SOE will regreat that

bestia · February 2004

Yeah they are still earning lots of bucks with SWG but they have dig his own grave, most of the ppl i know from SWG wil never buy EQ2 or any other SOE game doesnt matter how good they are. Industry has just started to find out what a big fail SOE did with SWG, its just unplayable (a bunch of mindless nice graphics).

Once ppl that keeps playing SWG just cos the SW factor sifts to other games, and with the incoming new MMORPGs generation lead by WoW, SOE is gonna be in real troubles, his name is no longer tied to quality, more to "bucks stealers" and we dont know what are we doing.

What really has me lost is ... Who hired Raph Coaster and why he has even been promoted?????? He is the top responsible of that fiasco and they promote him to general coordination of every project in SOE .... i see bad days coming for SOE.

Enigma · February 2004

Originally posted by bestia
What really has me lost is ... Who hired Raph Coaster and why he has even been promoted?????? He is the top responsible of that fiasco and they promote him to general coordination of every project in SOE .... i see bad days coming for SOE.

There's a couple people on these forums perplexed why people who had a bad experience wont ever buy EQ2 as it has nothing to do with SWG. Well, the explanation above for those who asked these questions can be found in the above quote. Raph.

Also, many people wont touch another SOE game again because instead of admitting they're wrong, they cover up stuff (far too manye xamples on these forums to explain)

Bujinkage · February 2004

I totally agree with you. for my part, I will never ever again touch to a SOE product. I would had not a case of that if at least they showed respect for the players. But, this is not the case. When you only think about money and forget that it is your customers that bring it, that is what happen.

Blacksmith · February 2004

Got to agree with the general sentiment here. I played for two months after release and I was bored by week 2. I kept telling myself "it will get better, it will get better" well guess what? It never did.

Nerfs, nerfs and more nerfs does NOT make a game better! It just pisses off the players that got nerfed. Period. I'm not saying that nerfs aren't necessarry from time to time but to nerf just for the sake of being able to do it? Pure crap.

Sony has lost many customers because of this. I wonder if they even care?

Enigma · February 2004

Originally posted by Blacksmith
Sony has lost many customers because of this. I wonder if they even care?

Sadly, I am positive that SOE could care less.

All yo uhave to do is look at SWG's Customer Service, MODS, and DEVS. A great quote that still stands today: "Action speaks louder than words"

Blaze2 · February 2004

I agree as well. I played SWG for around 6 months but i was bored of it in one. Only reason i keeped on playing is because of friends and i keeped telling myself it would get better. In the end i quit because i had a friend that was stuck in a wall and i contacted a CRS to help and he basicly told me to get lost and banned me from the forum. Ill never play another SOE game again.

Cant wait for WoW to come out

Enigma · February 2004

Originally posted by Rhoklaw
EQ2 has nothing to do with SWG and therefor dooming it because of SWGs failure would have as much creditability as me saying it will rule because EQ blows everything else out of the water and its 5 years old.

I agree that EQ2 has nothing to do with SWG, but I can see why people will not buy EQ2 because of SWG, I, myself, will be one of them. I didn't just quit SWG just because of the lack of content or the flawed ideas. I quit the game because of all of that plus the sheer lack of competency that the SOE Customer Service provided its customer base.

When I receive horrible service from a company, I tend not to buy anything else from that company. For example, (this is a true story), I contracted out a Video Arcade Company to supply me with 14 Arcade games over the weekend in Jan 04 for a Children Lock-in I was hosting. I had so many problems with that company because of broken down machines, Tekken 4 on the arcade when it was actually Tekken 3. I'll never ever use them again and they lost someone who was going to give them $1400 a year. Why am I not ever using them again? Its not just because of a couple bad machines, it was because of their Secretary saying snotty-nose comments about the broken games, hence the customer service. Not only will I never rent from them again, I have also informed other non-profit organizations about their poor business ethics.

It's a proven fact that if the average person receives bad service, that person will tell seven of their friends about it.

Star Wars fanboi I am not nor will ever be. However, I am very conscious of how businesses treat their client/customer base. If a business treated ny business or myself bad in terms of customer service, not only will I never buy that specific product, I will never buy any product from them again until there is some sort of change in management.

Dekron · February 2004

Originally posted by Rhoklaw

EQ2 has nothing to do with SWG and therefor dooming it because of SWGs failure would have as much creditability as me saying it will rule because EQ blows everything else out of the water and its 5 years old.

Well said. I hated SWG, but that doesn't mean that I won't play another SOE game. First off, everyone makes mistakes, SWG was a big one. One thing you SOE bashers should understand is that SOE does not have a single group of DEVs working on every project. They have divisions. They have the EQ division, the SWG division..so on. SOE will continue to put out good games and there will be the occasional slip up like the SWG slop. For all you people still saying "Huh" let me put it in simple terms. Say you own a PS2. And say you own a Sony TV. If you have a problem with the PS2 you wouldn't call the same service number for the both. And still for all those people that are going to stick with "I ain't buying another SOE product again!" attitude. Well, speaking of PS2s you better get rid of it because guess what SOE puts them out!

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33.333333333333336% of me is a huge nerd! How about you?

Enigma · February 2004

Originally posted by dekron
Well said. I hated SWG, but that doesn't mean that I won't play another SOE game. First off, everyone makes mistakes, SWG was a big one. One thing you SOE bashers should understand is that SOE does not have a single group of DEVs working on every project. They have divisions. They have the EQ division, the SWG division..so on. SOE will continue to put out good games and there will be the occasional slip up like the SWG slop. For all you people still saying "Huh" let me put it in simple terms. Say you own a PS2. And say you own a Sony TV. If you have a problem with the PS2 you wouldn't call the same service number for the both. And still for all those people that are going to stick with "I ain't buying another SOE product again!" attitude. Well, speaking of PS2s you better get rid of it because guess what SOE puts them out!

That's not a very accurate illustration. You cannot compare Sony TVs and Sony Playstations to Sony Online Entertainment. It's a completley different set of executives under one main parent company. Thats like comparing GEICO insurance to Coca Cola. There own by the same man, Warren Buffet. But they have completley different executives running the show.

While the SOE division have different Developers for each game they do have Raph Koster promoted to oversee multiple departments within the Online department and that is why I am considering to hold out on any SOE products in the future.

I'll continue to buy Sony TVs and Playstations as they are not run by Sone Online ENtertainment. But as long as Raph Koster has considerable development pull in multiple games that are developed by SOE, then Ill look elsewhere.

If you like SOE, then thats cool. If you're gonna buy EQ2 then thats cool. I for one, wont touch SOE with a ten foot pole and I really dont think I'll be missing out on life for doing so. Its just my opinion.

Rilix · February 2004

I see alot of fingers getting pointed at SoE... what about LucasArts? Like already stated in this post, they played a big role in the development of SWG too. It's not all sony. I was one of them who was really excited. I saw a game that had to do with starwars, and it was an online game at that, something I've wanted for a long time. I got into beta, and I actually enjoyed it. Even in beta it was quite obvious this game was definitely not ready for release, all the testers said it too, but they we're to hooked on just getting it on the shelves already, that was the reason Starwars Galaxies fell so bad. I do agree however, I was very disappointed in SoE and LucasArts equally. Lucasarts has been known for complete junk games in the past, in my opinion that company is going to crap, they have made some real doozie games recently, but I never expected SoE to disappoint me so much. I have played all there games for years, I have done alot of beta testing for them as well, and loved every bit of it. I have been a EQ player since it was very first released, and till this day I still love the game. It was a big disappointment to me to see where SWG went..

During the end of beta the game was still loaded with bugs, most of us thought they we're going to eventually push the date back and keep it in beta, which would of been the smart move. If SWG would of just stayed in beta for a few more months, I think the game would of had alot of different reviews right now. Instead they released it on schedule loaded with bugs, and instead of having the whole team focus on them, and getting them out of the game, they left alot of the bugs and went straight on to adding new content. That was where they failed bad.

One thing I do disagree and partially agree with. Those who said they won't ever touch another SoE product again because of this, what about lucasarts? Will you continue playing there repetitive junk they keep releasing? I don't think people should jump to conclusions that the rest of SoE products will suck just because of this. You must also think SoE has never done a game like this before, and most of the content in SWG was driven by LucasArts. SWG was mostly responsible for the graphics engine and servers. Most of the SWG content did come from the LucasArts side. I do agree SoE is continuing to ruin SWG more and more by just putting bugs to the side to add in new content which seems to be fluttering the game with even more bugs.

However I do not think you should judge this mistake and use it against anything else they put out. Look at EQ, that is still till this date the most successful online RPG going. I do believe EQ2 will be an even bigger success. I can understand being more wary before jumping into one of there games again, but plainly never trying them out, or even bothering to take a look is taking it abit to far in my opinion. Even me, a huge SoE fan will be cautious from here on in with SoE products, if I don't get to test the game, then I will wait a few months until after release of the product, to check out reviews and make sure I want to try it, before I go spending 60 bucks to hop right in.

In order to see the light, you must be in darkness

dokterwer · February 2004

I think something that people arnt seeing clearly in this case is that SOE Is the developer of the game. Yes lucasarts has its tag on it, but its purely licencing and has nothing to do with them making the game. They provide origonal artwork and ideas, they dont however tell them how to go about making the game.

It's all SOE's fault. I was in the beta too and we did all think that the beta was going to be longer but they opted to release a hella buggy game and then afterwards twist the game around and add more stuff while ignoring bugs. I mean hell, thanks for the missions on endor, i loved that, me and 3 friends did that constantly for 4 days straight. Unfortunately we were all runnin around with a rancor and probot which they said a big NO to later on. Since then we all gravitated back to hangin out at the basketball court and are havin a ball.

All SOE's fault, all all all all all. They make the game, who else you going to try to blame?

Enigma · February 2004

Originally posted by dokterwer

I think something that people arnt seeing clearly in this case is that SOE Is the developer of the game. Yes lucasarts has its tag on it, but its purely licencing and has nothing to do with them making the game. They provide origonal artwork and ideas, they dont however tell them how to go about making the game.

Yeah, but you have to admit, Lucas is probably a little embarassed with this mmorpg. Anyone with an untarnish experience (those who never played the game) knows the game has become infamous with player/user complaints as reviews (including Gamespot and gamespy) has very little good to say about it. And you know Lucas is probably upset to see so many Jedi when it's suppose to be during a time where Jedi seem to be extinct

But, then again, Lucas probably loves SWG because he seems to love the first two Movies he has made in the past 6 years and they really suck.

Wankler · February 2004

I feel ripped off by SOE. I don't buy from companies I feel ripped me off.

Lucas Arts is bascially a licensing company, they license the name, then other companys build their action figures, or write their games. I've seem some really good games with the Lucas Arts license and some really bad games (SWG being so far the worst).

SOE wrote the game, marketed it, and sold a bill of goods that didn't come close to delivering.

Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.

mrbbman · February 2004

Alot of the Star Wars games that have been out have not been alot of fun. I will say Knights of the Old Republic was fun though and Kotor seems like a really good game. IMHO sony really did trash what could have been a good game. Al those who have played can probably sympathize with me on the fact that after awhile the game seems more like work than actual fun. Running here, running there, harvesting minerals, and all just to make the things I need to enter combat :0. Other wise you cannot master alot of skill trees. They made crafting a nescessity when in reality some people may not want to do that. All in all this game had a lot of potential but it became not only a time sink but one in which only the hardcore players can benifit.

bgh95035 · February 2004

Raph Coaster is the reason why I'm not trusting another SOE title. He was promoted to "Creative Director" whatever the hell his title is on ALL SOE titles. Get that? on ALL SOE titles, so he has the "creative" input to f'up any and all future SOE titles.

powermatt · February 2004

If EQ2 becomes the biggest game around (IF) you will all eat your words. You will not sit idly by and not play the best game out there because the company made a game you didn't like. People like to pretend that they will boycott things but often it is just a bandwagon. When that bandwagon moves to loving EQ2 many will stay on for the ride. I am sure there exceptions to the rule, but I call it like I see (have seen) it.

Now on old Raph. Him getting promoted simply means he makes a bunch more money but becomes more distanced from the product. It is the nature of a company as large as SOE, I know, I work for one. So while his title implies we will oversee all the creative development there are many other people actually doing the work of creating new ideas and implementing these new ideas. If you don't like him then his promotion could almost be good news, not bad.

I am not advocating EQ2 here, it was just and example. I will laugh if WoW comes out as "successful" as the other games people love so much. Not to say no game has had a truly successful launch, but the highly anticipated ones generally do not. They tend to get pressured by the raving lunatics that want the game to come out NOW and then complain about how it wasn't ready to be released. WoW is currently in the same boat SWG was in on a slightly lesser scale. We will see what happens. Perhaps WoW will deliver, perhaps.

Oh yeah, I will be playing WoW so i am not trying to say it sucks. Just too much anticipation and expectation.

j7007 · February 2004

I will never again buy SOE game, cause they destroy themselves in the eyes of their loving players...

One bad XP is enough not to like something, it happened with SWG, no more SOE and i regret it, because the company had XPs with Online Gaming and great support. But i think there will be another online star soon (or i hope stars to choose from).

Bye bye SOE, we will be missing you a lot but you committed a suicide and its a sign of some psychosis. We feel sorry for you

bgh95035 · February 2004

Maybe it's just me. I played AO when it was first released, and I cancelled after my free month. EVERYONE now raves how great the game is, but I can't bring myself to try it again. SWG has supposedly improved now, but I don't have any desire to try it out for free again. I had 2 active accounts with EQ, but I cancelled those shortly after I cancelled SWG. So, although true there are lots of bandwagon jumpers. I for one am not one, and I will not trust another SOE title.

powermatt · February 2004

Just wanted to laugh at myself for the bandwagon comment. I have been a big FF for a long time. I was real mad when they said they were going to stop making them and were moving it to an online game with XI. I swore I would never play it and now I keep thinking I will because people seem to like it so much. So I guess I may jump on that bandwagon.

Unknown · February 2004

Originally posted by bgh95035

Maybe it's just me. I played AO when it was first released, and I cancelled after my free month. EVERYONE now raves how great the game is, but I can't bring myself to try it again. SWG has supposedly improved now, but I don't have any desire to try it out for free again. I had 2 active accounts with EQ, but I cancelled those shortly after I cancelled SWG. So, although true there are lots of bandwagon jumpers. I for one am not one, and I will not trust another SOE title.

A "bandwagon jumper" is some one who keeps jumping around to games not because they llike the games, but because others like them.

AO was horrible to play not only at release, but during its first 6months to 9 months after release. Mostly because of a HUGE major game bug. Right now at current time AO is arguably one of the best ever MMORPGs ever created. It is one of the only 2 most successfull Sci-Fi MMORPGs out. It has recently doubled the size of the game with the new Shadowlands expansion. And added a new playable Breed. The game is stuffed with new ideas, new experiements. Even EQ is starting to copy some of the things in AO..... LOL!

It's like American cars. They were pieces of junk 15-30 years ago. Built on purpose to fall apart after 2-5 years. Remember the new Ford commercials "Have You Driven A Ford.....Lately?"

Lately American cars have made serioius improvements. They are still behind the Japanese and Europeans in terms of quality, but they are definatly far, far, better than they were 15 years ago! Now lasting to 100k miles without falling apart after 25k miles.

MMORPGs by definition continously change. No MMORPG is the same as it was 1 year before. And definatly not 2 years before. It's like Judging a girl on her looks from when she was 12 yrs old, even though she's now 18 years old LOL! You have no idea what you are missing!

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MMORPG games I've played:
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http://community.webshots.com/user/xplororor

Star Wars Galaxies:
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http://community.webshots.com/user/capt_xplororor

More games:
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http://community.webshots.com/user/xplororor_archives01

oumarch110 · March 2004

SWG's failure will not dissuade me from trying EQ2. I wasnt a fan of EQ due to ancient graphics engine...and the fact I started it over three years after it had been out. I felt lost and so far behind the curve.

But, SWG was screwed by Holocron and his bizarre social engineering ideas. He wasnt making a game, but social experiment. I dont hold that against EQ2 developers.

Motorhead · March 2004

Please God deliver us World of Warcraft.

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Frodo has failed. Bush has The Ring.

SumerNivek · March 2004

Originally posted by Motorhead

Please God deliver us World of Warcraft.

City of Heros is next on my list before WoW. Hopefully that will be plain, old fun until WoW arrives.

Sumer Nivek

MMORPGs played: Ultima Online, World War II Online, Star Wars Galaxies...

Currently waiting for City of Heros and World of Warcraft.

Unknown · March 2004

Originally posted by Motorhead

Please God deliver us World of Warcraft.

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Frodo has failed. Bush has The Ring.

1. WoW has its own forums for you to advertise about it.

2. WoW is a Tolkien-themed MMORPG. It will be entering a super-saturated market.

3. SWG is a Sci-Fi themed MMORPG..... it's market is not overcrowded. SWG and WoW cannot be compared to each other LOL!

4. WoW already has some horribly serious problems. Their "death system" allows players to be invincible in actual practice... as I pointed out on a major forum which got the attention of even the most l00t d00d WoW fan.

5. Blizzard, who have zero experience with MMORPGs, think death is an inconvience in MMORPGs that should be run away from. In MMORPGs, dying is part of the fun.

I find it funny that Blizzard seems to be making their MMORPG with the wimpiest death system, considering their ORPG games (like Diablo 2) feature a hardcore mode, which has proven to be incredibly popular! Hardcore mode in D2 = permadeath. High level eh? You die that's it! Heheheh.

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MMORPG games I've played:
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http://community.webshots.com/user/xplororor

Star Wars Galaxies:
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http://community.webshots.com/user/capt_xplororor

More games:
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http://community.webshots.com/user/xplororor_archives01

jjjbad · March 2004

Originally posted by Rhoklaw

EQ2 is not the new "Lord of the MMO Manor" like EQ is during its reign. I liked DAoC and I liked AC, but neither of those games have anything close to the amount of content EQ has. Too many of you center your gaming on how COOL the eye candy is and then we end up with games like SWG. Games that look pretty but have no <censored>ing content. Never once in my 3 years of EQ did I ever get bored and I still play it. Sure, DAoC looks better but damn is it boring aside from their new expansion, ToA, which I might point out, is content driven. They did improve armor graphics, but thats about it, no major facelifts to the core game.

I think you hit the nail on the head when you mentioned content. The coolest part about EQ was the quests and new and more powerful items you could get for your class. I think the fact that drops in SWG are pitiful and the quest rewards are minimal just reinforces your point. This game could be really cool but again the general feel of this thread is that SOE doen't really care about its customers. I heartily agree with this sentiment. Remember hitting high lvls in EQ only to die because of LD problems and the amount of EXP you would lose? That doesn't make a fun game. And I am the first player to lol if I die because I have made a boneheaded manoever. Now SOE would claim its client based problems I am experiencing. I only get these problems with SOE games. I will probably cancel my SWG (account just like I did my EQ account) because I feel that SOE doesn't really care about me as a customer and a gamer.

Jermai · March 2004

I beg to differ son, sure SOE sucks so far, but I must say that u havnt been reading up on the japan releases,MARCH31st marks the date for the release of Resident Evil Outbreak on PS2, only the 2nd most sold game in Japan (EVER) so get ready to piss your pants

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