Anyone that thinks Aion is a great pvp game is really out of their mind... Aion pvp is nothing more than the old crap WoW honor system that rewards more playtime, bigger zergs etc. Fortress sieges are nothing but a race to kill a pve mob, I mean hell you can even farm pve mobs to get pvp gear? WTF?
Lineage 2 was a better pvp game than Aion hands down, castle sieges actually meant something. The game promoted a lot of clan v clan wars and alliance v alliance wars.
Guild Wars was a better pvp game than Aion also, I just picked these two games since they are both NCsoft titles.
I won't be a blind WoW hater, maybe WoW deserves to barely be on that list at #5, and maybe not. But WAR? /facepalm You've got to be kidding me. That MMO has some of the most bland PvP I have ever witnessed. Replace it with something like Shadowbane. I'm sorry but you have low ass standards if WAR is on your top 5 list of PvP MMOs.
I totally agree. The fact that an incredibly bland game like WAR can appear on a top 5 pvp mmo list goes to show how lacking mmos are for decent pvp games. WoW isnt even a pvp game and it gets a place........and Ultima Online is 10 years old. Then again I knew the list was going to be terrible before I even clicked on the link.
This article simply proves that we need more pvp based mmos. Hopefully this will change in 2010
Honestly, the only reason I'd even say WoW should be on that list is the older version of Alterac Valley. It turned what was just a pvp instanced map into a real war-zone. It was actual warfare instead of the horrid zerg it is today. You had to collect drops, save people, and struggle to gain the upperhand. If you were lucky, you could unleash hell with the uber summons that both side had. If you managed to drop them? Got some nice gear then. If not? Well its a train speeding right towards your main base, and no brakes attached.
As for today, PvP is the number one reason why several classes got gimped in PvE in WoW. Ret pallies got nerfed to hell and back because they were working as intended according to GC, Death Knights had cooldowns smacked around because they lowered damage taken. If this was a top 10 list, sure, give WoW a position for what it once was, maybe near 9 or so, but 5? No. Darkfall deserves a spot on this list, even if its a 5.
before anyone says anything, I do play WoW, I haven't played Darkfall. If they had a trial system I'd give the game a go.
For those of you who laugh at wow being on the list, have you actually played the game within the first 2 years of its release? Yes i admit the pvp now in WoW is a complete joke. However back in the old days before the AQ patch even. I absolutely LOVED AV. i still remember 8 hour long battles in AV where neither side could see victory, just back and forth of pure slaughter. In my opinion, blizzard should make another server to just allow old gameplay and none of the new crap they put in the game.
Yes I played WoW and no I didn't like it lol. You spent 8 hours in a PvP match to get what? And how does that compare to a 2 month+ long war that was waged in DFO where one large alliance was attempting to take control of the game world by conquering it? Where politicians mattered, crafters mattered, soldiers mattered, spies mattered, sabotage mattered, recruiters mattered, strategists and tacticians mattered, economists mattered, salesmen mattered, peons mattered, public speakers and public image mattered?
While you can talk about an 8 hour PvP match I will talk about the months long war that was waged on land and on sea, where many cities were destroyed, many clans crushed and assimalated or disbanded, where gaining the favor of the public was important, were hundreds of players were clashing blades and firing canons in all corners of the world, where multi prong attacks to divide and conquer your foes was a tactic commonly used. Where flanking the enemy wasn't some skill you bought from the trainer but something you actually had to do.
I mean your saying those that scoff at WoW just don't know, but what you don't realize is the reason we are scoffing is because you and some others just don't know lol.
I'm glad you enjoyed your 8 hour long arena fight... but understand why I view that as something meh. It just doesn't compaire to a virtual War. I mean for the first time in the history of MMO's the Goons were on the side of good lol. They had to be or they too would have been swept under the might of Hyperion. They rose to the challenge though and led the charge against Hyperion.
Your saying don't bash WoW I had a great 8 hour arena fight once, while I'm sitting here wondering why that arena was even considered PvP due to the experiences I've had in many games.
In UO we regularly had 100+ vs. 100+ wars, granted they weren't as epic as DFO's, but they were still epic. In Shadowbane War was waged, not some little "Haa Haa I pwn'd you in an arena". Were talking large scale battles that actually can only be reffered to as Epic.
I mean thats like calling a VW Bug one of the best trucks on the market... sure it has an engine, wheels, doors and even runs on gas, but it isn't a truck. You can haul groceries in it, but your not going to be hauling building materials around in it.
Darkfall fans attacking the article and preaching the awesomeness of DF is about as surprising as this:
I agree with the list. Might switch the order of #4 and #5, or kick WoW out and put WAR in #5 and Shadowbane/Planetside/whatever in #4. But #3, #2, and #1, I agree with.
Darkfall fans attacking the article and preaching the awesomeness of DF is about as surprising as this: I agree with the list. Might switch the order of #4 and #5, or kick WoW out and put WAR in #5 and Shadowbane/Planetside/whatever in #4. But #3, #2, and #1, I agree with.
Want to know a little Secret? I don't play DFO anymore I'm an Aion fan :P
I quit DFO when Aventurine decided to try and charge NA players twice for the same game, regardless of stating at the time of purchase that players would be able to create 1 toon per server and told all the NA players that they were welcome to play on EU launch and that they would be able to transfer or start a new char on the NA servers when it launched.
So... unless Aventurine gives control of DFO over to another company I won't be playing again. Aventurine sucks, big time.
But that doesn't change facts, DFO is sadly one of the best PvP MMO's out.
Edited to Add: Heres another funny little side not, I think FE is crap... but I herald it as having one of the best crafting systems ever in an MMO.
I mean thats like calling a VW Bug one of the best trucks on the market... sure it has an engine, wheels, doors and even runs on gas, but it isn't a truck. You can haul groceries in it, but your not going to be hauling building materials around in it.
In a nutshell this sums it up for me.
To those that say it's their site, and their opinion, fair enough. But I personally believe that a site as popular as this, should be a little more responsible when doing top5 or top10 lists. It is amazingly foolish to put WOW on a list like that. And yes I played WOW shortly after launch, but I still do not agree at all.
Do you think I'll be clicking on another thread like this on this site? No way. It wouldn't matter anymore to me. I'm sure I'm not alone.
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uhhh... GUILD WARS should have been in there amongst top 3 definetly... the only PvP that I played that requires skill and not button bashing which seems like thats what u posted here... exept for EVE....
For those of you who laugh at wow being on the list, have you actually played the game within the first 2 years of its release? Yes i admit the pvp now in WoW is a complete joke. However back in the old days before the AQ patch even. I absolutely LOVED AV. i still remember 8 hour long battles in AV where neither side could see victory, just back and forth of pure slaughter. In my opinion, blizzard should make another server to just allow old gameplay and none of the new crap they put in the game.
I liked the old 8 hour AVs but it is still instanced PvP with no consequences upon death.
"Keep in mind that this list is my own, and your mileage may vary, but here then are my top five PvP MMOs."
Note, it is not the offcial MMORPG Top 5 PVP games list, he doesn't say he's played every PVP game out there, so maybe he didn't experience Shadowbane or Planetside. (I missed the latter one)
This is his opinion, and like another poster said, some PVP games are better at one thing (full loot, FFA combat) vs a more controlled, balanced PVP environment (i.e. WOW arenas and BG's)
We all have our preferences on how we like our PVP, and none of us would ever come up with the same top 5 PVP game list.
Myself, I would have left WAR off, but I'm sure there's many WAR players who would disagree with my choice.
But of course, since the OP said EVE was #!1, I'm in complete agreement with him.
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Not a bad list in my opinion, but still i'm very suprised that Guild Wars isn't on the list, well of course in Guild Wars it's not about the gear or numbers you have, but the skill so it would become also an odd one in the list.
Sigh, no one reads I guess, from the OP: "Keep in mind that this list is my own, and your mileage may vary, but here then are my top five PvP MMOs." Note, it is not the offcial MMORPG Top 5 PVP games list, he doesn't say he's played every PVP game out there, so maybe he didn't experience Shadowbane or Planetside. (I missed the latter one) This is his opinion, and like another poster said, some PVP games are better at one thing (full loot, FFA combat) vs a more controlled, balanced PVP environment (i.e. WOW arenas and BG's) We all have our preferences on how we like our PVP, and none of us would ever come up with the same top 5 PVP game list. Myself, I would have left WAR off, but I'm sure there's many WAR players who would disagree with my choice. But of course, since the OP said EVE was #!1, I'm in complete agreement with him.
Yeah I read that, if he had put it in the title of the article it would have been better received. Instead he stuck in inside the article and wrote the title to read "The Top 5 PvP MMO's" which does over ride any disclaimer inside the article considering it should be a known fact that the majority will read the title then skim through the rest of the article.
A better received title would have been "My Top 5 PvP MMO's" or something similar.
I'm surprised that there has been no mention of Darktide on AC; a classic open pvp world. Not that I played it much, but it the type of pvp that many are always clammoring for. Its funny how those that are always begging for *real* pvp, don't continue to support a game that provides it after all the easy-to-kill players have been driven off. Its no wonder that there aren't that many pvp only mmos that survive.
Not a bad list. Obviously there will be some people who had an amazing experience in games that haven't been listed such as darkfall and aoc, but I don't think it discounts the relevance of the writer's top 5. Honestly, for that "type" of gameplay, the FPS Pirates, Vikings and Knights blows it away in every aspect except the fact you don't have to level up or anything.
And, I'm one of the people who don't believe WoW is a "great" pvp game however, it has international tournaments -- so it'd be absolutely retarded not to include it. And as dumbed down the overrall pvp is in it, the small scale arena matches are great and the fluidity is unmatched.
how the heck could you not have planetsideon the list?? heck how can it not be #1 or #2. It was/is a great game and it's all PvP, with epic scale battles.
LOL, while i know you clearly stated that this is your list and my mileage may vary, i have never before been unable to find one in a list that i could agree with.
wow, lol, and i cant stop loling. nub mmo nub pvp, nub nub nub. it is shameful that this game still gets press of any kind and i avoid grouping with ppl in other games who make it known that they have played this one. those who state proudly tht they ruled in wow are extra fail when they come play competitive pvp games. this game is a marketing success, not a gameplay success. i dont hate blizzard, i think its great that they introduced millions to online gameplay. but this is not for gamers.
warhammer...really?
ultima online? i have more fun playing ultima's 1-6 [and i actually still do when i feel nostalgic about stealing goods from behind npc vendors and getting greedy to the point the guards come and pwn me] than i ever did in this online adaptation
daoc, cough, excuse me i just threw up in my mouth. i had a fun 30 minutes in daoc one day
eve online...while i dont especially hate anything about eve, its pvp didnt really engage me, nor the rest of the game for that matter.
your mention of UO being your first leads me to assume u've been around the mmo block a few times so it saddens me that these were your choices
Asherons Call 1 on the Darktide server was the best FFA PvP experience in any MMORPG, period. The fact that you havent got that on your list shows that you are fairly new to PvP in MMORPGs.
Also, Eve may be a good FFA PvP game but I did alot more PvP in WAR than I do in Eve, and I live in 0.0 space. Reason? The death penalty in the game is so high that the game is more about ganking than just straight up PvP. Rarely do you get even remotely even fights or fights where both parties actually want to fight. So it is very bad to encourage new people that likes to do PvP in MMORPGs to Eve, the game is only for the nische people of the PvP crowd. Mostly the ones that likes extreme death penalties and assymetrical warfare (i.e. uneven fights).
I am fine with the list ... except, Warhammer ... its doesn't belong anywhere remotely close to the top five. And I speak as someone who waited years for that game, beta'd it, and hung in there with it for 9 grueling months. Mythic totally dropped the ball with that game, and are incapable, or unwilling to save it.
They should have just remade DAoC with a new engine and updated graphics, and they would have had a number 1 hit on their hands.
My apologies to Darkfall fans ... I've never played that game, so I can't comment.
Comments
No Planetside either? wtf
Anyone that thinks Aion is a great pvp game is really out of their mind... Aion pvp is nothing more than the old crap WoW honor system that rewards more playtime, bigger zergs etc. Fortress sieges are nothing but a race to kill a pve mob, I mean hell you can even farm pve mobs to get pvp gear? WTF?
Lineage 2 was a better pvp game than Aion hands down, castle sieges actually meant something. The game promoted a lot of clan v clan wars and alliance v alliance wars.
Guild Wars was a better pvp game than Aion also, I just picked these two games since they are both NCsoft titles.
I totally agree. The fact that an incredibly bland game like WAR can appear on a top 5 pvp mmo list goes to show how lacking mmos are for decent pvp games. WoW isnt even a pvp game and it gets a place........and Ultima Online is 10 years old. Then again I knew the list was going to be terrible before I even clicked on the link.
This article simply proves that we need more pvp based mmos. Hopefully this will change in 2010
Honestly, the only reason I'd even say WoW should be on that list is the older version of Alterac Valley. It turned what was just a pvp instanced map into a real war-zone. It was actual warfare instead of the horrid zerg it is today. You had to collect drops, save people, and struggle to gain the upperhand. If you were lucky, you could unleash hell with the uber summons that both side had. If you managed to drop them? Got some nice gear then. If not? Well its a train speeding right towards your main base, and no brakes attached.
As for today, PvP is the number one reason why several classes got gimped in PvE in WoW. Ret pallies got nerfed to hell and back because they were working as intended according to GC, Death Knights had cooldowns smacked around because they lowered damage taken. If this was a top 10 list, sure, give WoW a position for what it once was, maybe near 9 or so, but 5? No. Darkfall deserves a spot on this list, even if its a 5.
before anyone says anything, I do play WoW, I haven't played Darkfall. If they had a trial system I'd give the game a go.
Yes I played WoW and no I didn't like it lol. You spent 8 hours in a PvP match to get what? And how does that compare to a 2 month+ long war that was waged in DFO where one large alliance was attempting to take control of the game world by conquering it? Where politicians mattered, crafters mattered, soldiers mattered, spies mattered, sabotage mattered, recruiters mattered, strategists and tacticians mattered, economists mattered, salesmen mattered, peons mattered, public speakers and public image mattered?
While you can talk about an 8 hour PvP match I will talk about the months long war that was waged on land and on sea, where many cities were destroyed, many clans crushed and assimalated or disbanded, where gaining the favor of the public was important, were hundreds of players were clashing blades and firing canons in all corners of the world, where multi prong attacks to divide and conquer your foes was a tactic commonly used. Where flanking the enemy wasn't some skill you bought from the trainer but something you actually had to do.
I mean your saying those that scoff at WoW just don't know, but what you don't realize is the reason we are scoffing is because you and some others just don't know lol.
I'm glad you enjoyed your 8 hour long arena fight... but understand why I view that as something meh. It just doesn't compaire to a virtual War. I mean for the first time in the history of MMO's the Goons were on the side of good lol. They had to be or they too would have been swept under the might of Hyperion. They rose to the challenge though and led the charge against Hyperion.
Your saying don't bash WoW I had a great 8 hour arena fight once, while I'm sitting here wondering why that arena was even considered PvP due to the experiences I've had in many games.
In UO we regularly had 100+ vs. 100+ wars, granted they weren't as epic as DFO's, but they were still epic. In Shadowbane War was waged, not some little "Haa Haa I pwn'd you in an arena". Were talking large scale battles that actually can only be reffered to as Epic.
I mean thats like calling a VW Bug one of the best trucks on the market... sure it has an engine, wheels, doors and even runs on gas, but it isn't a truck. You can haul groceries in it, but your not going to be hauling building materials around in it.
Darkfall fans attacking the article and preaching the awesomeness of DF is about as surprising as this:
I agree with the list. Might switch the order of #4 and #5, or kick WoW out and put WAR in #5 and Shadowbane/Planetside/whatever in #4. But #3, #2, and #1, I agree with.
Want to know a little Secret? I don't play DFO anymore I'm an Aion fan :P
I quit DFO when Aventurine decided to try and charge NA players twice for the same game, regardless of stating at the time of purchase that players would be able to create 1 toon per server and told all the NA players that they were welcome to play on EU launch and that they would be able to transfer or start a new char on the NA servers when it launched.
So... unless Aventurine gives control of DFO over to another company I won't be playing again. Aventurine sucks, big time.
But that doesn't change facts, DFO is sadly one of the best PvP MMO's out.
Edited to Add: Heres another funny little side not, I think FE is crap... but I herald it as having one of the best crafting systems ever in an MMO.
In a nutshell this sums it up for me.
To those that say it's their site, and their opinion, fair enough. But I personally believe that a site as popular as this, should be a little more responsible when doing top5 or top10 lists. It is amazingly foolish to put WOW on a list like that. And yes I played WOW shortly after launch, but I still do not agree at all.
Do you think I'll be clicking on another thread like this on this site? No way. It wouldn't matter anymore to me. I'm sure I'm not alone.
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uhhh... GUILD WARS should have been in there amongst top 3 definetly... the only PvP that I played that requires skill and not button bashing which seems like thats what u posted here... exept for EVE....
I liked the old 8 hour AVs but it is still instanced PvP with no consequences upon death.
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Sigh, no one reads I guess, from the OP:
"Keep in mind that this list is my own, and your mileage may vary, but here then are my top five PvP MMOs."
Note, it is not the offcial MMORPG Top 5 PVP games list, he doesn't say he's played every PVP game out there, so maybe he didn't experience Shadowbane or Planetside. (I missed the latter one)
This is his opinion, and like another poster said, some PVP games are better at one thing (full loot, FFA combat) vs a more controlled, balanced PVP environment (i.e. WOW arenas and BG's)
We all have our preferences on how we like our PVP, and none of us would ever come up with the same top 5 PVP game list.
Myself, I would have left WAR off, but I'm sure there's many WAR players who would disagree with my choice.
But of course, since the OP said EVE was #!1, I'm in complete agreement with him.
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It also doesn't exist anymore. Probably why it's not there, you think?
Not a bad list in my opinion, but still i'm very suprised that Guild Wars isn't on the list, well of course in Guild Wars it's not about the gear or numbers you have, but the skill so it would become also an odd one in the list.
Yeah I read that, if he had put it in the title of the article it would have been better received. Instead he stuck in inside the article and wrote the title to read "The Top 5 PvP MMO's" which does over ride any disclaimer inside the article considering it should be a known fact that the majority will read the title then skim through the rest of the article.
A better received title would have been "My Top 5 PvP MMO's" or something similar.
I'm surprised that there has been no mention of Darktide on AC; a classic open pvp world. Not that I played it much, but it the type of pvp that many are always clammoring for. Its funny how those that are always begging for *real* pvp, don't continue to support a game that provides it after all the easy-to-kill players have been driven off. Its no wonder that there aren't that many pvp only mmos that survive.
Not a bad list. Obviously there will be some people who had an amazing experience in games that haven't been listed such as darkfall and aoc, but I don't think it discounts the relevance of the writer's top 5. Honestly, for that "type" of gameplay, the FPS Pirates, Vikings and Knights blows it away in every aspect except the fact you don't have to level up or anything.
And, I'm one of the people who don't believe WoW is a "great" pvp game however, it has international tournaments -- so it'd be absolutely retarded not to include it. And as dumbed down the overrall pvp is in it, the small scale arena matches are great and the fluidity is unmatched.
Funny list! This was definitely not written by any PvPer that I've ever known.
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how the heck could you not have planetside on the list?? heck how can it not be #1 or #2. It was/is a great game and it's all PvP, with epic scale battles.
I need a new MMOG
Nice article OP, although I disagree for the most part with your list.
I would certainly not have WAR on there as I find the PvP in that game horrible, and WoW only had "good" PvP back before Battlegrounds came out.
Ultima Online - absolutely
Dark Age of Camelot - absolutely
EvE Online - probably yes
However, I think you're missing some very important ones: Shadowbane, Planetside, and in my opinion the MMO with the best PvP by far: Darkfall.
Either way, we're entitled to our opinions and you have yours, so I'll have to respectfully disagree.
LOL, while i know you clearly stated that this is your list and my mileage may vary, i have never before been unable to find one in a list that i could agree with.
wow, lol, and i cant stop loling. nub mmo nub pvp, nub nub nub. it is shameful that this game still gets press of any kind and i avoid grouping with ppl in other games who make it known that they have played this one. those who state proudly tht they ruled in wow are extra fail when they come play competitive pvp games. this game is a marketing success, not a gameplay success. i dont hate blizzard, i think its great that they introduced millions to online gameplay. but this is not for gamers.
warhammer...really?
ultima online? i have more fun playing ultima's 1-6 [and i actually still do when i feel nostalgic about stealing goods from behind npc vendors and getting greedy to the point the guards come and pwn me] than i ever did in this online adaptation
daoc, cough, excuse me i just threw up in my mouth. i had a fun 30 minutes in daoc one day
eve online...while i dont especially hate anything about eve, its pvp didnt really engage me, nor the rest of the game for that matter.
your mention of UO being your first leads me to assume u've been around the mmo block a few times so it saddens me that these were your choices
The only game on the list that should actually be there is EvE online. I can't believe there's no mentioning of L2 and Darkfall either.
Asherons Call 1 on the Darktide server was the best FFA PvP experience in any MMORPG, period. The fact that you havent got that on your list shows that you are fairly new to PvP in MMORPGs.
Also, Eve may be a good FFA PvP game but I did alot more PvP in WAR than I do in Eve, and I live in 0.0 space. Reason? The death penalty in the game is so high that the game is more about ganking than just straight up PvP. Rarely do you get even remotely even fights or fights where both parties actually want to fight. So it is very bad to encourage new people that likes to do PvP in MMORPGs to Eve, the game is only for the nische people of the PvP crowd. Mostly the ones that likes extreme death penalties and assymetrical warfare (i.e. uneven fights).
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I am fine with the list ... except, Warhammer ... its doesn't belong anywhere remotely close to the top five. And I speak as someone who waited years for that game, beta'd it, and hung in there with it for 9 grueling months. Mythic totally dropped the ball with that game, and are incapable, or unwilling to save it.
They should have just remade DAoC with a new engine and updated graphics, and they would have had a number 1 hit on their hands.
My apologies to Darkfall fans ... I've never played that game, so I can't comment.
DAoC was my favorite MMO, also my first. Great game all around, not just in PvP either. The community was the best.
But I think WWII Online should be on that list
It's only PvP hehe. That's the other game I can never put down.
I think SWG before the NGE should be number one but I agree DAoC should be number two, I haven't ever played EVE though
Do us a favor and never write a list again.
No Darkfall?
No Shadowbane?
No Asheron's Call?
Gtfo...