"Hey bob, way to go posting that internal discussion about whether or not to continue x product or discontinue it and convince our customers to move to the new y product. Since we haven't made a decision yet I really appreciated you putting this out there without any context so that our customers could worry needlessly. You show some really get up and go attitude!"
"Thanks Ted. I'm also going to start posting some of our future pipeline so that our competitors can see what we have planned"
"wow Bob, you have some real cajones. I'm so glad you are my coworker".
*boss sticks his head in*
"just overheard you guys talking! Good work on leaking that information Bob. I think you'll find something extra in your next paycheck! Keep up the good work!"
sometimes I wonder if some of mmorpg's posters have ever worked a day in their life or actually ever been a part of a company.
You're my hero.
In any case, I admittedly haven't played EVE in a long time(Though I was thinking about picking it up again.), but I can't help but feel this has been blown so far out of proportion that it seems worse than it truly is. When things become like this I notice it tends to become difficult to tell what's spot on and what's exaggerated to the point of no return.
I guess we'll see eventually, unless we decide not to look.
I think what some people are missing here, even those who think they know what they are complaining about, is that this isn't about the fact that there is an item on a cash shop in Eve that is priced at $60 - $80. That item has no meaningful impact on your gaming experience and it does not detract from or - if you buy it - enhance your abilities or skills in anyway. It's purely vanity. No, what is really wrong here is the principle of the thing.
Firstly I have to make a quick point before I forget: In Zulu's blog post he implies that the Monocle (the item that is causing so much madness) is a grade of item comparable to $1000 jeans. He suggests that its appeal is based around its perceived exclusivety and that - much like a $1000 pair of jeans - only a minority should have access to it. It should be a status symbol more so than a "go to" item for new players. That's all well and good, but someone should tell the item description what's going on:
Looking Glass Ocular Implant: "A common implant found throughout New Eden, the Looking Glass ocular implant offers vision enhancement or replacement beyond the capabilities of low-profile prosthetics. Filters, lenses, NeoCom interface, and blackbox video recorders are all standard issue with this implant."
That's merely a bit-point. I just wanted to point out how silly it is to say one thing in a blog post, and imply something totally different in an item description. Anyhoo, let's put CCP's mad lack of professionalism aside.
I don't think anyone is actually arguing against the Noble Exchange, and the only reason some have gone to that extreme is due to the piss poor way in which its "Grand Opening" has been handled. Currently there are a handful of items on there ranging in price from around $20 to around $80, but the actual number of each particular item "type" is significantly smaller than it should be. Returninig to the Monocle example for a moment, there is currently 1 ocular implant available and it is valued by CCP at around $80 a pop. Is the problem in the value, or is the problem in the lack of scaling on that particular item? If CCP had implemented 5 distinct ocular implants, some simple in design and cheap in price and others complex in design and more expensive, would the "shitstorm" be so vigorous? I personally don't think so. If I could log on now and buy a simple looking ocular implant for my character for £5-£10 worth of PLEX (or 1000 - 2000 AURAN) I would not be here and I would not empathise with the rather vocal complaints that are being made. There would be still be a minority who would complain - there always is: You can please some of the people all of the time, or all of the people some of the time but you can't please all of the people all of the time - but I think the vast majority would be happy with that arrangement. So I think the first point that should be taken away from this is that the number of options for each particular type of item on the Noble Exchange, and a scaling of pricing from cheap to expensive, is distinctly lacking and is DIRELY needed. After all, some people don't have the money to spend on $1000 jeans, so they go out and buy the $30 jeans instead.
The second point of course is the way in which CCP handeled the complaints that were being made. Let's make it clear to start with: this isn't a "vocal minority vs silent majority" issues here. This is a large number of players protesting in numerous ways. Thousands upon thousands of pilots flocked to major systems such as Jita over the last couple of days and the numbers aren't showing any signs of diminishing right now. Over 2000 accounts have been cancelled DIRECTLY related to the current issues players are having with CCP. CCP handeled the aftermath of the Noble Exchange poorly from a customer service stand point. They managed to tick all of the boxes under the "don't do" criteria of PR management with a single blog post, and instead of doing what any good company does in situations like this - a listening exercise - CCP spent their efforts painting an "us vs them" scene where they were the noble guardians and we were the undead onslaught. Regardless of the outcome of anything else here, THAT is a perfectly legitimate thing to get up yourself about.
And lastly in my mind is the internal memo/newsletter that discussed the idea of none-vanity items on the Noble Exchange. Whilst there was no expressed intent to follow this path the idea has been discussed and the tone of the newsletter made it clear that it has been, or is being, seriously considered. As has been pointed out CCP once said they would NEVER put a cash shop in Eve... so they did. Now CCP is saying they will NEVER place none-vanity items on the Noble Exchange. Track record dictates that it is best to doubt their words because they are liars, or at the very least they have no idea what they may or may not do in the future. That's why God invented such pre-fixes as, "At this time..." and "In the near future", so that you may say things like, "At this time we have no intention of..." and "In the near future we do not intend to..." Englsh is a beautifully poetic language at times; use it well and you can say anything and do the opposite, never having to worry about being called on your comments.
In the end however someone others have the right idea: CCP will fight and fight and then magically drop the prices. Everyone will feel a victory has been had, and CCP will get to charge what they REALLY want to charge. It's a common business tactic these days.
Whether they're appreciated by -anybody- or not usually depends on the results of what they do, I believe.
Actually that was exactly my point. But you must be blind to think a cash shop like the one they are puting in place is fitting into Eve Online, i might be wrong, i'm not a god on earth, but i strongly believe i'm not mistaken when i say this. Greediness doesn't fit well in any situation, sometime it does, sometime it doesn't. If they want to be greedy why don't they make a pay to win mmo, its not like it is hard to do, why make such a fuzz with Eve that is at the oposite of this kind of stuff. It make no sense, the people behind those decision are not smart, period.
Whether they're appreciated by -anybody- or not usually depends on the results of what they do, I believe.
Actually that was exactly my point. But you must be blind to think a cash shop like the one they are puting in place is fitting into Eve Online, i might be wrong, i'm not a god on earth, but i strongly believe i'm not mistaken when i say this. Greediness doesn't fit well in any situation, sometime it does, sometime it doesn't. If they want to be greedy why don't they make a pay to win mmo, its not like it is hard to do, why make such a fuzz with Eve that is at the oposite of this kind of stuff. It make no sense, the people behind those decision are not smart, period.
Oh no, don't get me wrong, cash shops in general are a major annoyance to me, especially when they're so out-of-place. I'm just saying I don't agree with the information being leaked like that. When people leak something, they also open the way for chaos and disorder to come about. (Over-dramatic, I know.) While the intentions are fine, I believe in the end it's more trouble than it's worth. But sometimes companies thrive on things like that, as well.
But as they say, that's business.
Forgot to add, they're being incredibly bold, but at the same time they're pushing their luck.
Some people are seriously gullible. There are a lot of people out there today who hold grudges against CCP and anyone with a bandwidth. Proof in point, all the hack attacks. If you don't think for a second that some of what was "leaked" wasn't editted to make it look worse than it is, then you need a reality check. That stuff is cut and paste if I ever saw it. Get a grip
Some people are seriously gullible. There are a lot of people out there today who hold grudges against CCP and anyone with a bandwidth. Proof in point, all the hack attacks. If you don't think for a second that some of what was "leaked" wasn't editted to make it look worse than it is, then you need a reality check. That stuff is cut and paste if I ever saw it. Get a grip
It wouldn't be the first time, for sure.
Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if the whole thing was done for pubilicity of some kind. Of course, that's pushing it a bit, but with all the stuff happening of late (Even outside of EVE) it's not that far off of a shot.
In the end it will either hurt them, or help them.
I has absolutely NOTHING to do with the monicle or the price of bling for your space barbie, it has to do with two things CCP's track record over time in dealing with their customers and their stated future plans for MT.
Let me quote you some things:
"One other service we’re looking at is selling faction standings."
"Not all virtual purchases will focus on customization: some will simply be new items, ammunition, ships, etc. that can be purchased outright. The devil, as always, is in the details."
Players arent stupid, they know what they pay for and if they are unhappy with the product they are buying each month they will walk away from it. There are lots of players in my alliance cancelling accounts, as are many others that I have talked to about this subject.
The internal email from Hilmar has been confirmed by CCP Navigator "Private communication between the Game Masters, Eve Team members, moderators and administrators of the forum and the forum users is not to be made public on these forums or by any other venue. You are not permitted to publicize any private correspondence (including petitions) received from any of the aforementioned."
Look into RMT store and how alot of alliances are using it to gain a monetary advantage over other alliances, Eve online is a game that is full of meta-gaming and to say that a fleet of players wouldnt be using any advantage they can over an adversary your are sadly mistaken. It has become almost common place for DDoS attacks to start before major invasions on another alliances Vent/Teamspeak servers, forums, etc... I am not sure what type of pvp you engage in but eve online has become a fleet organized pvp event, solo pvp doesnt exsist any longer, and your survival rate is much higher when its blob against blob.
Please do some research before guessing and spreading false information, the fact that you havent played for a while shows that you are out of touch and just read through some basic 'coverage' of what is really at the core of what is going on with CCP and their customers.
The CEO is SO far removed in thinking from the majority of the real player base, it's not funny.
There will be your newcomers and bears that don;t see a problem, but many, many people do.
I see you are a pot calling a kettle black... If you think that this is not a very carefully reserached/calculated/balanced move you need to take acourse or two on how to run a company...
As i said before... They have no choice... It is trying to get more cahs from some place or finally dip under the red line... And i hardly think there are enough "loyal vets" to fron the bill... Would you rather like them to tuck another 5 bucks on your monthly fee.. and that would only be a temporary solution.
I must have missed that course in business mangement on how to alienate your customer base and and not provide them with a service they would be happy with paying.
CCP has not had a decrease in subscriptions, they have increased their players base and accounts every single year, if they have the threat of going in the red then it is a failure on their part by not being able to project their profits/loss for funding projects like Dust 514.
First and foremost I apologize for not reading all the post, but as far as I've read and understand, they are going to implement cosmetic items in their item/cash shop.
You guys/girls overreacting over some vanity items that have no game breaking effects, just some cosmetics that will make you look "cool". The item shop is optional, it's not like you are forced to buy those items even if they were/are overpriced.
You dramatize even more than those CNN/BBC and other big news television reporters. There is no reason why to quit because they'll add some cosmetic items to the shop.
However, if it's more than just cosmetic shop I believe it's alright to cancel your subscription to the game, but if they are adding only cosmetic, I find that silly because the item/cash shop is completely optional to use.
Well, you should read all of it It's not just cosmetic items people are pissed about, it's the statements that they may consider selling other things like ships and faction standings that have many people upset, and rightfully so. I am not one of those to act so rashly, I'd like to see how this plays out regardless. However, if and when I do see a Scorpion batlleship on sale for $7.99, I am out.
whoever leaked the internal memo should be fired. they caused harm to the company they agreed to work for.
They were staying true to the people who pay their wages, namely us the paying customers who play their game.
um sure!
So which one of the players actually cuts that check?
I don't recall ever working for a company that didn't have a non-disclosure agreement in place when I was hired. Whoever leaked this should be fired.
We don't know if this leak isn't part of a plan. Float a little something out there, see how people react. Weather the storm. A "Leak" could get the player base to make excuses for the company and help them in their plan.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
Originally posted by Angervien Dot, I has absolutely NOTHING to do with the monicle or the price of bling for your space barbie, it has to do with two things CCP's track record over time in dealing with their customers and their stated future plans for MT. Let me quote you some things: "One other service were looking at is selling faction standings." "Not all virtual purchases will focus on customization: some will simply be new items, ammunition, ships, etc. that can be purchased outright. The devil, as always, is in the details." Players arent stupid, they know what they pay for and if they are unhappy with the product they are buying each month they will walk away from it. There are lots of players in my alliance cancelling accounts, as are many others that I have talked to about this subject.
Bla bla bla bla bla bla bla...
People cancelling subscriptions on assumptions based on internal dialogue are foolish people indeed. CCP have stated NO intent to implement faction rep purchases, item purchases of a game changing nature or any other such purchases so far. In fact the only statement of intent from CCP has said, "the internal news letter was about ideas and NOT about what we ARE going to do with the Noble Exchange," (not a direct quote, but a paraphrase of CCPs retort to concerns; perhaps it is you that needs to do the research?). To save you having to go and do your own reading, I'll quote the actual blog post:
Its worth mentioning that the topic of the issue was "Greed is good?" as a way to ask a question that would then be debated back and forth and often exaggerated purposefully to draw contrasts and make points. The result of that is now widely available on the internet.
The opinions and views expressed in Fearless are just that; opinions and views. They are not CCP policy nor are they a reliable source of CCP views as a company. The employees who submitted articles to that newsletter did exactly what they were asked to do, write about theories and opinions from an exaggerated stand.
And I entirely agree with the sentiment Gylfason is trying to get across to what is largely a group of blithering, slack jawed idiots pawing ineffectually at their keyboards whilst not actually understanding a word being said to them about the newsletter. When you work for a company and you are implementing a new service you would be foolish not to discuss ALL options for that service, even the negative options and the options you aren't intending to implement; there's a reason that newsletter was an internal newsletter. I'm not saying that they AREN'T going to implement such things, or that you shouldn't express displeasure at the idea, but outright punishing them for a crime they have not committed yet is a ridiculous attitude to take; the attitude you and your fellow alliance members, as well as a handful of other people, are taking.
You've heard of presumption of innocence, yes? Better men than you fought for hundreds of years to get presumption of innocence made law so that people are judged fairly based on what they have done, not what they might have done or possibly might do in the future. That principle well and truly applies here. How would you like it if you were accused of murdering your sister, and then sent to prison on the basis that you sent an email to your Mum saying you were going to kill her? Rather inflated comparison there, but I fear you wouldn't get it if I were any more subtle. Circumstantial evidence is NOT valid evidence, ESPECIALLY when it makes no statement of intent of any kind.
You and your friends have come to a fundamentally flawed assumption, and you're now expressing anger over that fundamentally flawed assumption. Should CCP be held accountable for YOUR mistake in this instance? No.
As I said originally this is about a principle and should have NOTHING to do with an internal newsletter that makes no statement of intent on CCPs part.
Please do some research before guessing and spreading false information
Look into RMT store and how alot of alliances are using it to gain a monetary advantage over other alliances, Eve online is a game that is full of meta-gaming and to say that a fleet of players wouldnt be using any advantage they can over an adversary your are sadly mistaken. It has become almost common place for DDoS attacks to start before major invasions on another alliances Vent/Teamspeak servers, forums, etc... I am not sure what type of pvp you engage in but eve online has become a fleet organized pvp event, solo pvp doesnt exsist any longer, and your survival rate is much higher when its blob against blob.
Please do some research before guessing and spreading false information, the fact that you havent played for a while shows that you are out of touch and just read through some basic 'coverage' of what is really at the core of what is going on with CCP and their customers.
I might be far of the mark, time will tell.
As for fleet vs fleet i have not taken part in em but all those i have watchd ships pops left and right. If your in a mighty alliance where you can field a fleet and have minimal loss time after time i guess you have earnd it but that is far from common for everyone, someone will loose in every fight.
You have big fleets and small scale fleet fights all over, solo pvp might not be the norm but it happens quite often outside of 0.0
RMT have minimal impact on eve, isk is quite easy to come by and even more so for big alliance that you talk about. Lazy alliance that realy hate gathering isk i can see useing rmt but they hardly get an advantage over those that will farm for em.
DDoS made me laugh, eve is a bit more hardcore then ur avarage game.
As for CCP and theyr customers is futile to discuss as those usaly are about a small % of the playerbase and rarely reflect the complete playerbase.
Eve might be a special case here but to be honest i won't waste my time with it.
If CCP is so corrupt etc... just stop playing eve-online and look for a different game..
Many people are already doing that. But, they will continue to discuss the changes for a long time to come. So, better to get used to it now.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
Look into RMT store and how alot of alliances are using it to gain a monetary advantage over other alliances, Eve online is a game that is full of meta-gaming and to say that a fleet of players wouldnt be using any advantage they can over an adversary your are sadly mistaken.
*snip*
Interesting. In other games, players will try to one up each other by buying the best weapons/gems/etc in the cash shop. In Eve, however, it will be alliance vs alliance...huge.
Remember the chick who stayed up three days straight to make sure her alliance could practice their tournament setups? She missed work and had to go to the hospital I think. Can you imagine what people would do if all it took to help their alliance win is to open their wallet?
Wow, I think this is the gold mine CCP is looking at...everytime there is a war, their sales will spike. I have to admit it would be hard to resist.
I would like to point out eve is NOT having finacal troubles, DUST and WOD needs more funding the ccp is trying to milk eve for it. Which is a very shitty buisness choice as they put eve on the back burner for these games. It's not our faults CCP does shity buiness management and bit more then they can chew. They also have investors for those games who want results soon. Hence their insto push on eve for more cash. They as a company screwed up and probally will go bankrupt, because they didnt think things through throughly, just as fe and several other games did. Eve's content got put in the back burner and the vision of eve so they can try other games. Considering eve is their only source of income, id say stupid move. So yea we the players will say no to their MT system and we will continue this and thousands unsubed already and thousands more will also, You piss off your customers (paycheck) You lose you buisness. Plain and simple listen to the customers when their angry as they can change this around and fix it, however they best bite the bullet for WOD and DUST and closem down and use to eve to slowly repay debts back and refocus on eve content, THey make 4.5 mill+ a month from us and it got to their heads. Dumb Dumb ceo descions ^^
What CCP should've done is focus on ONE new game, not two, so that liberates financial pressure from EVE and they don't feel as obliged to "milk" it. You can't blame a gaming company for wanting to make new games. That's like blaming Intel for making new processors. But a small gaming company like CCP should really focus more on single projects and not stretch it. They should go for quality, not quantity and make themselves a name on the broader, more mainstream gaming industry.
What made Bioware and Blizzard famous and rich was not that they made many games early on, but that the few games they made had quality. Later on, when they become bigger companies, they can go for multiple projects at a time.
So instead with dealing with community concerns CCP is now trying to shame the community into shutting up? Not cool CCP, not cool at all.
I remember the CSM fiasco, where CCP essentially started ignoring the CSM wholesale, and it makes me think that if the EVE players and fans didn't stay on CCP's back and essentially force them to stay honest EVE would be the shittiest game ever at the moment.
Look into RMT store and how alot of alliances are using it to gain a monetary advantage over other alliances, Eve online is a game that is full of meta-gaming and to say that a fleet of players wouldnt be using any advantage they can over an adversary your are sadly mistaken.
*snip*
Interesting. In other games, players will try to one up each other by buying the best weapons/gems/etc in the cash shop. In Eve, however, it will be alliance vs alliance...huge.
Remember the chick who stayed up three days straight to make sure her alliance could practice their tournament setups? She missed work and had to go to the hospital I think. Can you imagine what people would do if all it took to help their alliance win is to open their wallet?
Wow, I think this is the gold mine CCP is looking at...everytime there is a war, their sales will spike. I have to admit it would be hard to resist.
I support this!!!!
Down with the middle man (crafters). CCP spawn my stuff now!!!!!!
No more having to put up with some d-bags crippling my alliances production. Come siege me now boyz!!
I have a fat wallet and I am ready to pay.
I know people love CCP. The way they refer to players in those articles is some what disturbing. It has a small niche market. Those players they refer to helped build Eve to what it is. Yet the protesters are being called sheep. They're trying to insure that crafters and the meta game stays intact. What happens to the meta game when the only resource that matters is my wallet against your wallet.
Not too long ago RMT was never going to make it into game.
Now they are talking about adding it to buy faction, ships, and who knows what else...
You want vanity items to stay in. I doubt there would be nearly as many upset if that's all it was.
Looking at history and then seeing this leeked article..... It looks as if there's a hell of a lot more on the table or already in the works than vanity items. Sad day when this was brought into the spotlight. The sadder part is a big portion of the populace accepts it. Just as the letter says they would.. Sad day indeed....
Also fuck every EVE player that boughrt a shitty, overpriced, fake, virtual monocle. You're helping sink EVE by shitting all over the game. The least you could have done was curb your purchasing impulses until CCP became much more reasonable about the whole thing.
Comments
You're my hero.
In any case, I admittedly haven't played EVE in a long time(Though I was thinking about picking it up again.), but I can't help but feel this has been blown so far out of proportion that it seems worse than it truly is. When things become like this I notice it tends to become difficult to tell what's spot on and what's exaggerated to the point of no return.
I guess we'll see eventually, unless we decide not to look.
I think what some people are missing here, even those who think they know what they are complaining about, is that this isn't about the fact that there is an item on a cash shop in Eve that is priced at $60 - $80. That item has no meaningful impact on your gaming experience and it does not detract from or - if you buy it - enhance your abilities or skills in anyway. It's purely vanity. No, what is really wrong here is the principle of the thing.
Firstly I have to make a quick point before I forget: In Zulu's blog post he implies that the Monocle (the item that is causing so much madness) is a grade of item comparable to $1000 jeans. He suggests that its appeal is based around its perceived exclusivety and that - much like a $1000 pair of jeans - only a minority should have access to it. It should be a status symbol more so than a "go to" item for new players. That's all well and good, but someone should tell the item description what's going on:
Looking Glass Ocular Implant: "A common implant found throughout New Eden, the Looking Glass ocular implant offers vision enhancement or replacement beyond the capabilities of low-profile prosthetics. Filters, lenses, NeoCom interface, and blackbox video recorders are all standard issue with this implant."
That's merely a bit-point. I just wanted to point out how silly it is to say one thing in a blog post, and imply something totally different in an item description. Anyhoo, let's put CCP's mad lack of professionalism aside.
I don't think anyone is actually arguing against the Noble Exchange, and the only reason some have gone to that extreme is due to the piss poor way in which its "Grand Opening" has been handled. Currently there are a handful of items on there ranging in price from around $20 to around $80, but the actual number of each particular item "type" is significantly smaller than it should be. Returninig to the Monocle example for a moment, there is currently 1 ocular implant available and it is valued by CCP at around $80 a pop. Is the problem in the value, or is the problem in the lack of scaling on that particular item? If CCP had implemented 5 distinct ocular implants, some simple in design and cheap in price and others complex in design and more expensive, would the "shitstorm" be so vigorous? I personally don't think so. If I could log on now and buy a simple looking ocular implant for my character for £5-£10 worth of PLEX (or 1000 - 2000 AURAN) I would not be here and I would not empathise with the rather vocal complaints that are being made. There would be still be a minority who would complain - there always is: You can please some of the people all of the time, or all of the people some of the time but you can't please all of the people all of the time - but I think the vast majority would be happy with that arrangement. So I think the first point that should be taken away from this is that the number of options for each particular type of item on the Noble Exchange, and a scaling of pricing from cheap to expensive, is distinctly lacking and is DIRELY needed. After all, some people don't have the money to spend on $1000 jeans, so they go out and buy the $30 jeans instead.
The second point of course is the way in which CCP handeled the complaints that were being made. Let's make it clear to start with: this isn't a "vocal minority vs silent majority" issues here. This is a large number of players protesting in numerous ways. Thousands upon thousands of pilots flocked to major systems such as Jita over the last couple of days and the numbers aren't showing any signs of diminishing right now. Over 2000 accounts have been cancelled DIRECTLY related to the current issues players are having with CCP. CCP handeled the aftermath of the Noble Exchange poorly from a customer service stand point. They managed to tick all of the boxes under the "don't do" criteria of PR management with a single blog post, and instead of doing what any good company does in situations like this - a listening exercise - CCP spent their efforts painting an "us vs them" scene where they were the noble guardians and we were the undead onslaught. Regardless of the outcome of anything else here, THAT is a perfectly legitimate thing to get up yourself about.
And lastly in my mind is the internal memo/newsletter that discussed the idea of none-vanity items on the Noble Exchange. Whilst there was no expressed intent to follow this path the idea has been discussed and the tone of the newsletter made it clear that it has been, or is being, seriously considered. As has been pointed out CCP once said they would NEVER put a cash shop in Eve... so they did. Now CCP is saying they will NEVER place none-vanity items on the Noble Exchange. Track record dictates that it is best to doubt their words because they are liars, or at the very least they have no idea what they may or may not do in the future. That's why God invented such pre-fixes as, "At this time..." and "In the near future", so that you may say things like, "At this time we have no intention of..." and "In the near future we do not intend to..." Englsh is a beautifully poetic language at times; use it well and you can say anything and do the opposite, never having to worry about being called on your comments.
In the end however someone others have the right idea: CCP will fight and fight and then magically drop the prices. Everyone will feel a victory has been had, and CCP will get to charge what they REALLY want to charge. It's a common business tactic these days.
Actually that was exactly my point. But you must be blind to think a cash shop like the one they are puting in place is fitting into Eve Online, i might be wrong, i'm not a god on earth, but i strongly believe i'm not mistaken when i say this. Greediness doesn't fit well in any situation, sometime it does, sometime it doesn't. If they want to be greedy why don't they make a pay to win mmo, its not like it is hard to do, why make such a fuzz with Eve that is at the oposite of this kind of stuff. It make no sense, the people behind those decision are not smart, period.
Oh no, don't get me wrong, cash shops in general are a major annoyance to me, especially when they're so out-of-place. I'm just saying I don't agree with the information being leaked like that. When people leak something, they also open the way for chaos and disorder to come about. (Over-dramatic, I know.) While the intentions are fine, I believe in the end it's more trouble than it's worth. But sometimes companies thrive on things like that, as well.
But as they say, that's business.
Forgot to add, they're being incredibly bold, but at the same time they're pushing their luck.
Some people are seriously gullible. There are a lot of people out there today who hold grudges against CCP and anyone with a bandwidth. Proof in point, all the hack attacks. If you don't think for a second that some of what was "leaked" wasn't editted to make it look worse than it is, then you need a reality check. That stuff is cut and paste if I ever saw it. Get a grip
It wouldn't be the first time, for sure.
Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if the whole thing was done for pubilicity of some kind. Of course, that's pushing it a bit, but with all the stuff happening of late (Even outside of EVE) it's not that far off of a shot.
In the end it will either hurt them, or help them.
CCP just pushed the self destruct button.
The CEO is SO far removed in thinking from the majority of the real player base, it's not funny.
There will be your newcomers and bears that don;t see a problem, but many, many people do.
-----
Pay-to-Win / F2P will be the death of real gaming, Boycott it !!
Dot,
I has absolutely NOTHING to do with the monicle or the price of bling for your space barbie, it has to do with two things CCP's track record over time in dealing with their customers and their stated future plans for MT.
Let me quote you some things:
"One other service we’re looking at is selling faction standings."
"Not all virtual purchases will focus on customization: some will simply be new items, ammunition, ships, etc. that can be purchased outright. The devil, as always, is in the details."
Players arent stupid, they know what they pay for and if they are unhappy with the product they are buying each month they will walk away from it. There are lots of players in my alliance cancelling accounts, as are many others that I have talked to about this subject.
The internal email from Hilmar has been confirmed by CCP Navigator "Private communication between the Game Masters, Eve Team members, moderators and administrators of the forum and the forum users is not to be made public on these forums or by any other venue. You are not permitted to publicize any private correspondence (including petitions) received from any of the aforementioned."
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1537710
Rav,
Look into RMT store and how alot of alliances are using it to gain a monetary advantage over other alliances, Eve online is a game that is full of meta-gaming and to say that a fleet of players wouldnt be using any advantage they can over an adversary your are sadly mistaken. It has become almost common place for DDoS attacks to start before major invasions on another alliances Vent/Teamspeak servers, forums, etc... I am not sure what type of pvp you engage in but eve online has become a fleet organized pvp event, solo pvp doesnt exsist any longer, and your survival rate is much higher when its blob against blob.
Please do some research before guessing and spreading false information, the fact that you havent played for a while shows that you are out of touch and just read through some basic 'coverage' of what is really at the core of what is going on with CCP and their customers.
I see you are a pot calling a kettle black... If you think that this is not a very carefully reserached/calculated/balanced move you need to take acourse or two on how to run a company...
As i said before... They have no choice... It is trying to get more cahs from some place or finally dip under the red line... And i hardly think there are enough "loyal vets" to fron the bill... Would you rather like them to tuck another 5 bucks on your monthly fee.. and that would only be a temporary solution.
This have been a good conversation
I must have missed that course in business mangement on how to alienate your customer base and and not provide them with a service they would be happy with paying.
CCP has not had a decrease in subscriptions, they have increased their players base and accounts every single year, if they have the threat of going in the red then it is a failure on their part by not being able to project their profits/loss for funding projects like Dust 514.
Well, you should read all of it
It's not just cosmetic items people are pissed about, it's the statements that they may consider selling other things like ships and faction standings that have many people upset, and rightfully so. I am not one of those to act so rashly, I'd like to see how this plays out regardless. However, if and when I do see a Scorpion batlleship on sale for $7.99, I am out.
We don't know if this leak isn't part of a plan. Float a little something out there, see how people react. Weather the storm. A "Leak" could get the player base to make excuses for the company and help them in their plan.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
If CCP is so corrupt etc... just stop playing eve-online and look for a different game..
Alot of people are Dran.
People cancelling subscriptions on assumptions based on internal dialogue are foolish people indeed. CCP have stated NO intent to implement faction rep purchases, item purchases of a game changing nature or any other such purchases so far. In fact the only statement of intent from CCP has said, "the internal news letter was about ideas and NOT about what we ARE going to do with the Noble Exchange," (not a direct quote, but a paraphrase of CCPs retort to concerns; perhaps it is you that needs to do the research?). To save you having to go and do your own reading, I'll quote the actual blog post:
And I entirely agree with the sentiment Gylfason is trying to get across to what is largely a group of blithering, slack jawed idiots pawing ineffectually at their keyboards whilst not actually understanding a word being said to them about the newsletter. When you work for a company and you are implementing a new service you would be foolish not to discuss ALL options for that service, even the negative options and the options you aren't intending to implement; there's a reason that newsletter was an internal newsletter. I'm not saying that they AREN'T going to implement such things, or that you shouldn't express displeasure at the idea, but outright punishing them for a crime they have not committed yet is a ridiculous attitude to take; the attitude you and your fellow alliance members, as well as a handful of other people, are taking.
You've heard of presumption of innocence, yes? Better men than you fought for hundreds of years to get presumption of innocence made law so that people are judged fairly based on what they have done, not what they might have done or possibly might do in the future. That principle well and truly applies here. How would you like it if you were accused of murdering your sister, and then sent to prison on the basis that you sent an email to your Mum saying you were going to kill her? Rather inflated comparison there, but I fear you wouldn't get it if I were any more subtle. Circumstantial evidence is NOT valid evidence, ESPECIALLY when it makes no statement of intent of any kind.
You and your friends have come to a fundamentally flawed assumption, and you're now expressing anger over that fundamentally flawed assumption. Should CCP be held accountable for YOUR mistake in this instance? No.
As I said originally this is about a principle and should have NOTHING to do with an internal newsletter that makes no statement of intent on CCPs part.
I hope the irony is not lost on you.
I might be far of the mark, time will tell.
As for fleet vs fleet i have not taken part in em but all those i have watchd ships pops left and right. If your in a mighty alliance where you can field a fleet and have minimal loss time after time i guess you have earnd it but that is far from common for everyone, someone will loose in every fight.
You have big fleets and small scale fleet fights all over, solo pvp might not be the norm but it happens quite often outside of 0.0
RMT have minimal impact on eve, isk is quite easy to come by and even more so for big alliance that you talk about. Lazy alliance that realy hate gathering isk i can see useing rmt but they hardly get an advantage over those that will farm for em.
DDoS made me laugh, eve is a bit more hardcore then ur avarage game.
As for CCP and theyr customers is futile to discuss as those usaly are about a small % of the playerbase and rarely reflect the complete playerbase.
Eve might be a special case here but to be honest i won't waste my time with it.
Many people are already doing that. But, they will continue to discuss the changes for a long time to come. So, better to get used to it now.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
Interesting. In other games, players will try to one up each other by buying the best weapons/gems/etc in the cash shop. In Eve, however, it will be alliance vs alliance...huge.
Remember the chick who stayed up three days straight to make sure her alliance could practice their tournament setups? She missed work and had to go to the hospital I think. Can you imagine what people would do if all it took to help their alliance win is to open their wallet?
Wow, I think this is the gold mine CCP is looking at...everytime there is a war, their sales will spike. I have to admit it would be hard to resist.
I would like to point out eve is NOT having finacal troubles, DUST and WOD needs more funding the ccp is trying to milk eve for it. Which is a very shitty buisness choice as they put eve on the back burner for these games. It's not our faults CCP does shity buiness management and bit more then they can chew. They also have investors for those games who want results soon. Hence their insto push on eve for more cash. They as a company screwed up and probally will go bankrupt, because they didnt think things through throughly, just as fe and several other games did. Eve's content got put in the back burner and the vision of eve so they can try other games. Considering eve is their only source of income, id say stupid move. So yea we the players will say no to their MT system and we will continue this and thousands unsubed already and thousands more will also, You piss off your customers (paycheck) You lose you buisness. Plain and simple listen to the customers when their angry as they can change this around and fix it, however they best bite the bullet for WOD and DUST and closem down and use to eve to slowly repay debts back and refocus on eve content, THey make 4.5 mill+ a month from us and it got to their heads. Dumb Dumb ceo descions ^^
What CCP should've done is focus on ONE new game, not two, so that liberates financial pressure from EVE and they don't feel as obliged to "milk" it. You can't blame a gaming company for wanting to make new games. That's like blaming Intel for making new processors. But a small gaming company like CCP should really focus more on single projects and not stretch it. They should go for quality, not quantity and make themselves a name on the broader, more mainstream gaming industry.
What made Bioware and Blizzard famous and rich was not that they made many games early on, but that the few games they made had quality. Later on, when they become bigger companies, they can go for multiple projects at a time.
So instead with dealing with community concerns CCP is now trying to shame the community into shutting up? Not cool CCP, not cool at all.
I remember the CSM fiasco, where CCP essentially started ignoring the CSM wholesale, and it makes me think that if the EVE players and fans didn't stay on CCP's back and essentially force them to stay honest EVE would be the shittiest game ever at the moment.
I support this!!!!
Down with the middle man (crafters). CCP spawn my stuff now!!!!!!
No more having to put up with some d-bags crippling my alliances production. Come siege me now boyz!!
I have a fat wallet and I am ready to pay.
I know people love CCP. The way they refer to players in those articles is some what disturbing. It has a small niche market. Those players they refer to helped build Eve to what it is. Yet the protesters are being called sheep. They're trying to insure that crafters and the meta game stays intact. What happens to the meta game when the only resource that matters is my wallet against your wallet.
Not too long ago RMT was never going to make it into game.
Now they are talking about adding it to buy faction, ships, and who knows what else...
You want vanity items to stay in. I doubt there would be nearly as many upset if that's all it was.
Looking at history and then seeing this leeked article..... It looks as if there's a hell of a lot more on the table or already in the works than vanity items. Sad day when this was brought into the spotlight. The sadder part is a big portion of the populace accepts it. Just as the letter says they would.. Sad day indeed....
Also fuck every EVE player that boughrt a shitty, overpriced, fake, virtual monocle. You're helping sink EVE by shitting all over the game. The least you could have done was curb your purchasing impulses until CCP became much more reasonable about the whole thing.