"Toxic MMRPG gamers don't understand why no one wants to talk to them. More news at 11 Jim."
Primarily, it's the quality of discussion and community here. Discussions are boring and predictable at the best of times and typically toxic and hostile the rest of the time.
Even Reddit, despite its long list of flaws, is infinitely better and more productive. Discussions happen. Questions are asked and answered. People share their likes and frustrations.
I couldn't come here and post about a game I'm playing and have a good discussion about it. I've tried so many times over the years and it always ends up nothing at best, or hostile toxic trolling at worst.
The community, site owners, staff, and authors sill writing here need to take a hard look in the mirror: Why would anyone even want to come here? Why would they post here? What would they get out of it? Where's the motivation? When I answered those questions, I came up with nothing. Whatever happens here, there is a better place for it somewhere else.
So, those people and groups need to ask themselves how can they change to make it attractive and interesting for others to visit. Or, just keep going until it winds down.
I really wish Blueturtle would have bought the site, or rather the site owners would have sold it to him instead. He had some interesting ideas about turning the site around and has a passion for the mmrpg community, before being chased off by hateful bigotry.
You can thank people who couldn't leave politics, and worse, out of conversations. the bans were warranted.
I doubt the moderators care until a post is reported.
PRO TIP: If you find yourself reaching for the 'report' button the internet may not be for you.
They were banned for what they posted. End of story.
Agree to blame the person reporting is not fair. That power ultimately rests with the moderators acting on behalf of the site. Sorry, but some people on here got to asshatish with the politics and deserve their bans. Good grief, this is a site to discuss games not devisive politics. If I wanted to deal with negative and hateful political rhetoric I'd go anywhere else on the internet.
As for the lack ofactivity on here, well that's more reflective of the state of MMORPG in general and the constant failure of the last hope for it which was crowd funding/indie developers.
I still come in here to read post from the community and old time favorite posters like Kyleran, Slapshot1188, Quizzical and others who keep the old forums interesting.
Just would like to remind that there IS an ignore function which allows you to... ignore a person that annoys you.
Controlling what you hear (see in this case) is far preferable to controling what others say (type).
But whether or not I think it's right or wrong, its undeniable that the banning of active posters has played a large role in the downturn of forum activity. As someone above mentioned, just pull up one of the good and active threads from 2 years ago and count how many of those posters now show BANNED or DELETED next to them.
It's a sad graveyard.
I understand banning for political content. I don't want to read about Trump/Biden here.
What bothers me a little bit is the banning over 'woke' when it became intertwined with games. Changes in culture are going to impact games and yet we cannot discuss them here. Not that I really have anything to say 'bout it.
If you cannot discuss what is going on then yeah, a forum will die off.
It is all about how one uses their words.
Saying that "woke culture is a cancer" is weaponizing words and phrases into slurs against another person's beliefs which Bill in particular is totally against seeing on this site's forums.
Blaming the world's problems and / or slurring a group of people based on their beliefs is largely viewed as onerous as doing it based on a person's race or national origin.
Well, unless you are running for political office, then almost anything goes.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
lotrlore said: - In order to foster discussion, we need to be writing the types of features and editorials people are looking for as well. Always feel free to hit me up with the type of coverage you guys like to read. It's not always going to come to fruition, as we also are writing the articles we enjoy writing (take the recent multi-part LotRO series I've been running the last two weeks, for example), but at the end of the day we want to write about what our community is interested first and foremost.
When there is a drought in MMO news and discussions, what I'd love to see is articles discussing the theory of multiplayer game design. This could be analysis of features from the past or present, or daydreaming about the future.
Some of the most active discussions on the forums revolve around this kind of thing (horizontal vs vertical progression, depth vs complexity, tactical vs action, themepark vs sandbox etc) but we rarely have articles written in the same vein. I realise that these are hard to write compared to news or reviews so it may not be possible, but I think they'd be interesting and generate a lot of discussion.
As an example: as part of Camelot Unchained's BSC design docs, they stated that group sizes will be unlimited, so you could have a group with 500 players in it. Their goal is to add organisational structures to help manage massively multiplayer content (or to help herding cats.....)
This is a concept we haven't seen anywhere else, and given CU's development, it's unlikely we'll see it in CU either. But, the concept of developers adding tools to help the community manage itself is a really good one. I'd love to see some theorycrafting from the writers here on what else could be useful to online communities.
lotrlore said: That's not to say we won't be covering single-player RPGs and stuff - we will. At the end of the day, the forum traffic is a small fraction of our overall picture, something that is driven by Google and their constant algorithm changes. But I'm hoping that the moves we are making will help not only move our needle the way we want to, but also cultivate the type of conversation that doesn't have us all reaching for banhammers.
I have never had a problem with this site (or any site) covering whatever the hell they like. Its your time, your money, write about whatever you want! Not to mention that most of us play games from a wide variety of genres, so the wider coverage is useful.
However.....
I cannot stand mislabeling of games! Don't call a multiplayer game an MMO if it is not, in fact, massively multiplayer! It always undermines the credibility of the author and just drives me insane!
I trace this issue back to a roundtable Bill and Suzie did years ago (2016?) where they discussed this very issue. Every single one of them agreed that an MMO needed 250+ players, they backed up that POV with quotes from devs who also agreed.......then at the end of the article, Bill just straight up said "We don't care, so we're just gonna call everything an MMO because it helps the website" (paraphrasing).
Interestingly, this issue is almost exclusively a journalist problem. Actual games studios rarely mislabel their games (except mobile games, there its common).
Currently Playing: WAR RoR - Spitt rr7X Black Orc | Scrotling rr6X Squig Herder | Scabrous rr4X Shaman
When there is a drought in MMO news and discussions, what I'd love to see is articles discussing the theory of multiplayer game design. This could be analysis of features from the past or present, or daydreaming about the future.
Some of the most active discussions on the forums revolve around this kind of thing (horizontal vs vertical progression, depth vs complexity, tactical vs action, themepark vs sandbox etc) but we rarely have articles written in the same vein. I realise that these are hard to write compared to news or reviews so it may not be possible, but I think they'd be interesting and generate a lot of discussion.
As an example: as part of Camelot Unchained's BSC design docs, they stated that group sizes will be unlimited, so you could have a group with 500 players in it. Their goal is to add organisational structures to help manage massively multiplayer content (or to help herding cats.....)
This is a concept we haven't seen anywhere else, and given CU's development, it's unlikely we'll see it in CU either. But, the concept of developers adding tools to help the community manage itself is a really good one. I'd love to see some theorycrafting from the writers here on what else could be useful to online communities.
So, interestingly enough, these are the types of pitches I've been asking for, but you are right: it is harder to write this type of stuff versus a game review/editorial. These types of articles have been written in the past on our site and others, so the other issue is whether writing something now will be demonstrably different.
But those are the type of general pieces I'm actively looking for, so it's good to see this suggestion here.
I need to probably reach back out to Nikolas, he was excellent at these types of game design articles, Just got busy.
On the definition of an MMO, there were actually a ton of developers in the late 2010s that were doing that as well if they had anything MMO-adjacent, but that has thankfully slowed down in recent years as well. Not every multiplayer game is an MMO for sure,but I don't think there is a clearly agreed upon definition of an MMO anymore thanks to how it's been used as a marketing catch all in recent years. That might be worth a discussion on the site again too.
I don't think it's only here but even MOP has many stories with nary a comment. I think the genre has a different face now. It's changed a lot and some of us haven't changed and are expecting more of the old.
I am just playing the older games.
and its in game too....One of the games I play there are 20 active players in the guild....Everyone logs on every day and almost no one (other than me) says a word.
When there is a drought in MMO news and discussions, what I'd love to see is articles discussing the theory of multiplayer game design. This could be analysis of features from the past or present, or daydreaming about the future.
Some of the most active discussions on the forums revolve around this kind of thing (horizontal vs vertical progression, depth vs complexity, tactical vs action, themepark vs sandbox etc) but we rarely have articles written in the same vein. I realise that these are hard to write compared to news or reviews so it may not be possible, but I think they'd be interesting and generate a lot of discussion.
As an example: as part of Camelot Unchained's BSC design docs, they stated that group sizes will be unlimited, so you could have a group with 500 players in it. Their goal is to add organisational structures to help manage massively multiplayer content (or to help herding cats.....)
This is a concept we haven't seen anywhere else, and given CU's development, it's unlikely we'll see it in CU either. But, the concept of developers adding tools to help the community manage itself is a really good one. I'd love to see some theorycrafting from the writers here on what else could be useful to online communities.
So, interestingly enough, these are the types of pitches I've been asking for, but you are right: it is harder to write this type of stuff versus a game review/editorial. These types of articles have been written in the past on our site and others, so the other issue is whether writing something now will be demonstrably different.
But those are the type of general pieces I'm actively looking for, so it's good to see this suggestion here.
I need to probably reach back out to Nikolas, he was excellent at these types of game design articles, Just got busy.
On the definition of an MMO, there were actually a ton of developers in the late 2010s that were doing that as well if they had anything MMO-adjacent, but that has thankfully slowed down in recent years as well. Not every multiplayer game is an MMO for sure,but I don't think there is a clearly agreed upon definition of an MMO anymore thanks to how it's been used as a marketing catch all in recent years. That might be worth a discussion on the site again too.
Appreciate the feedback, as always!
I can't speak on game mechanics, because I always feel woefully inadequate when I try. When it comes to story however, that's probably my bread and butter. I've been digging into books on writing and adding reference books to my library for my own fiction work lately. So I'm fully immersed in that world of asking "Why did or didn't this story work? Why do or don't we care about these characters? What is hooking the reader here?" and trying to apply that to games I play lately. I don't think me doing a deep dive into game story analysis is really what readers are looking for or interested in, though, so that idea forever sits on my shelf.
I thought about doing a rant column for a little while, but I had to take a step back and ask myself if that's what I really wanted: always conjuring up frustration and angry thoughts to make a passionate point. Nah. Could always do a column about the things I love and think are underrated- but people wouldn't care about it as much as the rants, or may even accuse me of being a paid shill.. So another one on the shelf.
Sometimes the things we're passionate about or the things we enjoy writing just...don't fit the audience.
I don't think it's only here but even MOP has many stories with nary a comment. I think the genre has a different face now. It's changed a lot and some of us haven't changed and are expecting more of the old.
I am just playing the older games.
I think MOP has a few issues which contribute to this:
Their site is setup as a News Site with a little bit of discussion. Their "forum" really doesn't foster posts beyond one or two. You cannot even follow conversations once there are a few replies.
They have far too many articles. I just looked and yesterday there were 19 articles posted. Honestly I think thats OK for news but it isn't condusive to discussion.
The "moderation" is the worst type. Bree only wants people who parrot her beliefs to be able to post. She will stealth delete and edit comments of other posters. I have watched her edit posts people made while I was reading them. At the end of the day, she got what she wanted, the only people that post there are the ones that think like she does, which as you can see is not a lot.
Also, just like other sites... they face headwinds around subject matter and content delivery method.
In general, use them for what the site is designed to supprt: News Delivery Use MMORPG for both News Delivery AND Forums/Discussion because it's setup is so much better (although yes, it could be better as well its lightyears ahead of MOP).
While I can’t comment on what “Bree “ does (whoever that is) I do agree that their site is not conducive to discussion.
This site seems to lack in news but is great for discussion.
I think part of that is that they seem larger with more people writing articles.
The This site seems to have less people and I wonder if any of them are full time.
Also is Mike Bitton still around? He’s the community manager but we don’t see him anymore?
And if you look at activity there is that former moderator (can’t remember her name) who went to run game space.
This site feels like no one actively takes care of it. Extremely old stickied posts that don’t seem relevant anymore….
I hate to say “maintenance mode “ but it feels a bit like the that.
So a few things on this:
- We do have a smaller staff, which is changing over the next few months. We write fewer news pieces purely because of manpower, we have myself and Christina mostly, and I'm also handling all the features, reviews, etc. So it's a process. Suzie was a machine that could knock out 16 articles a day by herself. I am a single dad, there has to be a cut off point each night, lol. Christina and I are full time, everyone else you see on the site is a freelance contributor, which means they only write when they pitch something or I assign something as the budget we work with allows.
- We are ramping up our news coverage as we bring on more dedicated news writers, so you will start to see more news pieces in line with what everyone else is doing. But that should still (hopefully) foster some discussion like all news articles have the potential to do.
- Mike B is still around. We also have a volunteer mod that helps with keeping things in check.
- In order to foster discussion, we need to be writing the types of features and editorials people are looking for as well. Always feel free to hit me up with the type of coverage you guys like to read. It's not always going to come to fruition, as we also are writing the articles we enjoy writing (take the recent multi-part LotRO series I've been running the last two weeks, for example), but at the end of the day we want to write about what our community is interested first and foremost.
MMOs, especially nowadays when that term is so nebulous it has lost meaning with newer and younger gamers, are incredibly hard to cover than they used to be. I've covered them as my own niche in this industry since 2009 and the landscape and way they are covered has changed tremendously since then. And as such a niche topic, especially focusing on older MMOs or the genre as a whole, it doesn't move the needle on Google as much any more. It's why you saw Bill/Suz start to branch out years ago, and why we continued they when I took the reigns in 2019. One of the discussions we're having behind the scenes right now is reigning in some of that scope again, so over the next few months you should start to see that as well.
That's not to say we won't be covering single-player RPGs and stuff - we will. At the end of the day, the forum traffic is a small fraction of our overall picture, something that is driven by Google and their constant algorithm changes. But I'm hoping that the moves we are making will help not only move our needle the way we want to, but also cultivate the type of conversation that doesn't have us all reaching for banhammers.
Thanks for coming to my Ted Talk. My email is always open if you want to pitch an article yourself as well! Always happy to bring on new freelancers and contributors if you're interested. Maybe a rant to save the site? :P
Thanks for the response and please don’t take my words as a harsh criticism.
More of just noticing how the site has changed.
Yes! SBFord! Does she still post as I see her under contributors?
I might just submit an article ?
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I come here for game news or updates to upcoming games I am interested in and to see if there new games coming I am not aware of that interest me.
Oh and giveaways..I mean who doesn't like a nice game key giveaway and such?
It isn't just mmo's but I like lots of single player games too.....sometimes the discussions here are great but I tend not to get into as many as before due to lots of the snark from the usual suspects which frankly I feel I don't have time to waste on.
Brenics ~ Just to point out I do believe Chris Roberts is going down as the man who cheated backers and took down crowdfunding for gaming.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Thanks for the response and please don’t take my words as a harsh criticism.More of just noticing how the site has changed.
Yes! SBFord! Does she still post as I see her under contributors?
I might just submit an article ?
I've been writing on the internet professionally since 2009, at this point, I don't get too upset unless it's a personal attack. This is good feedback and there is a reason I try to respond to these threads when I see them pop up - genuinely interested in the feedback because when we improve, everyone here wins.
Suzie doesn't contribute anymore, but as she knows the door is literally always open!
And yes! If you've got an idea, shoot me an email and we can talk! editor@mmorpg.com
Thanks for the response and please don’t take my words as a harsh criticism.More of just noticing how the site has changed.
Yes! SBFord! Does she still post as I see her under contributors?
I might just submit an article ?
I've been writing on the internet professionally since 2009, at this point, I don't get too upset unless it's a personal attack. This is good feedback and there is a reason I try to respond to these threads when I see them pop up - genuinely interested in the feedback because when we improve, everyone here wins.
Suzie doesn't contribute anymore, but as she knows the door is literally always open!
And yes! If you've got an idea, shoot me an email and we can talk! editor@mmorpg.com
It's nice to see you chime in and give some insights.
Really there is only so much you can do as a writer here. There are a lot of factors that are just out of your control and beyond something that the MMORPG site reporting on or anything to do with the community here. The fall off in interest isn't just here.
It must be a real challenge trying to wheel out fresh new exciting stuff to try and get people interested. Like trying to make stale old bread appetizing.
I'm sure there is room for improvement here but really we need something to revitalize the entire MMORPG genre.
"You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
A few thoughts from someone who has been here 19 years, but really doesn't post a whole lot anymore?
I posted a heck of a lot more when I first came here, because the discussions and opinions were all with people who were having the same sorts of experiences thru the same sorts of games. When you finally got here, you were having those conversations for the first time with people. Thing is, while games changed, and some opinions or preferences changed, the bulk of most discussions was the same thing, over and over. You pretty much had heard or seen all the arguments, and you pretty much knew who was coming down on what side. That didn't change, and so the conversations we had about one game were the same from one to the next, to the next, to the next, and so on.
I don't want to say that made it stale, but when you pretty much know how any thread is going to go, you do reach a point where you just stop. That's something that I think takes a lot of semi-casual folks like me (and I wasn't semi-casual back then) away.
The format really has changed. These days I can have discord discussions with groups that I have played with, and while still being similar, the conversations are rapid, easy, and it's a community that doesn't just talk games, but we play the same ones. On this site, every now and then you'd have a game you would see, but the community was forum based, not in-game based, and that's a difference.
When communities don't grow, the slow die. There are still posts here, and folks that when I read an article I'll scroll down and see who is responding, because over the years, I've come to respect, agree or disagree, with them. Before the bans, and I hate saying it, to a semi-casual, there was definitely more than it's share of toxic posters, and the community was definitely not welcoming to any new voices, or posters who disagreed. From a format point of view, Discord, and the way it works lets people end up more often sharing opinions with the people they are engaging with.
Finally, I think people are spread across more games, rather than what some folks have said that their are less games now. The truth, is that back in 2000-2010, I think more people were involved with some of the biggest titles. These days there are debates about if a game truly is an MMO, or a lobby game, but the community really spreads out, especially with survival titles, and other niche games being available. EQ, UO, DAoC, moved to EQ2, GW, WoW, and then the niche games like LotRO, Age of Conan, and Warhammer. Today though, the population of all the big titles is down, but there are so many more choices.
Either way, I still like the forum format, I like the news, lol, even if it's heavily slanted to what Mr. Bradford likes (There are a ton of LotRO articles), but the weekly indy updates are great, and as a TW fan, I enjoy those articles, although I rarely see comments. Proving, to me, that maybe it's not the same audience.
The upcoming changes look good, and because I started playing MMO's in UO, and back then stratics was "the go to" for a big portion of the community, I'll always have a fond spot for it. I hope the changes breathe some new life, and it finds a wider audience, because it deserves it.
If MMORPG.com were to get rid of members like this and the scammers then there might just be a little more discussion around here.
I just put you on ignore. I've learned the ways of cancel culture - wow, this is fun.
Thats not cancel culture. Cancel culture is banning him so HE can't talk. Ignore is not cancelling him, it's just freeing YOU from having to hear/read him.
It's far, far preferable to banning.
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I always thought a Point/Counterpoint feature would be fun and interesting. Where you have a topic and a series of points, and one writer takes the pro side and the other takes the con side.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
I always thought a Point/Counterpoint feature would be fun and interesting. Where you have a topic and a series of points, and one writer takes the pro side and the other takes the con side.
So I've written those style articles and they are not fun, lol. But something to keep inmnd if the coverage dictates. Maybe a point/counterpoint on the Pantheon 247 messaging, or whether Star Citizen is still feeling vaporware-y after the S42 Feature Complete news?
The main problem with this format though is budget. Since we pay our writers, that ties up more budget than normal for the same topic. So it really has to make sense.
Well, I don't know about the rest of you, but every time I visit this site I need to re login even though I check the "remember me " box. So frustrating to have to do this even if it is only to leave an Agree; Insightful: LOL etc.
And I do flag every 1 post that has irrelevant content and links to "I make xx dollars doing squat..." or to outside content not relevant to the topic; darn gnats that they are lol !
MMOs, especially nowadays when that term is so nebulous it has lost meaning with newer and younger gamers, are incredibly hard to cover than they used to be. I've covered them as my own niche in this industry since 2009 and the landscape and way they are covered has changed tremendously since then. And as such a niche topic, especially focusing on older MMOs or the genre as a whole, it doesn't move the needle on Google as much any more. It's why you saw Bill/Suz start to branch out years ago, and why we continued they when I took the reigns in 2019. One of the discussions we're having behind the scenes right now is reigning in some of that scope again, so over the next few months you should start to see that as well.
you're an MMORPG website.
you should be defending the MMORPG genre from the noise, not give in to the dark side.
this is what this place never understood. we come here BECAUSE of the situation, not be be exposed to the situation.
I completely understand why they branched out and got lax with definitions and had MMO lists including games like Path of Exile where the devs say it's not an MMO on their own website. They wouldn't have survived without branching out. This is from someone who has said "That's not a MMO." many times on here as well. They want that needle on google to move. They needed a bigger umbrella and more traffic to the site.
I'm not sure what any actual metrics look like but just from the forums with the amount of single digit replies it's not what it used to be. Even with branching out and covering more. I dunno how reigning in some of that scope is going to help either. Good luck.
"You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
If MMORPG.com were to get rid of members like this and the scammers then there might just be a little more discussion around here.
I think things often depend on the choice of words. Had @Robokapp said "wokeness has issues" instead, it might have gone better?
Then again, I once got banned for trying to broach the subject of "equity", making the point that it's actually hiring and promoting people based on something other than qualifications, and how that could hurt the end results of a product. Fortunately for me, a bunch of posters here supported me for not being a typical pain in the rear end (other than my constant opinionated takes, I suppose), and I was reinstated. That's still a topic of value, IMO, especially when we saw a new AAA title really mess things up "recently" with well known issues.
I don't know how you see banning opinions as good for discussions.
I always thought a Point/Counterpoint feature would be fun and interesting. Where you have a topic and a series of points, and one writer takes the pro side and the other takes the con side.
So I've written those style articles and they are not fun, lol. But something to keep inmnd if the coverage dictates. Maybe a point/counterpoint on the Pantheon 247 messaging, or whether Star Citizen is still feeling vaporware-y after the S42 Feature Complete news?
The main problem with this format though is budget. Since we pay our writers, that ties up more budget than normal for the same topic. So it really has to make sense.
I've always like articles where one person questions "this vs. that", as it brings us into the discussions.
I see the biggest problem as being "same old, same old" in the marketplace, and the loss over the years of gamers who grew tired of it and left. I don't buy the argument that gamers are more spread out. I think they are desperate for better games, and the total numbers actually appear bigger only because gamers have more games, all in search of something better and using more multiples of games to feed their overall desires.
Any forums have an issue with social media, but I find SM does not represent the views of posters as well as a forum does. Reddit might as well be moderated by The Ministry Of Truth and any social media that allows you to 'up and or down vote' posts is the bane of honest discussion. You would have to believe group-think is the epitome of thought if you favour that system in my eyes.
Comments
Saying that "woke culture is a cancer" is weaponizing words and phrases into slurs against another person's beliefs which Bill in particular is totally against seeing on this site's forums.
Blaming the world's problems and / or slurring a group of people based on their beliefs is largely viewed as onerous as doing it based on a person's race or national origin.
Well, unless you are running for political office, then almost anything goes.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
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Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Also, dedicated forums in the age of Reddit? Lol.
But those are the type of general pieces I'm actively looking for, so it's good to see this suggestion here.
I need to probably reach back out to Nikolas, he was excellent at these types of game design articles, Just got busy.
On the definition of an MMO, there were actually a ton of developers in the late 2010s that were doing that as well if they had anything MMO-adjacent, but that has thankfully slowed down in recent years as well. Not every multiplayer game is an MMO for sure,but I don't think there is a clearly agreed upon definition of an MMO anymore thanks to how it's been used as a marketing catch all in recent years. That might be worth a discussion on the site again too.
Appreciate the feedback, as always!
and its in game too....One of the games I play there are 20 active players in the guild....Everyone logs on every day and almost no one (other than me) says a word.
I thought about doing a rant column for a little while, but I had to take a step back and ask myself if that's what I really wanted: always conjuring up frustration and angry thoughts to make a passionate point. Nah. Could always do a column about the things I love and think are underrated- but people wouldn't care about it as much as the rants, or may even accuse me of being a paid shill.. So another one on the shelf.
Sometimes the things we're passionate about or the things we enjoy writing just...don't fit the audience.
More of just noticing how the site has changed.
I might just submit an article ?
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Brenics ~ Just to point out I do believe Chris Roberts is going down as the man who cheated backers and took down crowdfunding for gaming.
Enjoy!
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I've been writing on the internet professionally since 2009, at this point, I don't get too upset unless it's a personal attack. This is good feedback and there is a reason I try to respond to these threads when I see them pop up - genuinely interested in the feedback because when we improve, everyone here wins.
Suzie doesn't contribute anymore, but as she knows the door is literally always open!
And yes! If you've got an idea, shoot me an email and we can talk! editor@mmorpg.com
Really there is only so much you can do as a writer here. There are a lot of factors that are just out of your control and beyond something that the MMORPG site reporting on or anything to do with the community here. The fall off in interest isn't just here.
It must be a real challenge trying to wheel out fresh new exciting stuff to try and get people interested. Like trying to make stale old bread appetizing.
I'm sure there is room for improvement here but really we need something to revitalize the entire MMORPG genre.
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer
Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/I posted a heck of a lot more when I first came here, because the discussions and opinions were all with people who were having the same sorts of experiences thru the same sorts of games. When you finally got here, you were having those conversations for the first time with people. Thing is, while games changed, and some opinions or preferences changed, the bulk of most discussions was the same thing, over and over. You pretty much had heard or seen all the arguments, and you pretty much knew who was coming down on what side. That didn't change, and so the conversations we had about one game were the same from one to the next, to the next, to the next, and so on.
I don't want to say that made it stale, but when you pretty much know how any thread is going to go, you do reach a point where you just stop. That's something that I think takes a lot of semi-casual folks like me (and I wasn't semi-casual back then) away.
The format really has changed. These days I can have discord discussions with groups that I have played with, and while still being similar, the conversations are rapid, easy, and it's a community that doesn't just talk games, but we play the same ones. On this site, every now and then you'd have a game you would see, but the community was forum based, not in-game based, and that's a difference.
When communities don't grow, the slow die. There are still posts here, and folks that when I read an article I'll scroll down and see who is responding, because over the years, I've come to respect, agree or disagree, with them. Before the bans, and I hate saying it, to a semi-casual, there was definitely more than it's share of toxic posters, and the community was definitely not welcoming to any new voices, or posters who disagreed. From a format point of view, Discord, and the way it works lets people end up more often sharing opinions with the people they are engaging with.
Finally, I think people are spread across more games, rather than what some folks have said that their are less games now. The truth, is that back in 2000-2010, I think more people were involved with some of the biggest titles. These days there are debates about if a game truly is an MMO, or a lobby game, but the community really spreads out, especially with survival titles, and other niche games being available. EQ, UO, DAoC, moved to EQ2, GW, WoW, and then the niche games like LotRO, Age of Conan, and Warhammer. Today though, the population of all the big titles is down, but there are so many more choices.
Either way, I still like the forum format, I like the news, lol, even if it's heavily slanted to what Mr. Bradford likes (There are a ton of LotRO articles), but the weekly indy updates are great, and as a TW fan, I enjoy those articles, although I rarely see comments. Proving, to me, that maybe it's not the same audience.
The upcoming changes look good, and because I started playing MMO's in UO, and back then stratics was "the go to" for a big portion of the community, I'll always have a fond spot for it. I hope the changes breathe some new life, and it finds a wider audience, because it deserves it.
I've learned the ways of cancel culture - wow, this is fun.
It's far, far preferable to banning.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
The main problem with this format though is budget. Since we pay our writers, that ties up more budget than normal for the same topic. So it really has to make sense.
I'm not sure what any actual metrics look like but just from the forums with the amount of single digit replies it's not what it used to be. Even with branching out and covering more. I dunno how reigning in some of that scope is going to help either. Good luck.
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer
Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/Then again, I once got banned for trying to broach the subject of "equity", making the point that it's actually hiring and promoting people based on something other than qualifications, and how that could hurt the end results of a product.
Fortunately for me, a bunch of posters here supported me for not being a typical pain in the rear end (other than my constant opinionated takes, I suppose), and I was reinstated.
That's still a topic of value, IMO, especially when we saw a new AAA title really mess things up "recently" with well known issues.
I don't know how you see banning opinions as good for discussions.
Once upon a time....
I see the biggest problem as being "same old, same old" in the marketplace, and the loss over the years of gamers who grew tired of it and left.
I don't buy the argument that gamers are more spread out. I think they are desperate for better games, and the total numbers actually appear bigger only because gamers have more games, all in search of something better and using more multiples of games to feed their overall desires.
Once upon a time....