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Should more MMO's do "expeditions" like No Man's Sky?

olepiolepi Member EpicPosts: 3,017
edited March 2023 in The Pub at MMORPG.COM
No Mans' Sky (NMS) is a sandbox, your character can do everything based on what tools, weapons, ships, etc you have, and what upgrades they have. Creating an alt means nothing really, since every character can do everything.

NMS has "expeditions", where the player starts out a new game, with almost no tools, weapons, or ships. There are certain milestones you have to complete to advance the expedition. Your money and items from your regular game are not included.

So it's like playing a new alt, and whatever is discovered or awarded to the alt carries over to your other characters. The play is not so much sandbox, as a long questline. Although to get there you still use all the knowledge of how to play and can use sandbox features to harvest, mine, and craft items you know you will need.

How many times have you wanted to play an alt in an MMO? But didn't want to waste the time? What if you played the alt and your main toon gets to keep the rewards? 

Should other MMO's use a mechanism like this?

------------
2024: 47 years on the Net.


Champiecameltosis
«1

Comments

  • TheocritusTheocritus Member LegendaryPosts: 9,976
    Hi...Im Theocritus...and Im an.....altoholic
    eoloePhaserlightScot
  • olepiolepi Member EpicPosts: 3,017
    Theocritus said:
    Hi...Im Theocritus...and Im an.....altoholic

    I am too, bad. But what does it mean in a sandbox?

    The expedition lets you play from the start again, but keep your expedition  rewards on your main character.

    ------------
    2024: 47 years on the Net.


  • UwakionnaUwakionna Member RarePosts: 1,139
    edited March 2023
    That's called a season. MMOs do it a lot.

    Edit: ok to be fair not all games call it seasons. Some call them progression servers. Some just tie events to the character (like STO has "recruit" events where you get a unique unlock progression track added to leveling and doing certain things on a new captain).

    I dare say the expedition model NMS uses is based on these longstanding habits.
    Post edited by Uwakionna on
  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    olepi said:

    The expedition lets you play from the start again, but keep your expedition  rewards on your main character.
    What kind of rewards?

    Most games with a supported alt system have at least some and sometimes many things that are account-wide and apply to all your characters.

    Things like gear, achievements, transmogs, and some even (like D3 and ESO with the Paragon and Champion Point systems for example) have stats that you can apply to all characters in the account.

    What else does NMS have that is unique? 
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  • olepiolepi Member EpicPosts: 3,017
    Iselin said:
    olepi said:

    The expedition lets you play from the start again, but keep your expedition  rewards on your main character.
    What kind of rewards?

    Most games with a supported alt system have at least some and sometimes many things that are account-wide and apply to all your characters.

    Things like gear, achievements, transmogs, and some even (like D3 and ESO with the Paragon and Champion Point systems for example) have stats that you can apply to all characters in the account.

    What else does NMS have that is unique? 

    The rewards are mainly some cosmetics,  a new robot pet, and a new ship.

    Regular alts don't do that in NMS. If you start a new character, it is separate from the other characters you have. Whatever ships, etc, one has are not shared with the others. Once the expedition is over, you can keep the new character if you want. Or get the rewards applied to other chracters.

    In the expeditions, everybody is doing the same quests, so you see tons of other player bases, ships, etc while doing it. Normally in NMS, you don't see many people except at the hub. 

    I usually play lots of alts, to see how different setups play differently. In NMS, a sandbox, they all play the same, so no raeson really to make alts. So the expeditions scratch that itch for me.

    ------------
    2024: 47 years on the Net.


  • eoloeeoloe Member RarePosts: 864
    The appeal of alts for me is the ability of playing different game mechanics.

    Creating alts for getting skins and other cosmetics sound like a hassle.
    MMOExposedSovrathKyleran
  • defector1968defector1968 Member UncommonPosts: 469
    No mans' sky is NOT an mmo
    so its expeditions by creating new save each time isnt what mmos do.
    MMOs already have theri expeditions, they call them events.
    Champie
    fan of SWG, XCOM, Defiance, Global Agenda, Need For Speed, all Star Wars single player games. And waiting the darn STAR CITIZEN
  • AmarantharAmaranthar Member EpicPosts: 5,851
    edited March 2023
    I want expeditions in my MMORPGs, but I want them in the regular game world. 
    What I want requires a rich Sandbox world where you can try different things out, including crafting tools, spells (a fireball might cause a secret door to open, or writing on a wall to reveal), things like that, to see if they have an effect. Clues might lead to these, and they could require a "key" of sorts. 

    The rewards should be unique and rare items of all sorts, including unknown knowledge of things too (in many varieties). 

    Edit: A huge World, too. Expeditions should be as much about the journey as the destination. This only adds to one of the biggest player desires, exploration. 
    Champie

    Once upon a time....

  • PhaserlightPhaserlight Member EpicPosts: 3,075
    If a game allows you to create alts, I feel there should be some meaning behind it; I guess I disagree with a design philosophy of 'one character can do it all'; this doesn't necessarily have to be based on 'character class', either: it could simply be a matter of choices made along the way (although I suppose you could make the argument that picking a class is a choice).

    If I start from the beginning again, it's neat to see how differently things can play out.

    "The simple is the seal of the true and beauty is the splendor of truth" -Subrahmanyan Chandrasekhar
    Authored 139 missions in Vendetta Online and 6 tracks in Distance

  • AmarantharAmaranthar Member EpicPosts: 5,851
    Phaserlight said:
    If a game allows you to create alts, I feel there should be some meaning behind it; I guess I disagree with a design philosophy of 'one character can do it all'; this doesn't necessarily have to be based on 'character class', either: it could simply be a matter of choices made along the way (although I suppose you could make the argument that picking a class is a choice).

    If I start from the beginning again, it's neat to see how differently things can play out.
    Yeah, I like Alts for that too. I like Characters that are devoted to general things that we can do in MMORPGs. One Fighter might also be a Smith, another might also be a Ranger. 
    For exploration and Expeditions, I'd want a Ranger type but depending on the game, with some other skills/abilities too. Then I'd also want a Mage who can do a few other things too, for the actual Dungeon depths and whatnot. But it all depends on the game design, of course. 

    Once upon a time....

  • mklinicmklinic Member RarePosts: 2,012
    Makes me think of Path of Exiles. A league introduces new mechanics usually and, once its run its course, I believe the character is converted to a normal save like with NMS. It's been a while since I played PoE so someone can correct me if I'm misremembering.

    Putting aside any "it's not an MMO/is an MMO debate": Sure. It's a nice option for people to have, so why not. 

    -mklinic

    "Do something right, no one remembers.
    Do something wrong, no one forgets"
    -from No One Remembers by In Strict Confidence

  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 24,273
    Its an answer to the insatiable demand for new content by giving the same old again, so not a fan. 
    Champie
  • ChampieChampie Member UncommonPosts: 191
    I have no experience in most MMO's, but I have much experience in one particular MMO that nobody else here plays, or even knows about.

    Salem (The Crafting MMO) has had 2 Expedition Servers since 2012. First was in 2015, the last was in 2017-18.

    https://salemthegame.wiki/page/Expedition
    About

    An expedition is a separate game server with its own unique map, rules and mechanics. Expeditions are meant for players that want more action. Since the map area is 10 times smaller, a lot more confrontations will happen.

    An expedition is also a place to experience the newest mechanics that will be transferred to the main server Providence when polished out in the end of an expedition.


    Salem is from the same developers who created Haven & Hearth (with help from Paradox Interactive) and was sold to a dedicated fan(s) in 2014 who implemented the Expedition Server system. The current SOLO developer had previously been the artist and designer of the expeditions. 


  • TheDalaiBombaTheDalaiBomba Member EpicPosts: 1,493
    edited March 2023
    If a game allows you to create alts, I feel there should be some meaning behind it; I guess I disagree with a design philosophy of 'one character can do it all'; this doesn't necessarily have to be based on 'character class', either: it could simply be a matter of choices made along the way (although I suppose you could make the argument that picking a class is a choice).

    If I start from the beginning again, it's neat to see how differently things can play out.
    Any game that includes AI companions for things like crafting (i.e. SWTOR, Albion) should allow you to replace the randomized NPC with an alt that has those crafting abilities.  I would also include a bonus to efficiency or chance for rare/upgrade items if you went through the trouble of leveling an alt's crafting professions.  Of course, when you can level everything (Albion), there's really no point.

    But that doesn't directly pertain to static instanced content to repeat ad nauseum, so nobody cares.  People are strange, man.
  • mklinicmklinic Member RarePosts: 2,012
    Scot said:
    Its an answer to the insatiable demand for new content by giving the same old again, so not a fan. 
    How so? In NMS' case, the Expeditions coincide with major patches that either bring new features or overhaul existing. The expedition serves more as a guided tour through those additions/changes, so not sure how that is giving the same old again.

    Similar with PoE's approach. New Leagues tend to come with new mechanics.

    Otherwies, you're just doing time-constrained 'fresh starts' which, i agree, would have limited value/appeal (for me at least).
    ChampieScot

    -mklinic

    "Do something right, no one remembers.
    Do something wrong, no one forgets"
    -from No One Remembers by In Strict Confidence

  • DibdabsDibdabs Member RarePosts: 3,238
    edited March 2023
    Iselin said:
    What else does NMS have that is unique? 

    Bonecrushing tedium.  Endless planet all exactly the same - same organic and mineral  materials everywhere, just different skins to give the illusion of depth.  Infinite same old, same old.
  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 24,273
    edited March 2023
    mklinic said:
    Scot said:
    Its an answer to the insatiable demand for new content by giving the same old again, so not a fan. 
    How so? In NMS' case, the Expeditions coincide with major patches that either bring new features or overhaul existing. The expedition serves more as a guided tour through those additions/changes, so not sure how that is giving the same old again.

    Similar with PoE's approach. New Leagues tend to come with new mechanics.

    Otherwies, you're just doing time-constrained 'fresh starts' which, i agree, would have limited value/appeal (for me at least).
    It sounds like I would have to play it to see what you mean and since it is sitting in my Steam Library waiting to played that may even be this year. Yes, with all the games I have unplayed I am not sure it will be this year!
    Post edited by Scot on
  • PhaserlightPhaserlight Member EpicPosts: 3,075
    Champie said:
    I have no experience in most MMO's, but I have much experience in one particular MMO that nobody else here plays, or even knows about.

    Salem (The Crafting MMO) has had 2 Expedition Servers since 2012. First was in 2015, the last was in 2017-18.

    https://salemthegame.wiki/page/Expedition
    About

    An expedition is a separate game server with its own unique map, rules and mechanics. Expeditions are meant for players that want more action. Since the map area is 10 times smaller, a lot more confrontations will happen.

    An expedition is also a place to experience the newest mechanics that will be transferred to the main server Providence when polished out in the end of an expedition.


    Salem is from the same developers who created Haven & Hearth (with help from Paradox Interactive) and was sold to a dedicated fan(s) in 2014 who implemented the Expedition Server system. The current SOLO developer had previously been the artist and designer of the expeditions. 



    I know about Salem.
    Champie

    "The simple is the seal of the true and beauty is the splendor of truth" -Subrahmanyan Chandrasekhar
    Authored 139 missions in Vendetta Online and 6 tracks in Distance

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 32,780
    I'm not really a big "alt" person but I don't think something like this would be a bad thing for those who enjoy alts.

    I would love to see a more complex "radiant quest" system, like what is used in Skyrim but more involved, come to mmorpg's.
    Scot
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  • olepiolepi Member EpicPosts: 3,017
    edited March 2023
    Deathkon1 said:
    Hi...Im Theocritus...and Im an.....altoholic
    My first experience with alting was with minecraft in factions and now I do it with every game I play pretty much for several different reasons like trying something new or making grinds easier for my main.

    In DAOC back in 2001, I played a Minstrel, Cabalist, and Cleric to max level. Even back then I had it bad.

    In CoH I went crazy, making over 45 alts.

    In ESO I had to play almost every class to max level.

    I've got it bad.

    ------------
    2024: 47 years on the Net.


  • AdamantineAdamantine Member RarePosts: 5,093
    I own NMS.

    Expeditions I did so far: 0

    Expeditions I forsee doing in future: 0
    Dibdabs
  • cameltosiscameltosis Member LegendaryPosts: 3,832
    I only play alts in order to experience new gameplay mechanics.


    So, if an expedition introduces a new class / skill line which plays significantly differently to what is already available, great, im in. Otherwise, couldn't care less.
    Currently Playing: WAR RoR - Spitt rr7X Black Orc | Scrotling rr6X Squig Herder | Scabrous rr4X Shaman

  • olepiolepi Member EpicPosts: 3,017
    cameltosis said:
    I only play alts in order to experience new gameplay mechanics.


    So, if an expedition introduces a new class / skill line which plays significantly differently to what is already available, great, im in. Otherwise, couldn't care less.

    NMS is a sandbox, there are no classes or skill lines. What the expedition does is start you out as a new player, on a world they picked, and you have to follow a chain of missions on different planets.

    So you get to play differently, although you could probably just start a new game and get the new experience without the expedition.

    The only rewards for completing one is some cosmetics and a new ship, if you like to collect ships. I haven't done one to conclusion yet.

    ------------
    2024: 47 years on the Net.


  • cameltosiscameltosis Member LegendaryPosts: 3,832
    olepi said:
    cameltosis said:
    I only play alts in order to experience new gameplay mechanics.


    So, if an expedition introduces a new class / skill line which plays significantly differently to what is already available, great, im in. Otherwise, couldn't care less.

    NMS is a sandbox, there are no classes or skill lines. What the expedition does is start you out as a new player, on a world they picked, and you have to follow a chain of missions on different planets.

    So you get to play differently, although you could probably just start a new game and get the new experience without the expedition.

    The only rewards for completing one is some cosmetics and a new ship, if you like to collect ships. I haven't done one to conclusion yet.

    Yeh, doesn't sound like the sort of thing I'd enjoy if it doesn't introduce new gameplay. But, I'm an endgame-focused player, I really dislike the leveling up process so a new game mode that encourages me to do the thing I don't enjoy was never gonna work for me!
    Currently Playing: WAR RoR - Spitt rr7X Black Orc | Scrotling rr6X Squig Herder | Scabrous rr4X Shaman

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