many kids are going to start mmos because of their fathers.
Hey man, what about us females? I game as much or more then most males out there, considering... its all I do currently with no job. Now while I'm not planning on having children, I've got an anger streak that just wouldn't be fair to throw a kid in the middle of, I think its only fair to include the mothers in this equasion!
I can sure as hell tell you that if I had a kid, I'd still game.
Well, I know a few families and whenver their kids started watching more TV than not, their grades went down and they really didn't do much else. So then the parents stepped in and BLAMMO! Grades went up, the kids started partaking in other activities and started becoming more interesting and engaging people. So I'm all for llimiting games and TV for children.
It all depends. If you start kids out with them, they know how to manage it. If it's limited too much, as soon as you give them freedom, they'll take advantage of it in fear it'll be gone soon enough.
Well, it depends on how you do it. If you treat it like contraband then sure.
but all the interesting kids who are engaged, have mulitpble interestes, are polite with a great sense of self and who seem to be on a good track have limited TV and Video Game time.
I've met couch potato kids and quite franky they don't impress me.
But part of it too is how the family is and what the expectations are.
if you are in a family that doesn't do much and the children don't have a lot that is offered them then they are going to be slugs. If they are surrounded by successful and engaged people (whether one is a lawyer, Doctor, Physisist or Carpenter, Steamfitter) then that will rub off on them.
but sometimes discipline needs to be taught. Not everyone takes to it. Heck, i remember a teen from high school who was essentially a F*ck up. Didn't amount to anything. No one expected anything from him and he has no expectations. Finall he was at the end of his rope as he really had nowhere to turn to. So what did he do? He went into the army.
Came back more serious, with goals and a plan to make his life better. he also had a work ethic. Took pride in what he did.
Now, I'm not saying that Video games or TV is completely bad. but it can lead to bad habits and it's those habits that need to be addressed.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
I'm doing everything I can to keep the nieces and nephews away from MMOs, and trying to steer them to learning games if they must. I prefer to try do things out of doors with them.
If I ever have kids, it'll be the same. I play MMOs, but I got into them in my 30s. I do NOT want any young people I care about involved in MMOs until they find them as adults. If they had these things when I was in school.... I shudder to think.
While I agree to you on most points, i am not sure that the direction is correct. That is, you last statement indicates the same as what my parents said about TV and it may appear they were wrong. Why is it that you feel kids should wait for mmorpg's?
TV is passive. MMOs are interactive. You can get a kid to stop watching T V easily enough, but kids (and adults) often have a hard time logging out of MMOs.
Parenting is one of the hardest things to do, and the thing with the greatest repercussions. There's no way to predict which kids are and which kids aren't going to get addicted to video games. There are things you can no doubt do to help make your kids turn out OK, but the truth is a lot of it is a crapshoot. MMOs add a whole new level of variables that are often largely outside a parents control and purview (the folks you meet in-game and what they impart upon your children).
When kids are young they're learning lessons that will effect the rest of their lives. They're learning a work ethic, values, priorities, etc. MMOs can (and frequently will) reinforce other lessons because it is another "world" of sorts. Unless the game's primary focus is on education and rewarding a good work ethic, there's nothing beneficial a child could get from an MMO. Children could be outside breathing fresh air and getting vital exercise. I'd rather the kid be outside digging holes in the ground than inside playing WoW or EVE or something.
As long as my kid gets acceptable grades in school, participates in a sport, and does their chores they can play as long as they'd like.
I've been playing MMOs for about 4-5 years, starting at 11 or 12 years old and I'm not messed up. I'd like to think I'm pretty balanced even though my parents may think otherwise.
I do all of the things I mentioned and even though my parents don't really like the fact that I game, they humor me for the most part.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Guys! I'm hopelessly lost in a mountain of mole hills! Them damn moles!
I'm doing everything I can to keep the nieces and nephews away from MMOs, and trying to steer them to learning games if they must. I prefer to try do things out of doors with them.
If I ever have kids, it'll be the same. I play MMOs, but I got into them in my 30s. I do NOT want any young people I care about involved in MMOs until they find them as adults. If they had these things when I was in school.... I shudder to think.
While I agree to you on most points, i am not sure that the direction is correct. That is, you last statement indicates the same as what my parents said about TV and it may appear they were wrong. Why is it that you feel kids should wait for mmorpg's?
Well, I know a few families and whenver their kids started watching more TV than not, their grades went down and they really didn't do much else. So then the parents stepped in and BLAMMO! Grades went up, the kids started partaking in other activities and started becoming more interesting and engaging people.
So I'm all for llimiting games and TV for children.
Seen that also, got to ask, what age is appropriate for MMORPG's and/or TV watching per desire?
As far as TV no age limit they just have to be doing well in school and have other interests. I know that I watch very little TV but that has more to do with the fact that I have a lot of interests and a fairly busy social life. Not to mention that when I do have free time I normally do a bit of gaming over TV.
Since mmo's can be very time consuming I would say that around 14 to 16 without supervision. maybe even 13 but it depends. Part of being a kid is learning how to be an adult and learning that not all adults that are out there on the internet are good. In my family, when I was 14, my mother came into my room and said "It's time to get a job".
I hated the idea but did it and learned what having financial freedom was like. I learned to save and learned that if I wanted somethign that I had to plan for it. So at that time I had school activities, practicing, and free time with friends. Keep in mind, the Internet wasn't around for families in the form that we are familiar with today. You didn't chat online or go to facebook or any number of things. You went over your friend's house, did a bit of Atari maybe and played football.
I think today's parent is very challenged as some of the influences that kids have today didn't really exist or exist in the form/quantities that they have today.
And in the end, I don't believe (and this is my personal taste) that sitting in front of a screen all day is good for the body or mind.
One needs to excercise their mind and body. And believe me, you really learn the value of this as you get older.
That same family I was talking about? The son plays a bit of LOTRO. When he was younger he had supervision. Now he has some guidlines as he is older and quickly becoming a man. But because he has scholastic expectations and it is expected that he do something that is physically active he does more than sit in front of the screen playing games. He is also an avid reader and that helps tremendously.
I think part of it is knowing your kids, knowing their proclivities and also wanting to give them the tools to become successful adults. Whatever that is.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
"Getting good grades" is a very low bar to set, by the way.
Some kids could be very talented and can "get by" very easily with no effort, falling far short of their potential and learning that being lazy is OK. Adding MMOs and their addictive nature and the lessons they learn into the mix is a recipe for disaster.
"Getting good grades" is a very low bar to set, by the way.
Some kids could be very talented and can "get by" very easily with no effort, falling far short of their potential and learning that being lazy is OK. Adding MMOs and their addictive nature and the lessons they learn into the mix is a recipe for disaster.
That was said in a colloquial sense. You are of course right, one could get Straight A's and be a lazy kid. I would be happy to expand upon that and say "fullfilling their potential".
It's funny you mention that. I've known two pianists who were great. Rearlly great. They didn't really have to put much effort into what they did and barely had to practice.
After the fact both of them acknowledged that though they do fine with their lessons they both would be failures because they never put in the real work to take them to the next level.
It's an interesting problem to have.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
"Getting good grades" is a very low bar to set, by the way.
Some kids could be very talented and can "get by" very easily with no effort, falling far short of their potential and learning that being lazy is OK. Adding MMOs and their addictive nature and the lessons they learn into the mix is a recipe for disaster.
That was said in a colloquial sense. You are of course right, one could get Straight A's and be a lazy kid. I would be happy to expand upon that and say "fullfilling their potential".
It's funny you mention that. I've known two pianists who were great. Rearlly great. They didn't really have to put much effort into what they did and barely had to practice.
After the fact both of them acknowledged that though they do fine with their lessons they both would be failures because they never put in the real work to take them to the next level.
It's an interesting problem to have.
It reinforces some very negative lessons.
I had a very easy time getting good grades in elementary school, whereas a friend had to study hard. He was a C+/B student, I was an A student. In the end, he learned to work very hard and eventually, in college, he was an A student while I graduated a C+/B student who never bothered to study.
He wound up with the job offers, I worked for a bit over minimum wage with a useless college degree. He makes sh*t-loads more than I do now.
My knowledge that I'm actually "smarter" than he is and have so much more potential is scant consolation to me as I try to claw my way to where I could have been had I learned that hard work pays off.
"Getting good grades" is a very low bar to set, by the way.
Some kids could be very talented and can "get by" very easily with no effort, falling far short of their potential and learning that being lazy is OK. Adding MMOs and their addictive nature and the lessons they learn into the mix is a recipe for disaster.
That was said in a colloquial sense. You are of course right, one could get Straight A's and be a lazy kid. I would be happy to expand upon that and say "fullfilling their potential".
It's funny you mention that. I've known two pianists who were great. Rearlly great. They didn't really have to put much effort into what they did and barely had to practice.
After the fact both of them acknowledged that though they do fine with their lessons they both would be failures because they never put in the real work to take them to the next level.
It's an interesting problem to have.
It reinforces some very negative lessons.
I had a very easy time getting good grades in elementary school, whereas a friend had to study hard. He was a C+/B student, I was an A student. In the end, he learned to work very hard and eventually, in college, he was an A student while I graduated a C+/B student who never bothered to study.
He wound up with the job offers, I worked for a bit over minimum wage with a useless college degree. He makes sh*t-loads more than I do now.
My knowledge that I'm actually "smarter" than he is and have so much more potential is scant consolation to me as I try to claw my way to where I could have been had I learned that hard work pays off.
You are correct, parents need to teach their children the value of hard work.
I got that as young as 6. Really.
My parents divorced by the time I was 7. They started the proceedings when I was 6.
My grandfather was an old school laborer/carpenter and we would be given actual chores and actual work projects. by the time I was in 5th grade we would be called over and we would be put to work.
After he mowed his lawn he would give my brother and I clippers, he would get down on the ground and point to areas where my brother and I would then proceed to try to find these areas and even out the tufts of grass that he missed.
then he would take the lawn mower into the garage, put it up on the horses and teach us how to break it down and clean it. He would oil parts, use brushes to clean parts and then sharpen the blade if it needed it.
this would be on a Saturday morning when most kids were out playing or watching cartoons.
So yes getting good grades is not enough. But it's a whole package. That's what parenthood is about. It's about teaching children how to be successful people. Whatever one believes that to be.
That's why it's extremely hard for me to see the "I'm bored" or the "I don't have anything better to do, am bored so I'm just playing this until X comes out" posts.
Because when I was young the mantra was "you are bored? You find something to do or I will give you something to do".
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
aa.) Would like to play a MMO but focused on my kids development and being a husband/dad. So to simulate the experience visit MMORPG to simulate the Barrens Chat experience.
"There is only one thing of which I am certain, and that's nothing is certain."
My take on MMOs and kids is restrict their play. Sorry kids. 2 hours a day is more than enough. I'm concerned about the formative years, socializing, girls, reading books, playing ball, etc. Some kids stay in MMOs most of their waking hours. Moderation in all things.
Bingo! As a father of a 1.5 year old, his study/homework desk will be next to my home office. We'll play together in the future, but he will not be playing for more than an hour or two a day. That if and only if he finished his homework and got some exercise in (basketball, soccer, etc).
I want him to enjoy his time playing video games, but that's all dependent on how well he does in school. No good grades, no games.
Comments
Hey man, what about us females? I game as much or more then most males out there, considering... its all I do currently with no job. Now while I'm not planning on having children, I've got an anger streak that just wouldn't be fair to throw a kid in the middle of, I think its only fair to include the mothers in this equasion!
I can sure as hell tell you that if I had a kid, I'd still game.
It all depends. If you start kids out with them, they know how to manage it. If it's limited too much, as soon as you give them freedom, they'll take advantage of it in fear it'll be gone soon enough.
Well, it depends on how you do it. If you treat it like contraband then sure.
but all the interesting kids who are engaged, have mulitpble interestes, are polite with a great sense of self and who seem to be on a good track have limited TV and Video Game time.
I've met couch potato kids and quite franky they don't impress me.
But part of it too is how the family is and what the expectations are.
if you are in a family that doesn't do much and the children don't have a lot that is offered them then they are going to be slugs. If they are surrounded by successful and engaged people (whether one is a lawyer, Doctor, Physisist or Carpenter, Steamfitter) then that will rub off on them.
but sometimes discipline needs to be taught. Not everyone takes to it. Heck, i remember a teen from high school who was essentially a F*ck up. Didn't amount to anything. No one expected anything from him and he has no expectations. Finall he was at the end of his rope as he really had nowhere to turn to. So what did he do? He went into the army.
Came back more serious, with goals and a plan to make his life better. he also had a work ethic. Took pride in what he did.
Now, I'm not saying that Video games or TV is completely bad. but it can lead to bad habits and it's those habits that need to be addressed.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
While I agree to you on most points, i am not sure that the direction is correct. That is, you last statement indicates the same as what my parents said about TV and it may appear they were wrong. Why is it that you feel kids should wait for mmorpg's?
TV is passive. MMOs are interactive. You can get a kid to stop watching T V easily enough, but kids (and adults) often have a hard time logging out of MMOs.
Parenting is one of the hardest things to do, and the thing with the greatest repercussions. There's no way to predict which kids are and which kids aren't going to get addicted to video games. There are things you can no doubt do to help make your kids turn out OK, but the truth is a lot of it is a crapshoot. MMOs add a whole new level of variables that are often largely outside a parents control and purview (the folks you meet in-game and what they impart upon your children).
When kids are young they're learning lessons that will effect the rest of their lives. They're learning a work ethic, values, priorities, etc. MMOs can (and frequently will) reinforce other lessons because it is another "world" of sorts. Unless the game's primary focus is on education and rewarding a good work ethic, there's nothing beneficial a child could get from an MMO. Children could be outside breathing fresh air and getting vital exercise. I'd rather the kid be outside digging holes in the ground than inside playing WoW or EVE or something.
As long as my kid gets acceptable grades in school, participates in a sport, and does their chores they can play as long as they'd like.
I've been playing MMOs for about 4-5 years, starting at 11 or 12 years old and I'm not messed up. I'd like to think I'm pretty balanced even though my parents may think otherwise.
I do all of the things I mentioned and even though my parents don't really like the fact that I game, they humor me for the most part.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Guys! I'm hopelessly lost in a mountain of mole hills! Them damn moles!
While I agree to you on most points, i am not sure that the direction is correct. That is, you last statement indicates the same as what my parents said about TV and it may appear they were wrong. Why is it that you feel kids should wait for mmorpg's?
Well, I know a few families and whenver their kids started watching more TV than not, their grades went down and they really didn't do much else. So then the parents stepped in and BLAMMO! Grades went up, the kids started partaking in other activities and started becoming more interesting and engaging people.
So I'm all for llimiting games and TV for children.
Seen that also, got to ask, what age is appropriate for MMORPG's and/or TV watching per desire?
As far as TV no age limit they just have to be doing well in school and have other interests. I know that I watch very little TV but that has more to do with the fact that I have a lot of interests and a fairly busy social life. Not to mention that when I do have free time I normally do a bit of gaming over TV.
Since mmo's can be very time consuming I would say that around 14 to 16 without supervision. maybe even 13 but it depends. Part of being a kid is learning how to be an adult and learning that not all adults that are out there on the internet are good. In my family, when I was 14, my mother came into my room and said "It's time to get a job".
I hated the idea but did it and learned what having financial freedom was like. I learned to save and learned that if I wanted somethign that I had to plan for it. So at that time I had school activities, practicing, and free time with friends. Keep in mind, the Internet wasn't around for families in the form that we are familiar with today. You didn't chat online or go to facebook or any number of things. You went over your friend's house, did a bit of Atari maybe and played football.
I think today's parent is very challenged as some of the influences that kids have today didn't really exist or exist in the form/quantities that they have today.
And in the end, I don't believe (and this is my personal taste) that sitting in front of a screen all day is good for the body or mind.
One needs to excercise their mind and body. And believe me, you really learn the value of this as you get older.
That same family I was talking about? The son plays a bit of LOTRO. When he was younger he had supervision. Now he has some guidlines as he is older and quickly becoming a man. But because he has scholastic expectations and it is expected that he do something that is physically active he does more than sit in front of the screen playing games. He is also an avid reader and that helps tremendously.
I think part of it is knowing your kids, knowing their proclivities and also wanting to give them the tools to become successful adults. Whatever that is.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
"Getting good grades" is a very low bar to set, by the way.
Some kids could be very talented and can "get by" very easily with no effort, falling far short of their potential and learning that being lazy is OK. Adding MMOs and their addictive nature and the lessons they learn into the mix is a recipe for disaster.
That was said in a colloquial sense. You are of course right, one could get Straight A's and be a lazy kid. I would be happy to expand upon that and say "fullfilling their potential".
It's funny you mention that. I've known two pianists who were great. Rearlly great. They didn't really have to put much effort into what they did and barely had to practice.
After the fact both of them acknowledged that though they do fine with their lessons they both would be failures because they never put in the real work to take them to the next level.
It's an interesting problem to have.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
That was said in a colloquial sense. You are of course right, one could get Straight A's and be a lazy kid. I would be happy to expand upon that and say "fullfilling their potential".
It's funny you mention that. I've known two pianists who were great. Rearlly great. They didn't really have to put much effort into what they did and barely had to practice.
After the fact both of them acknowledged that though they do fine with their lessons they both would be failures because they never put in the real work to take them to the next level.
It's an interesting problem to have.
It reinforces some very negative lessons.
I had a very easy time getting good grades in elementary school, whereas a friend had to study hard. He was a C+/B student, I was an A student. In the end, he learned to work very hard and eventually, in college, he was an A student while I graduated a C+/B student who never bothered to study.
He wound up with the job offers, I worked for a bit over minimum wage with a useless college degree. He makes sh*t-loads more than I do now.
My knowledge that I'm actually "smarter" than he is and have so much more potential is scant consolation to me as I try to claw my way to where I could have been had I learned that hard work pays off.
That was said in a colloquial sense. You are of course right, one could get Straight A's and be a lazy kid. I would be happy to expand upon that and say "fullfilling their potential".
It's funny you mention that. I've known two pianists who were great. Rearlly great. They didn't really have to put much effort into what they did and barely had to practice.
After the fact both of them acknowledged that though they do fine with their lessons they both would be failures because they never put in the real work to take them to the next level.
It's an interesting problem to have.
It reinforces some very negative lessons.
I had a very easy time getting good grades in elementary school, whereas a friend had to study hard. He was a C+/B student, I was an A student. In the end, he learned to work very hard and eventually, in college, he was an A student while I graduated a C+/B student who never bothered to study.
He wound up with the job offers, I worked for a bit over minimum wage with a useless college degree. He makes sh*t-loads more than I do now.
My knowledge that I'm actually "smarter" than he is and have so much more potential is scant consolation to me as I try to claw my way to where I could have been had I learned that hard work pays off.
You are correct, parents need to teach their children the value of hard work.
I got that as young as 6. Really.
My parents divorced by the time I was 7. They started the proceedings when I was 6.
My grandfather was an old school laborer/carpenter and we would be given actual chores and actual work projects. by the time I was in 5th grade we would be called over and we would be put to work.
After he mowed his lawn he would give my brother and I clippers, he would get down on the ground and point to areas where my brother and I would then proceed to try to find these areas and even out the tufts of grass that he missed.
then he would take the lawn mower into the garage, put it up on the horses and teach us how to break it down and clean it. He would oil parts, use brushes to clean parts and then sharpen the blade if it needed it.
this would be on a Saturday morning when most kids were out playing or watching cartoons.
So yes getting good grades is not enough. But it's a whole package. That's what parenthood is about. It's about teaching children how to be successful people. Whatever one believes that to be.
That's why it's extremely hard for me to see the "I'm bored" or the "I don't have anything better to do, am bored so I'm just playing this until X comes out" posts.
Because when I was young the mantra was "you are bored? You find something to do or I will give you something to do".
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Well my kiddo's two years old now...
The kind of MMO dad I am...
aa.) Would like to play a MMO but focused on my kids development and being a husband/dad. So to simulate the experience visit MMORPG to simulate the Barrens Chat experience.
"There is only one thing of which I am certain, and that's nothing is certain."
Bingo! As a father of a 1.5 year old, his study/homework desk will be next to my home office. We'll play together in the future, but he will not be playing for more than an hour or two a day. That if and only if he finished his homework and got some exercise in (basketball, soccer, etc).
I want him to enjoy his time playing video games, but that's all dependent on how well he does in school. No good grades, no games.