The guy asking the questions seemed rather rude. He was grilling the poor Dev..Oh well, I have been playing the beta and enjoying it but it is VERY rough. Still seems years off from release but I will play it when it does release
I was very pleasantly surprised to see a wall of text. I don't want to take four times as long watching a video or listening to a podcast you read much faster. So all credit to "Rigeborod" I think it is.
I won't address the complexity of what Toval said about the crafting, just that the best gear should never some from drops that is just barmy in my eyes.
One thing, among several others, that stands out to me is when JG mentions that dropping full gear in addition to rare crafting materials is because not everyone likes to craft. I find this reasoning somewhat puzzling, but also something common with industry developers.
So, the dev team doesn't want to make people craft and will drop high end intact gear. But what about people who want to craft the best gear and don't want to run "end game dungeons and raids".
I haven't read the review yet so not clear on the context, but isn't that what Lineage 2 did? People could craft but they could also raid and get gear drops.
I thought it worked quite well. Of course, the game had a system where gear could be removed so there was a constant need to raid and craft.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
So finally decided to pre order to get into beta. I played quite a bit last weekend was dabbling in crafting myself.
You can learn 2 crafting professions. I picked up Hunter(skinning) and Outfitter(armor crafting). I found gear crafting while leveling to be unrewarding and unsatisfying. Especially the way the weight system works. So I can create all this armor but can only wear maybe 1-3 pieces of it at level 12 due to weight restrictions. If players go over weight restriction then it really slows movement speed of character.
Then there's the fact that mob drops are better and faster to obtain. At level 10, I went up to North New Haven and grind mobs at Exile Camp with a full group. Within about 2 hours, I gained 2 levels and replaced all my gear. So now I'm not very inspired to craft my own gear.
So finally decided to pre order to get into beta. I played quite a bit last weekend was dabbling in crafting myself.
You can learn 2 crafting professions. I picked up Hunter(skinning) and Outfitter(armor crafting). I found gear crafting while leveling to be unrewarding and unsatisfying. Especially the way the weight system works. So I can create all this armor but can only wear maybe 1-3 pieces of it at level 12 due to weight restrictions. If players go over weight restriction then it really slows movement speed of character.
Then there's the fact that mob drops are better and faster to obtain. At level 10, I went up to North New Haven and grind mobs at Exile Camp with a full group. Within about 2 hours, I gained 2 levels and replaced all my gear. So now I'm not very inspired to craft my own gear.
I just don't understand why developers keep making crafting a waste and only done once you get to higher levels because what you make at lower levels are not as good as what drops or they have weight restrictions that don't make sense.
Why do all games invite this 'crafted vs dropped' debate? The simple solution is to make NPCs do all the crafting. Turn in materials + payment to NPC, wait, and NPC returns back an item. Take the crafting out of the player's hands.
If you make it properly, 'crafted' items could be better than most 'dropped' items. Different NPCs might make better quality items, while others might cost less, require different materials, or produce items faster. There could be plenty of complexity without indulging the player's need to push a 'combine' button.
If crafting is simply about 'push button, get item', it really doesn't represent crafting skills very well.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
Is there a magic class of any kind in this game? All I see is melee.
Are there magic items or just things like upgraded metals for armor or weapons?
Thats the only reason I haven't bought in yet. I prefer to play casters/hybrid casters. Something akin to a Shaman or Druid. But this game appears to have no spellcasters whatsoever. Everything appears to be melee only save for bows. Their hybrid classes are all hybrid melee's. Whether thats melee/healer/ melee/buffer melee/debuffer etc. which for me is a major turn off.
Why do all games invite this 'crafted vs dropped' debate? The simple solution is to make NPCs do all the crafting. Turn in materials + payment to NPC, wait, and NPC returns back an item. Take the crafting out of the player's hands.
If you make it properly, 'crafted' items could be better than most 'dropped' items. Different NPCs might make better quality items, while others might cost less, require different materials, or produce items faster. There could be plenty of complexity without indulging the player's need to push a 'combine' button.
If crafting is simply about 'push button, get item', it really doesn't represent crafting skills very well.
I like this idea, however their is a lot of people that like to play merchants and crafting is part of that.
Personally I would do similar to what you are suggesting with automation except make it where merchant/crafters can set up non AFK stalls right on the spot. Then the player can open a window and do exactly as you say.
I would also add a mechanic that autopays the crafter 50% what an NPC would cost. Additionally I would setup where there was a small chance the crafter could "save" a random component which would drop into the crafters pack as a reward.
So essentially if you want to save money vs NPC you use a player crafter at a 50% savings although NPC is available at higher cost. Process is automated so no hassle to player. Player doesn't even have to pay the crafter as the pay/reward is built into the system.
So finally decided to pre order to get into beta. I played quite a bit last weekend was dabbling in crafting myself.
You can learn 2 crafting professions. I picked up Hunter(skinning) and Outfitter(armor crafting). I found gear crafting while leveling to be unrewarding and unsatisfying. Especially the way the weight system works. So I can create all this armor but can only wear maybe 1-3 pieces of it at level 12 due to weight restrictions. If players go over weight restriction then it really slows movement speed of character.
Then there's the fact that mob drops are better and faster to obtain. At level 10, I went up to North New Haven and grind mobs at Exile Camp with a full group. Within about 2 hours, I gained 2 levels and replaced all my gear. So now I'm not very inspired to craft my own gear.
I just don't understand why developers keep making crafting a waste and only done once you get to higher levels because what you make at lower levels are not as good as what drops or they have weight restrictions that don't make sense.
There has to be sufficient reward for all the effort crafters put it, I have only ever been a resource gatherer for a guild myself, but when I become a guild officer I make sure I know the ins and outs. You would think developers would get this by now, I learnt it in DAOC when guild members started talking about the craft system, which up until then I had taken no notice of. It was incredibly important to our crafters and I realised a player might actually decided to play or not play DAOC based on the crafting system. You can't mess around with crafting just to appease casuals.
So finally decided to pre order to get into beta. I played quite a bit last weekend was dabbling in crafting myself.
You can learn 2 crafting professions. I picked up Hunter(skinning) and Outfitter(armor crafting). I found gear crafting while leveling to be unrewarding and unsatisfying. Especially the way the weight system works. So I can create all this armor but can only wear maybe 1-3 pieces of it at level 12 due to weight restrictions. If players go over weight restriction then it really slows movement speed of character.
Then there's the fact that mob drops are better and faster to obtain. At level 10, I went up to North New Haven and grind mobs at Exile Camp with a full group. Within about 2 hours, I gained 2 levels and replaced all my gear. So now I'm not very inspired to craft my own gear.
I just don't understand why developers keep making crafting a waste and only done once you get to higher levels because what you make at lower levels are not as good as what drops or they have weight restrictions that don't make sense.
There has to be sufficient reward for all the effort crafters put it, I have only ever been a resource gatherer for a guild myself, but when I become a guild officer I make sure I know the ins and outs. You would think developers would get this by now, I learnt it in DAOC when guild members started talking about the craft system, which up until then I had taken no notice of. It was incredibly important to our crafters and I realised a player might actually decided to play or not play DAOC based on the crafting system. You can't mess around with crafting just to appease casuals.
I thought the loot system in DAoC was just about perfect. Gear depended heavily on the roll you wanted to play.
The same class could be defensive or offensive or support or all three, if geared properly. Some dropped items or artifacts could have a higher proc rate or a larger proc value than player crafted gear but player crafted gear was very necessary to fill in any gaps that dropped gear left.
I don't know why this type of system hasn't been replicated.
For anyone interested, this game just reset everyone to level 1 on Apr 13th. So if you are looking for something to do, this might pass the time. I never played EQ, but a few friends of mine joined that played EQ alot, and they were saying this was giving them the total EQ vibe. I was surprised how much they liked this game. Game feels like alpha to me as I have said in other threads, but if you like social slow paced grouping games this might scratch that itch.
Comments
Proud MMORPG.com member since March 2004! Make PvE GREAT Again!
Reading is hard.
I was very pleasantly surprised to see a wall of text. I don't want to take four times as long watching a video or listening to a podcast you read much faster. So all credit to "Rigeborod" I think it is.
I won't address the complexity of what Toval said about the crafting, just that the best gear should never some from drops that is just barmy in my eyes.
I haven't read the review yet so not clear on the context, but isn't that what Lineage 2 did? People could craft but they could also raid and get gear drops.
I thought it worked quite well. Of course, the game had a system where gear could be removed so there was a constant need to raid and craft.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
You can learn 2 crafting professions. I picked up Hunter(skinning) and Outfitter(armor crafting). I found gear crafting while leveling to be unrewarding and unsatisfying. Especially the way the weight system works. So I can create all this armor but can only wear maybe 1-3 pieces of it at level 12 due to weight restrictions. If players go over weight restriction then it really slows movement speed of character.
Then there's the fact that mob drops are better and faster to obtain. At level 10, I went up to North New Haven and grind mobs at Exile Camp with a full group. Within about 2 hours, I gained 2 levels and replaced all my gear. So now I'm not very inspired to craft my own gear.
Are there magic items or just things like upgraded metals for armor or weapons?
Proud MMORPG.com member since March 2004! Make PvE GREAT Again!
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
Thats the only reason I haven't bought in yet. I prefer to play casters/hybrid casters. Something akin to a Shaman or Druid. But this game appears to have no spellcasters whatsoever. Everything appears to be melee only save for bows. Their hybrid classes are all hybrid melee's. Whether thats melee/healer/ melee/buffer melee/debuffer etc. which for me is a major turn off.
I like this idea, however their is a lot of people that like to play merchants and crafting is part of that.
Personally I would do similar to what you are suggesting with automation except make it where merchant/crafters can set up non AFK stalls right on the spot. Then the player can open a window and do exactly as you say.
I would also add a mechanic that autopays the crafter 50% what an NPC would cost. Additionally I would setup where there was a small chance the crafter could "save" a random component which would drop into the crafters pack as a reward.
So essentially if you want to save money vs NPC you use a player crafter at a 50% savings although NPC is available at higher cost. Process is automated so no hassle to player. Player doesn't even have to pay the crafter as the pay/reward is built into the system.
The same class could be defensive or offensive or support or all three, if geared properly. Some dropped items or artifacts could have a higher proc rate or a larger proc value than player crafted gear but player crafted gear was very necessary to fill in any gaps that dropped gear left.
I don't know why this type of system hasn't been replicated.