Twice, Warhammer and Guild Wars 2, overly hyped myself, I felt blind sided by the change over to 3rd generation. I expected more of the same yet better.
Warhammer is easy to explain.... I simply hated it within two hours, and can't putt my finger on why. Later I could. Instantly everything was instanced small zones, RvR got old fast, classes were boring, graphics were not my style.... Experience was given only to scenarios and the world was left empty because of it...... My guess is because something was wrong with the programming where the servers couldn't handle the population. To this day they never admitted it.
Guild Wars 2 From second one, the player was put into story mode. Space bar, space bar, space bar. With water color graphics and glow, the graphics and music were never my style...... Everything was driven by dynamic events, only fun for the first two hours.... Several hours into it, I opened the map to realize I was playing liner advancement from left to right across the map. Two levels at a time then move a little more forward. The story was forced on me, like it or not.
When were you let down ?
I should have moved on from EVerquest, but I was stuck playing it because I was addicted failing hard at life and couldn't afford a new PC--I had limited options due to not having a stable job. So that being aside, for me it was when I noticed how EQ got more and more dumbed down over time. At least, that's how I felt. They kept adding more and more things, and it felt like it was losing its identity. This was around 2007 or thereabout. I was posting in the classic server thread as Naudanyas. This was before progression servers, so what happened is I joined Project 1999 in 2009 and played for the first time late that year into 2010. In Project 1999 all I hoped for was realized. They did everytyhing to exceeding excellence. And it's still going. I can't really explain how amazing they've been to do it so well and so long.
I have great respect for how live did eventually add progression servers. I also respected DBG's decision to leave Project 1999 alone. In fact that caused me to play on live for a while even until recently.
Seems like water under the bridge now. So far from me. So many things have happened since I my first PC. Just remembrances of so many hours spent playing games hardcore.
Yay. Proper straightforward bash-any-game thread. Two times with games that almost felt like dream games to me:
Elite:Dangerous: Such an immersive feeling flying the spaceship. Such a great system with the BGS. So much promise with the powerplay. But the game loops themselves felt really repetitive and shallow to me, and I never felt the game expanding in a way that mattered to me after launch. Horizons was a tech achievement with the space to ground seamless landing but never felt interesting gameplay wise.
BDO: So many things to love about the game: how the world looked and felt, the worker system, the lifeskill activities, the combat, and I hated to my guts their RNG gear upgrade system, the market restrictions, the sloppy and buggy UI and especially, my pet peeve, the AFK systems needing the PC to be kept up and running.
AFK systems. Need PC running. Facepalm.
BDO was amazing in so many ways. The only game breaking problem is really the RNG gear system. 5000 hours to work for the second best piece of gear in the game? One try at upgrading it to the best gear in the game and it fails then you lose the item completely. Could been the best MMO ever imo.
I don't know if let down was teh word, maybe very disappointed....Warhammer is a great example.....WE didn't get alot of things taht we were promised to be in at launch...There were a couple of cities I am not sure if they ever made it to the game.....The game itself was just OK but nothing special.....I endured until just past level 20 when the game became unbearable.....I played a Choppa and when we fought in RVR it was a nightmare.....I literally spent 3/4 of my playtime unable to move because the crowd control mechanics of the game were just ridiculous....It came down to players just playing 4-5 classes because the melees basically were worthless due to the CC.
GW2 byt the time I got to it was well past the hype and my epectations were pretty low.....To me it was just more of the same stuff...Go fight in an area, other players join in, rinse and repeat.....I really saw no reason to go on...Once again, made it to level 20 or so and had seen enough.
You can also add Age of Conan and The Secret World to my list.
1 cash shops 2 further monetization 3 mobile gaming 4 developers willingness to aim low "Arpg's/mobas/CS Go type games". 5 Smedley reappears
I have seen no pisitive signs,Indie devs with puny budgets,low end work are actually taking over bigger studios and that is really sad.
I see no signs of an upswing especially seeing Valorant and FN still atop the popularity list,just simple shooters.The funny thing is that 20 years ago shooters were not all that popular,we had UT and Quake but at the world cyber games "Korea"they were mildly supported.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
When WoW went Kung Fu Panda I realized I was no longer the target audience. Things have changed a lot since then and I actually enjoy the Pandarean expansion. WAR and AoC were letdowns, but WoW “forced” me out around the same time, so that is why I choose MoP.
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
When WoW went Kung Fu Panda I realized I was no longer the target audience. Things have changed a lot since then and I actually enjoy the Pandarean expansion. WAR and AoC were letdowns, but WoW “forced” me out around the same time, so that is why I choose MoP.
Even before Panda, WoW abended their original target all audience for 10 and younger AND end game radars.
I'm surprised how many responses here didn't like Warhammer Online, I always assumed it was just me.
I never got to play AoC, and when I found time, it was already getting negative reviews. Also the first 10 levels had the solo story thing going on that turned me off.
Once you level up to max level, there is nothing else to do. And it don't take long to max your level.
Your disappointment is well founded during launch year yes, but they added a ton since and an alternate advancement system after max level. They completely rewrote the gear system (gear did not matter at all orginally, just exploits on gems... which got nerfed).
But you never/rarely get a second chance to make a first impression. They never recovered the players lost during the disaster launch and lack of end game (and gaps in upper mid leveling that was fixed).
Once you level up to max level, there is nothing else to do. And it don't take long to max your level.
Your disappointment is well founded during launch year yes, but they added a ton since and an alternate advancement system after max level. They completely rewrote the gear system (gear did not matter at all orginally, just exploits on gems... which got nerfed).
But you never/rarely get a second chance to make a first impression. They never recovered the players lost during the disaster launch and lack of end game (and gaps in upper mid leveling that was fixed).
For me, it turned F2P to fast to care about added content. F2P sucks..... I'm surprised I'm playing around with lotro again... boring times I guess. And believe me the F2P is in your face..... Infact I think the "rally", I tried starting, may not have worked with that game anyway because of it.
Here's the thing, difference between being disappointed at launch vs disappointed where the game matured to:
Warhammer- like others said, bunch of issues that caused me to eventually abandon it for other games.
HOWEVER- I fully enjoy Warhammer Reckoning private server (free btw) in which the devs have added content and fixed a ton of problems I had with the live version. I still play it.
Age Of Conan - little end game content unless you liked PVPing and were in a guild that sieged (or were sieged) by other guilds. PvP and RP kept me going, but I was like everyone else on the forums saying there is no end game.
HOWEVER-They updated the RPG system to make gear and crafting matter, added many raids (with progression), max level 6 man dungeons, a full expansion, pvp gear and pvp 24 man large battleground, alternate advancement at max level... etc.
Games that just let me down:
SWTOR- planets/zones were so small an on such tiny rails. Not sure how bad their server tech was, but only a handful of players in quest zones at a given instance. The PVP "planet" died a horrible death and they just abandoned it. The only time I really played with other players and had enjoyment was during pvp matches (even though balance was terrible). Really a single player game with lobbies for pve groups or pvp matches. NOT a massive galactic MMO.
Number 1 goes to WoW: Cataclysm. A complete U-turn in game development. I couldn't even recognize the game anymore. Thank god we got Classic.
Number 2: Warhammer Online. I looked forward to this game so much only to find out it was an incomplete mess of a game. As a non-PvP type of a player, however, i have to say PvP was maybe the best i've witnessed in any game so far.
Number 3: ArcheAge. The almighty sandbox, our saviour. I grew tired of the most boring and most linear questing i've ever seen. I hear the game opened up a lot once the quests ended but they lost me before that point. Good riddance.
Number 4: SWTOR. The most expensive computer game so far (in 2008). Turns out to be a linear single-player game with lots of cut-scenes. Did i mention everyone could had their own ship! Yay!
Number 5: Guildwars 2. "Do you dislike every other MMORPG in existence?". "Do you have problems grasping the idea of roles in group content?". "Does the concept of "threat" make you feel confused?". "No worries, we have a game just for you. It's called Guild Wars 2".
For me, it turned F2P to fast to care about added content.
Could you put that "too fast" into context? Seems a bit odd...
Too fast for AoC itself, from launch: it was sub-based for more than 3 years, some content updates and a full expansion, doesn't seem too fast to me.
Too fast overall, within the genre: after DDO kinda kickstarted the trend of f2p-switches, quite a couple games turned f2p before AoC did, so I fail to see the too fast there as well...
For the thread itself, I'm like Scot, do my research and set my expectations accordingly, thus I rarely surprised in any directions. If I feel I won't like a game (and try it anyway for kinda professional courtesy), I usually don't like it at the end. Same for the other way around.
The closest to a letdown was maybe SWTOR. As others mentioned, it wasn't entirely MMORPG, regardless of even MikeB did an article about why it really is one. (I still digress with you on that, Mike )
But it too just close to it, and not entirely a letdown, since I really liked it for the class stories, played it though a couple times, etc.
The letdown feel is mainly just there for the fact that I've bought two boxes... and it barely was even multiplayer, let alone an MMORPG.
(and a quick return to the "too fast" remark, delete, SWTOR switched to f2p a bit more than a year after launch...)
Number 5: Guildwars 2. "Do you dislike every other MMORPG in existence?". "Do you have problems grasping the idea of roles in group content?". "Does the concept of "threat" make you feel confused?". "No worries, we have a game just for you. It's called Guild Wars 2".
This could be the best sarcasm for the year 2021.
Love this
Can I please add: Do you like running up to about 100 players beating on a monster, do nothing, and at the end run up and take your reward ?
Number 5: Guildwars 2. "Do you dislike every other MMORPG in existence?". "Do you have problems grasping the idea of roles in group content?". "Does the concept of "threat" make you feel confused?". "No worries, we have a game just for you. It's called Guild Wars 2".
This could be the best sarcasm for the year 2021.
Love this
Can I please add: Do you like running up to about 100 players beating on a monster, do nothing, and at the end run up and take your reward ?
I'll add... There are actually no guild wars in Guildwars 2. Should have been called "Server wars".
Age of Conan had legitimate guild vs guild wars where you could capture the guild's city (which was a very expensive loss). Alliances were important.
Number 5: Guildwars 2. "Do you dislike every other MMORPG in existence?". "Do you have problems grasping the idea of roles in group content?". "Does the concept of "threat" make you feel confused?". "No worries, we have a game just for you. It's called Guild Wars 2".
This could be the best sarcasm for the year 2021.
Love this
Can I please add: Do you like running up to about 100 players beating on a monster, do nothing, and at the end run up and take your reward ?
There are actually no guild wars in Guildwars 2. Should have been called "Server wars".
Better yet, Just stand in key spots and auto win wars 2
Boy, I'm with those of you who mentioned that block of MMOs from AoC to SWTOR. I blew through a lot of preorder dough during that time.
I got my 8800gt to be able to play AoC. I still remember the disbelief after I finished the starter zone. Fully voiced quests back to text and small instanced zones. I preordered this months ahead and picked it up at the store after work. I was super excited. Don't even think I played a week.
Warhammer's PvP was cool. The world felt like a series of instanced, vertical runs, though. The world quests were innovative, but after the first leveling wave, you couldn't do them anymore. The little non-instanced dungeons were the same. I did all the contests on the webpage and even won a prize in the art contest. I lasted through beta and maybe three weeks?
I followed SWTOR from the day it was announced. I loved the KoTOR games and could not wait for this world to become an MMO. I was a little suspect about the art style(fully commit to realistic or a more cartoon CGI effect, please), but this was still the most stoked I have ever been for an MMO. The story was cool, but the worlds felt like a single player game with other players running around. Invisible walls as far as the eye can't see. I remember a guy on the forums leading up to release. This was around the time games were shifting to F2P models and people questioned whether SWTOR could sustain a subscription-only model. He placed a legit open bet for $10,000 on the forums that SWTOR would not go F2P in a year. I wish I had taken that bet. I made it until I finished the HM of that raid that was released with the first major content patch. I had nothing to do, so I quit.
Number 5: Guildwars 2. "Do you dislike every other MMORPG in existence?". "Do you have problems grasping the idea of roles in group content?". "Does the concept of "threat" make you feel confused?". "No worries, we have a game just for you. It's called Guild Wars 2".
This could be the best sarcasm for the year 2021.
Love this
Can I please add: Do you like running up to about 100 players beating on a monster, do nothing, and at the end run up and take your reward ?
There are actually no guild wars in Guildwars 2. Should have been called "Server wars".
Better yet, Just stand in key spots and auto win wars 2
Jump ship from your losing server wars... aka Server Transfer Wars 2
He placed a legit open bet for $10,000 on the forums that SWTOR would not go F2P in a year. I wish I had taken that bet.
You're lucky you didn't. It lasted for a few months beyond the first year
The Tortage fiasco is legit, AoC launch was really rushed... now quite more NPCs have voices in the main world too, but still they're the minority and it took several years for Funcom to add those voices.
Making Tortage fully voiced was only raising everyone's expectations through the roof, it was obvious they will be disappointed when it won't continue on the mainland.
Maybe Funcom really thought they can make the entire game voiced? Probably, with enough time... but the game was delayed already too many times.
They've actually succeeded with fully voiced later in TSW.
He placed a legit open bet for $10,000 on the forums that SWTOR would not go F2P in a year. I wish I had taken that bet.
You're lucky you didn't. It lasted for a few months beyond the first year
The Tortage fiasco is legit, AoC launch was really rushed... now quite more NPCs have voices in the main world too, but still they're the minority and it took several years for Funcom to add those voices.
Making Tortage fully voiced was only raising everyone's expectations through the roof, it was obvious they will be disappointed when it won't continue on the mainland.
Maybe Funcom really thought they can make the entire game voiced? Probably, with enough time... but the game was delayed already too many times.
They've actually succeeded with fully voiced later in TSW.
I agree, I think they should have voice acted out the 1-80 Godslayer main questline instead. Maybe the dungeon bosses and key characters (like, hello, Conan).
"I'm surprised how many responses here didn't like Warhammer Online, I always assumed it was just me. "
I think because it was supposed to be the DAoC successor....IT seems anytime a game has to live up to the next coming of something, it falls well short....That is why many see EQ2 as a failure, and why pantheon will fall short also if that day ever comes.
"Number 3: ArcheAge. The almighty sandbox, our saviour. I grew tired of
the most boring and most linear questing i've ever seen. I hear the game
opened up a lot once the quests ended but they lost me before that
point. Good riddance."
My take is exactly the same...people ere raving about this game...i thought it was flat out awful....Then the community was brutal too and wh ythe forced PVP at 35?...Just a terrible game.
Those two games were ultra-casual to begin with and had buzzwords to try and spin why their lack of content, features, and actual genre innovative changes weren't added in. They skipped on most of the content so it became a chore to level and end game was all that mattered.
Warhammer, in particular, had obscenely unbalanced classes(Brightwizard) and tab targetted combat still when Age of Conan proved you can do much better. It was a WoW with more of a focus on pvp but the territory control was meaningless.
Gw2 was is the definitive mmorpg when I ask what happened to the genre and how casuals really ruined the genre. Unbalanced classes, terrible zerg fest WVW where numbers always won(The caravan system and guilds owning forts was nice though!). The dynamic quests were just normal quests but in a chain format, so just a buzzword. Lack of the holy trininity meant unbalanced classes(I was an engineer and was ridiculously op).
There was no focus on character development outside getting max level besides collectables which is nice and all but just filler-fluff content. Arena pvp was fun but had no reward for doing well. Dungeons were non-existant (until fractals) which wouldn't have been a bad thing if the pvp was actually engaging, fun and not blob vs blob. The only unique and noteworthy thing the game achieved was its platforming mini game. ---------------------------- Age of Conan could have been so much better if they fleshed it out more and didn't cut content. The world and atmosphere were amazing. The combat was fun and engaging(In god's name why did they add tab targeting combat to spell casters? Why? It completely ruined the balance of the game, especially when magic was supposed to be ultra-rare). The whole tortage/rest of the game issue and the spin artist Erling really soiled Funcom's name. I had fun for 1 1/2 year playing it though.
Did you need to even ask? Darkfall online. In a time of WoW clones being pumped out left and right DFO was a nice sight to behold. The imaginings of what could have been had they added things like skill caps, more in-depth faction pvp and territory control, non-pvp activities to do only fuel the hatred for aventurine. The core game is/was phenomenal and should be the basis many games should try to replicate instead of WoW.
I-I've never felt let down by MMOs, ever...? I-I'm always excited and giddy when a new MMO comes out... Regardless if they're supposedly bad. For me, it just means another opportunity to make friends and discover its potential together.....
Comments
Had TR come out pre-2004 it would have had much more success ino. I agree with you there for sure.
2 further monetization
3 mobile gaming
4 developers willingness to aim low "Arpg's/mobas/CS Go type games".
5 Smedley reappears
I have seen no pisitive signs,Indie devs with puny budgets,low end work are actually taking over bigger studios and that is really sad.
I see no signs of an upswing especially seeing Valorant and FN still atop the popularity list,just simple shooters.The funny thing is that 20 years ago shooters were not all that popular,we had UT and Quake but at the world cyber games "Korea"they were mildly supported.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
I'm surprised how many responses here didn't like Warhammer Online, I always assumed it was just me.
I never got to play AoC, and when I found time, it was already getting negative reviews. Also the first 10 levels had the solo story thing going on that turned me off.
But you never/rarely get a second chance to make a first impression. They never recovered the players lost during the disaster launch and lack of end game (and gaps in upper mid leveling that was fixed).
F2P sucks..... I'm surprised I'm playing around with lotro again... boring times I guess.
And believe me the F2P is in your face..... Infact I think the "rally", I tried starting, may not have worked with that game anyway because of it.
Warhammer- like others said, bunch of issues that caused me to eventually abandon it for other games.
HOWEVER- I fully enjoy Warhammer Reckoning private server (free btw) in which the devs have added content and fixed a ton of problems I had with the live version. I still play it.
Age Of Conan - little end game content unless you liked PVPing and were in a guild that sieged (or were sieged) by other guilds. PvP and RP kept me going, but I was like everyone else on the forums saying there is no end game.
HOWEVER-They updated the RPG system to make gear and crafting matter, added many raids (with progression), max level 6 man dungeons, a full expansion, pvp gear and pvp 24 man large battleground, alternate advancement at max level... etc.
Games that just let me down:
SWTOR- planets/zones were so small an on such tiny rails. Not sure how bad their server tech was, but only a handful of players in quest zones at a given instance. The PVP "planet" died a horrible death and they just abandoned it. The only time I really played with other players and had enjoyment was during pvp matches (even though balance was terrible). Really a single player game with lobbies for pve groups or pvp matches. NOT a massive galactic MMO.
Number 2: Warhammer Online. I looked forward to this game so much only to find out it was an incomplete mess of a game. As a non-PvP type of a player, however, i have to say PvP was maybe the best i've witnessed in any game so far.
Number 3: ArcheAge. The almighty sandbox, our saviour. I grew tired of the most boring and most linear questing i've ever seen. I hear the game opened up a lot once the quests ended but they lost me before that point. Good riddance.
Number 4: SWTOR. The most expensive computer game so far (in 2008). Turns out to be a linear single-player game with lots of cut-scenes. Did i mention everyone could had their own ship! Yay!
Number 5: Guildwars 2. "Do you dislike every other MMORPG in existence?". "Do you have problems grasping the idea of roles in group content?". "Does the concept of "threat" make you feel confused?". "No worries, we have a game just for you. It's called Guild Wars 2".
Love this
Can I please add:
Do you like running up to about 100 players beating on a monster, do nothing, and at the end run up and take your reward ?
Age of Conan had legitimate guild vs guild wars where you could capture the guild's city (which was a very expensive loss). Alliances were important.
Just stand in key spots and auto win wars 2
I got my 8800gt to be able to play AoC. I still remember the disbelief after I finished the starter zone. Fully voiced quests back to text and small instanced zones. I preordered this months ahead and picked it up at the store after work. I was super excited. Don't even think I played a week.
Warhammer's PvP was cool. The world felt like a series of instanced, vertical runs, though. The world quests were innovative, but after the first leveling wave, you couldn't do them anymore. The little non-instanced dungeons were the same. I did all the contests on the webpage and even won a prize in the art contest. I lasted through beta and maybe three weeks?
I followed SWTOR from the day it was announced. I loved the KoTOR games and could not wait for this world to become an MMO. I was a little suspect about the art style(fully commit to realistic or a more cartoon CGI effect, please), but this was still the most stoked I have ever been for an MMO. The story was cool, but the worlds felt like a single player game with other players running around. Invisible walls as far as the eye can't see. I remember a guy on the forums leading up to release. This was around the time games were shifting to F2P models and people questioned whether SWTOR could sustain a subscription-only model. He placed a legit open bet for $10,000 on the forums that SWTOR would not go F2P in a year. I wish I had taken that bet. I made it until I finished the HM of that raid that was released with the first major content patch. I had nothing to do, so I quit.
Warhammer, in particular, had obscenely unbalanced classes(Brightwizard) and tab targetted combat still when Age of Conan proved you can do much better. It was a WoW with more of a focus on pvp but the territory control was meaningless.
Gw2 was is the definitive mmorpg when I ask what happened to the genre and how casuals really ruined the genre. Unbalanced classes, terrible zerg fest WVW where numbers always won(The caravan system and guilds owning forts was nice though!). The dynamic quests were just normal quests but in a chain format, so just a buzzword. Lack of the holy trininity meant unbalanced classes(I was an engineer and was ridiculously op).
There was no focus on character development outside getting max level besides collectables which is nice and all but just filler-fluff content. Arena pvp was fun but had no reward for doing well. Dungeons were non-existant (until fractals) which wouldn't have been a bad thing if the pvp was actually engaging, fun and not blob vs blob. The only unique and noteworthy thing the game achieved was its platforming mini game.
----------------------------
Age of Conan could have been so much better if they fleshed it out more and didn't cut content. The world and atmosphere were amazing. The combat was fun and engaging(In god's name why did they add tab targeting combat to spell casters? Why? It completely ruined the balance of the game, especially when magic was supposed to be ultra-rare). The whole tortage/rest of the game issue and the spin artist Erling really soiled Funcom's name. I had fun for 1 1/2 year playing it though.
Did you need to even ask? Darkfall online.
In a time of WoW clones being pumped out left and right DFO was a nice sight to behold. The imaginings of what could have been had they added things like skill caps, more in-depth faction pvp and territory control, non-pvp activities to do only fuel the hatred for aventurine. The core game is/was phenomenal and should be the basis many games should try to replicate instead of WoW.
MurderHerd