A Newbie's Guide to Demon's Souls: What I Learned in My First True 'Souls' Experience | MMORPG.com

System · November 2020

A Newbie's Guide to Demon's Souls: What I Learned in My First True 'Souls' Experience | MMORPG.com

Mike shares some important things he's learned as a 'Souls' newbie when playing the Demon's Souls remake on PlayStation 5.

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Gorwe · November 2020

I just can't take anyone fawning over Demon Souls Remaster quite seriously. It is a PS3 title, how hard can it be to play it? You can probably play it on PS4, PS3(cheaper option), even PC(emulators).

Look, I am not against Remasters when they are done properly(like this is) because I myself would like to see that happening(Dungeon Siege 1 and 2?), but I also think that this is overblown. And that the Remaster itself don't deserve that much praise.

lahnmir · November 2020

When I buy a PS5 it will be for this game alone. There can not be enough fawning over how much of an upgrade this is over the original and that was probably the best Souls game out there. Essential and brilliant.

I also love the word fawning, fawning.

/Cheers,
Lahnmir

lahnmir · November 2020

remsleep said:

lahnmir said:

When I buy a PS5.....

lol good luck tying to find one for sale at retail price

I am in no hurry, waiting for the second round with a bigger SSD anyways

/Cheers,
Lahnmir

Gorwe · November 2020

lahnmir said:

When I buy a PS5 it will be for this game alone. There can not be enough fawning over how much of an upgrade this is over the original and that was probably the best Souls game out there. Essential and brilliant.

I also love the word fawning, fawning.

/Cheers,
Lahnmir

I could and would never buy a whole console for like 2-3 games. That's at least ~600$ and almost NO game is worth 150$+, especially in the digital format.

But you do you, huh. I simply object against this becaise it can ricochet back to me in the form of market change.

ashiru_1978 · November 2020

Gorwe said:

I just can't take anyone fawning over Demon Souls Remaster quite seriously. It is a PS3 title, how hard can it be to play it? You can probably play it on PS4, PS3(cheaper option), even PC(emulators).

Look, I am not against Remasters when they are done properly(like this is) because I myself would like to see that happening(Dungeon Siege 1 and 2?), but I also think that this is overblown. And that the Remaster itself don't deserve that much praise.

Not only that, but all the games by the studio are literally the same game with a different name. You can't even jump in it and all you do is fight tough enemies and learn how to dodge... this gets old in like 20 minutes of playing when there isn't much else in the game. I find it very curious how people are still drooling over the same games.

Gorwe · November 2020

ashiru_1978 said:

Gorwe said:

I just can't take anyone fawning over Demon Souls Remaster quite seriously. It is a PS3 title, how hard can it be to play it? You can probably play it on PS4, PS3(cheaper option), even PC(emulators).

Look, I am not against Remasters when they are done properly(like this is) because I myself would like to see that happening(Dungeon Siege 1 and 2?), but I also think that this is overblown. And that the Remaster itself don't deserve that much praise.

Not only that, but all the games by the studio are literally the same game with a different name. You can't even jump in it and all you do is fight tough enemies and learn how to dodge... this gets old in like 20 minutes of playing when there isn't much else in the game. I find it very curious how people are still drooling over the same games.

It's more of an individual feeling of playing it, of overcoming challenges and achieving success, all painted on a background of a bizzare, yet epic medieval dark fantasy.

Factually it isn't much, but it feels like much, much more than it realistically is. With that said, I wouldn't mind if it evolved more than just on graphics axis. Nioh or Fallen Order could be some good starting points.

ashiru_1978 · November 2020

Gorwe said:

ashiru_1978 said:

Gorwe said:

I just can't take anyone fawning over Demon Souls Remaster quite seriously. It is a PS3 title, how hard can it be to play it? You can probably play it on PS4, PS3(cheaper option), even PC(emulators).

Look, I am not against Remasters when they are done properly(like this is) because I myself would like to see that happening(Dungeon Siege 1 and 2?), but I also think that this is overblown. And that the Remaster itself don't deserve that much praise.

Not only that, but all the games by the studio are literally the same game with a different name. You can't even jump in it and all you do is fight tough enemies and learn how to dodge... this gets old in like 20 minutes of playing when there isn't much else in the game. I find it very curious how people are still drooling over the same games.

It's more of an individual feeling of playing it, of overcoming challenges and achieving success, all painted on a background of a bizzare, yet epic medieval dark fantasy.

Factually it isn't much, but it feels like much, much more than it realistically is. With that said, I wouldn't mind if it evolved more than just on graphics axis. Nioh or Fallen Order could be some good starting points.

Demon Souls needs an open world and more freedom on top of the already existing foundation. Instead of having a closed world that looks like a waterpipe and you like the water in it that can only travel forward - make it an open world and allow the player to do whatever they want and pick what adventures they want to go on.

Sovrath · November 2020

Gorwe said:

I could and would never buy a whole console for like 2-3 games. That's at least ~600$ and almost NO game is worth 150$+, especially in the digital format.

But you do you, huh. I simply object against this becaise it can ricochet back to me in the form of market change.

Oh, I would. It's all about the experience and eventually, you will get a few other games that come out. Heck, a girlfriend of mine and I bought the switch solely for breath of the wild and we had so many weekends of entertainment from that thing. It was well worth it.

As long as the game wasn't a 4-hour affair or something like that.

And you can just break down the cost. For someone who doesn't know Demon's souls (as we are using that as the example), it takes closer to 40 hours to finish. so with the game, it's $570 and that's about $14 US dollars each out of entertainment which is more expensive than a movie and certainly far less than concert tickets or any other show.

Not taking into account that people will probably play it again and eventually buy one or two other games.

Mythla · November 2020

Gorwe said:

I just can't take anyone fawning over Demon Souls Remaster quite seriously. It is a PS3 title, how hard can it be to play it? You can probably play it on PS4, PS3(cheaper option), even PC(emulators).

Look, I am not against Remasters when they are done properly(like this is) because I myself would like to see that happening(Dungeon Siege 1 and 2?), but I also think that this is overblown. And that the Remaster itself don't deserve that much praise.

Um, do you realize this is a complete, ground-up, rebuild? Calling the best looking game you can play without a $3,000+ PC "a PS3 title" rather misses the point. I've never understood people who criticize games they've never played (which it's obvious you haven't actually played this) instead of giving them a chance or just ignoring them. It's really your loss in this case /shrug.

Babuinix · November 2020

Gorwe said:

I just can't take anyone fawning over Demon Souls Remaster quite seriously. It is a PS3 title, how hard can it be to play it? You can probably play it on PS4, PS3(cheaper option), even PC(emulators).

Look, I am not against Remasters when they are done properly(like this is) because I myself would like to see that happening(Dungeon Siege 1 and 2?), but I also think that this is overblown. And that the Remaster itself don't deserve that much praise.

Demon Souls deserves all the fawning it gets because it's a genre defining cult classic in gaming history.

The remaster is very well made and greatly improves the gameplay experience since the original ones performance was sometimes so awful that it would dip under 15 fps.

Iselin · November 2020

Good ole Demon Souls. I played it back when it first released and had a love/hate relationship with it. "Hate" only because I'm hopeless playing any game with a controller that requires fast reactive play. I can do that just fine with my 12-button mouse + KB on PC but I suck at it with a controller.

@MikeB

I always enjoy your game articles because you focus on the actual game details that are important to me. You have an analytical character development take on games exactly like mine. It's what interests me the most in any game I play.

Bloodaxes · November 2020

Sovrath said:

-snip
Oh, I would. It's all about the experience and eventually, you will get a few other games that come out. Heck, a girlfriend of mine and I bought the switch solely for breath of the wild and we had so many weekends of entertainment from that thing. It was well worth it.

As long as the game wasn't a 4-hour affair or something like that.

And you can just break down the cost. For someone who doesn't know Demon's souls (as we are using that as the example), it takes closer to 40 hours to finish. so with the game, it's $570 and that's about $14 US dollars each out of entertainment which is more expensive than a movie and certainly far less than concert tickets or any other show.

Not taking into account that people will probably play it again and eventually buy one or two other games.

Different strokes for different folks.

I WANT to play demon souls and bloodborne, but I would never consider buying a console just to play those two games. Especially at launch. Depends on the person of course, but I'm not a person that gets excited for the playstation exclusives.

The majority of games eventually come to PC anyway.

lahnmir · November 2020

Gorwe said:

lahnmir said:

When I buy a PS5 it will be for this game alone. There can not be enough fawning over how much of an upgrade this is over the original and that was probably the best Souls game out there. Essential and brilliant.

I also love the word fawning, fawning.

/Cheers,
Lahnmir

I could and would never buy a whole console for like 2-3 games. That's at least ~600$ and almost NO game is worth 150$+, especially in the digital format.

But you do you, huh. I simply object against this becaise it can ricochet back to me in the form of market change.

I own 60+ Xbox one games, 82 PS4 titles and 141 Switch titles. However, I only purchase a console when THAT game is available, that game that makes me boot up the console in the first place. Once I own that must play title more follow, I just won’t buy a console before that must play title is available. PS5 is lucky, it has the best launch title ever.

/Cheers,
Lahnmir

Sovrath · November 2020

Bloodaxes said:

Sovrath said:

-snip
Oh, I would. It's all about the experience and eventually, you will get a few other games that come out. Heck, a girlfriend of mine and I bought the switch solely for breath of the wild and we had so many weekends of entertainment from that thing. It was well worth it.

As long as the game wasn't a 4-hour affair or something like that.

And you can just break down the cost. For someone who doesn't know Demon's souls (as we are using that as the example), it takes closer to 40 hours to finish. so with the game, it's $570 and that's about $14 US dollars each out of entertainment which is more expensive than a movie and certainly far less than concert tickets or any other show.

Not taking into account that people will probably play it again and eventually buy one or two other games.

Different strokes for different folks.

I WANT to play demon souls and bloodborne, but I would never consider buying a console just to play those two games. Especially at launch. Depends on the person of course, but I'm not a person that gets excited for the playstation exclusives.

The majority of games eventually come to PC anyway.

Well, I will be buying it on PC when it comes out. But it depends on how you look at it.

You just said "play station exclusives." As if that mattered. It doesn't to me.

For me, I strip the marketing out of it. What is it I'm getting? A beloved classic game that, with the remake looks amazing.

That to me is what mattesr. If it wasn't coming to pc I'd buy the playstaion 5. Well, "eventually" as it's apparently difficult to get.

And like I said, it's about $14 per hour of game play "if" you don't do any replay or new game plus and "if" you don't buy any other games which most certainly would eventually happen.

MikeB · November 2020

Iselin said:

Good ole Demon Souls. I played it back when it first released and had a love/hate relationship with it. "Hate" only because I'm hopeless playing any game with a controller that requires fast reactive play. I can do that just fine with my 12-button mouse + KB on PC but I suck at it with a controller.

@MikeB

I always enjoy your game articles because you focus on the actual game details that are important to me. You have an analytical character development take on games exactly like mine. It's what interests me the most in any game I play.

Thanks for the kind words! I'm loving Demon's Souls right now. I can't believe I have this many hours in a Souls game after how many of these games I've ragequit in the past!

I'm fine with a controller unless I have to manually aim. Thankfully, the bow isn't necessary. I use it for pulling when farming Red Eye Knights for souls, but that's about it.

Asheram · November 2020

Gorwe · November 2020

Bloodaxes said:

Sovrath said:

-snip

Oh, I would.

It's all about the experience and eventually, you will get a few other games that come out.

Heck, a girlfriend of mine and I bought the switch solely for breath of the wild and we had so many weekends of entertainment from that thing. It was well worth it.

As long as the game wasn't a 4-hour affair or something like that.

And you can just break down the cost. For someone who doesn't know Demon's souls (as we are using that as the example), it takes closer to 40 hours to finish. so with the game, it's $570 and that's about $14 US dollars each out of entertainment which is more expensive than a movie and certainly far less than concert tickets or any other show.

Not taking into account that people will probably play it again and eventually buy one or two other games.

Different strokes for different folks.

I WANT to play demon souls and bloodborne, but I would never consider buying a console just to play those two games. Especially at launch. Depends on the person of course, but I'm not a person that gets excited for the playstation exclusives.

The majority of games eventually come to PC anyway.

These two won't. Because Sony KNOWS that they are literally selling the units of PlayStation. They have us at a gunpoint and the choice is binary: buy or let go. I also won't purchase a console just for a few games even if it came with, idk, a beautiful girl in tow. No. It's a matter of principles.

Besides, it's not about the price per hour aka DoT. It's about what you have to pay at once(aka Burst). And the Burst is unreasonably high right now. For me.

Bloodaxes · November 2020

Gorwe said:

Bloodaxes said:

Sovrath said:

-snip

Oh, I would.

It's all about the experience and eventually, you will get a few other games that come out.

Heck, a girlfriend of mine and I bought the switch solely for breath of the wild and we had so many weekends of entertainment from that thing. It was well worth it.

As long as the game wasn't a 4-hour affair or something like that.

And you can just break down the cost. For someone who doesn't know Demon's souls (as we are using that as the example), it takes closer to 40 hours to finish. so with the game, it's $570 and that's about $14 US dollars each out of entertainment which is more expensive than a movie and certainly far less than concert tickets or any other show.

Not taking into account that people will probably play it again and eventually buy one or two other games.

Different strokes for different folks.

I WANT to play demon souls and bloodborne, but I would never consider buying a console just to play those two games. Especially at launch. Depends on the person of course, but I'm not a person that gets excited for the playstation exclusives.

The majority of games eventually come to PC anyway.

These two won't. Because Sony KNOWS that they are literally selling the units of PlayStation. They have us at a gunpoint and the choice is binary: buy or let go. I also won't purchase a console just for a few games even if it came with, idk, a beautiful girl in tow. No. It's a matter of principles.

Besides, it's not about the price per hour aka DoT. It's about what you have to pay at once(aka Burst). And the Burst is unreasonably high right now. For me.

There's also the possibility they add it to the PSNow for PC eventually.

cheyane · November 2020

Whenever I try to convince myself I could play this I just have to watch a youtube video that will quickly disabuse me of that notion. The reflexes required are Herculean by my standards. I really envy you young people.

Gorwe · November 2020

cheyane said:

Whenever I try to convince myself I could play this I just have to watch a youtube video that will quickly disabuse me of that notion. The reflexes required are Herculean by my standards. I really envy you young people.

Reflexes? No, you simply have to bide your time and act accordingly. Keep in mind, this is classic Souls experience, from before BloodBorne and RhythmSouls. It's much more about learning patterns, abusing your tools(...magic?) etc.

It is nowhere near to what Nioh and co can become. I don't think 90+ apm is possible in most Souls, in Nioh it can get hectic, especially with faster weapons(Tonfa etc).

Sovrath · November 2020

cheyane said:

Whenever I try to convince myself I could play this I just have to watch a youtube video that will quickly disabuse me of that notion. The reflexes required are Herculean by my standards. I really envy you young people.

Gorwe is right, it's about learning the attack patterns, not freaking out when being attacked (which an of course cause mistakes)

I'm 53 and other than wrestling with the unfamiliarity of a controller, once I get used to it (I have to practice) I usually do well enough.

PC Controls are "ok" more so with something like Dark Souls 3.

You just have to be ok with dying. Don't let that get you down, consider it part of the fun and you will be ok.

Gorwe · November 2020

Sovrath said:

cheyane said:

Whenever I try to convince myself I could play this I just have to watch a youtube video that will quickly disabuse me of that notion. The reflexes required are Herculean by my standards. I really envy you young people.

Gorwe is right, it's about learning the attack patterns, not freaking out when being attacked (which an of course cause mistakes)

I'm 53 and other than wrestling with the unfamiliarity of a controller, once I get used to it (I have to practice) I usually do well enough.

PC Controls are "ok" more so with something like Dark Souls 3.

You just have to be ok with dying. Don't let that get you down, consider it part of the fun and you will be ok.

Thank you, of course I am right. Not only am I perceptive of changes, but also of what something is. There are basically two eras of FROM "Souls" games: before and after BloodBorne. Before they were much more methodical with slower stamina regen, enemies trying to scare you into doing something etc. But they allowed you to approach the situation as freely as possible, given constraints of rules etc. After they became increasingly rhythmic(what I call "breakdance souls") and the freedom in approaching the situation got shrinked into 2, even 1 way of doing it. Best examples of differences are Artorias and Gael. Artorias is much more methodical fight, you can use his moves against him! Gael is much more badass fight, but there is no freedom! You attack when you are told to, or you die. There is no more room for you to outplay enemies. You literally just press buttons like in something like Thumper(feels equally badass though), like a QTE of sorts.

Compare Nioh's fight system and Souls fight system. Souls system looks completely archaic in comparison. Things you can do with Tonfa...Souls can only have wet dreams about that. And such.

cheyane · November 2020

Sovrath said:

cheyane said:

Whenever I try to convince myself I could play this I just have to watch a youtube video that will quickly disabuse me of that notion. The reflexes required are Herculean by my standards. I really envy you young people.

Gorwe is right, it's about learning the attack patterns, not freaking out when being attacked (which an of course cause mistakes)

I'm 53 and other than wrestling with the unfamiliarity of a controller, once I get used to it (I have to practice) I usually do well enough.

PC Controls are "ok" more so with something like Dark Souls 3.

You just have to be ok with dying. Don't let that get you down, consider it part of the fun and you will be ok.

You memorise the patterns and you can succeed, no quick dodge and avoid required? I mean just study the mob and then you can kill it ?

Hello I had problems playing Horizon Zero dawn on normal I played it on easy. I not convinced I can play this but will go and watch some videos of people playing it from the beginning. See if I can actually see the way they play.

I am 65 and no controllers for me just mouse and KB. Controllers only for turn based games.

Babuinix · November 2020

cheyane said:
You memorise the patterns and you can succeed, no quick dodge and avoid required? I mean just study the mob and then you can kill it ?

Hello I had problems playing Horizon Zero dawn on normal I played it on easy. I not convinced I can play this but will go and watch some videos of people playing it from the beginning. See if I can actually see the way they play.

I am 65 and no controllers for me just mouse and KB. Controllers only for turn based games.

Depends a lot in how you build your char and what weapons you use but the game relies on player (dying) experience a lot. What every Souls like game does is having death as a learning lesson. Embracing it goes a long way dealing with the frustration

cheyane · November 2020

Babuinix said:

cheyane said:
You memorise the patterns and you can succeed, no quick dodge and avoid required? I mean just study the mob and then you can kill it ?

Hello I had problems playing Horizon Zero dawn on normal I played it on easy. I not convinced I can play this but will go and watch some videos of people playing it from the beginning. See if I can actually see the way they play.

I am 65 and no controllers for me just mouse and KB. Controllers only for turn based games.

Depends a lot in how you build your char and what weapons you use but the game relies on player (dying) experience a lot. What every Souls like game does is having death as a learning lesson. Embracing it goes a long way dealing with the frustration

I really want to believe this because if I can even play this halfway I would be personally impressed with myself. You're right though about dying being a learning exercise because with death comes the knowledge of how you died. Repeated deaths would suggest you would learn eventually how to avoid said death.

My main issue isn't about the death I can handle that it is only when they want you to perform a series of quick action moves which my poor old hands simply cannot manage that I will fail. From what I have observed players characters are moving very quickly to dodge and get out of the way. This type of actions is simply beyond me no matter how many times I die is what I am afraid of. Path of Exile finally defeated me this way in the maps when I started making negative progress dying and losing more experience than I gained and I had to finally admit to myself I had reached the end of what I was capable of.

I play ARPGs and I can dodge and do stuff but not very well which is why I play pet classes or those with ice attacks to slow down the enemy and thereby giving me some room for mistakes. Or ones with turrets or other forms of assistance because if I have to depend on my own skills we are in far more shit than I care to say. I fear this game is rather unforgiving towards the type of mistakes I envisage I will be making quite frequently.

Although I am definitely intrigued but given that I cannot even make the cliffside in Recore and had to give up because I jump so badly and why I never played a Lara Croft game because I cannot jump accurately. I hated Blackfathom Depths as I fell at the entrance without fail every single time and slowed everyone down and when the PUG group started yelling I would say sorry and leave... get another healer if you cannot help me get to you.

Thanks for igniting the possibility of me playing this game I am quite happy you all have such confidence which I personally lack of my own skills at these games.

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