This looks fantastic. I cannot play it. Too difficult the combat but it looks amazing. I'll watch some let's play when it does .
I don’t see how adding accessibility into a game can be negative in anything. I like how games add things like story mode so as many people as possible can enjoy the game.
It takes nothing away from others enjoyment and is a win win imho
Pretty much what's stopping me from buying.
I'm deeply attracted in a RPG, with a cooperative multiplayer mode, and with G.R.R. Martin in its shadows, but I'm too old to deal with "Dark Souls" kind of frustrating gameplay.
He says that they design their games so that players can overcome adversity. I can confidently say that is how I approach Dark Souls. Though I do have Dark Souls II and III in my steam list.
My thought was, if I can practice and learn the guitar I can practice and learn a controller as the keyboard and mouse for Dark Souls is still "iffy" for me.
Am I amazing? no. Have I downed a few bosses with the first try? Yes! That's a great feeling. Sometimes the defeats drain my energy and I put the game down in order to take a break.
Some say the games aren't difficult but if that was true then this conversation wouldn't be happening. There is truth to the fact that the games get a lot more forgiving the higher you go in level.
Unfortunately many don't get that high as they give up in the lower levels. My opinion is that people don't take the correct attitude and that is their biggest downfall. Instead of finding the deaths funny, finding your mistakes amusing, and getting an enjoyment out of failing, people take it out on themselves, the game and just rage quit in worst case scenarios.
To help that, I've gone into fights with the thought "let's see if I can play my best but STILL die 5 times." Or some such thing. So dying was the real goal. You then relax, and lo and behold sometimes you don't die at all.
If players would shift their paradigm a bit they might be able to enjoy these games and do reasonably well.
The oversight is that people don’t realize that dying and doing it over again are an essential part of the Souls genre, you are supposed to learn through defeat. Many call the dying part failing and give up, the dying part is an essential part of the experience though. This has been boiled down to the indeed toxic ‘git gud’ but there is truth in there, learn, adapt, try again. And then, by the skin of your teeth, succeed.
Got Elden Ring preordered, we’ll see how it turns out.
/Cheers, Lahnmir
The only thing I don't like about the Souls games is that they make you start right back at the start of a level if you die to a boss. I appreciated how in Nioh (and some other games) you would generally respawn near a boss if you died.
I've never thought of this as anything other than a single player game with some minor multiplayer interactions like in all previous souls games.
I don't get all the comments about it not being multiplayer enough. Where's that coming from? Did they hype it as multiplayer?
No, I just think some folks are airing their opinions on From Software's unique multiplayer system.
I am not a fan of it myself, either, but it is the system they use.
I'll be waiting on reviews for this one. Never really liked the way the entire Souls combat system relies so heavily on "i-frames." Not immersive at all compared to, say, God of War, where dodging has to actually move you out of the way or you get hit anyways.
The only thing I don't like about the Souls games is that they make you start right back at the start of a level if you die to a boss.
I agree, this is the only thing I don't like about them either. And I absolutely loved the feature in DS2 that when you kill enough of the same mob, they stop respawning. Too bad they removed it in DS3. I would sometimes just farm the mobs on the way to a tough boss so I wouldn't have to worry about them when I die over and over again to the boss
When you judge others, you do not define them, you define yourself
This looks fantastic. I cannot play it. Too difficult the combat but it looks amazing. I'll watch some let's play when it does .
I don’t see how adding accessibility into a game can be negative in anything. I like how games add things like story mode so as many people as possible can enjoy the game.
It takes nothing away from others enjoyment and is a win win imho
Pretty much what's stopping me from buying.
I'm deeply attracted in a RPG, with a cooperative multiplayer mode, and with G.R.R. Martin in its shadows, but I'm too old to deal with "Dark Souls" kind of frustrating gameplay.
He says that they design their games so that players can overcome adversity. I can confidently say that is how I approach Dark Souls. Though I do have Dark Souls II and III in my steam list.
My thought was, if I can practice and learn the guitar I can practice and learn a controller as the keyboard and mouse for Dark Souls is still "iffy" for me.
Am I amazing? no. Have I downed a few bosses with the first try? Yes! That's a great feeling. Sometimes the defeats drain my energy and I put the game down in order to take a break.
Some say the games aren't difficult but if that was true then this conversation wouldn't be happening. There is truth to the fact that the games get a lot more forgiving the higher you go in level.
Unfortunately many don't get that high as they give up in the lower levels. My opinion is that people don't take the correct attitude and that is their biggest downfall. Instead of finding the deaths funny, finding your mistakes amusing, and getting an enjoyment out of failing, people take it out on themselves, the game and just rage quit in worst case scenarios.
To help that, I've gone into fights with the thought "let's see if I can play my best but STILL die 5 times." Or some such thing. So dying was the real goal. You then relax, and lo and behold sometimes you don't die at all.
If players would shift their paradigm a bit they might be able to enjoy these games and do reasonably well.
Society is teaching us that losing is for losers.
If we don’t win, we don’t play or we bitch about it until we do win
Here's the thing I feel that people who manage to play a game like Dark Souls and kill the mobs do not really understand that certain people just cannot do it. They think that if you practice enough you'll eventually get it and that the reason you don't is because you give up.
For me I get massive headaches when I keep trying. I mean really bad headaches from trying and trying. I was trying to get across a cliff and progress in Shadow of the Tomb Raider. I tried like a 100 times and may be made it twice then faced my next obstacle after that and kept dying again. I just don't have the motor ability to succeed. Most people say you can achieve that by practice but it's because they have never actually faced this inability themselves. Not everything can be solved this way and it is horribly unfun and not worth it even when you manage it after a hundred tries. I just felt drained and completely wasted. Thank goodness it was the demo and I had not bought the game.
I prefer to just watch the game on youtube if I really want it.
I could play Horizon Zero Dawn because they had a lot of assisted climbing.
I am not saying games should make that allowance for people like me . I merely wish to dispel the notion that the reason we never get past the first past is because we are not trying enough.
I wish you could try doubling your frame rate.
I’ve had a few instances where I couldn’t get something accomplished at 30fps When I set things to run 60fps those former obstacles were a piece of cake.
It certainly doesn’t solve all issues, but it can improve them.
I was amazed at how much a difference frame rate can make, even when I thought that it was ok and wasn’t a problem.
The thing is I read it was very doable with a controller but I have even less control of my movements with a controller so I had to do it with the mouse and KB and some people have said parts of the game are completely impossible with the M/Kb. So I just told myself to stop trying.
You and everyone else must think I was exaggerating. No after the first 15 or 20 times I wrote down every 5 times I tried for a lark. If anything it made me more depressed that was I was trying so hard. I think it was more than 2 times I made it but if you're dying after that you go back to the earlier part you cleared.
Seriously it isn't from lack of trying or patience. I totally understand there is a learning curve because hell I use a 19 button mouse I took 2 weeks to get down so I can learn things but this isn't something you can force yourself to do and most important of all there's absolutely no fun in falling and dying so many times. It's depressing and I get into these anxiety spurts that cause those massive headaches. Whole day is ruined after that. I just learned to accept that some games are not for me.
In the end I said fuck this.
I absolutely loved Monster Hunter World and I enjoyed playing it but after a point I think it was the 4th target I was just getting killed and I could not move fast enough. I tried a lot weapons and I admitted that it was time to stop playing. There is always a point when you know that you're not having fun and if you just push ahead and try and try all you're doing is wasting your time when there are many other games you can be playing.
This isn't like a task you're handling in real life where giving up is not always an option but while gaming which is supposed to be a fun thing you can stop if it stops being fun. It does not mean you're a loser in real life.
Also I am perfectly happy to watch others playing a game.
The thing is I read it was very doable with a controller but I have even less control of my movements with a controller so I had to do it with the mouse and KB and some people have said parts of the game are completely impossible with the M/Kb. So I just told myself to stop trying.
You and everyone else must think I was exaggerating. No after the first 15 or 20 times I wrote down every 5 times I tried for a lark. If anything it made me more depressed that was I was trying so hard. I think it was more than 2 times I made it but if you're dying after that you go back to the earlier part you cleared.
Seriously it isn't from lack of trying or patience. I totally understand there is a learning curve because hell I use a 19 button mouse I took 2 weeks to get down so I can learn things but this isn't something you can force yourself to do and most important of all there's absolutely no fun in falling and dying so many times. It's depressing and I get into these anxiety spurts that cause those massive headaches. Whole day is ruined after that. I just learned to accept that some games are not for me.
In the end I said fuck this.
I absolutely loved Monster Hunter World and I enjoyed playing it but after a point I think it was the 4th target I was just getting killed and I could not move fast enough. I tried a lot weapons and I admitted that it was time to stop playing. There is always a point when you know that you're not having fun and if you just push ahead and try and try all you're doing is wasting your time when there are many other games you can be playing.
This isn't like a task you're handling in real life where giving up is not always an option but while gaming which is supposed to be a fun thing you can stop if it stops being fun. It does not mean you're a loser in real life.
Also I am perfectly happy to watch others playing a game.
I won’t buy Monster Hunter World because I know that the game will be too much for me.
It may not be towards the beginning, but I would end up in the exact same place. No matter whether its a couple monsters before or a couple monsters after.
I would have died and given my soul away to play something like it when I was young
The thing is I read it was very doable with a controller but I have even less control of my movements with a controller so I had to do it with the mouse and KB and some people have said parts of the game are completely impossible with the M/Kb. So I just told myself to stop trying.
As an fyi, there is a woman who I follow, Lillia, who completed the entirety of Dark Souls with a Mouse and Keyboard.
If you can get the newer edition it might be doable. Having said that, you do need decent reflexes so that is always going to be a factor.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
If I’m going to try frustrating myself, I think Elden Ring looks like a great title to do that with.
Based on the reception of their previous games, I’m really looking forward to this one. I’m hoping these guys learned a lot from their previous games that will make this one that much better.
I’m not worried about getting my money’s worth with this title.
The thing is I read it was very doable with a controller but I have even less control of my movements with a controller so I had to do it with the mouse and KB and some people have said parts of the game are completely impossible with the M/Kb. So I just told myself to stop trying.
As an fyi, there is a woman who I follow, Lillia, who completed the entirety of Dark Souls with a Mouse and Keyboard.
If you can get the newer edition it might be doable. Having said that, you do need decent reflexes so that is always going to be a factor.
The game I was talking about is Shadow of the Tomb raider not Dark Souls.
The thing is I read it was very doable with a controller but I have even less control of my movements with a controller so I had to do it with the mouse and KB and some people have said parts of the game are completely impossible with the M/Kb. So I just told myself to stop trying.
As an fyi, there is a woman who I follow, Lillia, who completed the entirety of Dark Souls with a Mouse and Keyboard.
If you can get the newer edition it might be doable. Having said that, you do need decent reflexes so that is always going to be a factor.
The game I was talking about is Shadow of the Tomb raider not Dark Souls.
lol oops. Thought she was still on dark souls.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
I've never thought of this as anything other than a single player game with some minor multiplayer interactions like in all previous souls games.
I don't get all the comments about it not being multiplayer enough. Where's that coming from? Did they hype it as multiplayer?
No, I just think some folks are airing their opinions on From Software's unique multiplayer system.
I am not a fan of it myself, either, but it is the system they use.
I'll be waiting on reviews for this one. Never really liked the way the entire Souls combat system relies so heavily on "i-frames." Not immersive at all compared to, say, God of War, where dodging has to actually move you out of the way or you get hit anyways.
Agreed that I think people interested in multiplayer were just hoping for more of an opportunity to share the adventure in a richly textured high fantasy setting and not so much about an online help system to get passed sticky encounters.
Your God of War example is good. It seems like that one focuses more on tactical combat and less on choreographed encounters which feels very arcade-like to me. I was hoping Elden Ring was more about immersive high fantasy like an Elder Scrolls title and less about bragging rights and challenge badges.
Same here. The trailers introduced an incredibly tantalizing world.
If it is simply more Souls-like goodness, then I'm happy for all those folks who love it. There's quite a few other titles that look more my speed coming this year (Starfield, Bloodlines 2 hopefully, etc.), so I'll just look forward to those.
I do want a good shared world multiplayer RPG like what you describe, though. Something between cRPGs like Divinity/Pillars and action games like Vermintide/Destiny in a shared world multiplayer system would be perfect imo.
This looks fantastic. I cannot play it. Too difficult the combat but it looks amazing. I'll watch some let's play when it does .
I don’t see how adding accessibility into a game can be negative in anything. I like how games add things like story mode so as many people as possible can enjoy the game.
It takes nothing away from others enjoyment and is a win win imho
Pretty much what's stopping me from buying.
I'm deeply attracted in a RPG, with a cooperative multiplayer mode, and with G.R.R. Martin in its shadows, but I'm too old to deal with "Dark Souls" kind of frustrating gameplay.
He says that they design their games so that players can overcome adversity. I can confidently say that is how I approach Dark Souls. Though I do have Dark Souls II and III in my steam list.
My thought was, if I can practice and learn the guitar I can practice and learn a controller as the keyboard and mouse for Dark Souls is still "iffy" for me.
Am I amazing? no. Have I downed a few bosses with the first try? Yes! That's a great feeling. Sometimes the defeats drain my energy and I put the game down in order to take a break.
Some say the games aren't difficult but if that was true then this conversation wouldn't be happening. There is truth to the fact that the games get a lot more forgiving the higher you go in level.
Unfortunately many don't get that high as they give up in the lower levels. My opinion is that people don't take the correct attitude and that is their biggest downfall. Instead of finding the deaths funny, finding your mistakes amusing, and getting an enjoyment out of failing, people take it out on themselves, the game and just rage quit in worst case scenarios.
To help that, I've gone into fights with the thought "let's see if I can play my best but STILL die 5 times." Or some such thing. So dying was the real goal. You then relax, and lo and behold sometimes you don't die at all.
If players would shift their paradigm a bit they might be able to enjoy these games and do reasonably well.
My 'correct attitude' is that I don't like that sort of game play. Not interested in suffering through hairshirt games. Not interested in continually replaying stuff til I learn the trick. Don't like checkpoint saving. There was a time when hardware and memory constraints were such that that made a certain sense. Now it has evolved into a stylistic decision. A decision I don't like, but hey, not every game is for everyone.
When I look at my game backlog, fitting into game styles I don't prefer starts to look like a poor use of my time.
Aye, the problem is they could easily expand their player base by adding a "story" mode without ever harming those who prefer it hardcore. It's such a shame and a waste, really, the game seems awesome. I will wait post release reviews to see if I can cope with the difficulty or not, apparently from early sources it's still much easier than Dark Souls.
Respect, walk, what did you say? Respect, walk Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me? - PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
This looks fantastic. I cannot play it. Too difficult the combat but it looks amazing. I'll watch some let's play when it does .
I don’t see how adding accessibility into a game can be negative in anything. I like how games add things like story mode so as many people as possible can enjoy the game.
It takes nothing away from others enjoyment and is a win win imho
Pretty much what's stopping me from buying.
I'm deeply attracted in a RPG, with a cooperative multiplayer mode, and with G.R.R. Martin in its shadows, but I'm too old to deal with "Dark Souls" kind of frustrating gameplay.
He says that they design their games so that players can overcome adversity. I can confidently say that is how I approach Dark Souls. Though I do have Dark Souls II and III in my steam list.
My thought was, if I can practice and learn the guitar I can practice and learn a controller as the keyboard and mouse for Dark Souls is still "iffy" for me.
Am I amazing? no. Have I downed a few bosses with the first try? Yes! That's a great feeling. Sometimes the defeats drain my energy and I put the game down in order to take a break.
Some say the games aren't difficult but if that was true then this conversation wouldn't be happening. There is truth to the fact that the games get a lot more forgiving the higher you go in level.
Unfortunately many don't get that high as they give up in the lower levels. My opinion is that people don't take the correct attitude and that is their biggest downfall. Instead of finding the deaths funny, finding your mistakes amusing, and getting an enjoyment out of failing, people take it out on themselves, the game and just rage quit in worst case scenarios.
To help that, I've gone into fights with the thought "let's see if I can play my best but STILL die 5 times." Or some such thing. So dying was the real goal. You then relax, and lo and behold sometimes you don't die at all.
If players would shift their paradigm a bit they might be able to enjoy these games and do reasonably well.
My 'correct attitude' is that I don't like that sort of game play. Not interested in suffering through hairshirt games. Not interested in continually replaying stuff til I learn the trick. Don't like checkpoint saving. There was a time when hardware and memory constraints were such that that made a certain sense. Now it has evolved into a stylistic decision. A decision I don't like, but hey, not every game is for everyone.
When I look at my game backlog, fitting into game styles I don't prefer starts to look like a poor use of my time.
Aye, the problem is they could easily expand their player base by adding a "story" mode without ever harming those who prefer it hardcore. It's such a shame and a waste, really, the game seems awesome. I will wait post release reviews to see if I can cope with the difficulty or not, apparently from early sources it's still much easier than Dark Souls.
The main path is much easier then Dark Souls. The difficulty is there though, it is more optional then in previous titles. Saving when quitting can be done anywhere btw.
There might be some technical hiccups and the engine is starting to show its age but the game is an absolute masterclass in design, world layout, pacing and combat. It also shows that you don’t need villages full of NPCs with quests and other busywork to provide content, or endless amounts of in game books to tell stories. I won’t even point at literally every other open world games’ combat system, compared to Elden Ring all of those are an utter embarrassment.
/Cheers, Lahnmir
'the only way he could nail it any better is if he used a cross.'
Kyleran on yours sincerely
'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'
Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...
'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless.
It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.
It is just huge resource waste....'
Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer
This looks fantastic. I cannot play it. Too difficult the combat but it looks amazing. I'll watch some let's play when it does .
I don’t see how adding accessibility into a game can be negative in anything. I like how games add things like story mode so as many people as possible can enjoy the game.
It takes nothing away from others enjoyment and is a win win imho
I somewhat disagree, as long as a story (easy) mode does not effect multiplayer in any way, then I am fine with it. If others have done the graft and then players pay to skip and gain multiplayer benefits that is pay to win. Though obviously not outfits and the like.
I have only discovered this game today, perhaps more importantly do posters think the single player campaign would be worth playing alone?
The only thing I don't like about the Souls games is that they make you start right back at the start of a level if you die to a boss. I appreciated how in Nioh (and some other games) you would generally respawn near a boss if you died.
The respawn points are more forgiving in this one. In my experience so far, they are generally near the difficult encounters.
Comments
I am not a fan of it myself, either, but it is the system they use.
I'll be waiting on reviews for this one. Never really liked the way the entire Souls combat system relies so heavily on "i-frames." Not immersive at all compared to, say, God of War, where dodging has to actually move you out of the way or you get hit anyways.
I agree, this is the only thing I don't like about them either. And I absolutely loved the feature in DS2 that when you kill enough of the same mob, they stop respawning. Too bad they removed it in DS3. I would sometimes just farm the mobs on the way to a tough boss so I wouldn't have to worry about them when I die over and over again to the boss
- Earl Nightingale
If we don’t win, we don’t play or we bitch about it until we do win
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
I’ve had a few instances where I couldn’t get something accomplished at 30fps When I set things to run 60fps those former obstacles were a piece of cake.
It certainly doesn’t solve all issues, but it can improve them.
I was amazed at how much a difference frame rate can make, even when I thought that it was ok and wasn’t a problem.
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
The thing is I read it was very doable with a controller but I have even less control of my movements with a controller so I had to do it with the mouse and KB and some people have said parts of the game are completely impossible with the M/Kb. So I just told myself to stop trying.
You and everyone else must think I was exaggerating. No after the first 15 or 20 times I wrote down every 5 times I tried for a lark. If anything it made me more depressed that was I was trying so hard. I think it was more than 2 times I made it but if you're dying after that you go back to the earlier part you cleared.
Seriously it isn't from lack of trying or patience. I totally understand there is a learning curve because hell I use a 19 button mouse I took 2 weeks to get down so I can learn things but this isn't something you can force yourself to do and most important of all there's absolutely no fun in falling and dying so many times. It's depressing and I get into these anxiety spurts that cause those massive headaches. Whole day is ruined after that. I just learned to accept that some games are not for me.
In the end I said fuck this.
I absolutely loved Monster Hunter World and I enjoyed playing it but after a point I think it was the 4th target I was just getting killed and I could not move fast enough. I tried a lot weapons and I admitted that it was time to stop playing. There is always a point when you know that you're not having fun and if you just push ahead and try and try all you're doing is wasting your time when there are many other games you can be playing.
This isn't like a task you're handling in real life where giving up is not always an option but while gaming which is supposed to be a fun thing you can stop if it stops being fun. It does not mean you're a loser in real life.
Also I am perfectly happy to watch others playing a game.
It may not be towards the beginning, but I would end up in the exact same place. No matter whether its a couple monsters before or a couple monsters after.
I would have died and given my soul away to play something like it when I was young
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
If you can get the newer edition it might be doable. Having said that, you do need decent reflexes so that is always going to be a factor.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Based on the reception of their previous games, I’m really looking forward to this one. I’m hoping these guys learned a lot from their previous games that will make this one that much better.
I’m not worried about getting my money’s worth with this title.
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
If it is simply more Souls-like goodness, then I'm happy for all those folks who love it. There's quite a few other titles that look more my speed coming this year (Starfield, Bloodlines 2 hopefully, etc.), so I'll just look forward to those.
I do want a good shared world multiplayer RPG like what you describe, though. Something between cRPGs like Divinity/Pillars and action games like Vermintide/Destiny in a shared world multiplayer system would be perfect imo.
Aye, the problem is they could easily expand their player base by adding a "story" mode without ever harming those who prefer it hardcore. It's such a shame and a waste, really, the game seems awesome. I will wait post release reviews to see if I can cope with the difficulty or not, apparently from early sources it's still much easier than Dark Souls.
Respect, walk
Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me?
- PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
This ^
There might be some technical hiccups and the engine is starting to show its age but the game is an absolute masterclass in design, world layout, pacing and combat. It also shows that you don’t need villages full of NPCs with quests and other busywork to provide content, or endless amounts of in game books to tell stories. I won’t even point at literally every other open world games’ combat system, compared to Elden Ring all of those are an utter embarrassment.
Lahnmir
Kyleran on yours sincerely
'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'
Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...
'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless.
It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.
It is just huge resource waste....'
Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer
I have only discovered this game today, perhaps more importantly do posters think the single player campaign would be worth playing alone?
Respect, walk
Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me?
- PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023