- 11,000,000 subs X 13.50 (Rough estimate not everyone pays 15 a month) = $148,500,000 a month
- $148,500,000 / 30 = $4,950,000.00 a day
Um I would say that is pretty damn successful. I know you are not saying that is not but compared to the game you mentioned well you can't compare. Those are the numbers speaking since you brought it up. Maybe my calculations are not exactly just rough estimations but you get the point.
So lets use your numbers:
- 50,000 subs x 10 = $500,000
- 500000/30 = $16,666.67
While I do not call it a total loss well might as well give it up, probably not even worth keeping can we say f2p soon if not totally cutting the game?
well i havent been on here in a long time but this one actualy got me inturested enuff to figure out my password again and log in, well that and i caught it before all the trolls realy started digging their teeth into the thread but i digress.
now if were talking finanancialy, (which when people use the word success for a company they usualy are) then i would say a player base of 250k-300k is successfull because that generaly gives a decent enough profit and you also cannot forget the fact that many players have multiple accounts in most games which means some people are more than one subscription.
now if were talking my personal tastes here are my criteria:
1. good story
2. game mechanics
3.good player base
4. polite community
ok now 4.polite community isnt realy a must its important but i mean its the interwebz it aint gonna happen at least not perfectly
one and two if you dont have one two doesnt even matter (i can deal with an O.K. story) but if 2. isnt up to par then they have pretty much lost me
3. realy depends on the type of mmo with guild wars i could care less i barely have to interact with people for the story and game mechanics to be inturesting
a little list of games i think are good even if i dont always like or want to play em
1. EVE
2.C.O.X.
3. Aion (it had great potential they just blew it big time)
4. W.O.W. (dont go all crazy on me about this it held my attention for a good six months to a year of active playing, now it bores me to tears)
5. am prolly missing one or two things but my post is already long enuf, if you dont like my grammer :P
Success is largely financial and customer based in NA; its a life lesson and applies to everything. I'd think for mmorpg games, below 300,000 subscribers post one-year out and sustained is a mediocer success. 300,001-600,000 is successful. 600,001 + is very successful, etc.
Where'd you get those numbers from, you seem to use them as if they are the 'standard', are you the know-it-all MMO business analyst? Most companies don't openly communicate subscriber numbers, Blizzard uses it as a selling point. Others that did it, horribly failed afterwards, WAR comes to mind ...
Succes theoretically means that the company is making enough money to keep in viable and obviously player opinions on succes can vary but usually boil down to 'how much fun' he or she has.
You can continue to be a wise-ass and know-it-all, but it doesn't prove me wrong. Also the game I took as an example dates from a different time of MMO's, DAoC's peak was before WoW. I agree that nowadays the bars for a succesful MMO are higher than ever before, simply because MMO's aren't niche any longer, and different business models are being explored.
@Mariouz, I have no idea what the daily operational costs for a MMO are... fact is DAoC is still going with a p2p model :P
The way I judge success is this: Are people playing it?
Not how many subscribers. How many players.
If there are only 30 thousand subscribers who play dedicatedly versus 60 million subscribers who play for a while, get bored, take a break, then come back later.
WoW is a success financially, but it's not as old as, say, Acheron's Call or DAoC, which still boast dedicated players 14 years after launch. THAT is success.
Success is the acheivment of a goal. It's a yes or no. It isn't 'juged' or measured by consumers. Consumers just decide if they like or dislike something. If a product developer's goal was to reach a certain amount of sales, or achieve a certain return on investment, then after reaching that goal, the project is considered a success.
Any mmo that is still running is a success. Do people think these game companies run mmos that are losing money? No way. First sign of trouble triggers promotions, if promotions don't work and numbers go red, product is either terminated, or business model is changed. If new business model still produces red figures, product is discontinued.
@Mariouz, I have no idea what the daily operational costs for a MMO are... fact is DAoC is still going with a p2p model :P
I am just screwing with you and if you did not gess it Mathizsias I was being sarcastic, I know it was not well done but that is all it was.
But WoW is successfull regardless of how we see it. I enjoyed the game for a long time but at this point it is all repeated so much it is like they can not come up with something new. I have lost all interest in the game.
And as far as DAOC I am glad that the game even though is old is still going strong. It goes to show that you do not have to be WoW successfull to be successfull. Number of subs does not mean that you are bad, hell you can have 10 guys and if the devs can support that then it is successfull.
1. It's challenging : I can't just mash buttons and win.
2. It has to have a large enough player base so that it is possible to find a group at odd hours.
3. It has to be fun. Mostly this entails fulfilling #1 and #2.
4. The graphics aren't drawn for a 5 year old. Thats subjective I know .. but if there are 2 distinct groups it is the 5-12 year olds and those that like graphics for 5 - 12 year olds .. and everyone else.
5. Im 13! ............. I wish.
LFD tools are great for cramming people into content, but quality > quantity. I am, usually on the sandbox .. more "hardcore" side of things, but I also do just want to have fun. So lighten up already
I don't care about the population, servers and stuff like that.
We need a MMORPG Cataclysm asap, finish the dark age of MMORPGS now!
"Everything you're bitching about is wrong. People don't have the time to invest in corpse runs, impossible zones, or long winded quests. Sometimes, they just want to pop on and play." "Then maybe MMORPGs aren't for you."
everybody is taking the "personal entertainment" approach in this topic, I'll go down the business road...
finantially speaking, success comes when your product meets your expectations or even surpass them.
quickly recouping the initial investment and then getting a steady profit (positive [income - running costs] balance) monthly for as long as the game runs, without needing to reduce costs (shutting down half your servers, laying off staff, reducing marketing) and while expanding your company.
under that light, I'd put LotR on the "successful" bag, I'd make a honourable mention of AoC for its 180 turn and getting close to be finally successful, and will use WAR as a textbook example of dismal failure and finantial catastrophe...
Comments
Ok so I am wrong... lets look at the numbers:
- 11,000,000 subs X 13.50 (Rough estimate not everyone pays 15 a month) = $148,500,000 a month
- $148,500,000 / 30 = $4,950,000.00 a day
Um I would say that is pretty damn successful. I know you are not saying that is not but compared to the game you mentioned well you can't compare. Those are the numbers speaking since you brought it up. Maybe my calculations are not exactly just rough estimations but you get the point.
So lets use your numbers:
- 50,000 subs x 10 = $500,000
- 500000/30 = $16,666.67
While I do not call it a total loss well might as well give it up, probably not even worth keeping can we say f2p soon if not totally cutting the game?
well i havent been on here in a long time but this one actualy got me inturested enuff to figure out my password again and log in, well that and i caught it before all the trolls realy started digging their teeth into the thread but i digress.
now if were talking finanancialy, (which when people use the word success for a company they usualy are) then i would say a player base of 250k-300k is successfull because that generaly gives a decent enough profit and you also cannot forget the fact that many players have multiple accounts in most games which means some people are more than one subscription.
now if were talking my personal tastes here are my criteria:
1. good story
2. game mechanics
3.good player base
4. polite community
ok now 4.polite community isnt realy a must its important but i mean its the interwebz it aint gonna happen at least not perfectly
one and two if you dont have one two doesnt even matter (i can deal with an O.K. story) but if 2. isnt up to par then they have pretty much lost me
3. realy depends on the type of mmo with guild wars i could care less i barely have to interact with people for the story and game mechanics to be inturesting
a little list of games i think are good even if i dont always like or want to play em
1. EVE
2.C.O.X.
3. Aion (it had great potential they just blew it big time)
4. W.O.W. (dont go all crazy on me about this it held my attention for a good six months to a year of active playing, now it bores me to tears)
5. am prolly missing one or two things but my post is already long enuf, if you dont like my grammer :P
Where'd you get those numbers from, you seem to use them as if they are the 'standard', are you the know-it-all MMO business analyst? Most companies don't openly communicate subscriber numbers, Blizzard uses it as a selling point. Others that did it, horribly failed afterwards, WAR comes to mind ...
Succes theoretically means that the company is making enough money to keep in viable and obviously player opinions on succes can vary but usually boil down to 'how much fun' he or she has.
You can continue to be a wise-ass and know-it-all, but it doesn't prove me wrong. Also the game I took as an example dates from a different time of MMO's, DAoC's peak was before WoW. I agree that nowadays the bars for a succesful MMO are higher than ever before, simply because MMO's aren't niche any longer, and different business models are being explored.
@Mariouz, I have no idea what the daily operational costs for a MMO are... fact is DAoC is still going with a p2p model :P
The way I judge success is this: Are people playing it?
Not how many subscribers. How many players.
If there are only 30 thousand subscribers who play dedicatedly versus 60 million subscribers who play for a while, get bored, take a break, then come back later.
WoW is a success financially, but it's not as old as, say, Acheron's Call or DAoC, which still boast dedicated players 14 years after launch. THAT is success.
Success is the acheivment of a goal. It's a yes or no. It isn't 'juged' or measured by consumers. Consumers just decide if they like or dislike something. If a product developer's goal was to reach a certain amount of sales, or achieve a certain return on investment, then after reaching that goal, the project is considered a success.
Any mmo that is still running is a success. Do people think these game companies run mmos that are losing money? No way. First sign of trouble triggers promotions, if promotions don't work and numbers go red, product is either terminated, or business model is changed. If new business model still produces red figures, product is discontinued.
I am just screwing with you and if you did not gess it Mathizsias I was being sarcastic, I know it was not well done but that is all it was.
But WoW is successfull regardless of how we see it. I enjoyed the game for a long time but at this point it is all repeated so much it is like they can not come up with something new. I have lost all interest in the game.
And as far as DAOC I am glad that the game even though is old is still going strong. It goes to show that you do not have to be WoW successfull to be successfull. Number of subs does not mean that you are bad, hell you can have 10 guys and if the devs can support that then it is successfull.
1. It's challenging : I can't just mash buttons and win.
2. It has to have a large enough player base so that it is possible to find a group at odd hours.
3. It has to be fun. Mostly this entails fulfilling #1 and #2.
4. The graphics aren't drawn for a 5 year old. Thats subjective I know .. but if there are 2 distinct groups it is the 5-12 year olds and those that like graphics for 5 - 12 year olds .. and everyone else.
5. Im 13! ............. I wish.
LFD tools are great for cramming people into content, but quality > quantity.
I am, usually on the sandbox .. more "hardcore" side of things, but I also do just want to have fun. So lighten up already
As to whether it is a success with me, my criteria are:
1. Did it hold my attention for 6 months or more?
2. Was I entertained?
3. Was the world and its story interesting and immersive?
4. Did I meet fun and interesting people?
5. Did I experience new things?
6. Was it memorable enough that I will look back on the experience fondly?
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
Is it
challenging
hard to master
risk vs reward
deep
fun for me
?
I don't care about the population, servers and stuff like that.
We need a MMORPG Cataclysm asap, finish the dark age of MMORPGS now!
"Everything you're bitching about is wrong. People don't have the time to invest in corpse runs, impossible zones, or long winded quests. Sometimes, they just want to pop on and play."
"Then maybe MMORPGs aren't for you."
sucess: i login for 5-8 hours per day
everybody is taking the "personal entertainment" approach in this topic, I'll go down the business road...
finantially speaking, success comes when your product meets your expectations or even surpass them.
quickly recouping the initial investment and then getting a steady profit (positive [income - running costs] balance) monthly for as long as the game runs, without needing to reduce costs (shutting down half your servers, laying off staff, reducing marketing) and while expanding your company.
under that light, I'd put LotR on the "successful" bag, I'd make a honourable mention of AoC for its 180 turn and getting close to be finally successful, and will use WAR as a textbook example of dismal failure and finantial catastrophe...