really enjoy arguing with people on a topic that already has already been determined by a different game.
That still doesn't negate what he said about split resources and a fragmented community. When you have multiple divergent paths on a project, things become chaotic. You just have to look at many bitbucket and github projects.
New Coke anyone? The executives at Blizzard are never going to admit they made a mistake. Coming out with Vanilla servers would be them admitting that they made some wrong turns. They think by shutting down private servers that people will come back to the REAL WoW servers even though at this point it is a very different product than vanilla.
Um, making vanilla servers doesn't admit mistakes. It acknowledges that different people want different things. No game can push out content and expansions and keep everyone happy.
Blizzard either cares about their players or the don't.
Yes, the 150,000 players on an illegal, unmarketed, unreliable private server is not at ALL indicative of a larger demand within the Warcraft and MMO community.... /sarcasm
I would say that 150k is the absolute minimum amount of players official legacy servers would bring in.
Sure some of the people playing on private servers wouldn't sub, then you have the millions of ex-wow players who might or the people who missed out on vanilla or tbc who are not playing or ever heard of private servers that want to pay to play on official legacy servers.
Point being the 100k petition or 150k active players on one private server is indicative of a much larger demand, how big I dunno but acting like official legacy servers would only pull in half of what one private server had because it was free is just laughable.
Blizzard just look like arrogant pricks, even with the moral high ground.
Maybe I just think I do but I don't. heh
If WoW players were that interested why aren't there more people signing the petition? That is .11% of the 100M WoW accounts that Sedryn mention. It's a small fraction of the 800K accounts from the private server. It costs nothing to sign that petition. Why isn't the outcry greater?
I won't speak to the totality of the situation, but I'd enjoy a vanilla (or TBC/WOTLK server) myself, but I haven't signed the petition. Why? Because the realist in me knows Blizzard is going to act like it doesn't exist, even if it reached a quarter million today.
Comments
It can give the little guy a fighting chance, instead of these big Corps winning by attrition and making a mockery of the legal system.
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
Because that is what the players want. Games that do not advance, die. Simple as that.
As SBFord has pointed out, Blizzard is FAR more concerned about the 5+ million fans that want to advance than the 100K or so that want to go back to the old game.
Could they make vanilla servers? I am sure they could. If a few guys working in a basement can do it, then Blizzard can too. But not without motivation.
If you want vanilla servers, then give Blizzard a reason to make them. A hundred thousand people canceling their accounts for two days will get their attention, but won't get them to move. A hundred thousand signatures on an online petition won't do anything, unless their is proof that each one is a WoW veteran and not some guy's 8 year old kid making up names.
They see the stats on games; it will take nearly a half million players to prove they are interested in Vanilla WoW for them to even consider devoting the resources to it. With a typical retention rate of 20-30% after the first month for most games, It would take a half million interested folks.
It could be profitable for Blizzard. Many players would pay the sub for regular and vanilla, and some folks who gave up on the game years ago may come back. They could also use the vanilla servers for trial accounts, giving them unlimited access to all features in the server for a week - 10 days, whatever, and giving the ability to transfer these characters to the regular WoW servers if they buy the game.
But it is up to the players to show Blizzard that it is worth their while.
Me, I am not the slightest bit interested in ever, ever going back to WoW. I was burned badly the first time I came back, and nothing less than Blizzard giving me the money I lost then back to me would even get me to consider going back (That ain't gonna happen). I am, however, very interested in the MMO community doing well and growing, and I think Vanilla WoW servers could be beneficial for that.
The world is going to the dogs, which is just how I planned it!
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer
Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/It's sort of a sore spot? Really? For you? Why? What did any of this do to you or your game? Cheating Blizzard out of their IP? Well I see the point there, but lets not throw too many stones shall we? I mean they did re-appropriate the Warhammer IP for their own when they couldn't get the license from Games Workshop. So those who played on it for free don't get sympathy? I read a few of the posts from people asking for a Vanilla server and most of the posts I read were people just asking for a Vanilla server or wondering why. Many out of ignorance because Blizzard is deleting any new threads rather than consolidating them into a mega-thread for people to read. So people keep making new threads asking the same thing. But I haven't read anyone asking for sympathy.
But this last sentence. "The wounds are still fresh." Wow that sentence really takes the cake. It puts things into another level and just shows the rabid fanbase there. That's fine for them. I don't visit that site often myself. I was just shocked at that level of company worship. No wound was done to the players. This has nothing to do with them. There is absolutely no sane rational for that line of thought. None.
The players that created that vanilla server was in the wrong. The players that played on that server was in the wrong as well. But neither of those people did anything to the current player base. This was only done to Blizzard. The wound (if you want to call it that) was done to Blizzard. Blizzard has made billions off of World of Warcraft. They are still making millions more. They have every right to shut the project down. But I personally think interest is there enough for them to take a second (third?) look at another possible revenue stream for the company. I think the people that were playing on that illegal server think the same thing and are looking for a way to ask Blizzard to reconsider or have Blizzard make a server of their own. Having people jump in accusing those that did this or support this of creating phantom wounds does absolutely nothing but make a situation worse than help to resolve it.
Hopefully you now see my point.
We'll assume that 10 million have left the game. The data supports that assumption.
Do we know that all 10 million left complaints when they unsubscribed?
If they did leave complaints, do we know if they were all of the "I wouldn't be leaving if this was still Vanilla WoW but you kept adding content which is wrecking the game so I quit" ilk?
If every one of those people who left did so because they preferred Vanilla WoW then why doesn't a free option of Vanilla WoW like Nostralrius have 10 million active subscriptions? Its not like free shards like Nostralrius are giant secrets and I'll concede that Nostralrius, by free shard standards, was huge. But compared to live World of Warcraft numbers, which are between 5 to 10 million paying customers and gold farmers world wide, they're kind of insignificant. It does make sense for a company to concentrate its efforts on current paying customers instead of customers who have left.
My personal story is that I played WoW from release for a couple of years. I left because my friends left to go play other games. I liked WoW. I had a lot of fun playing there. But I wouldn't go back to WoW because of any particular game mechanic or server type. The people I want to play games with are playing other games. Its that simple and I don't think I'm atypical in that particular position, but some people seem to that position is atypical. I'm trying to understand why.
Many a small thing has been made large by the right kind of advertising.
Blizz/Act have millions and Millions of paying customers , you and your 20--30 friends is less than .0000923% of Blizz/Act paying customers ....
cue the Jeopardy music... gonna need to think this one thru ...
Looking forward to: Crowfall / Lost Ark / Black Desert Mobile
I bet they are more interested in the money. Most people who try a game quit. Eventually everyone will stop playing a game.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
If they weren't paying money to play that server it might be difficult to convert those players over to subs. Kind of makes this thread moot.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
Sure some of the people playing on private servers wouldn't sub, then you have the millions of ex-wow players who might or the people who missed out on vanilla or tbc who are not playing or ever heard of private servers that want to pay to play on official legacy servers.
Point being the 100k petition or 150k active players on one private server is indicative of a much larger demand, how big I dunno but acting like official legacy servers would only pull in half of what one private server had because it was free is just laughable.
Blizzard just look like arrogant pricks, even with the moral high ground.
Maybe I just think I do but I don't. heh
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer
Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/But i will say this: i really hope everyone on this thread played vanilla WoW for a couple of months, then come here and type their thoughts about it. You won't believe how much everyone's mind can change after that experience - the game is very, very fun... for a while. Then it becomes a nightmare.
(Yay 1 hour corpse run and 2 hours dungeons for a blue with Agility for a Warrior.)
HAVING SAID THAT... i would really like to see WoW start from scratch, with the exact same patches they had since the beginning, with all the bugs and stuff, as if we were reliving the moment. Sadly, that won't happen.
I really enjoy arguing with people on a topic that already has already been determined by a different game.
Did you know it took just about the entire Blizzard team to work on WoD? Look how that turned out. Worst expansion so far.
They are working on Legion currently. They won't have enough people to spare on this project just to satisfy nostalgia. Most people would end up going back to their original servers after a couple weeks.
How many corporations do you know that do not display arrogance on a regular basis?
This behavior is the norm, not the exception.
Blizzard either cares about their players or the don't.