there is more to a good, fun character than raw DPS.
In the back of your head you know this isn't true, but it's so hard to admit it because that would undermine this whole "soul system".
Every single game based on the holy trinity makes min / max builds. There is no reason to assume Rift is any different.
The funny thing of all this is that Rift will end up with LESS diverity instead of more class diversity. Because you will have 4 classes that will be min / max and that's it.
Lets take two different souls, shaman and druid. If we examine raw dps output shaman is better than druid. Shaman also gives a 5% damage debuff on his target. Thing is, besides the damage and some resistances, shaman doesn't have that many tricks. Druid on the other hand has less damage output himself, but has a pet that gives 15% buff to all melee in the raid. It also has utility that make him a better choice overall when it comes to PvP tricks.
So for straight soloing, a shaman will be a better choice
For soloing in a PvP environment a bit more druid in the above shaman build is recommended.
For group content either shaman or druid will be fine. Druid will be slightly better if the team is mostly melee, shaman if not.
For raid content druid is a better choice, if said druid can keep his pet alive.
For PvP, mostly druid with a bit of shaman or justicar will fair better than straight shaman dps.
Not a straight answer really, depends on what you're trying to tackle and what compromises you're willing to take. DPS is useless if you can't keep yourself alive in PvP. Noone has reached the cap either, so we're still theorycrafting on what's better or not. I think we'll inevitably reach some FOTM builds for each class, but that's to be expected. The more free the system, the easier it is to create FOTM builds. In skill based systems it's not undeard of for people to run around with just one build. In restricted systems FOTM builds are tailor build by the designers.
Are you arguing about less freedom so the developers are the ones dictating the FOTM builds? (and change it once a while so you chase the carrot?)
Well if so many people seemingly made the same type of post then maybe there is something to it no?
Yes, and that "something" just may be that far too many MMORPG players have an overdeveloped sense of entitlement that makes them think that they should have a say on what kind of game a company who put in the sweat, the tears, and the venture capital, should make.
Don't like Rift? Cool, no one says you have to. Don't like that Trion decided to make a style of game they felt would make them money? Tough shit. It isn't your money or time or talent being used to create it so you don't get to choose. Want an innovative sandbox and not another themepark game? Great! So would I, too bad all the ones that have been attempted so far * have ended in financial disaster.
How about instead of continuing to waste tons of your (and our ) time writing ( or repeatedly commenting on) posts about a game you are never going to like, you guys put your energy into supporting the small companies that are trying to do something different. Or pool your resources and see if you can't get enough people to make your own game where you call the shots.
*with the exception of games such as Eve or Second Life.
"Gypsies, tramps, and thieves, we were called by the Admin of the site . . . "
This is a very original post. I applaud you on your creativity and uniqueness of view. On the other hand, it's a shame you didn't enjoy the game. I hope you're able to find one more to your liking.
Hehe, This
As it only takes maybe 5 mins to see 20-30 posted of the exact same type here. Yet people feel compelled to post the exact same thing again and again instead of just reading and agreeing with say the current 20-30 posts of the same type. If most
Games these days are WoW-clones then most ops are simply WoW-clone posts. (ie the same post about the same dynamic again and again and again.)
Everyone will have a min / max build 2 weeks after release. Not to mention the fact that many souls have exact copies of abilities.
You think there's 100 ways to do DPS? I have news for you, there's not. There's 1 right way and 99 wrong ways.
Have fun seeing your class get nerfed every week because the developers need to retune 300 combinations. Hey!..it already happened in beta.
Did you ever stop to think that there just may be players out there whos reason d'etre isn't to see their name at the top of a pointless DPS chart? I was around when the first stand up arcade games came out, and while it was a hoot to see your initials at the top of the High Score list, it was by no means the reason we played the damn things so often, we played them because they were fun. MMOs are no different.
And as to your silly "One Build To Rule Them All" theory, Rift is the first game I've played where my toon can be just as competent at killing enemies in melee, at range, and still be able to heal myself and sometimes others in the bargin. And this is without having to change to a new role and on warrior, mage, cleric, or rogue. Sorry but I feel your idea that everyone will only worry about how much DPS they do and not how flexible their build is, especially when so far when versatillity has been the contributing factor for survival, is about the same as your ability to see into the future, a load of horse elbows.
"Gypsies, tramps, and thieves, we were called by the Admin of the site . . . "
Played the last beta for 15 hours. Soul system is quite neat, yes. Graphics are decent. Character models are good, with lacklustre character customization. UI is a copy of WoW (which is okay, why fix what isn't broke and all that, I get it) Questing is nothing special and nothing new. I don't understand the gross hype. This game is the very definition of a WoW clone with a new coat of paint, yet people claim it as a "WoW killer" The lack of originality is SO dissappointing! Why can't developers use a little creativity and brainpower and get away from "raid all day for gear" end-game and offer something more unique, offer something more compelling in general?
Yeah it's a clone with practically zero originality - but it's NEW. That's what is attractiing people more than anything I wager. The RIFTs already get old after a good few times doing them, so after that all you have left is the same ol same ol
"gimmicks like rifts" are all thats left until some MAJOR strides in technology are made. at present there is no innovation left in the MMO genre.. its all been done. All we can look for and hope for are the games that do it better than the others. Rift Does that.
"gimmicks like rifts" are all thats left until some MAJOR strides in technology are made. at present there is no innovation left in the MMO genre.. its all been done. All we can look for and hope for are the games that do it better than the others. Rift Does that.
What does RIFT do better than the others?
Marketing.
It is stock product, good quality but nothing setting it apart, aside of... marketing.
If Allods got half the money instead of being dumped on the F2P pile it would be much better than this. Chinese and Korean studios could match it too at similar budget. But not the marketing.
There is a stickied thread here for these kinds of comparison discussions. Please use it. We are trying to cut down on thread redundancy as to allow discussion of the game itself.
Comments
Lets take two different souls, shaman and druid. If we examine raw dps output shaman is better than druid. Shaman also gives a 5% damage debuff on his target. Thing is, besides the damage and some resistances, shaman doesn't have that many tricks. Druid on the other hand has less damage output himself, but has a pet that gives 15% buff to all melee in the raid. It also has utility that make him a better choice overall when it comes to PvP tricks.
So for straight soloing, a shaman will be a better choice
For soloing in a PvP environment a bit more druid in the above shaman build is recommended.
For group content either shaman or druid will be fine. Druid will be slightly better if the team is mostly melee, shaman if not.
For raid content druid is a better choice, if said druid can keep his pet alive.
For PvP, mostly druid with a bit of shaman or justicar will fair better than straight shaman dps.
Not a straight answer really, depends on what you're trying to tackle and what compromises you're willing to take. DPS is useless if you can't keep yourself alive in PvP. Noone has reached the cap either, so we're still theorycrafting on what's better or not. I think we'll inevitably reach some FOTM builds for each class, but that's to be expected. The more free the system, the easier it is to create FOTM builds. In skill based systems it's not undeard of for people to run around with just one build. In restricted systems FOTM builds are tailor build by the designers.
Are you arguing about less freedom so the developers are the ones dictating the FOTM builds? (and change it once a while so you chase the carrot?)
Yes, and that "something" just may be that far too many MMORPG players have an overdeveloped sense of entitlement that makes them think that they should have a say on what kind of game a company who put in the sweat, the tears, and the venture capital, should make.
Don't like Rift? Cool, no one says you have to. Don't like that Trion decided to make a style of game they felt would make them money? Tough shit. It isn't your money or time or talent being used to create it so you don't get to choose. Want an innovative sandbox and not another themepark game? Great! So would I, too bad all the ones that have been attempted so far * have ended in financial disaster.
How about instead of continuing to waste tons of your (and our ) time writing ( or repeatedly commenting on) posts about a game you are never going to like, you guys put your energy into supporting the small companies that are trying to do something different. Or pool your resources and see if you can't get enough people to make your own game where you call the shots.
*with the exception of games such as Eve or Second Life.
"Gypsies, tramps, and thieves, we were called by the Admin of the site . . . "
Hehe, This
As it only takes maybe 5 mins to see 20-30 posted of the exact same type here. Yet people feel compelled to post the exact same thing again and again instead of just reading and agreeing with say the current 20-30 posts of the same type. If most
Games these days are WoW-clones then most ops are simply WoW-clone posts. (ie the same post about the same dynamic again and again and again.)
Did you ever stop to think that there just may be players out there whos reason d'etre isn't to see their name at the top of a pointless DPS chart? I was around when the first stand up arcade games came out, and while it was a hoot to see your initials at the top of the High Score list, it was by no means the reason we played the damn things so often, we played them because they were fun. MMOs are no different.
And as to your silly "One Build To Rule Them All" theory, Rift is the first game I've played where my toon can be just as competent at killing enemies in melee, at range, and still be able to heal myself and sometimes others in the bargin. And this is without having to change to a new role and on warrior, mage, cleric, or rogue. Sorry but I feel your idea that everyone will only worry about how much DPS they do and not how flexible their build is, especially when so far when versatillity has been the contributing factor for survival, is about the same as your ability to see into the future, a load of horse elbows.
"Gypsies, tramps, and thieves, we were called by the Admin of the site . . . "
Yeah it's a clone with practically zero originality - but it's NEW. That's what is attractiing people more than anything I wager. The RIFTs already get old after a good few times doing them, so after that all you have left is the same ol same ol
What does RIFT do better than the others?
Marketing.
It is stock product, good quality but nothing setting it apart, aside of... marketing.
If Allods got half the money instead of being dumped on the F2P pile it would be much better than this. Chinese and Korean studios could match it too at similar budget. But not the marketing.
There is a stickied thread here for these kinds of comparison discussions. Please use it. We are trying to cut down on thread redundancy as to allow discussion of the game itself.
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/306250/READ-The-Rift-World-of-WarcraftWarhammerEtc-Comparison-Thread.html - Continue or repost there if you'd like.
To give feedback on moderation, contact mikeb@mmorpg.com