Should Tortage from AOC be the "blueprint" for leveling and questing?

flguy147 · March 2019

Even if you hated Age of Conan, the one common theme i have heard about the game which i played a ton of was the soundtrack was incredible and the first 20 levels aka Tortage zone was one of the best experiences in a zone players have had. Is it just that hard to replicate or what? Personally i feel like it was incredible experience going through it the first time ever. And i cant even pinpoint exactly what made it so immersive, it just was.

Wizardry · March 2019

Nope because it is a single player design that removes the entire game world to become an instance,
It is at least a unique idea but not a good MMO idea.My biggest peeve was everything felt like an offline game,even the questing was unlocking homes to open up new quests,the kind of stuff other players will not see,only you,so imo Funcom doesn't know how to build an online game.

I also realized that Funcom started rushing their games even within AOC,there was missing or a lack of content around mid game,then this TSW looked really lame,another online game that was designed like a single player game,then the survival game,another fast cash grab.

Funcom does come up with some nice ideas but seems they just rush through the designs,if they stop and put some effort into them they might actually be good games.

Quizzical · March 2019

No, because if all games followed the same template, then there wouldn't be much variety.

Hatefull · March 2019

Wizardry said:

Nope because it is a single player design that removes the entire game world to become an instance,
It is at least a unique idea but not a good MMO idea.My biggest peeve was everything felt like an offline game,even the questing was unlocking homes to open up new quests,the kind of stuff other players will not see,only you,so imo Funcom doesn't know how to build an online game.

I also realized that Funcom started rushing their games even within AOC,there was missing or a lack of content around mid game,then this TSW looked really lame,another online game that was designed like a single player game,then the survival game,another fast cash grab.

Funcom does come up with some nice ideas but seems they just rush through the designs,if they stop and put some effort into them they might actually be good games.

Nope, wrong again.

To the point of the post, no it could have been done better and I would recommend fewer quest markers, and I really dislike being locked into a class. Having said that, Dark Templar was by far the best tank class I have ever played.

But no, starting zones do not appeal to me no matter how well they are done.

foppotee · March 2019

Tortage is one of the best tutorial zones there has been since it exposed a little bit of almost everthing of the game.

Is AoC still surviving? Fucom kept making big plans & promises for AoC & then kept delaying most of them then released that new Conan online game so I just figured Funcom let it shrivel-up & die. I don't trust Funcom's word because of AoC & it seems they have some good big ideas but lousy executethem sometimes.

Nebless · March 2019

flguy147 said:

Is it just that hard to replicate or what?

Well I guess if you moved all the Khopshef Province quests to Khemi you could.

While I'll agree Tortage is probably the best part of the game, the thing's that make it good is it's smaller size / quest hub area. Almost all of the quests are located in a very tiny area, which wouldn't really work for the rest of the game although it would make the main cities much more active.

The fact all the quests are voice acted is a plus the first couple times around, after that I think you'd find most of us just breeze through the sub-titles and frankly I would rather have the voice acting like it is now, just scattered here and there, little bonuses. I'll agree going from all to pretty much nothing was a shock, but in the long run really doesn't effect the game.

As to running back and forth, I haven't found a game yet that doesn't subject you to that. The closest fix I've seen is in LotRO where you can auto pick up some quests on the fly and auto turn them in as they finish.

Sovrath · March 2019

Hatefull said:

Wizardry said:

Nope because it is a single player design that removes the entire game world to become an instance,
It is at least a unique idea but not a good MMO idea.My biggest peeve was everything felt like an offline game,even the questing was unlocking homes to open up new quests,the kind of stuff other players will not see,only you,so imo Funcom doesn't know how to build an online game.

I also realized that Funcom started rushing their games even within AOC,there was missing or a lack of content around mid game,then this TSW looked really lame,another online game that was designed like a single player game,then the survival game,another fast cash grab.

Funcom does come up with some nice ideas but seems they just rush through the designs,if they stop and put some effort into them they might actually be good games.

Nope, wrong again.

To the point of the post, no it could have been done better and I would recommend fewer quest markers, and I really dislike being locked into a class. Having said that, Dark Templar was by far the best tank class I have ever played.

But no, starting zones do not appeal to me no matter how well they are done.

I agree with this first statement. And I rarely agree with him.

It was horrible. It was a single player game system. Tortage sucked.

What Funcom should do is make a single player game, different combat, or at least combat that is evolved from what the mmorpg had, and build from Tortage in a more quality way.

But for an mmorpg? Thumbs down.

IsilithTehroth · March 2019

Tortage was the lie. They polished it to try to hook players, but once you got out you realize how lacking the game was especially the non existent end game. So on cimmeria pvp we just went to the desert capital(I forgot the name Khesia i think). All of the end game bosses available were broken. So much content was cut out just before release too, tons of content. I bought a collectors edition which they gave the items away for free to everyone. Game was fun until you realize there wasn't much to the game. Pvping was fun, but cities(was an exploit to pvp against) and strongholds were meaningless. Then you have the slew of bugs/exploits like the gems which resulted to 1 shotting guardians.

Hatefull · March 2019

I would also like to point out, and this may garner some...hate but a Blueprint is exactly what this genre of gaming does not need right now. What we need is someone (sorry) to innovate a new way to play truly massive games in a living world, and actually, live up to the two ideas.

I know, and I am not smart enough to give a good answer on how to describe what I mean when I say innovate, however, I am damn sure the blueprint we have been seeing over and over for 20 some odd years at this point does not work (for me at least) anymore.

flguy147 · March 2019

Sovrath said:

Hatefull said:

Wizardry said:

Nope because it is a single player design that removes the entire game world to become an instance,
It is at least a unique idea but not a good MMO idea.My biggest peeve was everything felt like an offline game,even the questing was unlocking homes to open up new quests,the kind of stuff other players will not see,only you,so imo Funcom doesn't know how to build an online game.

I also realized that Funcom started rushing their games even within AOC,there was missing or a lack of content around mid game,then this TSW looked really lame,another online game that was designed like a single player game,then the survival game,another fast cash grab.

Funcom does come up with some nice ideas but seems they just rush through the designs,if they stop and put some effort into them they might actually be good games.

Nope, wrong again.

To the point of the post, no it could have been done better and I would recommend fewer quest markers, and I really dislike being locked into a class. Having said that, Dark Templar was by far the best tank class I have ever played.

But no, starting zones do not appeal to me no matter how well they are done.

I agree with this first statement. And I rarely agree with him.

It was horrible. It was a single player game system. Tortage sucked.

What Funcom should do is make a single player game, different combat, or at least combat that is evolved from what the mmorpg had, and build from Tortage in a more quality way.

But for an mmorpg? Thumbs down.

I am pretty sure they do have another Conan game in development that hasnt been announced with any details yet and its not the rts game just anounced or released. So you might get your wish on a single player game. Conan world is incredible.

Nebless · March 2019

Sovrath said

It was horrible. It was a single player game system. Tortage sucked.

You had a solo experience after you washed up on the beach, but once through the gate into the play area, it wasn't.

Now yes the Night time Destiny quests were solo, but that was more of a personalized story for your class so it worked.

Every other Daytime quest was groupable, most don't in the normal course, but you'll still see groups for the Bat Demon and the escort quest out of the Hall of the Black One's.

flguy147 · March 2019

Hatefull said:

I would also like to point out, and this may garner some...hate but a Blueprint is exactly what this genre of gaming does not need right now. What we need is someone (sorry) to innovate a new way to play truly massive games in a living world, and actually, live up to the two ideas.

I know, and I am not smart enough to give a good answer on how to describe what I mean when I say innovate, however, I am damn sure the blueprint we have been seeing over and over for 20 some odd years at this point does not work (for me at least) anymore.

I used it in quotation marks, cause i agree with you but didnt know how to really word it. But they did somehow make that Tortage so much fun to play through, that i havent realy experienced in just the questing part of a MMO.

Nebless · March 2019

foppotee said:

Is AoC still surviving?

Yes it is. Just in the last year they had a very successful special PvE server event. A kind of OK Pvp event and current are running a promotional event in support of Funcom's new RTS game that's coming out.

For all of those the servers pop's jumped. The special PvE one brought back a lot of old and a number of new players, the Pvp one was very active and this current one has Tortage and post-Tortage zones very active with old and new players.

Also one of the Mod's has said something new is in the works for later this year, so it's not quite dead yet.

Nebless · March 2019

I just want to add, that from reading alot of these posts I get the impression that people are commenting on the early version of the game when it first came out. And as everyone and their brother has said that version was lacking; lack of quests post-Tortage, holes in quests in the 50's etc... etc....

Well that version has had fixes since it first came out. Questing now flows better at all levels, the game did get some kind of optimization so it runs better, some of the combo's were shortened.

If you're still judging the game from 2008 when it came out, you might want to take another look at it. There's still bugs, there's still poor design decision's, but it's a heck of alot better now.

DrunkWolf · March 2019

Im assuming people are talking about Tortage night time? the quest arc ? because that was 100% single player, and yeah if i wanted to play a single player game then it was great. Day time tortage was like every other MMO, click the npc with the shinny thing over his head, make sure your friends are on the same part of the quest chain, go fetch stuff and bring it back, or go kill 20 of what ever.

Kilrain · March 2019

I don’t like quests or following stories.

Talemire · March 2019

Tortage was so good that it made everything after that seem like garbage. That's how I felt 10 years ago, though. Not sure what it's like today.

LackingMMO · March 2019

Starting areas should get you going and make you want to move on. Sadly in AoC most people moved on and wanted to move back, that's the problem with people liking the starting more than the end.

Nilden · March 2019

Meh it was pretty much yellow exclamation marks from WoW with some voice acting. Nothing really stuck out for me from pretty much every other game.

I don't really see any prime examples on why this should be a blueprint over say yellow exclamation points with voice acting...

Kyleran · March 2019

Tortage was the best part of AOC, but not the best part of MMORPGs so no, it really isn't any sort of standard bearer in their designs.

Quicksand · March 2019

I haven't thought about Tortage in a long time... Now I miss AoC again. Absolutely loved Tortage!

TheDarkrayne · March 2019

I always thought it was overrated tbh. I mean it's good but plenty of other MMOs have done it just as good... and carried it on throughout the game.

rounner · March 2019

Nebless said:

I just want to add, that from reading alot of these posts I get the impression that people are commenting on the early version of the game when it first came out. And as everyone and their brother has said that version was lacking; lack of quests post-Tortage, holes in quests in the 50's etc... etc....

Well that version has had fixes since it first came out. Questing now flows better at all levels, the game did get some kind of optimization so it runs better, some of the combo's were shortened.

If you're still judging the game from 2008 when it came out, you might want to take another look at it. There's still bugs, there's still poor design decision's, but it's a heck of alot better now.

Its not about bugs or lack of quests.

- It was solo centric (it doesn't matter if you can theoretically group, you didn't have to and it was not designed for grouping).
- It was too linear, you couldn't just ignore Tortage and go off somewhere else.
- It did not accommodate exploration (areas tightly level restricted), crafting (just an afterthought) or other elements that others like in mmorpg's.

If this thread was a question "which game had the best noob area" AOC would be way down the list for me.

Po_gg · March 2019

rounner said:

Its not about bugs or lack of quests.

- It was solo centric (it doesn't matter if you can theoretically group, you didn't have to and it was not designed for grouping).
- It was too linear, you couldn't just ignore Tortage and go off somewhere else.
- It did not accommodate exploration (areas tightly level restricted), crafting (just an afterthought) or other elements that others like in mmorpg's.

Nebless was right in that AoC was sort of "finished" in the following years after launch, and most people still used to cite the issues about the first few months... yep, it was a rushed launch, with a pretty bad aftertaste, no question about it. Funcom never could keep a deadline, and they didn't want to postpone one more time I guess. But most of those issues are long gone.

As for your points, Tortage has both single and multiplayer parts, and grouping _did_ matter during the daytime. Almost all quest chains end up in a group quest, and in places even just being there was pretty unsafe alone (depth of Underhalls, with the fast respawns for a start, or the Black Ones on White Sands Isle). Daytime was pretty harsh at launch for a solo player - it was toned down a bit over the years.

It wasnt more linear than the starter zone of most games... it offers three main paths during day, plus the solo class storyline at night. At launch you couldn't skip it, that is true - for that reason they've added the Smuggler, through that route you can now leave the island regardless of the blockade and Strom.

No part is level restricted, you can go anywhere on Tortage - if you can survive it

There were places for exloration (tucked away spots not included in quests - when they later added the "vistas" they usually put the globes on those spots), just as well hidden (sort of) quests, like the island of the Apes.

Crafting, that is not part of Tortage, you only get access to the crafting system when you reach the mainland.

Po_gg · March 2019

Gorwe said:

Hey pogg, how long will the Hardcore server run? Until...? Also, it's Hardcore PvE server, right?

Hiya Gorwe o7

It isn't a hardcore server, just an event, sorta. No new servers for it, like at the previous two times (Saga of Zath, and of Blood for pvp).

With Unconquered they've just added a toggle into the character creator, so when you roll a new character (on either servers I believe, but I have no idea who would try a deathless leveling on the pvp server...), you can mark him/her as unconquered.

If you do, until the first death of that character you receive rewards during the leveling process.

You also can display it on your name tag for other players, that you are on a death-free journey. (maybe not the best idea, even if AoC has a decent community. There are several ways to troll someone into a death, and then you have to start over... especially in dungeon PUGs)

No other changes beyond that, so nope for the hardcore PvE as well, it is the regular leveling with an extra thrill. No fight till you can, no close shaves, usually when you drop near 30% HP it is time to flee even if the mobs are near death too - I assume it will be "worse" as you get closer to the level cap, and with it you'll have much more invested time to lose with a wrong pull or an unexpected respawn.

Interesting idea, imo. I was always against permadeath in MMOs (connection problems, server issues, lag... plenty of things can ruin your character outside of the game's context), but when it's just a few cosmetic rewards and fluff at stakes, it can be a nice challenge.

Keller · March 2019

Tortage is a good example of how a "starter" zone can grab your attention. Also it is a good example of linear questing.

Best blueprint for a starting zone is Lotro's the Shire. Delivering pies, landmarks, exploring, farming, villages : it had it all. Plus high levels would still visit after they had done all the quests.

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Should Tortage from AOC be the "blueprint" for leveling and questing?

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Should Tortage from AOC be the "blueprint" for leveling and questing?

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Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV