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Some misconceptions, answers, and INFO!!!!!!!
PandaBurger
Member Posts: 5
ok, so I've been reading up on 9Dragons and I wanted to clear some things up. Before I start, I can't ensure my info to be 100% correct.
first of all according to Acclaim's Ken Chan, 9Dragons will be free to play. I don't know if this information has changed or if its just wrong, but thats what I got out of this interview. (it's actually talking about Acclaims other game "Bots" but Ken said that all of Acclaims games will be free) Heres the link : http://gamingvisionnetwork.blogspot.com/2006/03/interview-with-ken-chan-of-acclaim.html
secondly, I wanted to say that there will be over 500 different custumizable features from your starting costume to the eyes on your character. This will ensure that you won't wonder into your clone while you're playing. 
http://rpgvault.ign.com/articles/694/694809p2.html thats the link.
This will make at least a few people happy. According to this interview, lag will be at a minimal since there server can hold thousands of players and their engine is fast running and new. They will actually add servers if it is needed. http://rpgvault.ign.com/articles/697/697031p2.html. (personally, I think I'll play the game before I acually believe this.)
Other info-(don't quote me, no links but I remember reading it somewhere lol)
---- The storyline will be huge will over 400 quests. Most of these quests will intertwine with the storyline making sure that this game won't be just a grind fest. They also said that they would add 20-40 new quests every month but I'm not sure.
---- 9Dragons will be a point and click game. 
(eh... I could get used to it) There will be hotkeys to help you out too though. (ex. "g" for "pick up"/"c" for "sit down")
---- Open beta will start in August. Currently can't sign up but it will be at www.9dragonsgame.com/ or http://www.9dragonsonline.com/
---- AI will supposedly be ""smart" So weaker monsters will run away from you while stronger ones will attack you. There also will be no penalty for dying. This is because Acclaim wants the players to focus on mastering their Martial Arts instead of worrying about what you lose when you die.
---- here are some links for movies for two of the six clans that they will start with: Wu Tang clan - http://rpgvault.ign.com/articles/704/704025p1.html (download underneath pictures) and Mo-Jiao http://dl.qj.net/9Dragons-Trailer-Movie-PC-Gaming-MMORPG-Other-Games/pg/12/fid/7931/catid/476 (download near bottom)
I personally can't wait till this game comes out in open beta so I can see if it lives up to its reputation. Again I don't ensure that all my information is 100% correct. Anyways, hope I cleared some things up and feel free to post questions and I will try and answer them. Cheers 
To know, is to know that you know nothing. That is true knowledge.
-Confucius
Comments
The point-to-click thing is another disappointment. The theme of the game sounds very appealing, as does the fact that it's going to be based largely around questing. From the information currently available, though, it doesn't appear as if they're doing anything at all to "westernize" it other than having it professionally translated. While the Asian and Western cultures do have some similarities, there are also signficant differences in terms of what's important, at least in a general sense. Every major Western game I've played has had WASD as the default movement. Additionally, the Western trend is definitely moving in the direction of more and more customization for avatars.
Now, I've frequently heard fans of Korean/Asian MMOs cite that the lack of customization in their games is due to the fact that their endgames are all based on large-scale PvP, and heavy customization would massively degrade performance. That's fair enough, and it seems to be true, because every European/North American import of Korean MMOs seems to follow that model of the PvP endgame. One then wonders why we need another one. I'm just not interested in yet another point-and-click, poorly customized, PvP-based Korean import. PvP is certainly an important aspect of MMOs, but it's just as important to remember that a very large segment of Western gamers has little or no interest in that part of the game. Sacrificing [visual] individuality in exchange for an aspect of the game that they'll rarely or never use is a large barrier for such gamers to overcome.
While 9 Dragons certainly appears to offer some interesting features, a great deal of what I've read seems to indicate that the game will have more of the features from Korean games that I don't like than it will features from western games I do like. Western games are in no way, shape or form perfect, and I'm sure there are quite a few Korean MMOs [that are never imported to the West] with terrific features. My point here, is that the two cultures prioritize things differently, their MMO industries have evolved differently, and that, as a result, the companies importing these games would best be served by doing everything in their power to tailor their imports for their new target audiences.
While I'm sure there are some Western gamers who won't mind the issues I've outlined, there will be a much larger segment who will dismiss this game out of hand as "just more of the same from Asia." I've already mentioned that I think the theme of the game is terrific. I think the various clans, the skill-based system, and the historical accuracy are also extremely appealing. The Asian interface, movement controls, limited avatar individuality, and poor crafting system are all massive turn-offs, however. If Acclaim were to actually modify those aspects by bringing in their own professional designers, I'd almost certainly be willing to pay a premium subscription for the game. With the information I have at hand, however, I very much doubt I'll play it for free.
Certainly, my critics are more than welcome to call me close-minded for rejecting aspects of the game out-of-hand. It may even be true to a degree. Unfortunately, the seven years I've spent playing MMOs (and the nine years before that playing MUDs) have shaped my expectations. I've learned what I do and do not like via experience, and my priorities with regard to MMOs have been shaped by that experience as well. Time is the most valuable thing I have, as it's the only thing I'll never be able to get more of. As such, I'm very reluctant to spend any of it on a title that starts off with strong marks against it, even if it won't cost me a penny to play.
It's definitely possible that this game just wasn't picked up by Acclaim with gamers like me in mind, that it was never intended for an audience so wide that it included people with my priorities. That's completely fine, but it's also a real shame; with a few alterations, gamers like me would very likely flock to 9 Dragons with a wide variety of credit cards in hand. Of course, if I'm wrong and Acclaim really is using this pre-launch time to tailor the game for a Western audience, then this whole post is wasted space.
[P.S.- I just want to reiterate that my issues are not with the game or with Korean/Asian games in general, but with the importers. 9 Dragons does sound promising. I just wish it were being released as a premium subscription game, and that enough work were being focused on it by Western developers to merit that fee. I really think it's a mistake for any publisher to directly import/export titles without modification, whether they're East -> West or West -> East.]
The point-to-click thing is another disappointment. The theme of the game sounds very appealing, as does the fact that it's going to be based largely around questing. From the information currently available, though, it doesn't appear as if they're doing anything at all to "westernize" it other than having it professionally translated. While the Asian and Western cultures do have some similarities, there are also signficant differences in terms of what's important, at least in a general sense. Every major Western game I've played has had WASD as the default movement. Additionally, the Western trend is definitely moving in the direction of more and more customization for avatars.
Now, I've frequently heard fans of Korean/Asian MMOs cite that the lack of customization in their games is based around the fact that their endgames are all based on large-scale PvP, and heavy customization would massively degrade performance. That's fair enough, and it seems to be true, because every European/North American import of Korean MMOs seems to follow that model of the PvP endgame. One then wonders why we need another one. I'm just not interested in yet another point-and-click, poorly customized, PvP-based Korean import. PvP is certainly an important aspect of these games, but it's important to remember that a very large segment of Western gamers has little or no interest in that part of the game. Sacrificing [visual] individuality in exchange for an aspect of the game that they'll rarely or never use is a large barrier for such gamers to overcome.
While 9 Dragons certainly appears to offer some interesting features, a great deal of what I've read seems to indicate that the game will have more of the features from Korean games that I don't like than it will features from western games I do like. Western games are in no way, shape or form perfect, and I'm sure there are quite a few Korean MMOs [that are never imported to the West] with terrific features. My point here, is that the two cultures prioritize things differently, their MMO industries have evolved differently, and that, as a result, the companies importing these games would best be served by doing everything in their power to tailor their imports for their new target audiences.
While I'm sure there are some Western gamers who won't mind the issues I've outlined, there will be a much larger segment who will dismiss this game out of hand as "just more of the same from Asia." I've already mentioned that I think the theme of the game is terrific. I think the various clans, the skill-based system, and the historical accuracy are also extremely appealing. The Asian interface, movement controls, limited avatar individuality, and poor crafting system are all massive turn-offs, however. If Acclaim were to actually modify those aspects by bringing in their own professional designers, I'd almost certainly be willing to pay a premium subscription for the game. With the information I have at hand, however, I very much doubt I'll play it for free.
Certainly, my critics are more than welcome to call me close-minded for rejecting aspects of the game out-of-hand. It may even be true to a degree. Unfortunately, the seven years I've spent playing MMOs (and the nine years before that playing MUDs) have shaped my expectations. I've learned what I do and do not like via experience, and my priorities with regard to MMOs have been shaped by that experience as well. Time is the most valuable thing I have, as it's the only thing I'll never be able to get more of. As such, I'm very reluctant to spend any of it on a title that starts off with strong marks against it, even if it won't cost me a penny to play.
It's definitely possible that this game just wasn't picked up by Acclaim with gamers like me in mind, that it was never intended for an audience so wide that it included people with my priorities. That's completely fine, but it's also a real shame; with a few alterations, gamers like me would very likely flock to it with a wide variety of credit cards in hand. Of course, if I'm wrong and Acclaim really is using this pre-launch time to tailor the game for a Western audience, then this whole post is wasted space.
[P.S.- I just want to reiterate that my issues are not with the game or with Korean/Asian games in general, but with the importers. 9 Dragons does sound promising. I just wish it were being released as a premium subscription game, and that enough work were being focused on it by Western developers to merit that fee. I really think it's a mistake for any publisher to directly import titles without modification, whether they're East -> West or West -> East.]
You do have a point about crafting and customization but what is it that makes asdw so special? Yes I am an asian and I am used to asian games but the thing is why is it that asdw is so important? In the case of nine dragons, skills will be your main weapon and im not sure how you use skills with asdw since your fingers are all being used by asdw. If thats the case, then you will have a hard time to use skills cause you dont have any finger to press the hotkeys for skills. Please explain to me why asdw is so special thank you.
I think another major reason WASD is so greatly preferred by Western gamers is that, as I alluded in my first post, every single one of our big three-dimensional MMOs from the very beginning has been based on that movement. By contrast, Ultima Online, which was really the first major Western MMO of the bunch, used point-and-click movement, but it was a two-dimensional, isometric world; as a result, point-and-click might, in some cases, be perceived as "old technology." In any case, UO was the first and last of our big games to be based on point-and-click, so WASD/keyboard movement is what we're all comfortable with. While it's true that there's something to be said for learning to adapt, it's also true that the major British automobiles sold in the United States have been modified so that their steering wheels are on the left side of the vehicle rather than the right. When you're selling a product, it's a good idea to know your audience and remove every conceivable barrier that might prevent said audience from buying.
As an example, here's a quote from a developer at Simutronics on the subject:
"This is a divisive issue in the US, but in some cultures, such as Asia, it’s expected and is considered normal for players to purchase
items with real world money. As game designers we are forced to treat
this issue as a fate accompli and assume this activity will take place,
sanctioned by us or not. When we put Hero’s Journey in Asia, we’ll even
have to consider how to facilitate this activity in order to please our
customers there."
-Erick Slick, November 08, 2005
I have no idea whether or not his assumptions about the Asian market and real-world purchases of game objects are true (though they seem to be in the imports we get), but the quote does indicate that at least one Western developer is thinking about changing their product to suit their target audience. That's really what I'd like to see from the Asian designers, or at least the importers who bring us their games.
I think another major reason WASD is so greatly preferred by Western gamers is that, as I alluded in my first post, every single one of our big three-dimensional MMOs from the very beginning has been based on that movement. By contrast, Ultima Online, which was really the first major Western MMO of the bunch, used point-and-click movement, but it was a two-dimensional, isometric world; as a result, point-and-click might, in some cases, be perceived as "old technology." In any case, UO was the first and last of our big games to be based on point-and-click, so WASD/keyboard movement is what we're all comfortable with. While it's true that there's something to be said for learning to adapt, it's also true that the major British automobiles sold in the United States have been modified so that their steering wheels are on the left side of the vehicle rather than the right. When you're selling a product, it's a good idea to know your audience and remove every conceivable barrier that might prevent said audience from buying.
As an example, here's a quote from a developer at Simutronics on the subject:
"This is a divisive issue in the US, but in some cultures, such as Asia, it’s expected and is considered normal for players to purchase
items with real world money. As game designers we are forced to treat
this issue as a fate accompli and assume this activity will take place,
sanctioned by us or not. When we put Hero’s Journey in Asia, we’ll even
have to consider how to facilitate this activity in order to please our
customers there."
-Erick Slick, November 08, 2005
I have no idea whether or not his assumptions about the Asian market and real-world purchases of game objects are true (though they seem to be in the imports we get), but the quote does indicate that at least one Western developer is thinking about changing their product to suit their target audience. That's really what I'd like to see from the Asian designers, or at least the importers who bring us their games.
Thank you for your response although I find it sad that some good games is not as popular just because of controls but if controls is a very big issue for you guys then you have every right to avoid a game. But I suggest you try it since its free in beta and hopefully also free when the game is released. I heard they will add 20-40 quests a month which is story driven and thus less grind. I think this game will be the best free mmorpg and maybe just maybe, it will be able to compete with some p2p games like linage or maybe WoW. Ive played that korean version and let me tell you that you level up easily compared to other korean games (silkroad).
500 unique character appearances is nothing even close to what I'd consider acceptable customization. If the game offers six clothing slots as well as a choice of face and hair then there would be eight things to customize. If you only got three options for each of those customizable items then you already have over 500 combinations. If that "500" number is real then the developers aren't promising us much customization at all!
I just wanted to clarify that it's not soley the movement commands. Those alone might not be enough to discourage potential gamers, but each additional issue (customization, crafting, interface, et cetera) creates one more barrier to entry for your average Western gamer. I'm sure the game will still attract a bunch of us, especially since it's free. I think there was/is a window for a much larger audience here than 9 Dragons will get with its current code and features, though.
I wouldn't be posting on this board at all if I hadn't been interested enough to read the various interviews about the game and follow them up, but what I've read has taken most of the wind out of my sails. The theme really does sound great, but the implementation (as described by Howard Marks from Acclaim) just isn't what I'm looking for in a game. As I said, it's possible, even probable, that I'm not the target demographic for 9 Dragons. If I'm not, no worries. It's definitely a setting I'd really like to explore in an MMO with the right features, though.
Sad to say but that is incorrect. From the 9Dragons newsletter sent out on July 5:
"We are very excited about the launch of 9Dragons and hope that you will be too. Our expectation is that we will run beta some time around Oct/Nov. In the meantime, unless you choose to unsubscribe in the section below, we will e-mail you monthly with more details regarding the game along with some exclusive sneak peaks."
And you can sign up for beta and register on both the US and EU sites.
Although I have not been playing MMO's for as much time as you Jenuviel, I have came across the same realizations and conclusions about the western - asian importation process's pros and cons based upon some different Korean and Western P2P games and various betas that I have played... all I have to say is thank you for confirming my underlying thoughts and opinions. (I wasn't sure if it was just my biased point of view) With everything in consideration great post with your aspect on the difficulties with the foriegn MMO system
Although over used, Ignorance truly is bliss