I like to think that the ES fans who always hated faction separation didn't really have a clue how much damage they were doing to the social aspect of the game by lobbying to get rid of it. They just seemed to hate it because it was not a TES thing or didn't want any of that Matt Firor DAoC crap in their game.
I agree with most of the post but not this bit.
It was more about the freedom. I think if they were free to go wherever they wanted but that there were hostile areas that "could" have worked.
But hard segregating the world because of 3 faction pvp isn't what a good amount of Elder Scrolls fans were looking for.
Exploration and freedom is what they were looking for.
Essentially they were looking for <insert their favorite Elder Scrolls Game> online and that you could play with friends/others.
That's it. And that's not really what we got.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
I like to think that the ES fans who always hated faction separation didn't really have a clue how much damage they were doing to the social aspect of the game by lobbying to get rid of it. They just seemed to hate it because it was not a TES thing or didn't want any of that Matt Firor DAoC crap in their game.
I agree with most of the post but not this bit.
It was more about the freedom. I think if they were free to go wherever they wanted but that there were hostile areas that "could" have worked.
But hard segregating the world because of 3 faction pvp isn't what a good amount of Elder Scrolls fans were looking for.
Exploration and freedom is what they were looking for.
Essentially they were looking for <insert their favorite Elder Scrolls Game> online and that you could play with friends/others.
That's it. And that's not really what we got.
I understand that but along with that freedom came essentially triple the megaserver size for PvE and like I said, server size is one of the factors that plays into socialization - the bigger they are the more anonymous you are.
Sure you can huddle together in a guild with a group of friends and socialize that way but that's what all MMOs, old or new, have always had and I've never considered that to be the factor that makes an MMO more or less sociable.
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I do not know about MMOs but I think I have become less sociable. Over time and finding groups where people are mean I have begun to distance myself. Which is wholly on me I guess. I am less inclined to group when there was a time I never played without grouping.
I think that having come across things I don't want to deal with grouping has become one of the things I don't want to any more. Which is sad. I do think I have to make an effort and try to change that when I used to enjoy grouping so much in older games.
The only thing I got out of old school MMo's is that I hate most people.
It depended on the game.....UO and FFXI had terrible communities...One was a vicious gankfest and the other was a bunch of elite snobs that had no interest whatsoever in helping out new players....EQ though had a great community...The players were very helpful. Anarchy Online also had a great community when it came to helping others.
You musta played on a shite server for FFXI. I played on Gilgamesh and the old school players always helped out the new players. Back then you could loan a stranger a set of +1 armour and they'd actually return it to you, Something like that would never happen today.
Well, here's an example. If you wanted a group in Dark Age of Camelot, you had to get in voice comms or you didn't get invited. Lineage 2, people lived in Ventrilo because PvP. Nowdays, you just click a button, join a queue and you've got a group. Take that as you will. Yes, the social aspects of MMO's have drastically changed over the years, whether you like it or not. Older MMO's needed certain classes to fill out groups, nowdays every class is a swiss army knife and able to solo most content. Those of you who are too young to remember the late 90's and early 00's of online gaming, just won't have a clue what it used to be like. Period.
I like to think that the ES fans who always hated faction separation didn't really have a clue how much damage they were doing to the social aspect of the game by lobbying to get rid of it. They just seemed to hate it because it was not a TES thing or didn't want any of that Matt Firor DAoC crap in their game.
I agree with most of the post but not this bit.
It was more about the freedom. I think if they were free to go wherever they wanted but that there were hostile areas that "could" have worked.
But hard segregating the world because of 3 faction pvp isn't what a good amount of Elder Scrolls fans were looking for.
Exploration and freedom is what they were looking for.
Essentially they were looking for <insert their favorite Elder Scrolls Game> online and that you could play with friends/others.
That's it. And that's not really what we got.
I understand that but along with that freedom came essentially triple the megaserver size for PvE and like I said, server size is one of the factors that plays into socialization - the bigger they are the more anonymous you are.
Sure you can huddle together in a guild with a group of friends and socialize that way but that's what all MMOs, old or new, have always had and I've never considered that to be the factor that makes an MMO more or less sociable.
But I think that's fine.
I would offer that there is a certain desirability to get lost in the world and then, when you want to seek people out, you can.
That's one of the greatest downsides of Elder Scrolls Online. There always a person around ALWAYS.
It's so tiring.
I almost think it should have been done like guild wars. A lot of people in the cities/towns/maby certain outlying lands, and then when you leave you have the area to you and your party.
Obviously that's personal preference.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
No, people are less social. Even in games like FFXIV I see people all the time trying to initiate conversation during things but most just ignore them or give simple one word reply and that's that. There's no reason people couldn't be more social if they wanted to, but they don't. If EQ came out today it would be the same.
But who wants to talk to a stranger while they're busy?
If people weren't social in EQ, they couldn't survive well or long. With the exception of two classes I believe.
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While there's a point in Kaji's and kitarad's notion (people are less social now), I believe that ain't the full answer, since it's general and applies everything not just on games.
Could be a good topic on its own though, how social media and instant connection makes people actually less social...
What I've found really interesting in the thread (and also in the OP) is
how easily everyone accepts the premise of "social == grouping for
content", and cite game mechanics, rewards, etc. as the root of the
issue.
The exception was camel, as usual he has good points from a broader angle.
Group content aint equal social, it's only a mean to the end, just a tool to bring people together and give them a chance of socializing - if they want to.
Removing the forced part of grouping doesn't kill off socializing, if the intent ain't there in the first place... and people indeed are less sociable now.
When GW2 launched there was a similar article (from Shannon I believe?), about how the design choice (no need to group up) was a smart way because players of today won't see forced grouping as a chance to meet new people, just as an extra annoyance.
And pretty much that's the case now, in most games. You don't have to group up, if you don't want to. Or, can find easy "pick and and the throw away" group through in-game tools when you're forced to group up.
But, those changes didn't make the games less sociable... just made the life of the alreadyless sociable players easier.
The bottom line is, a game is only as sociable as its players are. And that's why I found it odd OP was using LotRO as one of the examples, it's maybe the most sociable MMORPGs out there...
Sure, maybe not in the aforementioned "social == group content" meaning (but group content is still actively played), nor the other common (and false imo) view of "combat is the core ascept of the game".
That doesn't mean there aren;t other activities that can build social bonds. Combat isn't the only reason to group, or interact with others. Roleplaying, the player economy, player events and whatever else you can think of.
LotRO's community, especially on the RP servers, is always socializing, there's no week (usually) without community events. I'd take that as socializing over instances/raids any day - but maybe that's just me.
I loved the way City of Heroes/Villains grouping worked. I enjoyed how you had so many different combination of classes and having 8 people in a group meant you could mix and match an insane amount and try and work things out and even when your group wasn't really optimal or even able to do the content if we worked together it really managed to come together albeit slowly.
I didn't really enjoy the current private server because of how they allowed so much of the distinctive classes to cross over both Heroes and Villains. It worked so much better before when there were limitations and people were forced to work together with more thought and planning. It also killed the Villains side when they allowed all the unique classes to be played by Heroes.
Grouping is an individual responsibility. You have to make an effort to make it work and be enjoyable. If it isn't walk away from the group. I often do it.
I think that the way working together these days is structured mainly for the end game and certain dungeons for the loot the people playing them are more goal oriented and less about the people you are playing with. I prefer playing with guild members but I miss meeting that random PUG that turned out great.
Based on my own experience I'd say it is really less social but I am very old school so take that with a grain of salt.
They are still social but no were near as social as back in early everquest days, in those days your reputation actually mattered and if you were an asshole you didnt find groups and most content was group based unless you were a couple classes. WoW came along and made MMO easy mode gaming with instant gratification, you didnt even need to talk to your group for dungeons just speed run through it for your insta loot and peace out, you could even solo to endgame on any character so there was no need to group or socialize and reputation meant nothing so the toxic levels rouse to astonishing levels (there was toxicity back in those days to but nothing like today). Todays MMO are all EZ mode basically, unfortunately the generation of MMO today want that ez loot and gratification, they want to be max lvl in a couple days then bitch that there is nothing to do, hell i remember grinding for 6 hours getting 3 bubs of experience and feeling like it was a good day, specially seeing as one death would completely wipe all that exp out if i couldnt find a REZ (rezzes werent 100% either so dying still had consequences). Unfortunately EQ today has changed as well to cater to the EZ mode generation, my outlook on mmorpg today are not good for now.
When people start talking about "social" in MMORPGs, why is it that all they think about is the grouping?
For social interaction, players need more than that. Because players need to know other players better. What MMORPGs need is more social interaction outside of that.
You group, then it's done. You may never see those other players again.
What these games need is player interaction in trade and other community style actions. It's unfortunate that players only think of the dungeon runs and quests when they think of playing an MMORPG. It's a total waste of that "massively" part.
What I have noticed is that action combat and faster paced gameplay has made it more difficult to be social while adventuring, especially for gamers like me who do not want to use voice chat. Instancing and phasing also play a big role in separating players and keeping them from interacting with each other while adventuring. Placing much if not most of the rewards in a cash shop removes an important incentive to adventure in general and certainly makes grouping much less worth the hassle.
I like a good mix of solo and group content, but with slower paced gameplay and an open world with public areas, public dungeons and dynamic events. Being able to buff and heal strangers as I pass by or adventure around them. Grouping on demand when I'm in an area that is more difficult and gathering with other adventurers organically in those areas for dynamic events. Being rewarded with the entire range of gold, magic items, consumables, crafting items, special item graphics and effects and lore for playing the game counts toward not only the enjoyment, but also to the community of players. Cash shops dilute if not completely remove this personal and communal incentive.
Zone/World/OOC chat in any MMO has been a mess since 1999. Only thing that'd devolved has been the people. People's attention spam has been getting shorter and less patient. Fortnight is a good example of this. All content is short with happy quick rewards. Tictoc is the same thing, being social means something different for this generation.
You can see I don't post. Mostly I don't need to, whats another opinion supporting an already stated opinion?!
Xatsh said it first in his comments.
Blizzard revolutionized the market when they figured out how to simplify the system to suck in console gamers. This shot their subs sky high! And it worked. Then they kept going with this concept. To the point that today you have Retail World of Warcraft.
A game where you can log in and in under 5 minutes be in the center of some action and advancing your character goals, whatever they might be. You want to craft? You want to quest? You want to do a dungeon? Or maybe raid? In under 5 minutes you can be actively pursuing your goal.
Early MMO's didn't have the mechanics to provide you with all these fancy features; that removed the social aspect from the game. AO, UO and EQ didn't even have "raid groups", in the beginning. You had to walk up hill, in the snow, both ways to raid! 40 man groups were 8 groups of 5 folks in unlinked groups taking on raid content. If you didn't chat, you didn't progress.
You logged in and if you weren't part of an active guild you spent your next 20 minutes (minimum) looking for a group that was willing to do what content you were working on. You also needed specific classes to do that! Classes were specialized to do one thing well and anything else poorly. Sure you could solo content with your healer, but expect to put in some serious time. You needed the holy trinity, back then; Tank, Healer, DPS. CC was always cream on top, and actually meant something.
And there was a cost to your actions! If you died, you lost exp. This cost more than anything else forced the player base into a community. You didn't want to pay this cost, so you grouped, but to group you had to find players. And if you found someone who sucked or screwed you over, you shared this with the "community". Folks could and were shunned and forced off servers by bad social behavior. "Social Behavior".
All said and done, I will not go back. I admit it. Blizzard has spoiled me. I play classic because I can't stand Retail. But I play classic. I won't go back to AO, UO or EQ. Blizzard did this to the MMO industry and to me.
---------------------------------------- My dog barks some. Mentally you picture my dog, but I have not told you the type of dog which I have. Perhaps you even picture Toto, from "The Wizard of Oz." But I warn you, my dog is always with me.
What has happened is that they have shifted towards being online chat rooms that people use to communicate while they move through their solo game. So some aspects of communication and socialization are greater. At a high/surface level.
What has lessened is the more intimate socialization. The one where you have a static group of people that you bond with through the trials and tribulations of gameplay. To be sure you can still find that, but overall the genre has shifted to the former.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
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We'll see when Pantheon releases just how well an old school MMO will do today pushing the social side.
Personally I like Guild Ward 2 and thats about it as most other MMOs have lost even the passive social interaction that GW2 has kept.
My first MMO was SWG back in 2003 and for the first 3 months, I never talked to a single person. Once I got in to the social side of things, started buying Doc and Ent buffs, actively joined a guild and became part of that ecosystem, the game became larger for me but no, the games back then were just as insulated as they are now. It's a choice people need to make. Forced social scenarios will fail. Add the mechanics, see what happens. It's all Devs can do.
A Note on activities in MMORPGs or other games which may have some sort of apparently or possible Forced Socializing.
Aren't there things in Real Life that can sometimes force us (or at least attempt) to force us to socialize?
Families/Family Gatherings
School
Work
Sports
Of course, things like Religious Gatherings, Military Service, Clubs, and other such Social Groups/Activities are usually entirely optional in this day and age.
"If everything was easy, nothing would be hard."
"Show me on the doll where PVP touched you."
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My first MMO was SWG back in 2003 and for the first 3 months, I never talked to a single person. Once I got in to the social side of things, started buying Doc and Ent buffs, actively joined a guild and became part of that ecosystem, the game became larger for me but no, the games back then were just as insulated as they are now. It's a choice people need to make. Forced social scenarios will fail. Add the mechanics, see what happens. It's all Devs can do.
Some people might argue that SWG had forced social scenarios. You mention that the game became bigger once you began to open up and communicate. That to me shows that that a large portion of the game "requires" social interaction.
I did the same thing in EQ. I played most of my 6 years solo and never had a bad time playing it, though it is more often than not the primary example of a "forced" social game.
I just believe in these scenarios, you in SWG and me in EQ, it's just us playing the game the way we want and the game actually allowing it. It's not as "forced" as people tend to believe, but the bigger more prominent features of the game would lead you to expanding and being more social in order to access it.
I'm curious how you feel about modern games because of this. For me they pose no challenge and are rather boring. I hate plowing through content without any challenge and if others who thought EQ as forced grouping don't like how easy the modern games are it's no wonder I don't.
No, no, no. Yes a social MMO will be popular but it is solo play that keeps it alive. EVERYONE plays an MMO solo at some point. I tied WOW because the other two major MMO at the time DEMANDED grouping to level (Everquest and Lineage II). Being a polite care bear was anathema (and still is in most) in these games and, heaven forbid, if you tell people that is what you are. I went to Wow and could group whenever I wanted but play solo to endgame and stayed for 13 years. MMO's ARE declining BECAUSE more and more are demanding social grouping.
No, no, no. Yes a social MMO will be popular but it is solo play that keeps it alive. EVERYONE plays an MMO solo at some point. I tied WOW because the other two major MMO at the time DEMANDED grouping to level (Everquest and Lineage II). Being a polite care bear was anathema (and still is in most) in these games and, heaven forbid, if you tell people that is what you are. I went to Wow and could group whenever I wanted but play solo to endgame and stayed for 13 years. MMO's ARE declining BECAUSE more and more are demanding social grouping.
Which ones are "demanding social grouping"?
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Old games were more social? yeah they were.
Can we just re-make the same concepts in new games? no because players have changed.
Does that mean we can't make social games anymore? no, it means you have to RETHINK how to make them social in the new reality.
You can no longer force players into grouping, you can no longer create artificial need for long breaks, you can no longer make people spend extremely long time of getting the right classes to join a group and travel for 30 minutes to destinations.
Instant action and instant gratification is not social, but you can introduce new kinds of social, more subtle and less demanding kind of social interactions, more freedom to choose when to be social and when not to - From the idea that all people want some form of social relations in games too, it is just individual how much and when they want to have it.
It is the sum of a lot of things, to not provide features that destroy social but also not have features that destroy fun ... to encourage social behaviours through rewards.
Dungeon finder = not social, but that doesn't mean there can not be QoL systems that makes getting groups together easier. Insta travel not good, but you could put in systems that makes it easier to get players to your location.
Strict class setups can be redesigned, giving more tactical options so you don't necessarily need a holy trinity + dps, more tactical combat so you could rely on shields or avoidance more than hp spunge heals, more cc options, etc .. and NOT SCALE CONTENT but make the fights last longer with fewer players, making it possible to beat content without a full group but just less efficient and more challenging. It should be an option to play group content as a duo (WITHOUT SCALING).
ETC. ok this is getting too long .. cutting here.
Old games were more social? yeah they were.
Can we just re-make the same concepts in new games? no because players have changed.
Does that mean we can't make social games anymore? no, it means you have to RETHINK how to make them social in the new reality.
You can no longer force players into grouping, you can no longer create artificial need for long breaks, you can no longer make people spend extremely long time of getting the right classes to join a group and travel for 30 minutes to destinations.
Instant action and instant gratification is not social, but you can introduce new kinds of social, more subtle and less demanding kind of social interactions, more freedom to choose when to be social and when not to - From the idea that all people want some form of social relations in games too, it is just individual how much and when they want to have it.
It is the sum of a lot of things, to not provide features that destroy social but also not have features that destroy fun ... to encourage social behaviours through rewards.
Dungeon finder = not social, but that doesn't mean there can not be QoL systems that makes getting groups together easier. Insta travel not good, but you could put in systems that makes it easier to get players to your location.
Strict class setups can be redesigned, giving more tactical options so you don't necessarily need a holy trinity + dps, more tactical combat so you could rely on shields or avoidance more than hp spunge heals, more cc options, etc .. and NOT SCALE CONTENT but make the fights last longer with fewer players, making it possible to beat content without a full group but just less efficient and more challenging. It should be an option to play group content as a duo (WITHOUT SCALING).
ETC. ok this is getting too long .. cutting here.
You might be on to something.
"If everything was easy, nothing would be hard."
"Show me on the doll where PVP touched you."
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Comments
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Sure you can huddle together in a guild with a group of friends and socialize that way but that's what all MMOs, old or new, have always had and I've never considered that to be the factor that makes an MMO more or less sociable.
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I think that having come across things I don't want to deal with grouping has become one of the things I don't want to any more. Which is sad. I do think I have to make an effort and try to change that when I used to enjoy grouping so much in older games.
You musta played on a shite server for FFXI. I played on Gilgamesh and the old school players always helped out the new players. Back then you could loan a stranger a set of +1 armour and they'd actually return it to you, Something like that would never happen today.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
I didn't really enjoy the current private server because of how they allowed so much of the distinctive classes to cross over both Heroes and Villains. It worked so much better before when there were limitations and people were forced to work together with more thought and planning. It also killed the Villains side when they allowed all the unique classes to be played by Heroes.
Grouping is an individual responsibility. You have to make an effort to make it work and be enjoyable. If it isn't walk away from the group. I often do it.
I think that the way working together these days is structured mainly for the end game and certain dungeons for the loot the people playing them are more goal oriented and less about the people you are playing with. I prefer playing with guild members but I miss meeting that random PUG that turned out great.
Based on my own experience I'd say it is really less social but I am very old school so take that with a grain of salt.
For social interaction, players need more than that.
Because players need to know other players better.
What MMORPGs need is more social interaction outside of that.
You group, then it's done. You may never see those other players again.
What these games need is player interaction in trade and other community style actions.
It's unfortunate that players only think of the dungeon runs and quests when they think of playing an MMORPG.
It's a total waste of that "massively" part.
Once upon a time....
I like a good mix of solo and group content, but with slower paced gameplay and an open world with public areas, public dungeons and dynamic events. Being able to buff and heal strangers as I pass by or adventure around them. Grouping on demand when I'm in an area that is more difficult and gathering with other adventurers organically in those areas for dynamic events. Being rewarded with the entire range of gold, magic items, consumables, crafting items, special item graphics and effects and lore for playing the game counts toward not only the enjoyment, but also to the community of players. Cash shops dilute if not completely remove this personal and communal incentive.
Xatsh said it first in his comments.
Blizzard revolutionized the market when they figured out how to simplify the system to suck in console gamers. This shot their subs sky high! And it worked. Then they kept going with this concept. To the point that today you have Retail World of Warcraft.
A game where you can log in and in under 5 minutes be in the center of some action and advancing your character goals, whatever they might be. You want to craft? You want to quest? You want to do a dungeon? Or maybe raid? In under 5 minutes you can be actively pursuing your goal.
Early MMO's didn't have the mechanics to provide you with all these fancy features; that removed the social aspect from the game. AO, UO and EQ didn't even have "raid groups", in the beginning. You had to walk up hill, in the snow, both ways to raid! 40 man groups were 8 groups of 5 folks in unlinked groups taking on raid content. If you didn't chat, you didn't progress.
You logged in and if you weren't part of an active guild you spent your next 20 minutes (minimum) looking for a group that was willing to do what content you were working on. You also needed specific classes to do that! Classes were specialized to do one thing well and anything else poorly. Sure you could solo content with your healer, but expect to put in some serious time. You needed the holy trinity, back then; Tank, Healer, DPS. CC was always cream on top, and actually meant something.
And there was a cost to your actions! If you died, you lost exp. This cost more than anything else forced the player base into a community. You didn't want to pay this cost, so you grouped, but to group you had to find players. And if you found someone who sucked or screwed you over, you shared this with the "community". Folks could and were shunned and forced off servers by bad social behavior. "Social Behavior".
All said and done, I will not go back. I admit it. Blizzard has spoiled me. I play classic because I can't stand Retail. But I play classic. I won't go back to AO, UO or EQ. Blizzard did this to the MMO industry and to me.
----------------------------------------
My dog barks some. Mentally you picture my dog, but I have not told you the type of dog which I have. Perhaps you even picture Toto, from "The Wizard of Oz." But I warn you, my dog is always with me.
What has happened is that they have shifted towards being online chat rooms that people use to communicate while they move through their solo game. So some aspects of communication and socialization are greater. At a high/surface level.
What has lessened is the more intimate socialization. The one where you have a static group of people that you bond with through the trials and tribulations of gameplay. To be sure you can still find that, but overall the genre has shifted to the former.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Personally I like Guild Ward 2 and thats about it as most other MMOs have lost even the passive social interaction that GW2 has kept.
I did the same thing in EQ. I played most of my 6 years solo and never had a bad time playing it, though it is more often than not the primary example of a "forced" social game.
I just believe in these scenarios, you in SWG and me in EQ, it's just us playing the game the way we want and the game actually allowing it. It's not as "forced" as people tend to believe, but the bigger more prominent features of the game would lead you to expanding and being more social in order to access it.
I'm curious how you feel about modern games because of this. For me they pose no challenge and are rather boring. I hate plowing through content without any challenge and if others who thought EQ as forced grouping don't like how easy the modern games are it's no wonder I don't.
Which ones are "demanding social grouping"?
https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Troll
https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Troll
Can we just re-make the same concepts in new games? no because players have changed.
Does that mean we can't make social games anymore? no, it means you have to RETHINK how to make them social in the new reality.
You can no longer force players into grouping, you can no longer create artificial need for long breaks, you can no longer make people spend extremely long time of getting the right classes to join a group and travel for 30 minutes to destinations.
Instant action and instant gratification is not social, but you can introduce new kinds of social, more subtle and less demanding kind of social interactions, more freedom to choose when to be social and when not to - From the idea that all people want some form of social relations in games too, it is just individual how much and when they want to have it.
It is the sum of a lot of things, to not provide features that destroy social but also not have features that destroy fun ... to encourage social behaviours through rewards.
Dungeon finder = not social, but that doesn't mean there can not be QoL systems that makes getting groups together easier. Insta travel not good, but you could put in systems that makes it easier to get players to your location.
Strict class setups can be redesigned, giving more tactical options so you don't necessarily need a holy trinity + dps, more tactical combat so you could rely on shields or avoidance more than hp spunge heals, more cc options, etc .. and NOT SCALE CONTENT but make the fights last longer with fewer players, making it possible to beat content without a full group but just less efficient and more challenging. It should be an option to play group content as a duo (WITHOUT SCALING).
ETC. ok this is getting too long .. cutting here.
"I am my connectome" https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HA7GwKXfJB0
You might be on to something.