If a game has to entice players with cheap "daily" gimmicks, it just means that game lacks compelling content to keep players logging in every day.
This is a big red flag for me personally - games that have daily login rewards - means they are compensating for shallow repetitive gameplay.
Personally whenever I see daily rewards - immediate turnoff, as it really exposes the Skinner box design method behing most games.
I so agree. I play LotRO and ESO every so often. LotRO just launched the new wedding event, a set of repetitive quests which ultimately lead to a choice of cosmetic rewards and completion of a 'wrapper' deed. It requires you to complete X daily quests X times, but ultimately the duration of the festival is only X+5 days.
So people are requesting extensions of the festival, so they have more time to complete 'the deed'.
Both games also feature daily login rewards, ESO goes as far as to send me emails to 'remind' me of the goodies I'm missing out on if I don't log in soon.
So after 2 days of online play, after one forum thread at LotRO, I'm already disappointed. Disappointed in the design choices made by devs and marketeers and disappointed in the weak will of my fellow players.
So it's back to Skyrim for me.
Honestly, if anyone knows of a fantasy MMO that features little to no daily quests with no daily login rewards and no p2convenience store, please, do share. Don't keep this gem to yourself. Please.
If a game has to entice players with cheap "daily" gimmicks, it just means that game lacks compelling content to keep players logging in every day.
This is a big red flag for me personally - games that have daily login rewards - means they are compensating for shallow repetitive gameplay.
Personally whenever I see daily rewards - immediate turnoff, as it really exposes the Skinner box design method behing most games.
I so agree. I play LotRO and ESO every so often. LotRO just launched the new wedding event, a set of repetitive quests which ultimately lead to a choice of cosmetic rewards and completion of a 'wrapper' deed. It requires you to complete X daily quests X times, but ultimately the duration of the festival is only X+5 days.
So people are requesting extensions of the festival, so they have more time to complete 'the deed'.
Both games also feature daily login rewards, ESO goes as far as to send me emails to 'remind' me of the goodies I'm missing out on if I don't log in soon.
So after 2 days of online play, after one forum thread at LotRO, I'm already disappointed. Disappointed in the design choices made by devs and marketeers and disappointed in the weak will of my fellow players.
So it's back to Skyrim for me.
Honestly, if anyone knows of a fantasy MMO that features little to no daily quests with no daily login rewards and no p2convenience store, please, do share. Don't keep this gem to yourself. Please.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Typically they are so insignificant I don't care. ESO has some good ones like taking an entire day off crafting research.
Not sure why it would anger anyone though lol.
I've noticed that they're fine when I'm actually playing, but after I've missed a few days of rewards it becomes easier to set aside the game due to missed rewards.
I would be willing to play a little worse of a game if it lacked log on rewards.
Practice doesn't make perfect, practice makes permanent.
"At one point technology meant making tech that could get to the moon, now it means making tech that could get you a taxi."
I view them in the same way as daily quests or daily dungeon bonuses. It helps those with more limited play time to make some efficient progression or earn some rewards.
Playing - FFXIV, ESO Played - FFXI, WoW, Lineage 2, Guild Wars, Aion, SWToR, LotRO, GW2, TERA, Rift, ArcheAge, TSW
I like Daily Rewards. I can't afford membership every month and it's nice to get a "present" everyday for logging into ESO. I've gotten quite a few non-combat pets this way; which is awesome.
This is just another example of MMORPG's being led around by the nose by revenue models. So its not surprising players balk at it. We want to come online when WE want to come online, if you treat people like Pavlov's dogs long enough they become jaded and just don't want to know anymore.
Well EVE online has been running them for way to long now, and now forcing boosters on you not letting you choose when you like to use it is frustrating, and i was ok with the skins but did not realize many of them are 7 days temporary ones, not much use then.
I view them in the same way as daily quests or daily dungeon bonuses. It helps those with more limited play time to make some efficient progression or earn some rewards.
This is a psychological trick to make players feel like they are making some progression
In reality it's just a carrot on a stick, once you realize this the daily mechanics lose all appeal
I am not unfamiliar with the concept of the carrot on a stick or skinner box approach to MMO design. Nor do I religiously do daily quests for fear of missing out. Daily quests are more like weekend quests for me, as I have more important things to do with my limited time on weekdays.
But yes, I will often login on weekdays just to collect those login bonuses. Since it only takes a minute to login then logoff, I might as well get those rewards so I'll have them to use over the weekend. Some days I'll forget to login, in which case I just shrug my shoulders. You make it sound like everyone who doesn't mind these login bonuses are extremely addicted and will have a nervous breakdown if they miss out on them.
Playing - FFXIV, ESO Played - FFXI, WoW, Lineage 2, Guild Wars, Aion, SWToR, LotRO, GW2, TERA, Rift, ArcheAge, TSW
I view them in the same way as daily quests or daily dungeon bonuses. It helps those with more limited play time to make some efficient progression or earn some rewards.
This is a psychological trick to make players feel like they are making some progression
In reality it's just a carrot on a stick, once you realize this the daily mechanics lose all appeal
I am not unfamiliar with the concept of the carrot on a stick or skinner box approach to MMO design. Nor do I religiously do daily quests for fear of missing out. Daily quests are more like weekend quests for me, as I have more important things to do with my limited time on weekdays.
But yes, I will often login on weekdays just to collect those login bonuses. Since it only takes a minute to login then logoff, I might as well get those rewards so I'll have them to use over the weekend. Some days I'll forget to login, in which case I just shrug my shoulders. You make it sound like everyone who doesn't mind these login bonuses are extremely addicted and will have a nervous breakdown if they miss out on them.
If I make it sound like that - that's my fault in failing to communicate my point.
The point is the login rewards are disguised as a gift to costumer where the real intent is to just have people log in more in hope of playing and spending more money.
I agree, that really is the point behind the design. That the short time that I login for the reward, something might catch my eye on the cash shop. ESO is pretty blatant in regards to this, their daily login rewards UI is basically a panel in the crown store. Whether I actually end up spending more money, I can't say. I don't buy cash shop currency outside of what I get from my subscription.
Playing - FFXIV, ESO Played - FFXI, WoW, Lineage 2, Guild Wars, Aion, SWToR, LotRO, GW2, TERA, Rift, ArcheAge, TSW
Bottom line is that even if we consider the publisher or developer as being mostly honest,the very least they are simply trying to keep you in the game because that increases the chance of cash shop use .
I believe i mentioned FFXI,SE actually does a very good job here.Simple reason is that the login rewards were not there from the beginning,they were added as a show of appreciation to those that continue to support the game after 15+ years.Also FFXI does not have a cash shop so there is no negatives attached to FFXI's login rewards.
However typically you will see the idea of login awards attached to cash shop games ,other than FFXI it is likely 99.9% cash shop games doing it AND has some dishonesty tied into it.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Remember back in the day when you could just log into a game and do the things you wanted without feeling psychologically fked if you didn't do what game devs wanted you to do for the day/week simply because it was 'easy' or 'just there.'
FF14 can kind of get away with this simply because of how simple the game is at its core. Pretty much at the end game, stuff is build around 1-2 weekly things (usually the 4 raid bosses + the 24-man for most people) and the weekly tomes, all of which can be done (depending on the difficulty of the 4 raid bosses) in a matter of hours after reset. There will still be daily stuff you can do but honestly its mostly cosmetic progression or crafting related (if you're that kind of person), so it leaves you with time do what you 'want' to do if you like the overall game.
As a counter, WoW has this endless pointless grind that impacts EVERYONE (and I'll include emissaries as a 'log-in' reward since most end up taking 10 mins to complete). If you're casual, you're going to be doing a set amount of activities dictated by the game through time-gates until more things become available to through your daily progress or if you find people to carry you to bypass most of that. If you're mid, chances are you've been playing consistently and still have to do the stuff as casuals but you have more tact-on which revolves around massive RNG from that point on. If you're hardcore, you have to deal with both the casual and midcore progression as well as another layer of RNG with RNG being the main way that dictates who performs well currently in 8.3 and less so player skill (if you don't believe me, go run some rBGs atm in 8.3 and see how 'fun' it is getting one shot by people with 'good' corruptions).
I dislike the daily log-in bonus for many reasons. One of the main ones for me is it breaks immersion. I DM table top game and I could never see items just poofing into my players in bag... well once but that's a different story... but that's the point it was part of the story and had a reason.
Items that just "fall from the sky" no thanks. You want to do something like this than make everyone who wants a free items go to an npc and perform the "beg" emote.
Actually I would really like to see that and see how many people would do that...
Meh. Kinda impartial. If they dont have any i would prefer it as they dont serve any purpose for me, but i guess it does make people log in dailly.. even if just for a minute.
If a game has to entice players with cheap "daily" gimmicks, it just means that game lacks compelling content to keep players logging in every day.
This is a big red flag for me personally - games that have daily login rewards - means they are compensating for shallow repetitive gameplay.
Personally whenever I see daily rewards - immediate turnoff, as it really exposes the Skinner box design method behing most games.
I so agree. I play LotRO and ESO every so often. LotRO just launched the new wedding event, a set of repetitive quests which ultimately lead to a choice of cosmetic rewards and completion of a 'wrapper' deed. It requires you to complete X daily quests X times, but ultimately the duration of the festival is only X+5 days.
So people are requesting extensions of the festival, so they have more time to complete 'the deed'.
Both games also feature daily login rewards, ESO goes as far as to send me emails to 'remind' me of the goodies I'm missing out on if I don't log in soon.
So after 2 days of online play, after one forum thread at LotRO, I'm already disappointed. Disappointed in the design choices made by devs and marketeers and disappointed in the weak will of my fellow players.
So it's back to Skyrim for me.
Honestly, if anyone knows of a fantasy MMO that features little to no daily quests with no daily login rewards and no p2convenience store, please, do share. Don't keep this gem to yourself. Please.
As far as I know, EQ doesn't have daily loggin rewards; at least it didn't the last time I played it. It has been quite a few years though.
I view them in the same way as daily quests or daily dungeon bonuses. It helps those with more limited play time to make some efficient progression or earn some rewards.
This is a psychological trick to make players feel like they are making some progression
In reality it's just a carrot on a stick, once you realize this the daily mechanics lose all appeal
I am not unfamiliar with the concept of the carrot on a stick or skinner box approach to MMO design. Nor do I religiously do daily quests for fear of missing out. Daily quests are more like weekend quests for me, as I have more important things to do with my limited time on weekdays.
But yes, I will often login on weekdays just to collect those login bonuses. Since it only takes a minute to login then logoff, I might as well get those rewards so I'll have them to use over the weekend. Some days I'll forget to login, in which case I just shrug my shoulders. You make it sound like everyone who doesn't mind these login bonuses are extremely addicted and will have a nervous breakdown if they miss out on them.
If I make it sound like that - that's my fault in failing to communicate my point.
The point is the login rewards are disguised as a gift to costumer where the real intent is to just have people log in more in hope of playing and spending more money.
I agree, that really is the point behind the design. That the short time that I login for the reward, something might catch my eye on the cash shop. ESO is pretty blatant in regards to this, their daily login rewards UI is basically a panel in the crown store. Whether I actually end up spending more money, I can't say. I don't buy cash shop currency outside of what I get from my subscription.
exactly - and that's the thing - if it weren't for the daily login reward, would you log in at all?
Because just logging in to collect the reward - you are clearly not playing the game anymore, so the primary motive for logging in (playing the game) is no longer there.
You are only logging in for the reward, so the entire system works as intended - devs are getting people to log into the game not because they still want to play, but just to collect the daily reward - and every login there's a chance - as you put it - for something to catch your eye and then you might spend a bit in the cash shop.
You're right, I probably would not login during the weekdays if not for the reward. But not because I don't want to play the game, but because I don't have the time to play. I actually do play beyond the login rewards over the weekends, when I have the time for lengthy gaming sessions.
So while I don't have the time to play the game properly on weekdays, I can spare the minute to collect a reward that will benefit me during my actual play sessions later. In words similar to yours, I'm logging in because I still want to play, but I don't have time for much beyond collecting the daily reward (at least on weekdays).
Playing - FFXIV, ESO Played - FFXI, WoW, Lineage 2, Guild Wars, Aion, SWToR, LotRO, GW2, TERA, Rift, ArcheAge, TSW
Comments
I so agree. I play LotRO and ESO every so often. LotRO just launched the new wedding event, a set of repetitive quests which ultimately lead to a choice of cosmetic rewards and completion of a 'wrapper' deed. It requires you to complete X daily quests X times, but ultimately the duration of the festival is only X+5 days.
So people are requesting extensions of the festival, so they have more time to complete 'the deed'.
Both games also feature daily login rewards, ESO goes as far as to send me emails to 'remind' me of the goodies I'm missing out on if I don't log in soon.
So after 2 days of online play, after one forum thread at LotRO, I'm already disappointed. Disappointed in the design choices made by devs and marketeers and disappointed in the weak will of my fellow players.
So it's back to Skyrim for me.
Honestly, if anyone knows of a fantasy MMO that features little to no daily quests with no daily login rewards and no p2convenience store, please, do share. Don't keep this gem to yourself. Please.
I've got nothing.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I would be willing to play a little worse of a game if it lacked log on rewards.
Practice doesn't make perfect, practice makes permanent.
"At one point technology meant making tech that could get to the moon, now it means making tech that could get you a taxi."
Playing - FFXIV, ESO
Played - FFXI, WoW, Lineage 2, Guild Wars, Aion, SWToR, LotRO, GW2, TERA, Rift, ArcheAge, TSW
But yes, I will often login on weekdays just to collect those login bonuses. Since it only takes a minute to login then logoff, I might as well get those rewards so I'll have them to use over the weekend. Some days I'll forget to login, in which case I just shrug my shoulders. You make it sound like everyone who doesn't mind these login bonuses are extremely addicted and will have a nervous breakdown if they miss out on them.
Playing - FFXIV, ESO
Played - FFXI, WoW, Lineage 2, Guild Wars, Aion, SWToR, LotRO, GW2, TERA, Rift, ArcheAge, TSW
Playing - FFXIV, ESO
Played - FFXI, WoW, Lineage 2, Guild Wars, Aion, SWToR, LotRO, GW2, TERA, Rift, ArcheAge, TSW
Bottom line is that even if we consider the publisher or developer as being mostly honest,the very least they are simply trying to keep you in the game because that increases the chance of cash shop use .
I believe i mentioned FFXI,SE actually does a very good job here.Simple reason is that the login rewards were not there from the beginning,they were added as a show of appreciation to those that continue to support the game after 15+ years.Also FFXI does not have a cash shop so there is no negatives attached to FFXI's login rewards.
However typically you will see the idea of login awards attached to cash shop games ,other than FFXI it is likely 99.9% cash shop games doing it AND has some dishonesty tied into it.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Items that just "fall from the sky" no thanks. You want to do something like this than make everyone who wants a free items go to an npc and perform the "beg" emote.
Actually I would really like to see that and see how many people would do that...
If they dont have any i would prefer it as they dont serve any purpose for me, but i guess it does make people log in dailly.. even if just for a minute.
https://ashesofcreation.com/r/Y4U3PQCASUPJ5SED
So while I don't have the time to play the game properly on weekdays, I can spare the minute to collect a reward that will benefit me during my actual play sessions later. In words similar to yours, I'm logging in because I still want to play, but I don't have time for much beyond collecting the daily reward (at least on weekdays).
Playing - FFXIV, ESO
Played - FFXI, WoW, Lineage 2, Guild Wars, Aion, SWToR, LotRO, GW2, TERA, Rift, ArcheAge, TSW