Well that's the point isn't it? The only reason this game is putting in these mechanic is there is suppose to be a base of players that have no other option to get this type of play. I don't think anyone is saying that these regressive mechanics are actually popular. Even the game says it knows it appeals to a niche of players.
So where are these people? We are lead to believe there is an entire subset of players that want these features yet they cant even be bothered to play this game? Obviously there is not such a big demand that people are climbing over each other to get in. You would think they would be playing the BETA getting all their "FUN" in before it changes.
So its pretty obvious this theory that there is this large underserved base of players that want death penalties, trash loot, no teleportation is going up in smoke. I guess the final nail in the coffin will be release, once that is completely empty hopefully we wont have to hear this theory again.
Eh? Remember, I already wrote a whole saga about this being little more rose colored glasses.
However, I do have a optimist streak, sometimes, so just something to keep in mind, UO's best year was 5 years after launch. So maybe it's just not grabbing people yet, so who knows, maybe when word of mouth kicks in, maybe some larger Role Play guilds will start to pick up the game, streamers will start to play it, and suddenly the population begins to grow.
I mean, hell, ponder this, Among Us, was an unknown game for 3 years after it's launch, made by a small studio, and then just became a craze, and the Studio had more money and fame then it knew what to do with.. and.. legit.. Innersloth had no idea what to do with their newfound fame, like they just froze from it.
So, IF, the game is good and scratches that itch.. it might not be a big thing now, but it become a winner 3 years down the road.. might also close it's doors in a month.. legit.. fuck if I know.
If I knew things like that I would invest in CF games, and make a killing, which is why I don't touch a game till they give me a game to play.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
Eh? Remember, I already wrote a whole saga about this being little more rose colored glasses.
However, I do have a optimist streak, sometimes, so just something to keep in mind, UO's best year was 5 years after launch. So maybe it's just not grabbing people yet, so who knows, maybe when word of mouth kicks in, maybe some larger Role Play guilds will start to pick up the game, streamers will start to play it, and suddenly the population begins to grow.
I mean, hell, ponder this, Among Us, was an unknown game for 3 years after it's launch, made by a small studio, and then just became a craze, and the Studio had more money and fame then it knew what to do with.. and.. legit.. Innersloth had no idea what to do with their newfound fame, like they just froze from it.
So, IF, the game is good and scratches that itch.. it might not be a big thing now, but it become a winner 3 years down the road.. might also close it's doors in a month.. legit.. fuck if I know.
If I knew things like that I would invest in CF games, and make a killing, which is why I don't touch a game till they give me a game to play.
LOL well you have a bunch of MAYBE's and IF's, really stretching reality here. I have a maybe/if for you. HMMM every think its possible this crowd doesn't even exist and its the same couple hundred players jumping game to game in alpha/beta pushing these games for these mechanics that keep failing? That would be a shocker!
I suppose its much easier to throw out a bunch of crazy theories as to why this game is dead, like maybe aliens will invade the earth and start playing this game.
I will just go with the obvious choice. The reasons these games are dead is because few want these mechanics. The reason Vanilla WoW had 11mil subs was because the community wanted at least basic QOL which they added. I know this might be a stretch for you, but its not really hard to understand for me.
Eh? Remember, I already wrote a whole saga about this being little more rose colored glasses.
However, I do have a optimist streak, sometimes, so just something to keep in mind, UO's best year was 5 years after launch. So maybe it's just not grabbing people yet, so who knows, maybe when word of mouth kicks in, maybe some larger Role Play guilds will start to pick up the game, streamers will start to play it, and suddenly the population begins to grow.
I mean, hell, ponder this, Among Us, was an unknown game for 3 years after it's launch, made by a small studio, and then just became a craze, and the Studio had more money and fame then it knew what to do with.. and.. legit.. Innersloth had no idea what to do with their newfound fame, like they just froze from it.
So, IF, the game is good and scratches that itch.. it might not be a big thing now, but it become a winner 3 years down the road.. might also close it's doors in a month.. legit.. fuck if I know.
If I knew things like that I would invest in CF games, and make a killing, which is why I don't touch a game till they give me a game to play.
LOL well you have a bunch of MAYBE's and IF's, really stretching reality here. I have a maybe/if for you. HMMM every think its possible this crowd doesn't even exist and its the same couple hundred players jumping game to game in alpha/beta pushing these games for these mechanics that keep failing? That would be a shocker!
I suppose its much easier to throw out a bunch of crazy theories as to why this game is dead, like maybe aliens will invade the earth and start playing this game.
I will just go with the obvious choice. The reasons these games are dead is because few want these mechanics. The reason Vanilla WoW had 11mil subs was because the community wanted at least basic QOL which they added. I know this might be a stretch for you, but its not really hard to understand for me.
Keep in mind, 11M came 3 or 4 expansions later, around Cataclysm maybe, vanilla WOW "only" had like 3 or 4 million subs I think.
Also, before using numbers to support your case, remember WOW might have more players in their more hardcore Classic servers right now than the latest version, largely because they walked back many of the QOL improvements made over the years.
Another point, WOW might have 3- 4 million players today, but quite a few years ago announced over 100M gamers had paid for a sub over the years.
So despite all of their QOL "improvements" 95% of their player base has walked away for good.
It might be fair to compare NW to WOW but WOW to EA, apples to oranges in every possible way.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Keep in mind, 11M came 3 or 4 expansions later, around Cataclysm maybe, vanilla WOW "only" had like 3 or 4 million subs I think.
Also, before using numbers to support your case, remember WOW might have more players in their more hardcore Classic servers right now than the latest version, largely because they walked back many of the QOL improvements made over the years.
Another point, WOW might have 3- 4 million players today, but quite a few years ago announced over 100M gamers had paid for a sub over the years.
So despite all of their QOL "improvements" 95% of their player base has walked away for good.
It might be fair to compare NW to WOW but WOW to EA, apples to oranges in every possible way.
Well interestingly it might seem I am pushing all these QOL improvements. But I am not firmly in the QOL diehard camp. On a scale from 1 to 100 where RETAIL WOW represents a 80. I am probably at around 35. I am advocating for basic QOL improvements.
What I am NOT advocating for is:
EZ mode mob kills Running thru dungeons killing everything without even being able to loot Fast kills or progression Skill less encounters Mods that tell you when to move out of red Quest Arrows on the ground telling you where to go, lighting arrow path to follow Quests EZ mode in general like Questie Auto-teleports to location for quests. Auto run to location Autotargeting Auto stuff in general Gear being emailed to you all the time as you level I am against most of the "QOL" improvements new games have invented to make things feel like AUTO mode.
So yeah I think Retail WoW went overboard, and Classic WoW was probably a decent spot. So if embers cant even move to where I am at, they are just sitting in the darkest super fringe corner.
I am only pushing for BASIC QOL improvements. Decent Inventory, Summons to Party, Recall to town, basic travel options like speed boosts/horse/flyer, death penalty that doesn't kill massive time, decent regen out of combat.
The game is dead on arrival. Anyone who says otherwise is just kidding themselves. If you enjoy the game, that's great. You better play it while you can because it's not going to be around for very long once the money dries up.
If there was real demand for these mechanics like lack in inventory, extinct loot, waiting after battle for stamina/health, corpse runs, lack of travel etc... they wouldn't being struggling to get more than 6 people to play SERVERWIDE at a time. People cant even form a full group of players because nobody will even play.
You would think with all these forum warriors on Embers and Pantheons site saying how popular these mechanics are they would all be in this game playing and enjoying themselves while they can. They would get in on the action before this game does a complete 180 and changes all these things so they can actually make some money.
Or another thought, maybe all of them are actually playing this game and there is not even enough to fill a full group.
You know very well they intend to add fast travel and are talking about some sort of recall. At least you should be genuine in your critique
You also know they remain open to feedback on the death penalty and just recently adjusted it again. They are not entirely inflexible on it.
So, IF, the game is good and scratches that itch.. it might not be a big thing now, but it become a winner 3 years down the road.. might also close it's doors in a month.. legit.. fuck if I know.
If I knew things like that I would invest in CF games, and make a killing, which is why I don't touch a game till they give me a game to play.
It is potentially viable for the audience it seeks. It's far too niche to expect much more than the modest success appealing to a smaller market brings. Some of the comments here don't completely represent the developers intent regarding game features yet to come and their ongoing adjustment to those in place. I expect that if the game reaches release aspects some take issue with will no longer be as they are today.
Their hope to survive on subscription alone likely won't survive that journey. Interestingly, at least to me, is that P:G now has over 1,000 optional subscriptions despite being in early access and aesthetically challenged. That's by no means a huge number but I'm sure it would still be surprising to some. So, who knows really. Unexpected things sometimes happen.
I sense a cash shop coming... ie. to expand inventory, etc.?
Their intent is to be subscription only which is optimistic to say the least.
The entire project seems optimistic tbh, considering their limited resources in funding and manpower. Who knows, maybe it will attract an investor, but MMORPGs aren't a cheap or easy genre to produce.
The game is dead on arrival. Anyone who says otherwise is just kidding themselves. If you enjoy the game, that's great. You better play it while you can because it's not going to be around for very long once the money dries up.
Theres no way the game survives long term as a sub only...They will have to go to some sort of f2p or it will go under.
The game is dead on arrival. Anyone who says otherwise is just kidding themselves. If you enjoy the game, that's great. You better play it while you can because it's not going to be around for very long once the money dries up.
Theres no way the game survives long term as a sub only...They will have to go to some sort of f2p or it will go under.
Probably.
But then again who knows their overhead costs. If the team is small enough... they could be happy with 500 or 1000 subs.
I sense a cash shop coming... ie. to expand inventory, etc.?
Their intent is to be subscription only which is optimistic to say the least.
The entire project seems optimistic tbh, considering their limited resources in funding and manpower. Who knows, maybe it will attract an investor, but MMORPGs aren't a cheap or easy genre to produce.
Funny story, but they have been slogging away for quite awhile on a hobbiest basis when somehow they got some investor funding 2 or 3 years back.
They stopped accepting new pledges, went dark from public view for a year or more, remerging early this year with a new org structure (a couple of founders departed for reasons never really shared) and changed the name to Embers Adrift.
They announced the public beta, reopening of the pledge store, and in a bold move, a target release date. (Who does this anymore?)
No matter what else I have to give them credit for showing a lot of moxie in getting this far, but still doesn't mean I'll be playing their game.
Lack of inventory space and decent navigation tools (like a darn compass) being the biggest QOL tools I am unwilling to live without.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
The game is dead on arrival. Anyone who says otherwise is just kidding themselves. If you enjoy the game, that's great. You better play it while you can because it's not going to be around for very long once the money dries up.
Theres no way the game survives long term as a sub only...They will have to go to some sort of f2p or it will go under.
Probably.
But then again who knows their overhead costs. If the team is small enough... they could be happy with 500 or 1000 subs.
Survive, maybe. Be happy about, probably not.
1000 subscriptions at $15/month = 15,000/month. That's got to cover rental, bandwidth, personnel, utilities, business licenses, business insurance and the like. That's going to be very tight, especially with more than 3 employees. Depending on their investor arrangements, their break-even point might be 2500 subscriptions. That seems far less likely.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
Kyleran said: Keep in mind, 11M came 3 or 4 expansions later, around Cataclysm maybe, vanilla WOW "only" had like 3 or 4 million subs I think.
WoW, only sold something like a Million Copies at launch.
But keep in mind, this was an MMO that was literally, pulling a lot of jaded EQ1 players, and had been building up hype about some of their Devs being former Top Tier EQ1 players, so this game, was hyped to all hell when it launch, and it still only sold like a million copies.
Also, keep in mind, WoW climbed in popularity from launch and just went up, unlike other flash in the pan games that have a high launch number, and then die off, WoW started humble and just grew. By 2011, they were topping the charts as the King Shit of Gaming with 12 Million Subs.
That was 7 years of direct continual growth from launch.
IMHO, when it comes to MMO's, the real metric is how many people are still there 5 years later, not how many people where there for the opening party.
But again... it might stumble out the starting gate, trip, fall, break it's leg, and need to be put down in 3 years as well.. honestly..
Fuck if I know what will happen.. I might give the game a try when they have a game to try, but till then, I have no idea how good or bad this game is.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
If there was real demand for these mechanics like lack in inventory, extinct loot, waiting after battle for stamina/health, corpse runs, lack of travel etc... they wouldn't being struggling to get more than 6 people to play SERVERWIDE at a time. People cant even form a full group of players because nobody will even play.
You would think with all these forum warriors on Embers and Pantheons site saying how popular these mechanics are they would all be in this game playing and enjoying themselves while they can. They would get in on the action before this game does a complete 180 and changes all these things so they can actually make some money.
Or another thought, maybe all of them are actually playing this game and there is not even enough to fill a full group.
You know very well they intend to add fast travel and are talking about some sort of recall. At least you should be genuine in your critique
You also know they remain open to feedback on the death penalty and just recently adjusted it again. They are not entirely inflexible on it.
First off, you are wrong their site specifically says these features are still being considered but may or may not happen. Back in the start they said they would not have these features at all. So they are definitely moving on their position.
FROM THERE LATEST UPDATE
(still in discussions, may or may not happen) hearthstone ability that will likely take you back to the zone's "default" spawn point at the cost of ember essence
(still in discussions, may or may not happen) inter-zone group summon ability that will cost ember essence
In fact I will go even father and say they will continue moving BIG TIME. When they see nobody wants these stupid features, they are going to backtrack on all their IDEAS completely.
In the end, its all about money. So what they are saying is core to their game, is obviously not core to their game. What you have is a studio that is stubborn and extremely out of touch with reality. They think there is a big base of players that want this and are SLOWLY figuring out that a large group doesn't exist.
So why should I account for where they will move the game in 6 months when I already know they are going to change every one of these things, they just don't know it yet.
I am just trying to get them there faster, so that they have a chance to save their game. But its likely too late either way now.
I sense a cash shop coming... ie. to expand inventory, etc.?
Their intent is to be subscription only which is optimistic to say the least.
The entire project seems optimistic tbh, considering their limited resources in funding and manpower. Who knows, maybe it will attract an investor, but MMORPGs aren't a cheap or easy genre to produce.
The entire project is optimistic, but hoping to be subscription only is particularly so. Then again, anything else may compromise appeal to their intended market. One could argue that part of the old school experience is monetization reflective of it.
They do have limited resources but being a small team also limits their costs. Provided they keep their ambition modest and maintain a high degree of tenacity I believe success is within their grasp.
If there was real demand for these mechanics like lack in inventory, extinct loot, waiting after battle for stamina/health, corpse runs, lack of travel etc... they wouldn't being struggling to get more than 6 people to play SERVERWIDE at a time. People cant even form a full group of players because nobody will even play.
You would think with all these forum warriors on Embers and Pantheons site saying how popular these mechanics are they would all be in this game playing and enjoying themselves while they can. They would get in on the action before this game does a complete 180 and changes all these things so they can actually make some money.
Or another thought, maybe all of them are actually playing this game and there is not even enough to fill a full group.
You know very well they intend to add fast travel and are talking about some sort of recall. At least you should be genuine in your critique
You also know they remain open to feedback on the death penalty and just recently adjusted it again. They are not entirely inflexible on it.
First off, you are wrong their site specifically says these features are still being considered but may or may not happen. Back in the start they said they would not have these features at all. So they are definitely moving on their position.
FROM THERE LATEST UPDATE
(still in discussions, may or may not happen) hearthstone ability that will likely take you back to the zone's "default" spawn point at the cost of ember essence
(still in discussions, may or may not happen) inter-zone group summon ability that will cost ember essence
In fact I will go even father and say they will continue moving BIG TIME. When they see nobody wants these stupid features, they are going to backtrack on all their IDEAS completely.
In the end, its all about money. So what they are saying is core to their game, is obviously not core to their game. What you have is a studio that is stubborn and extremely out of touch with reality. They think there is a big base of players that want this and are SLOWLY figuring out that a large group doesn't exist.
So why should I account for where they will move the game in 6 months when I already know they are going to change every one of these things, they just don't know it yet.
I am just trying to get them there faster, so that they have a chance to save their game. But its likely too late either way now.
That they are planning on adding fast travel is certain. That they are talking about some sort of recall is not wrong, as "still in discussions" clearly indicates. I didn't even mention they are talking about an inter-zone group summon at all. My error there was forgetting to mention their discussion of it, not your imaginary claim I said it was certain.
Change happening despite their initial stance is indicative of their willingness to consider feedback and make some changes in response to it. That doesn't mean they are open to every suggestion their players make or acting on it precisely as desired.
What is core to their game is up to them to decide. A studio should be somewhat stubborn or their vision for their game will be constantly compromised. Likewise they should be slow to change and moderate when they do to aid in that preservation.
Perhaps for them it isn't all about money, though they undoubtedly hope
to be profitable. Being a smaller developer aiming to appeal to a niche
audience their motivation could well be other than material alone. It
may be somewhat a passion project of them such that their choices are
not entirely based on their likely effect on the bottom line.
You should talk about their future intent, both declared and being considered, for the sake of accuracy. Your hopeful expectations for how they may change to suit your preference are nothing more than that.
They do have a chance for success and it isn't by necessity confined to your recipe for it. However, they remain open to your input if not always your manner of delivery so if you are as tenacious as they things may adjust more to your preference.
The game isn't even at release yet and doesn't seem immanently so. There is time for them to change should they wish to.
Kyleran said: Keep in mind, 11M came 3 or 4 expansions later, around Cataclysm maybe, vanilla WOW "only" had like 3 or 4 million subs I think.
WoW, only sold something like a Million Copies at launch.
But keep in mind, this was an MMO that was literally, pulling a lot of jaded EQ1 players, and had been building up hype about some of their Devs being former Top Tier EQ1 players, so this game, was hyped to all hell when it launch, and it still only sold like a million copies.
WoW also broke the 24 hour sales record for fastest selling PC game in NA.
But back then the market was different: It meant selling only 240 000 copies. Back then a lot of people still waited for the review on monthly gaming magazine before purchasing, and also when WoW was more successful than they expected it took Blizzard months to launch the required number of servers and bring enough copies of the games to store shelves.
WoW launch numbers shouldn't really be compared to what MMOs today get at launch. It was so different tech and market than today.
Comments
However, I do have a optimist streak, sometimes, so just something to keep in mind, UO's best year was 5 years after launch. So maybe it's just not grabbing people yet, so who knows, maybe when word of mouth kicks in, maybe some larger Role Play guilds will start to pick up the game, streamers will start to play it, and suddenly the population begins to grow.
I mean, hell, ponder this, Among Us, was an unknown game for 3 years after it's launch, made by a small studio, and then just became a craze, and the Studio had more money and fame then it knew what to do with.. and.. legit.. Innersloth had no idea what to do with their newfound fame, like they just froze from it.
So, IF, the game is good and scratches that itch.. it might not be a big thing now, but it become a winner 3 years down the road.. might also close it's doors in a month.. legit.. fuck if I know.
If I knew things like that I would invest in CF games, and make a killing, which is why I don't touch a game till they give me a game to play.
I suppose its much easier to throw out a bunch of crazy theories as to why this game is dead, like maybe aliens will invade the earth and start playing this game.
I will just go with the obvious choice. The reasons these games are dead is because few want these mechanics. The reason Vanilla WoW had 11mil subs was because the community wanted at least basic QOL which they added. I know this might be a stretch for you, but its not really hard to understand for me.
Also, before using numbers to support your case, remember WOW might have more players in their more hardcore Classic servers right now than the latest version, largely because they walked back many of the QOL improvements made over the years.
Another point, WOW might have 3- 4 million players today, but quite a few years ago announced over 100M gamers had paid for a sub over the years.
So despite all of their QOL "improvements" 95% of their player base has walked away for good.
It might be fair to compare NW to WOW but WOW to EA, apples to oranges in every possible way.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Well interestingly it might seem I am pushing all these QOL improvements. But I am not firmly in the QOL diehard camp. On a scale from 1 to 100 where RETAIL WOW represents a 80. I am probably at around 35. I am advocating for basic QOL improvements.
What I am NOT advocating for is:
EZ mode mob kills
Running thru dungeons killing everything without even being able to loot
Fast kills or progression
Skill less encounters
Mods that tell you when to move out of red
Quest Arrows on the ground telling you where to go, lighting arrow path to follow
Quests EZ mode in general like Questie
Auto-teleports to location for quests.
Auto run to location
Autotargeting
Auto stuff in general
Gear being emailed to you all the time as you level
I am against most of the "QOL" improvements new games have invented to make things feel like AUTO mode.
So yeah I think Retail WoW went overboard, and Classic WoW was probably a decent spot. So if embers cant even move to where I am at, they are just sitting in the darkest super fringe corner.
I am only pushing for BASIC QOL improvements. Decent Inventory, Summons to Party, Recall to town, basic travel options like speed boosts/horse/flyer, death penalty that doesn't kill massive time, decent regen out of combat.
I'm not asking to put the game on AUTO.
You know very well they intend to add fast travel and are talking about some sort of recall. At least you should be genuine in your critique
You also know they remain open to feedback on the death penalty and just recently adjusted it again. They are not entirely inflexible on it.
Their intent is to be subscription only which is optimistic to say the least.
It is potentially viable for the audience it seeks. It's far too niche to expect much more than the modest success appealing to a smaller market brings. Some of the comments here don't completely represent the developers intent regarding game features yet to come and their ongoing adjustment to those in place. I expect that if the game reaches release aspects some take issue with will no longer be as they are today.
Their hope to survive on subscription alone likely won't survive that journey. Interestingly, at least to me, is that P:G now has over 1,000 optional subscriptions despite being in early access and aesthetically challenged. That's by no means a huge number but I'm sure it would still be surprising to some. So, who knows really. Unexpected things sometimes happen.
Theres no way the game survives long term as a sub only...They will have to go to some sort of f2p or it will go under.
But then again who knows their overhead costs. If the team is small enough... they could be happy with 500 or 1000 subs.
They stopped accepting new pledges, went dark from public view for a year or more, remerging early this year with a new org structure (a couple of founders departed for reasons never really shared) and changed the name to Embers Adrift.
They announced the public beta, reopening of the pledge store, and in a bold move, a target release date. (Who does this anymore?)
No matter what else I have to give them credit for showing a lot of moxie in getting this far, but still doesn't mean I'll be playing their game.
Lack of inventory space and decent navigation tools (like a darn compass) being the biggest QOL tools I am unwilling to live without.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
But keep in mind, this was an MMO that was literally, pulling a lot of jaded EQ1 players, and had been building up hype about some of their Devs being former Top Tier EQ1 players, so this game, was hyped to all hell when it launch, and it still only sold like a million copies.
Also, keep in mind, WoW climbed in popularity from launch and just went up, unlike other flash in the pan games that have a high launch number, and then die off, WoW started humble and just grew. By 2011, they were topping the charts as the King Shit of Gaming with 12 Million Subs.
That was 7 years of direct continual growth from launch.
IMHO, when it comes to MMO's, the real metric is how many people are still there 5 years later, not how many people where there for the opening party.
But again... it might stumble out the starting gate, trip, fall, break it's leg, and need to be put down in 3 years as well.. honestly..
Fuck if I know what will happen.. I might give the game a try when they have a game to try, but till then, I have no idea how good or bad this game is.
FROM THERE LATEST UPDATE
In fact I will go even father and say they will continue moving BIG TIME. When they see nobody wants these stupid features, they are going to backtrack on all their IDEAS completely.
In the end, its all about money. So what they are saying is core to their game, is obviously not core to their game. What you have is a studio that is stubborn and extremely out of touch with reality. They think there is a big base of players that want this and are SLOWLY figuring out that a large group doesn't exist.
So why should I account for where they will move the game in 6 months when I already know they are going to change every one of these things, they just don't know it yet.
I am just trying to get them there faster, so that they have a chance to save their game. But its likely too late either way now.
The entire project is optimistic, but hoping to be subscription only is particularly so. Then again, anything else may compromise appeal to their intended market. One could argue that part of the old school experience is monetization reflective of it.
They do have limited resources but being a small team also limits their costs. Provided they keep their ambition modest and maintain a high degree of tenacity I believe success is within their grasp.
That they are planning on adding fast travel is certain. That they are talking about some sort of recall is not wrong, as "still in discussions" clearly indicates. I didn't even mention they are talking about an inter-zone group summon at all. My error there was forgetting to mention their discussion of it, not your imaginary claim I said it was certain.
Change happening despite their initial stance is indicative of their willingness to consider feedback and make some changes in response to it. That doesn't mean they are open to every suggestion their players make or acting on it precisely as desired.
You should talk about their future intent, both declared and being considered, for the sake of accuracy. Your hopeful expectations for how they may change to suit your preference are nothing more than that.
They do have a chance for success and it isn't by necessity confined to your recipe for it. However, they remain open to your input if not always your manner of delivery so if you are as tenacious as they things may adjust more to your preference.
The game isn't even at release yet and doesn't seem immanently so. There is time for them to change should they wish to.
But back then the market was different: It meant selling only 240 000 copies. Back then a lot of people still waited for the review on monthly gaming magazine before purchasing, and also when WoW was more successful than they expected it took Blizzard months to launch the required number of servers and bring enough copies of the games to store shelves.
WoW launch numbers shouldn't really be compared to what MMOs today get at launch. It was so different tech and market than today.