the fun thing about pessimism is it require nothing but to stay back an wait for something better.
the game is in alpha yes, so everything looking an playing bad is part of the alpha, it is still been made give it time. i rather be optimistic that things can only get better versus it only going get worse.
Yes, but the part you are not mentioning is that they want money now for a product that is bad "now".
Might not release for 3 more years, might be a stripped down barely viable product.
Not something that is worth paying for at this time.
Part of the game is very playable. We have seen videos and it plays as intended. For people who are fans of this type of game play. Was downright refreshing to watch. Goal is to start Alpha and Beta in 2017. Says so right in their FAQ. Up till now I have not backed a single game. Pantheon is my first and despite the fact I got a copy of the game with my backing, I didnt pledge for that reason. I wanted to have a voice in the game. Im posting on their forums feedback in hopes of shaping Pantheon. It maybe a small voice but its something.
Also the progress I have seen in the past year has blown my mind. I have been convinced and I was a skeptic on their ability to deliver. So as far as I can see, the game has the support to deliver. They have even grown their number of staff. Seeing all this I feel my pledge is a low risk. One I am glad to take if it helps get me the game I want.
Saw a video, liked the part where the healer or mage or whatever sat down and stood back up continuously over and over, probably to optimize mana regen or something. How people truly believe this shit is the second coming of amazing MMO gameplay is just mind-boggling. Like it seriously confuses me.
Saw a video, liked the part where the healer or mage or whatever sat down and stood back up continuously over and over, probably to optimize mana regen or something. How people truly believe this shit is the second coming of amazing MMO gameplay is just mind-boggling. Like it seriously confuses me.
Did you notice when people sat down to med, team mates started talking and laughing? Hmmm for some I guess that would be a downside. For others....
I pledged a year ago, I love MMO's but hate everything currently out there (with dungeon finders, glowing paths to your quests etc), Pantheon looks to be the only thing that's good. Very excited to see where this game develops and to be there for the whole ride.
Saw a video, liked the part where the healer or mage or whatever sat down and stood back up continuously over and over, probably to optimize mana regen or something. How people truly believe this shit is the second coming of amazing MMO gameplay is just mind-boggling. Like it seriously confuses me.
Did you notice when people sat down to med, team mates started talking and laughing? Hmmm for some I guess that would be a downside. For others....
Hey everyone, come sit down for a real bonding and chuckle session. We guarantee you'll get a big warm sweet interior glowing.
(small print) Quality of company and jokes not guaranteed. See your local retailer for details.
I'll admit right up front i know very little of the game but considering the hype surrounding it i've been making it a point to educate myself lately. still not sure why i should even care all that much just yet but i will say some of the interesting mechanics grab my attention and they do sound great on paper. keeping my eye on it for now
The best these guys can hope for is they actually make it. They get a lot of people to buy it before word of mouth spreads about it and sales and player base tanks.
Theyre relying on an ultra niche here and it going to fail. I said that after the first comments they made. After I stopped laughing at Brad McQuaid being in charge that is.
You cant have forced grouping PERIOD, most people dont even like to group (even when necessary) in co op activities in games which are much more 'main stream' (Rift, GW2, ESO)
After they failed at the kickstarter that said enough. But these guys want to make money so bad (without getting actual employment somewhere) they peddle a dream (like so many others) hopping enough suckers will send them money so they can make a living and pretend to make an MMO.
The best these guys can hope for is they actually make it. They get a lot of people to buy it before word of mouth spreads about it and sales and player base tanks.
Theyre relying on an ultra niche here and it going to fail. I said that after the first comments they made. After I stopped laughing at Brad McQuaid being in charge that is.
You cant have forced grouping PERIOD, most people dont even like to group (even when necessary) in co op activities in games which are much more 'main stream' (Rift, GW2, ESO)
After they failed at the kickstarter that said enough. But these guys want to make money so bad (without getting actual employment somewhere) they peddle a dream (like so many others) hopping enough suckers will send them money so they can make a living and pretend to make an MMO.
There is nothing "ultra niche" about group focused PvE. Pantheon's predecessor had over half a million subs 15 years ago. Quite obviously, the many millions of people who loved the game feel different about grouping. Not to mention the fact that they won't force you to do anything, and some soloing will be viable.
It appears you may a bit behind on info regarding Pantheon. They currently have quite a few videos that more than demonstrate progress, and the staff are all gainfully employed.
The best these guys can hope for is they actually make it. They get a lot of people to buy it before word of mouth spreads about it and sales and player base tanks.
Theyre relying on an ultra niche here and it going to fail. I said that after the first comments they made. After I stopped laughing at Brad McQuaid being in charge that is.
You cant have forced grouping PERIOD, most people dont even like to group (even when necessary) in co op activities in games which are much more 'main stream' (Rift, GW2, ESO)
After they failed at the kickstarter that said enough. But these guys want to make money so bad (without getting actual employment somewhere) they peddle a dream (like so many others) hopping enough suckers will send them money so they can make a living and pretend to make an MMO.
So what happens if you are wrong? Do you just find a new MMO to harass or do you continue to tell VR that they are actively failing just because you personally dont like it. Im not claiming there are gonna be millions of players or anything like that. But the way you state things is as if you want it to fail. Why?
How about we wait and see what they can do? How about we judge the game for how it does post launch? And if you dont like it, manage to fairly judge it based on what the set out to do. I mean I dont like FFXIV but just because I dont like it doesnt mean I think its a failure. Just because I dont care for it overall doesnt mean I cant like certain things about it.
But instead you get on here and basically trash them, question their ethics with no real indication that would be an issue, and use kickstarter as an indication that something has failed. And you speak in absolutes. "You cant have forced grouping PERIOD". Really? And you just know this with absolute certainty?
There is nothing "ultra niche" about group focused PvE. Pantheon's predecessor had over half a million subs 15 years ago. Quite obviously, the many millions of people who loved the game feel different about grouping.
15 years ago we chose what to play based on what was available at that time. Needing to group to complete most content was not in any way unusual then. It is now.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
I'll admit right up front i know very little of the game but considering the hype surrounding it i've been making it a point to educate myself lately. still not sure why i should even care all that much just yet but i will say some of the interesting mechanics grab my attention and they do sound great on paper. keeping my eye on it for now
Perfectly reasonable approach. The game isnt going to be for everyone. But I would encourage anyone looking for a more challenging and deeper experience in an MMO to at least give it a try.
Nope. He said he didn't want solo players playing his game. And while I group 75-80% of the time in an MMO (even WoW I group most of the time), I do NOT support FORCED activity. The only people who like forced grouping are anti-social people who can't properly socialize unless they were forced to, which makes it NOT a social experience when its FORCED.
So he pretty much said for a huge portion of the playerbase he didn't want their money. No wonder their kickstarter failed.
I've seen some mindless posts in my day but this one is up there. The less grouping is encouraged, the more social people are? GW2 and TESO would like to have a word with you.
There is nothing "ultra niche" about group focused PvE. Pantheon's predecessor had over half a million subs 15 years ago. Quite obviously, the many millions of people who loved the game feel different about grouping.
15 years ago we chose what to play based on what was available at that time. Needing to group to complete most content was not in any way unusual then. It is now.
I think there is more people sick of the mess twitch combat has given us then you may think. When I talk to MMOers they are look back to the day of Enchanters and Bards. Pick pocketing and back-stabs. Its funny when people make threads asking for your fav thing you did in a MMO. Most stories are about games like DAoC, EQ1, AC, UO. Sometimes going back to your roots is something new and refreshing, if done right. Its kinda like the first time you try fusion style cooking and your favorite food just became your new favorite food.
There is nothing "ultra niche" about group focused PvE. Pantheon's predecessor had over half a million subs 15 years ago. Quite obviously, the many millions of people who loved the game feel different about grouping.
15 years ago we chose what to play based on what was available at that time. Needing to group to complete most content was not in any way unusual then. It is now.
I think there is more people sick of the mess twitch combat has given us then you may think. When I talk to MMOers they are look back to the day of Enchanters and Bards. Pick pocketing and back-stabs. Its funny when people make threads asking for your fav thing you did in a MMO. Most stories are about games like DAoC, EQ1, AC, UO. Sometimes going back to your roots is something new and refreshing, if done right. Its kinda like the first time you try fusion style cooking and your favorite food just became your new favorite food.
I understand the appeal quite well but then, I'm someone who has been playing MMOs for nearly 2 decades. The vast majority of 2017 MMO players have not.
I have no problem with a retro approach to new MMO development but I am highly doubtful that its appeal today is anything but niche.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
There is nothing "ultra niche" about group focused PvE. Pantheon's predecessor had over half a million subs 15 years ago. Quite obviously, the many millions of people who loved the game feel different about grouping.
15 years ago we chose what to play based on what was available at that time. Needing to group to complete most content was not in any way unusual then. It is now.
I think there is more people sick of the mess twitch combat has given us then you may think. When I talk to MMOers they are look back to the day of Enchanters and Bards. Pick pocketing and back-stabs. Its funny when people make threads asking for your fav thing you did in a MMO. Most stories are about games like DAoC, EQ1, AC, UO. Sometimes going back to your roots is something new and refreshing, if done right. Its kinda like the first time you try fusion style cooking and your favorite food just became your new favorite food.
I understand the appeal quite well but then, I'm someone who has been playing MMOs for nearly 2 decades. The vast majority of 2017 MMO players have not.
I have no problem with a retro approach to new MMO development but I am highly doubtful that its appeal today is anything but niche.
I think you are going back to far. There are many 2004 WoW gamers that no longer have a home because WoW has turned to crap. Classes are a shell of what they used to be. I even think there is many MMOers who has tried the love em and leave em MMOs over the past 6-8 years and are sick of the same rehashed game. Many of them are ready to try something different. Pantheon could be small, it also could be huge. Its all about timing. With whats coming out over the next year or so. Their timing looks good.
There is nothing "ultra niche" about group focused PvE. Pantheon's predecessor had over half a million subs 15 years ago. Quite obviously, the many millions of people who loved the game feel different about grouping.
15 years ago we chose what to play based on what was available at that time. Needing to group to complete most content was not in any way unusual then. It is now.
Actually, it was popular back then too. We did it in single player games. Grouping in a massively multiplayer game will again be popular when the option is available.
There is nothing "ultra niche" about group focused PvE. Pantheon's predecessor had over half a million subs 15 years ago. Quite obviously, the many millions of people who loved the game feel different about grouping.
15 years ago we chose what to play based on what was available at that time. Needing to group to complete most content was not in any way unusual then. It is now.
I think there is more people sick of the mess twitch combat has given us then you may think. When I talk to MMOers they are look back to the day of Enchanters and Bards. Pick pocketing and back-stabs. Its funny when people make threads asking for your fav thing you did in a MMO. Most stories are about games like DAoC, EQ1, AC, UO. Sometimes going back to your roots is something new and refreshing, if done right. Its kinda like the first time you try fusion style cooking and your favorite food just became your new favorite food.
I understand the appeal quite well but then, I'm someone who has been playing MMOs for nearly 2 decades. The vast majority of 2017 MMO players have not.
I have no problem with a retro approach to new MMO development but I am highly doubtful that its appeal today is anything but niche.
I think you are going back to far. There are many 2004 WoW gamers that no longer have a home because WoW has turned to crap. Classes are a shell of what they used to be. I even think there is many MMOers who has tried the love em and leave em MMOs over the past 6-8 years and are sick of the same rehashed game. Many of them are ready to try something different. Pantheon could be small, it also could be huge. Its all about timing. With whats coming out over the next year or so. Their timing looks good.
I'm not going anywhere except where the poster I was responding to went. Namely "15 years ago."
And I also played vanilla WOW at release. It was leaps and bounds more solo-friendly and quest-based than anything that came before. It in fact was the start of what is now the norm. I seriously doubt that even the WOW pirate server fans like pre-WOW game play styles because of their love of vanilla WOW.
15 years ago it was UO, EQ, AC, DAoC, etc. WOW was 13 years ago and Vanguard was 10.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
There is nothing "ultra niche" about group focused PvE. Pantheon's predecessor had over half a million subs 15 years ago. Quite obviously, the many millions of people who loved the game feel different about grouping.
15 years ago we chose what to play based on what was available at that time. Needing to group to complete most content was not in any way unusual then. It is now.
Actually, it was popular back then too. We did it in single player games. Grouping in a massively multiplayer game will again be popular when the option is available.
Let's wait and see, shall we?
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
There is nothing "ultra niche" about group focused PvE. Pantheon's predecessor had over half a million subs 15 years ago. Quite obviously, the many millions of people who loved the game feel different about grouping.
15 years ago we chose what to play based on what was available at that time. Needing to group to complete most content was not in any way unusual then. It is now.
Actually, it was popular back then too. We did it in single player games. Grouping in a massively multiplayer game will again be popular when the option is available.
Let's wait and see, shall we?
I'll go ahead and add this to my bookmarks under the "Pantheon: Told you so" folder.
Gamers are fickle and unforgiving. Once its over its over. Only games I know of that got more players after launch than at launch were EvE and ESO, and ESO went buy to play and some people might claim there were more players at launch than after they went B2P. But that can be debated. Other than that games sold mass units people played for a month (when there were subs and free 30 days) and then pops died.
Look at Conan Exiles. Their numbers have tanked. Yes, they sold 300K (best guesses) unit but they have slowed dramatically the past few days. They had 35K people at peak on their highest day, with around 90K units sold. They havent gotten above 25K since despite selling 3 times as many units sold. They barely got above 22500 players at peak today.
And that game has been hyped to heaven a cut and paste of a game that has sold 4.5 million copies and still has 70K players at peak (bug rebound for ARK there) , and it has been billed as a 'mature' game as opposed to a 'kiddie' game. But its still boring as hell and once the new factor wears off its over, that took 2 days by my estimation.
To have 'success' you have to have a game that is different enough to be different, and popular enough to retain players. That also means you need mass amounts of content, developed and semi repetitive (that doesnt feel like a grind).
Not saying these guys cant do that but its highly unlikely. Because no indie outfit has ever done it. Even ones with triple digits millions in funds (allegedly).
New games are only as good as the length of their 'wow' factor. Where their art or their mobs or their whatever still has some appeal and isnt suddenly 'ho hum'. GW2 good example. Centaurs were awesome during beta. But that 'wow' factor got old quick. "Dynamic" events were cool until people realized they followed the same script and timer every single time and werent dynamic at all.
Thats why I say this game is ultra niche. Not many people will play it anyway and the retention of those players will be relegated to the hardcore fans. Thats just reality. Sure you might win a few people over but again the number there will be tiny as well.
Comments
Also the progress I have seen in the past year has blown my mind. I have been convinced and I was a skeptic on their ability to deliver. So as far as I can see, the game has the support to deliver. They have even grown their number of staff. Seeing all this I feel my pledge is a low risk. One I am glad to take if it helps get me the game I want.
MAGA
Sums up my experience with many games.
So no, I never trust any promises made by any game makers.
Theyre relying on an ultra niche here and it going to fail. I said that after the first comments they made. After I stopped laughing at Brad McQuaid being in charge that is.
You cant have forced grouping PERIOD, most people dont even like to group (even when necessary) in co op activities in games which are much more 'main stream' (Rift, GW2, ESO)
After they failed at the kickstarter that said enough. But these guys want to make money so bad (without getting actual employment somewhere) they peddle a dream (like so many others) hopping enough suckers will send them money so they can make a living and pretend to make an MMO.
It appears you may a bit behind on info regarding Pantheon. They currently have quite a few videos that more than demonstrate progress, and the staff are all gainfully employed.
How about we wait and see what they can do? How about we judge the game for how it does post launch? And if you dont like it, manage to fairly judge it based on what the set out to do. I mean I dont like FFXIV but just because I dont like it doesnt mean I think its a failure. Just because I dont care for it overall doesnt mean I cant like certain things about it.
But instead you get on here and basically trash them, question their ethics with no real indication that would be an issue, and use kickstarter as an indication that something has failed. And you speak in absolutes. "You cant have forced grouping PERIOD". Really? And you just know this with absolute certainty?
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
I have no problem with a retro approach to new MMO development but I am highly doubtful that its appeal today is anything but niche.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
And I also played vanilla WOW at release. It was leaps and bounds more solo-friendly and quest-based than anything that came before. It in fact was the start of what is now the norm. I seriously doubt that even the WOW pirate server fans like pre-WOW game play styles because of their love of vanilla WOW.
15 years ago it was UO, EQ, AC, DAoC, etc. WOW was 13 years ago and Vanguard was 10.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Gamers are fickle and unforgiving. Once its over its over. Only games I know of that got more players after launch than at launch were EvE and ESO, and ESO went buy to play and some people might claim there were more players at launch than after they went B2P. But that can be debated. Other than that games sold mass units people played for a month (when there were subs and free 30 days) and then pops died.
Look at Conan Exiles. Their numbers have tanked. Yes, they sold 300K (best guesses) unit but they have slowed dramatically the past few days. They had 35K people at peak on their highest day, with around 90K units sold. They havent gotten above 25K since despite selling 3 times as many units sold. They barely got above 22500 players at peak today.
And that game has been hyped to heaven a cut and paste of a game that has sold 4.5 million copies and still has 70K players at peak (bug rebound for ARK there) , and it has been billed as a 'mature' game as opposed to a 'kiddie' game. But its still boring as hell and once the new factor wears off its over, that took 2 days by my estimation.
To have 'success' you have to have a game that is different enough to be different, and popular enough to retain players. That also means you need mass amounts of content, developed and semi repetitive (that doesnt feel like a grind).
Not saying these guys cant do that but its highly unlikely. Because no indie outfit has ever done it. Even ones with triple digits millions in funds (allegedly).
New games are only as good as the length of their 'wow' factor. Where their art or their mobs or their whatever still has some appeal and isnt suddenly 'ho hum'. GW2 good example. Centaurs were awesome during beta. But that 'wow' factor got old quick. "Dynamic" events were cool until people realized they followed the same script and timer every single time and werent dynamic at all.
Thats why I say this game is ultra niche. Not many people will play it anyway and the retention of those players will be relegated to the hardcore fans. Thats just reality. Sure you might win a few people over but again the number there will be tiny as well.