All games have to be something like that for instance.
Character creation - needed Zoned difficulty - not needed to wows extent but people won't like to constantly die in the same places over and over. especially near the start. End game raids - Again not needed but helpful to keep people playing
Yeah, you do need some kind of character generator in any RPG. We seen a few odd ones though but whatever, Meridian 59 had a character generator 8 years before Wow so it is not a clone feature, and single player games have had them far longer.
Same thing with zoned difficulty. End game raids were invented by Everquest so I don't see how anything on your list actually makes something a Wow clone.
Wow did bring in plenty of new things or things that were rare in earlier games that suddenly became common. Instanced dungeons for instance existed before Wow but they werent so common, most dungeons in most games were public.
Soloing have existed since M59 as well but Wow had way more of it then any earlier game.
Wows auctionhouse was not a new feature as such but how it was made became a standard anyways.
Also, Wow was first with having people stuck in the endgame for a long time. The earlier games had a long levelcurve and released expansions rather often so the endgame was just something for the fast people to do while waiting for the next expansion.
EQ2 is not a good example as some stated BTW, while it released before Wow the game got revamped pretty fast to be far more like Wow wehn SOE noticed how much popular it became then their own game.
And it is not a single feature that makes a Wow clone even if it is stolen directly from Wow, it is rather that the game feel very similar to Wow in general while you play it even if it differs in some ways. After all could you argue that Wow is a kind of EQ clone, it was made by people that played EQ (Morhaime and Kaplan met in a EQ raid guild), Wow have a lot in common with EQ but the games does not feel similar to play, that is why it isn't really a clone even if it shares so many features.
Rift is a good example, it differs from Wow but the gameplay still feels very similar. ESO, GW2 and BDO on the other hand does not feel like playing Wow so they are not clones. Does that makes sense?
All games have to be something like that for instance.
Character creation - needed Zoned difficulty - not needed to wows extent but people won't like to constantly die in the same places over and over. especially near the start. End game raids - Again not needed but helpful to keep people playing
Yeah, you do need some kind of character generator in any RPG. We seen a few odd ones though but whatever, Meridian 59 had a character generator 8 years before Wow so it is not a clone feature, and single player games have had them far longer.
Same thing with zoned difficulty. End game raids were invented by Everquest so I don't see how anything on your list actually makes something a Wow clone.
Wow did bring in plenty of new things or things that were rare in earlier games that suddenly became common. Instanced dungeons for instance existed before Wow but they werent so common, most dungeons in most games were public.
Soloing have existed since M59 as well but Wow had way more of it then any earlier game.
Wows auctionhouse was not a new feature as such but how it was made became a standard anyways.
Also, Wow was first with having people stuck in the endgame for a long time. The earlier games had a long levelcurve and released expansions rather often so the endgame was just something for the fast people to do while waiting for the next expansion.
EQ2 is not a good example as some stated BTW, while it released before Wow the game got revamped pretty fast to be far more like Wow wehn SOE noticed how much popular it became then their own game.
And it is not a single feature that makes a Wow clone even if it is stolen directly from Wow, it is rather that the game feel very similar to Wow in general while you play it even if it differs in some ways. After all could you argue that Wow is a kind of EQ clone, it was made by people that played EQ (Morhaime and Kaplan met in a EQ raid guild), Wow have a lot in common with EQ but the games does not feel similar to play, that is why it isn't really a clone even if it shares so many features.
Rift is a good example, it differs from Wow but the gameplay still feels very similar. ESO, GW2 and BDO on the other hand does not feel like playing Wow so they are not clones. Does that makes sense?
I would disagree with that. EQ was a bit more complex IMO, but WoW had a very similar feel to general setup of the world, combat, and moving around in the world. It was closer to EQ than EQ2. I think questing, soloing, rested exp, and having two warring factions were the only major differences between the two games aside from the lore. EQ had a much more in-depth skill, crafting, faction, and combat system though. Wheather that is good or bad is arguable.
You are welcome to your own opinion, but the skill, ability, and faction systems were far more in depth. Just finding abilities in shops, finding they exist at all, and finding everything needed to craft the ability was challenging. The faction system wasn't nearly so straightforward as horde vs alliance. There were factions for religion, class, and race. Crafting wasn't a simple click with a list of recipes. Classes and races had attribute bonuses, racial abilities, and experience penalties that actually mattered. Obviously, such an in-depth system is not for most people. That is why we have these more simplified games like WoW.
All games have to be something like that for instance.
Character creation - needed Zoned difficulty - not needed to wows extent but people won't like to constantly die in the same places over and over. especially near the start. End game raids - Again not needed but helpful to keep people playing
Wurm, EVE, Runescape and Darkfall - 2 of them have you pick a race. None of them have you pick a class. Your class is built organically through your gameplay or in Wurm and Darkfall there are classlike limitations you can accept once you have played the game for awhile (Destroyer in Darkfall and Priests in Wurm) and even then they are not irreversible decisions.
"Zoned Difficulty" is not what I said. What I said was "then has me quest through a series of zones". "Quest through a series of zones" is your key phrase there. Questing as your sole primary content and single path to efficient progression is a hallmark of WoW clones. It's not a feature of any of the four games I listed as not being WoW clones. Yes EVE and Runescape have quests(missions)... as one of many equally viable options. And because of this the map opens up much faster and is less segregated by level zones in all of these games.
"Endgame Content" is not really a phrase in any of these games because it's essentially the same content you have access to at level 1. In WoW clones you start in quests and end in dungeons. There are some appetizer dungeons along the way but they don't have the same role they do in the "end game." In EVE as an example, you start mining tritatium and doing level 1 missions in a frigate and end doing level 5s in a carrier or high end complexes, mining mercoxit in null sec etc. but this is essentially the same content you were doing at the start of the game scaled up in difficulty. The cut-off between early game and endgame is invisible and easily missed while in a WoW clone there is this major moment where you are like "Great, I'm max level now. I'm never doing another quest again. Time to go run dungeons." Maybe it's just so painfully obvious to me because I loathe questing.
When I describe things like questing from zone to zone, and people say "All games have that" it's very apparent why this genre is dying for lack of innovation. People can't even tell the games they're playing are clones because they can't even understand there are other options.
ESO and GW2 are not WoW clones but they are like WoW.
They are more like Asheron's Call 1, specially ESO. Just because a game is closer to the theme park model doesn't mean it's "like WoW". Or for f's sake, then a VW bettle is like a Ferrari.
No they are all clones. You can't look at the differences between EVE, Darkfall, and Runescape and then turn around and tell me there is any meaningful difference between WoW and ESO. They are essentially the same game with a few gimmicky differences.
When I describe things like questing from zone to zone, and people say "All games have that" it's very apparent why this genre is dying for lack of innovation. People can't even tell the games they're playing are clones because they can't even understand there are other options.
I wish you were wrong there but you are sadly right. And people get extremely surprised when even small things differ from the general model, when some friends tried GW2 the first time they couldn't fathom that you didn't have turnin for DEs and hearts, they just couldn't believe that.
Also, sometimes it feels like Wow is playing "Simon says" with the other games, they try to add most features Wow have no matter if it is a good feature or not. Thankfully seems they have stopped that now, nt all Wows ideas were great. The several times speeding up of the time it takes to level lead to the rather strange setup of modern MMOs were they are built like EQ but you outlevel almost all content the first few weeks.
Are we about done with WoW clones? No, and in my opinion we never will be. What we are finally getting wise to is the lower quality of some of these, while the good quality ones go from strength to strength.
Now good quality doesn't have to mean Nasa levels of virtual graphics. Quality refers to a whole host of things in a game: Combat, movement, content, race diversity, presentation, support, updates etc etc. The mmo theme park games that have these continue to thrive.
Maybe the original question should be: Is any major developer thinking of bringing out the next AAA theme park mmorpg ala WoW, FFXIV?
ESO and GW2 are not WoW clones but they are like WoW.
They are more like Asheron's Call 1, specially ESO. Just because a game is closer to the theme park model doesn't mean it's "like WoW". Or for f's sake, then a VW bettle is like a Ferrari.
No they are all clones. You can't look at the differences between EVE, Darkfall, and Runescape and then turn around and tell me there is any meaningful difference between WoW and ESO. They are essentially the same game with a few gimmicky differences.
So what you are also arguing (perhaps without realizing it) is EVE, DF, and Runescape are clones of the basic sandbox model set by UO with just a few "gimicky differences"
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
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"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I don't think "WOW clone" means what you think it means.
And no, Theme Parks are not done.
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“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
ESO and GW2 are not WoW clones but they are like WoW.
They are more like Asheron's Call 1, specially ESO. Just because a game is closer to the theme park model doesn't mean it's "like WoW". Or for f's sake, then a VW bettle is like a Ferrari.
No they are all clones. You can't look at the differences between EVE, Darkfall, and Runescape and then turn around and tell me there is any meaningful difference between WoW and ESO. They are essentially the same game with a few gimmicky differences.
So what you are also arguing (perhaps without realizing it) is EVE, DF, and Runescape are clones of the basic sandbox model set by UO with just a few "gimicky differences"
Not even close. I started outlining a list of differences but... there is really no need to do that. How about you outline a list of similarities between those two titles that comes even close to covering this much of the core gameplay.
WoW and ESO (And all the other clones killing this genre) - I pick a race and a class at the start of the game before having any opportunity to play the game.
WoW and ESO (And all the other clones killing this genre) - My primary content from level one to max is going through quests. "Kill X enemies." "Talk to this guy." "Gather this item!" Etc. It's the same few quest templates recycled dozens of times to give the illusion there is lots of content.
WoW and ESO (And all the other clones killing this genre) - Beyond item progression there is gear progression. Various grades of gear and power based on the sources it comes from and how much RNG loves me. When I reach max level this becomes the primary focus of progression.
WoW and ESO (And all the other clones killing this genre) - Gear progression focuses primarily around group content. Dungeons, raids, and group PvP in arenas or PvP designated zones.
You're going to have to stretch real hard to do that given that the core content in Runescape is quests that have actually have effort put into making them, mini-games, and skill grinding. And none of those three things even exist in EVE.
Rift Swtor Warhammer Runes of Magic 4Story (later renamed Gates of Andaron) Allods online Alganon (yupp, i went there).
The list is too long, but if you notice i only mentioned straight ripp offs. I didn't include anything with action combat or smaller hotbars, or anything slightly different.
Rift Swtor Warhammer Runes of Magic 4Story (later renamed Gates of Andaron) Allods online Alganon (yupp, i went there).
The list is too long, but if you notice i only mentioned straight ripp offs. I didn't include anything with action combat or smaller hotbars, or anything slightly different.
Combat differences just don't do it for me. To not be a clone the game should feel like a new experience. Any game that I step into the game world and it's like "You are the chosen one. Now go through this series of menial tasks for your next few dozen hours of gameplay that have no meaningful impact on the world. So that you can do more grandiose tasks that still have no impact on the world." is the same damn game these producers have been making since EverQuest aka WoW clones.
The combat system doesn't help. For instance Tera has a very interesting combat system that seemed pretty good but I still couldn't make it past the starting zone because I was playing WoW with a better targeting system.
We've been done with WoW clones for ages. Then we went through the Minecraft clone age. The Hearthstone clone age. The MOBA clone age. I wonder what 2018 will clone...
I personally thought that all those games: ESO, GW2, and BDO were WoW clones. I though people just realized the futility of call games WoW clones.
Pardon any spelling errors
Konfess your cyns and some maybe forgiven Boy: Why can't I talk to Him? Mom: We don't talk to Priests. As if it could exist, without being payed for. F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing. Even telemarketers wouldn't think that. It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
I've only ever reached endgame in LotRO, SWTOR, ArcheAge in terms of theme parks because I find such games insufferable and almost always burn out in the questing phase but I definitely did play ESO.
Between racial bonuses that make your race best for specific types of builds (For instance Argonians being the best healers, Nords being the best with 2h weapons etc.) and the class picks being pretty meaningful in that there are some pretty important skills that come from your class trees (For instance my templar being a good tank because he had a skill that allowed me to feed my mana into increased health and stam regen) ESO suffers from the "Make the right picks without playing the game or gimp yourself" syndrome just like any other WoW clone. Increased customization beyond that point doesn't matter. Any system that ever has you wanting to reroll because you want to try a different build style is bad.
I quested about halfway to max which really was only as bearable as it was because it was the first game I ever played together with my fiancé. When her laptop died and we were unable to play PC games together again for a long time, we had not interest in going back to ESO because it was essentially a WoW clone only made fun by the fact we played it together.
When the questing to max is the bulk of the experience for MMO players who don't generally play any game longer than a month or two. Having that questing to max be the primary early game in every MMO means ESO, WoW etc. are simply not deserving of the title of "genre".
Also, adding in the ability to craft endgame gear really doesn't change much. Nor does "only needing one set of gear". I've never had more than one set of gear in any WoW clone. The progression is still about gear and it still only offers the same few types of endgame content find in any WoW clone ever. Hell. Even ArcheAge does a better job with pack stealing and castle sieges being added in. What type of content does ESO offer that is unique to ESO or done in a way completely different from it's clone brethren? Closest I can think of is Open world PvP that I found very reminiscent of the Ettenmoors.
EVE, Runescape, in Wurm are all unique titles with completely different core gameplay that can all be described as sandbox. There is no meaningful variation within your "themepark genre". Themepark genre = WoW clones.
And yes all the big money is getting poured into Themeparks. With increasingly less success ever since WoW became king to the point that this genre is died up and there are like 1 or 2 new MMOs on the horizon not being made by indie groups that got funded through Kickstarter. The genre is dying because despite you people thinking all you need is a better done WoW clone you need anything but. You get bored with it almost as fast as me. I just recognize that and never bother to play a game anymore unless I can see how it is truly and meaningfully different from WoW. You give them the box sales and one or two months of sub fees they need to think it's still a decent idea.
I am ok with a similar game but done properly,Blizzard doesn't do games properly.
BY that i mean ,questing is ok,lose the yellow markers and ALL hand holding and NO xp for quests.Weapons should be skill based and since the game uses enhancing then utilize elemental properties and all mobs should also have similar affinities.
The world should feel like a world,meaning perhaps separate currencies for different regions,an over world leader for each region,a KING or whatever,the world is just not a place to litter npc's and mobs to get quest xp.
Characters should be multi classed but still focus on a MAIN/ROLE.I could go on and on but it is not my job to make the games for Blizzard,they can stick to making superficial EASY games with Esport gimmicks to make profits and let the more immersive developers make the better mmorpgs. Problem is that the Blizzard method is SIMPLE,so everyone keeps copying it,especially with costs being so high,nobody wants to put in the work to make a good well done mmorpg.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
I've only ever reached endgame in LotRO, SWTOR, ArcheAge in terms of theme parks because I find such games insufferable and almost always burn out in the questing phase but I definitely did play ESO.
Between racial bonuses that make your race best for specific types of builds (For instance Argonians being the best healers, Nords being the best with 2h weapons etc.) and the class picks being pretty meaningful in that there are some pretty important skills that come from your class trees (For instance my templar being a good tank because he had a skill that allowed me to feed my mana into increased health and stam regen) ESO suffers from the "Make the right picks without playing the game or gimp yourself" syndrome just like any other WoW clone. Increased customization beyond that point doesn't matter. Any system that ever has you wanting to reroll because you want to try a different build style is bad.
I quested about halfway to max which really was only as bearable as it was because it was the first game I ever played together with my fiancé. When her laptop died and we were unable to play PC games together again for a long time, we had not interest in going back to ESO because it was essentially a WoW clone only made fun by the fact we played it together.
When the questing to max is the bulk of the experience for MMO players who don't generally play any game longer than a month or two. Having that questing to max be the primary early game in every MMO means ESO, WoW etc. are simply not deserving of the title of "genre".
Also, adding in the ability to craft endgame gear really doesn't change much. Nor does "only needing one set of gear". I've never had more than one set of gear in any WoW clone. The progression is still about gear and it still only offers the same few types of endgame content find in any WoW clone ever. Hell. Even ArcheAge does a better job with pack stealing and castle sieges being added in. What type of content does ESO offer that is unique to ESO or done in a way completely different from it's clone brethren? Closest I can think of is Open world PvP that I found very reminiscent of the Ettenmoors.
EVE, Runescape, in Wurm are all unique titles with completely different core gameplay that can all be described as sandbox. There is no meaningful variation within your "themepark genre". Themepark genre = WoW clones.
And yes all the big money is getting poured into Themeparks. With increasingly less success ever since WoW became king to the point that this genre is died up and there are like 1 or 2 new MMOs on the horizon not being made by indie groups that got funded through Kickstarter. The genre is dying because despite you people thinking all you need is a better done WoW clone you need anything but. You get bored with it almost as fast as me. I just recognize that and never bother to play a game anymore unless I can see how it is truly and meaningfully different from WoW. You give them the box sales and one or two months of sub fees they need to think it's still a decent idea.
Tell me if i got this wrong but my impression is that you never got to Wow endgame but your qualified to compare games and name them clones?
Comments
Same thing with zoned difficulty. End game raids were invented by Everquest so I don't see how anything on your list actually makes something a Wow clone.
Wow did bring in plenty of new things or things that were rare in earlier games that suddenly became common. Instanced dungeons for instance existed before Wow but they werent so common, most dungeons in most games were public.
Soloing have existed since M59 as well but Wow had way more of it then any earlier game.
Wows auctionhouse was not a new feature as such but how it was made became a standard anyways.
Also, Wow was first with having people stuck in the endgame for a long time. The earlier games had a long levelcurve and released expansions rather often so the endgame was just something for the fast people to do while waiting for the next expansion.
EQ2 is not a good example as some stated BTW, while it released before Wow the game got revamped pretty fast to be far more like Wow wehn SOE noticed how much popular it became then their own game.
And it is not a single feature that makes a Wow clone even if it is stolen directly from Wow, it is rather that the game feel very similar to Wow in general while you play it even if it differs in some ways. After all could you argue that Wow is a kind of EQ clone, it was made by people that played EQ (Morhaime and Kaplan met in a EQ raid guild), Wow have a lot in common with EQ but the games does not feel similar to play, that is why it isn't really a clone even if it shares so many features.
Rift is a good example, it differs from Wow but the gameplay still feels very similar. ESO, GW2 and BDO on the other hand does not feel like playing Wow so they are not clones. Does that makes sense?
You are welcome to your own opinion, but the skill, ability, and faction systems were far more in depth. Just finding abilities in shops, finding they exist at all, and finding everything needed to craft the ability was challenging. The faction system wasn't nearly so straightforward as horde vs alliance. There were factions for religion, class, and race. Crafting wasn't a simple click with a list of recipes. Classes and races had attribute bonuses, racial abilities, and experience penalties that actually mattered. Obviously, such an in-depth system is not for most people. That is why we have these more simplified games like WoW.
Wurm, EVE, Runescape and Darkfall - 2 of them have you pick a race. None of them have you pick a class. Your class is built organically through your gameplay or in Wurm and Darkfall there are classlike limitations you can accept once you have played the game for awhile (Destroyer in Darkfall and Priests in Wurm) and even then they are not irreversible decisions.
"Zoned Difficulty" is not what I said. What I said was "then has me quest through a series of zones". "Quest through a series of zones" is your key phrase there. Questing as your sole primary content and single path to efficient progression is a hallmark of WoW clones. It's not a feature of any of the four games I listed as not being WoW clones. Yes EVE and Runescape have quests(missions)... as one of many equally viable options. And because of this the map opens up much faster and is less segregated by level zones in all of these games.
"Endgame Content" is not really a phrase in any of these games because it's essentially the same content you have access to at level 1. In WoW clones you start in quests and end in dungeons. There are some appetizer dungeons along the way but they don't have the same role they do in the "end game." In EVE as an example, you start mining tritatium and doing level 1 missions in a frigate and end doing level 5s in a carrier or high end complexes, mining mercoxit in null sec etc. but this is essentially the same content you were doing at the start of the game scaled up in difficulty. The cut-off between early game and endgame is invisible and easily missed while in a WoW clone there is this major moment where you are like "Great, I'm max level now. I'm never doing another quest again. Time to go run dungeons." Maybe it's just so painfully obvious to me because I loathe questing.
Also, sometimes it feels like Wow is playing "Simon says" with the other games, they try to add most features Wow have no matter if it is a good feature or not. Thankfully seems they have stopped that now, nt all Wows ideas were great. The several times speeding up of the time it takes to level lead to the rather strange setup of modern MMOs were they are built like EQ but you outlevel almost all content the first few weeks.
Are we about done with WoW clones? No, and in my opinion we never will be.
What we are finally getting wise to is the lower quality of some of these, while the good quality ones go from strength to strength.
Now good quality doesn't have to mean Nasa levels of virtual graphics. Quality refers to a whole host of things in a game:
Combat, movement, content, race diversity, presentation, support, updates etc etc.
The mmo theme park games that have these continue to thrive.
Maybe the original question should be:
Is any major developer thinking of bringing out the next AAA theme park mmorpg ala WoW, FFXIV?
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
And no, Theme Parks are not done.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
This covered it well a few years ago...
https://www.mmorpg.com/mobile/features.cfm?read=9107&game=15&ismb=1
To which I would add the following titles which at launch played far too closely to WOW IMO and felt like "I've played this game before"
1) Warhammer Online
2) LOTRO
3) SWTOR
4) AOC
5) Rift
6) Tera
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
WoW and ESO (And all the other clones killing this genre) - I pick a race and a class at the start of the game before having any opportunity to play the game.
WoW and ESO (And all the other clones killing this genre) - My primary content from level one to max is going through quests. "Kill X enemies." "Talk to this guy." "Gather this item!" Etc. It's the same few quest templates recycled dozens of times to give the illusion there is lots of content.
WoW and ESO (And all the other clones killing this genre) - Beyond item progression there is gear progression. Various grades of gear and power based on the sources it comes from and how much RNG loves me. When I reach max level this becomes the primary focus of progression.
WoW and ESO (And all the other clones killing this genre) - Gear progression focuses primarily around group content. Dungeons, raids, and group PvP in arenas or PvP designated zones.
You're going to have to stretch real hard to do that given that the core content in Runescape is quests that have actually have effort put into making them, mini-games, and skill grinding. And none of those three things even exist in EVE.
Swtor
Warhammer
Runes of Magic
4Story (later renamed Gates of Andaron)
Allods online
Alganon (yupp, i went there).
The list is too long, but if you notice i only mentioned straight ripp offs. I didn't include anything with action combat or smaller hotbars, or anything slightly different.
The combat system doesn't help. For instance Tera has a very interesting combat system that seemed pretty good but I still couldn't make it past the starting zone because I was playing WoW with a better targeting system.
Then we went through the Minecraft clone age.
The Hearthstone clone age.
The MOBA clone age.
I wonder what 2018 will clone...
Boy: Why can't I talk to Him?
Mom: We don't talk to Priests.
As if it could exist, without being payed for.
F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing.
Even telemarketers wouldn't think that.
It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
No fate but what we make, so make me a ham sandwich please.
Between racial bonuses that make your race best for specific types of builds (For instance Argonians being the best healers, Nords being the best with 2h weapons etc.) and the class picks being pretty meaningful in that there are some pretty important skills that come from your class trees (For instance my templar being a good tank because he had a skill that allowed me to feed my mana into increased health and stam regen) ESO suffers from the "Make the right picks without playing the game or gimp yourself" syndrome just like any other WoW clone. Increased customization beyond that point doesn't matter. Any system that ever has you wanting to reroll because you want to try a different build style is bad.
I quested about halfway to max which really was only as bearable as it was because it was the first game I ever played together with my fiancé. When her laptop died and we were unable to play PC games together again for a long time, we had not interest in going back to ESO because it was essentially a WoW clone only made fun by the fact we played it together.
When the questing to max is the bulk of the experience for MMO players who don't generally play any game longer than a month or two. Having that questing to max be the primary early game in every MMO means ESO, WoW etc. are simply not deserving of the title of "genre".
Also, adding in the ability to craft endgame gear really doesn't change much. Nor does "only needing one set of gear". I've never had more than one set of gear in any WoW clone. The progression is still about gear and it still only offers the same few types of endgame content find in any WoW clone ever. Hell. Even ArcheAge does a better job with pack stealing and castle sieges being added in. What type of content does ESO offer that is unique to ESO or done in a way completely different from it's clone brethren? Closest I can think of is Open world PvP that I found very reminiscent of the Ettenmoors.
EVE, Runescape, in Wurm are all unique titles with completely different core gameplay that can all be described as sandbox. There is no meaningful variation within your "themepark genre". Themepark genre = WoW clones.
And yes all the big money is getting poured into Themeparks. With increasingly less success ever since WoW became king to the point that this genre is died up and there are like 1 or 2 new MMOs on the horizon not being made by indie groups that got funded through Kickstarter. The genre is dying because despite you people thinking all you need is a better done WoW clone you need anything but. You get bored with it almost as fast as me. I just recognize that and never bother to play a game anymore unless I can see how it is truly and meaningfully different from WoW. You give them the box sales and one or two months of sub fees they need to think it's still a decent idea.
BY that i mean ,questing is ok,lose the yellow markers and ALL hand holding and NO xp for quests.Weapons should be skill based and since the game uses enhancing then utilize elemental properties and all mobs should also have similar affinities.
The world should feel like a world,meaning perhaps separate currencies for different regions,an over world leader for each region,a KING or whatever,the world is just not a place to litter npc's and mobs to get quest xp.
Characters should be multi classed but still focus on a MAIN/ROLE.I could go on and on but it is not my job to make the games for Blizzard,they can stick to making superficial EASY games with Esport gimmicks to make profits and let the more immersive developers make the better mmorpgs.
Problem is that the Blizzard method is SIMPLE,so everyone keeps copying it,especially with costs being so high,nobody wants to put in the work to make a good well done mmorpg.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.