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Meet Loftia, an Indie Solarpunk Social MMO in Development Now | MMORPG.com

SystemSystem Member UncommonPosts: 12,599
edited July 2023 in News & Features Discussion

imageMeet Loftia, an Indie Solarpunk Social MMO in Development Now | MMORPG.com

Loftia, developed by Qloud Games, is an indie social farming MMO that is in development.

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 25,483
    Pushing for a "bright, sustainable future" in a genre known for griefers? What could possibly go wrong?
    Scot
  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 25,483
    I looked through their site, and they're pretty openly pushing a political ideology.  Which is fine, really:  if you're going to do that, it's better to be open about it than to ambush people with it after they've paid for the game and gotten far into it.

    But their idea of "sustainable energy" is "flying fish wind turbines".  I am not making that up.  The game pushes for having flying wind turbines that somehow gather 8x the energy of wind turbines anchored to the ground.  A flying wind turbine not anchored to anything would just float around with the wind and not actually generate any energy for you, and that's if you can even keep it afloat.

    You could give it some sort of propulsion system that goes against the wind, but that would take a lot more energy than you'd generate from the turbine.  If you have some other source of energy (magic?) to cause the flying turbines to move how they'd need to in order to generate wind energy, then you could just use that much more directly to generate power on the ground.  Nuclear power, hydro power, and burning hydrocarbons all generate electricity by having something force turbines to spin, and whatever magic causes those flying wind turbines to fly how you want could presumably do the same.

    Meanwhile, the flying turbines aren't actually connected to the electric grid, so even if they can generate net energy, it won't do you any good.  Perhaps you could recharge some batteries or some such, but that won't let you store very much energy from a flight.

    If they want to imagine a world where they don't burn hydrocarbons for energy anymore because they can get electricity from magic instead, that's fine.  But if you're relying on magic, then call it magic.  Don't pretend that it's some fancy technology that is impossible or absurd for so many reasons that it's hard to list them all.
    maskedweaselKyleranValdheimUwakionnaScotSlapshot1188Champie
  • cheezyweaselcheezyweasel Member UncommonPosts: 17
    is this the palia killer?
    strawhat0981Viper482
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 43,975
    edited July 2023

    Quizzical said:

    I looked through their site, and they're pretty openly pushing a political ideology.  Which is fine, really:  if you're going to do that, it's better to be open about it than to ambush people with it after they've paid for the game and gotten far into it.

    But their idea of "sustainable energy" is "flying fish wind turbines".  I am not making that up.  The game pushes for having flying wind turbines that somehow gather 8x the energy of wind turbines anchored to the ground.  A flying wind turbine not anchored to anything would just float around with the wind and not actually generate any energy for you, and that's if you can even keep it afloat.

    You could give it some sort of propulsion system that goes against the wind, but that would take a lot more energy than you'd generate from the turbine.  If you have some other source of energy (magic?) to cause the flying turbines to move how they'd need to in order to generate wind energy, then you could just use that much more directly to generate power on the ground.  Nuclear power, hydro power, and burning hydrocarbons all generate electricity by having something force turbines to spin, and whatever magic causes those flying wind turbines to fly how you want could presumably do the same.

    Meanwhile, the flying turbines aren't actually connected to the electric grid, so even if they can generate net energy, it won't do you any good.  Perhaps you could recharge some batteries or some such, but that won't let you store very much energy from a flight.

    If they want to imagine a world where they don't burn hydrocarbons for energy anymore because they can get electricity from magic instead, that's fine.  But if you're relying on magic, then call it magic.  Don't pretend that it's some fancy technology that is impossible or absurd for so many reasons that it's hard to list them all.


    Well, it's a lot like real life where people think wind and solar can fully replace fossil fuels and of course, no nukes.

    Might as well believe in magic.

    Hey, this quote is very much like our lives in 7D2D, exactly how we go about sustaining our existence.

    Wonder if Loftia has any Z's?  If so, count me in.

    ;)

    "Sustainable Crafting
    By obtaining crafting materials through recycling, scavenging, and more, you'll be able to turn trash into treasure."
    ValdheimScot

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • fineflufffinefluff Member RarePosts: 561
    Playing computer games negatively impacts your carbon footprint.
  • BrenixBrenix Member UncommonPosts: 16
    I've become so apathetic to hearing about MMOs in development.
    strawhat0981Neoyoshi
  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 25,483
    Brenix said:
    I've become so apathetic to hearing about MMOs in development.
    I'm sure that you'll be excited to know that they're planning on having a Kickstarter in the future, but haven't gotten that far yet.
    KyleranChampiestrawhat0981Neoyoshi
  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 25,483
    Kyleran said:

    Quizzical said:

    I looked through their site, and they're pretty openly pushing a political ideology.  Which is fine, really:  if you're going to do that, it's better to be open about it than to ambush people with it after they've paid for the game and gotten far into it.

    But their idea of "sustainable energy" is "flying fish wind turbines".  I am not making that up.  The game pushes for having flying wind turbines that somehow gather 8x the energy of wind turbines anchored to the ground.  A flying wind turbine not anchored to anything would just float around with the wind and not actually generate any energy for you, and that's if you can even keep it afloat.

    You could give it some sort of propulsion system that goes against the wind, but that would take a lot more energy than you'd generate from the turbine.  If you have some other source of energy (magic?) to cause the flying turbines to move how they'd need to in order to generate wind energy, then you could just use that much more directly to generate power on the ground.  Nuclear power, hydro power, and burning hydrocarbons all generate electricity by having something force turbines to spin, and whatever magic causes those flying wind turbines to fly how you want could presumably do the same.

    Meanwhile, the flying turbines aren't actually connected to the electric grid, so even if they can generate net energy, it won't do you any good.  Perhaps you could recharge some batteries or some such, but that won't let you store very much energy from a flight.

    If they want to imagine a world where they don't burn hydrocarbons for energy anymore because they can get electricity from magic instead, that's fine.  But if you're relying on magic, then call it magic.  Don't pretend that it's some fancy technology that is impossible or absurd for so many reasons that it's hard to list them all.


    Well, it's a lot like real life where people think wind and solar can fully replace fossil fuels and of course, no nukes.

    Might as well believe in magic.

    Hey, this quote is very much like our lives in 7D2D, exactly how we go about sustaining our existence.

    Wonder if Loftia has any Z's?  If so, count me in.

    ;)

    "Sustainable Crafting
    By obtaining crafting materials through recycling, scavenging, and more, you'll be able to turn trash into treasure."
    Windmills genuinely do generate power.  The ones that exist in real-life are something closer to disposable toys for politicians so that they can feel good about chasing the latest trendy thing than a serious way to back the power grid.

    Even so, one could imagine plausible, future developments that make windmills last longer, able to handle stronger winds, able to operate in a wider temperature range, and less prone to breaking.  That plus a massively more robust system for transmitting electricity long distances could allow you to import electricity from several hundred miles away even on days that that there isn't much wind locally.

    What is a lot less plausible is that wind power could be more efficient than nuclear, which basically consists of putting your turbines wherever you want, then generating the optimal amount of your own wind to turn them.

    A society where much of the land is covered by ugly windmills that slaughter any birds that fly too close is a rather dystopian vision of the future.  But a society that was really determined to make it work could probably do so, without any need to invoke magic to make it possible.

    My objection here is specifically to flying windmills.  That just doesn't work at all for reasons of physics.
    ValdheimKidRisk
  • maskedweaselmaskedweasel Member LegendaryPosts: 12,195
    Quizzical said:
    Kyleran said:

    Quizzical said:

    I looked through their site, and they're pretty openly pushing a political ideology.  Which is fine, really:  if you're going to do that, it's better to be open about it than to ambush people with it after they've paid for the game and gotten far into it.

    But their idea of "sustainable energy" is "flying fish wind turbines".  I am not making that up.  The game pushes for having flying wind turbines that somehow gather 8x the energy of wind turbines anchored to the ground.  A flying wind turbine not anchored to anything would just float around with the wind and not actually generate any energy for you, and that's if you can even keep it afloat.

    You could give it some sort of propulsion system that goes against the wind, but that would take a lot more energy than you'd generate from the turbine.  If you have some other source of energy (magic?) to cause the flying turbines to move how they'd need to in order to generate wind energy, then you could just use that much more directly to generate power on the ground.  Nuclear power, hydro power, and burning hydrocarbons all generate electricity by having something force turbines to spin, and whatever magic causes those flying wind turbines to fly how you want could presumably do the same.

    Meanwhile, the flying turbines aren't actually connected to the electric grid, so even if they can generate net energy, it won't do you any good.  Perhaps you could recharge some batteries or some such, but that won't let you store very much energy from a flight.

    If they want to imagine a world where they don't burn hydrocarbons for energy anymore because they can get electricity from magic instead, that's fine.  But if you're relying on magic, then call it magic.  Don't pretend that it's some fancy technology that is impossible or absurd for so many reasons that it's hard to list them all.


    Well, it's a lot like real life where people think wind and solar can fully replace fossil fuels and of course, no nukes.

    Might as well believe in magic.

    Hey, this quote is very much like our lives in 7D2D, exactly how we go about sustaining our existence.

    Wonder if Loftia has any Z's?  If so, count me in.

    ;)

    "Sustainable Crafting
    By obtaining crafting materials through recycling, scavenging, and more, you'll be able to turn trash into treasure."
    Windmills genuinely do generate power.  The ones that exist in real-life are something closer to disposable toys for politicians so that they can feel good about chasing the latest trendy thing than a serious way to back the power grid.

    Even so, one could imagine plausible, future developments that make windmills last longer, able to handle stronger winds, able to operate in a wider temperature range, and less prone to breaking.  That plus a massively more robust system for transmitting electricity long distances could allow you to import electricity from several hundred miles away even on days that that there isn't much wind locally.

    What is a lot less plausible is that wind power could be more efficient than nuclear, which basically consists of putting your turbines wherever you want, then generating the optimal amount of your own wind to turn them.

    A society where much of the land is covered by ugly windmills that slaughter any birds that fly too close is a rather dystopian vision of the future.  But a society that was really determined to make it work could probably do so, without any need to invoke magic to make it possible.

    My objection here is specifically to flying windmills.  That just doesn't work at all for reasons of physics.
    But you're forgetting what might be the most technologically advanced part of the flying windmill. It's in the shape of a fish. 

    So you also have to take into consideration the physics of a fish. 
    Valdheim



  • BattlestormBattlestorm Member UncommonPosts: 136
    Gotta applaud them for their intent - sustainable energy would be great. So much energy moving around the earth all the time: wind, water, geo, and sun. There are a lot of drawbacks right now to natural methods (didn’t 14,000 panels get annihilated by hail, recently?). I love the idea, in concept it sounds great - in practice, it’s kind of been a mixed back of relative failures.

    Don’t we have to try, though, honestly? I think we do. At first it starts with more failures than successes, before you know it these methods are resisting hurricanes, saving birds, and shrugging off hailstorms. Maybe it’s the right point of view but with a backdrop of failures that makes it easy to criticize. I don’t know, I have a soft-spot for sustainable energy, so I’m very bias. I hope they do well - but flying windmills…oof, I don’t think I play along with that bit. Maybe I’m not as big of a fan of sustainable as I thought.
  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    edited July 2023
    I hardly see how this cozy fantasy game is "pushing a political ideology" except in the minds of old farts who have a kneejerk compulsion to think of everything as pushing a political agenda.

    All I see is yet another cozy game where everyone loves everyone and has big Teletubby hugs for all.

    I'm not a cozy games fan but "pushing a political agenda?"... pathetic spin.
    ValdemarJViper482
    "Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”

    ― Umberto Eco

    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED

  • OG_SolareusOG_Solareus Member RarePosts: 1,041
    reeeeeeeeeee
    F2P or DIE !
  • UwakionnaUwakionna Member RarePosts: 1,139
    If I wanted to play a game where I recycle people's junk I'd play 76.
    KyleranBattlestorm
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 43,975
    edited July 2023
    Iselin said:
    I hardly see how this cozy fantasy game is "pushing a political ideology" except in the minds of old farts who have a kneejerk compulsion to think of everything as pushing a political agenda.

    All I see is yet another cozy game where everyone loves everyone and has big Teletubby hugs for all.

    I'm not a cozy games fan but "pushing a political agenda?"... pathetic spin.
    No?

    "Qloud believes that Loftia is more than just a game but that it's also a platform where players can learn and advocate for a more sustainable future.

    The developers believe that games have the power to make a positive change in our environment and our world, and this belief is reflected in the game's design and themes"

    One side of the political spectrum favors this sort of approach while the other is in violent opposition.

    Attempts have been made recently to ban natural gas appliances, wood burning stoves etc with an army of supporters lining up to strike down the other side.

    As first said in 1969, "The personal is political."

    https://lifehacker.com/everything-is-political-and-always-has-been-1818724298


    IselinScotQuizzicalSlapshot1188Valdheim

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • slowz2secretslowz2secret Member RarePosts: 445
    Smoke
  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    Kyleran said:

    As first said in 1969, "The personal is political."


    Exactly how the obscenely wealthy power elite wants you to think to keep you busy bickering with your neighbor while they rake in yet more wealth and power.

    And 1969? Lol:

    “Man is by nature a political animal.”
    ― Aristotle


    ValdemarJ
    "Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”

    ― Umberto Eco

    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED

  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 24,273
    edited July 2023
    Thematically there is nothing "punk" about the game, and "solarpunk", well they are showing a lack of imagination there. How we resource our future energy needs is a political issue and as such the game is advocating one way of doing that. So I find this inappropriate for gaming especially as this is aimed at children.

    But our posts have become political, rather hard not to with a game that clearly is mind you. So that's my last post this thread.

    I would remind posters that they can get banned for posting about politics and we don't want to lose any of you. Unlike the recent somewhat political thread by a site member this article is not going to get deleted. So at least we will know who is getting banned, but that is small consolation to those who do I am sure.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 1,043
    The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    DarkZorvanReturns said:
    Can I make everything depend on solar energy, then block out the sun to create, oh I mean prevent, "climate change"?
    In a cozy game? No. They are all about peace, love. idealism and optimism. In any other kind of game? Sure. You can be the evil mad scientist.
    Kyleran
    "Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”

    ― Umberto Eco

    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED

  • olepiolepi Member EpicPosts: 3,017

    Windmills genuinely do generate power.  The ones that exist in real-life are something closer to disposable toys for politicians so that they can feel good about chasing the latest trendy thing than a serious way to back the power grid.


    Wind does generate real energy. Texas, known for being an oil state, gets 25% of its power from wind.


    ------------
    2024: 47 years on the Net.


  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 25,483
    Kyleran said:
    Iselin said:
    I hardly see how this cozy fantasy game is "pushing a political ideology" except in the minds of old farts who have a kneejerk compulsion to think of everything as pushing a political agenda.

    All I see is yet another cozy game where everyone loves everyone and has big Teletubby hugs for all.

    I'm not a cozy games fan but "pushing a political agenda?"... pathetic spin.
    No?

    "Qloud believes that Loftia is more than just a game but that it's also a platform where players can learn and advocate for a more sustainable future.

    The developers believe that games have the power to make a positive change in our environment and our world, and this belief is reflected in the game's design and themes"

    One side of the political spectrum favors this sort of approach while the other is in violent opposition.

    Attempts have been made recently to ban natural gas appliances, wood burning stoves etc with an army of supporters lining up to strike down the other side.

    As first said in 1969, "The personal is political."

    https://lifehacker.com/everything-is-political-and-always-has-been-1818724298


    When advocating something that is politically controversial is much of the point of your game, that very much is pushing a political ideology.  The developers of Loftia own that, and it's good that they do.  But I think it's ridiculous to deny what even the game's developers have directly stated.
    Slapshot1188IselinKyleranValdheim
  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 25,483
    Battlestorm said:
    Gotta applaud them for their intent - sustainable energy would be great. So much energy moving around the earth all the time: wind, water, geo, and sun. There are a lot of drawbacks right now to natural methods (didn’t 14,000 panels get annihilated by hail, recently?). I love the idea, in concept it sounds great - in practice, it’s kind of been a mixed back of relative failures.

    Don’t we have to try, though, honestly? I think we do. At first it starts with more failures than successes, before you know it these methods are resisting hurricanes, saving birds, and shrugging off hailstorms. Maybe it’s the right point of view but with a backdrop of failures that makes it easy to criticize. I don’t know, I have a soft-spot for sustainable energy, so I’m very bias. I hope they do well - but flying windmills…oof, I don’t think I play along with that bit. Maybe I’m not as big of a fan of sustainable as I thought.
    The game also has solar panels as its other, listed source of energy.  I didn't pick on that because, while solar panels efficient enough to be useful for backing the power grid today, one could plausibly see a future where they are.  That depends on a combination of massively better batteries so that you can still have electricity at night and operating well in a wider range of temperatures.  Current solar panels can generate a ton of electricity when you don't particularly need it, and little to none during peak demand times.

    Solar panels work really great out in space, at least so long as you don't get too far from the Sun.  There's not much of a night in space, and never any clouds.  If people end up living on satellites in space in the future, those satellites are likely to be powered entirely by solar power.  It's less viable on the ground, though.

    They could have made a game about the trade-offs between various sources of energy.  But this isn't that.  They're pushing solar and flying windmills.  Not solar and wind power, which are the fashionable things today in some political circles.  Solar and flying windmills.  And it's the flying windmills that are completely absurd.
    Battlestorm
  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    edited July 2023
    Quizzical said:
    Kyleran said:
    Iselin said:
    I hardly see how this cozy fantasy game is "pushing a political ideology" except in the minds of old farts who have a kneejerk compulsion to think of everything as pushing a political agenda.

    All I see is yet another cozy game where everyone loves everyone and has big Teletubby hugs for all.

    I'm not a cozy games fan but "pushing a political agenda?"... pathetic spin.
    No?

    "Qloud believes that Loftia is more than just a game but that it's also a platform where players can learn and advocate for a more sustainable future.

    The developers believe that games have the power to make a positive change in our environment and our world, and this belief is reflected in the game's design and themes"

    One side of the political spectrum favors this sort of approach while the other is in violent opposition.

    Attempts have been made recently to ban natural gas appliances, wood burning stoves etc with an army of supporters lining up to strike down the other side.

    As first said in 1969, "The personal is political."

    https://lifehacker.com/everything-is-political-and-always-has-been-1818724298


    When advocating something that is politically controversial is much of the point of your game, that very much is pushing a political ideology.  The developers of Loftia own that, and it's good that they do.  But I think it's ridiculous to deny what even the game's developers have directly stated.
    Good 'ole alt-right doublespeak. Calling the cozy games happy thoughts the developers have said about environmental sustainability in their goofy little game "pushing a political agenda" is the only political agenda pushing I see.

    You're the one pushing one by characterizing it that way, not them.

    Aren't clean energy and environmental sustainability politically agnostic, optimistic happy thoughts, realistic or not though the fantasy game solutions might be?

    But no that's some serious attempt to brainwash our young pushing a political agenda.
    Slapshot1188KyleranPr0tag0ni5tViper482
    "Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”

    ― Umberto Eco

    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED

  • ValdemarJValdemarJ Member RarePosts: 1,378
    Scot said:
    Thematically there is nothing "punk" about the game, and "solarpunk", well they are showing a lack of imagination there. How we resource our future energy needs is a political issue and as such the game is advocating one way of doing that. So I find this inappropriate for gaming especially as this is aimed at children.

    But our posts have become political, rather hard not to with a game that clearly is mind you. So that's my last post this thread.

    I would remind posters that they can get banned for posting about politics and we don't want to lose any of you. Unlike the recent somewhat political thread by a site member this article is not going to get deleted. So at least we will know who is getting banned, but that is small consolation to those who do I am sure.

    This is much more like what eco-goth solar punks would look like in my opinion. Nothing about the game imagery gives off a punk vibe. Punk has a connotation associated with it, and "shiny happy people" aren't it. I hate when games coopt the punk label and slap it on anything for some unknown reasons.

    Too bad it's online, because if it were single player I'd put it on my list. I love these sorts of games to relax in like: My Time at Portia, Big Farm Story, Disney Dreamlight Valley, and the like. Combat free crafting builders are a nice break to relax and just chill.
    Scot
    Bring back the Naked Chicken Chalupa!
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 43,975
    olepi said:

    Windmills genuinely do generate power.  The ones that exist in real-life are something closer to disposable toys for politicians so that they can feel good about chasing the latest trendy thing than a serious way to back the power grid.


    Wind does generate real energy. Texas, known for being an oil state, gets 25% of its power from wind.


    Err, aren't they the folks whose power grid is often offline due to weather related issues?

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






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