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mmorpg? Really?
Odhelm
Member Posts: 40
Dont see how this game could enter this site when its an hardcore strategy game.. Or is fantasy enough to make it as an mmorpg game? And if so, why the heck isnt Heroes of Newerh or Bloodline Champions included here also!? Hell, lets bring starcraft 1 & 2, Age of Empire, WarCraft, C&C and Total War in here as well :P
Comments
LOL! (and I dont mean LoL) Is a cash shop the definition of a mmo? I dont think so..
Massive Multiplayer Online. Games should not be included just becouse that many players are actual playing the game.. they should also play it together.. all at once!
Guild wars is typically considered an MMORPG (even though the developers say it isn't), and the only thing that is typically MMO about that game is the fact that players can internact in a city together, every other source of content is completely instanced.
LoL has one of the largest player bases out there and is wildly successfuly, and has the persistent elements to give it that MMO-esque feel. It is most certainly a type of mmo, imo.
It isn't a typical one, but nowadays the definition of the genre is growing to include all sorts of games that didn't even exist ten years ago. Who would have ever thought about in-browser MMOs back in the day?
as far as i know the devs themselves never referred to it being an MMO but rather MOBA (multiplayer online battle arena).
It does have features typical in an MMO like levelling (out of game avatar and champion), gear (runes), masteries (talent points), different roles (tank, support, damage dealer etc) so i can see why it might be placed here.
honestly i agree with op:it can be considered hardcore,it can be considered strategy .it can even claim to be a hard core pvp game but a massive multiplayer game?no it is not!(even if it is very popular)it is still a dota younger new kids on the block!
No this game is not a mmorpg. I have no idea why it is on this site, and in the list of "other" mmorpgs.
If a game qualifies as a mmorpg by having instanced online battles by "small groups" of people from the big pool of playerbase with player characters that gains levels, the game list of this site should be a lot bigger because there's a lot of games like that, many shooters etc technically works just like that but the gameplay is only different.
The line you are drawing between large population shooters (CoD) and LoL isn't entirely forthright, as shooters at their gameplay core share almost nothing with the gameplay of a typical MMO, beyond being real time. There have been isometic, mouse movement MMOs before of the traditional sense. LoL is effectively a mini-rpg every match, and your runes and masteries and persistent profile all are equivelents of what you'd have on a toon in say WoW. It also has millions of players, millions, MILLIONS. Millions makes it massive, hence the massively multiplayer online role playing game.
Does the genre name dictate that those massive amounts of players have to be in the same instanced content at the same time to qualitfy as an MMO? If you take the cities out of guildwars, it is just instanced pvp and pve. LoL is a strictly PvP game, if you take just the PvP portions of most MMOs today (most are instanced, RvR and world PvP is pretty rare) what do you have other than instanced content with a set number of players, ranging from small arenas to somewhat larger battlefronts?
Of course I'm happy to contend what makes a genre a genre, but thats just me.
LOL.
Sad, but becoming truer and truer each and every day.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
i think its more like RTS so for RTSguru.com not for mmorpg.com
Just because this site wants to acknowledge it as an MMORPG does not make it one and I don't acknowledge it as an MMORPG. It is closer to a strategy game so why don't they put it on their RTS site instead? Also I've always enjoyed the argument that GW isn't an MMO either and as far as I'm concerned it's as borderline as you can get. LoL however is not an MMORPG.
I'll give you an example take a car and a motorcyle. They both have engines, they both use fuel, they both transport people from place to place, but they are not the same thing. They fail to meet the other defining attributes that are only specific to cars and motorcycles. Then look at those weird Can am things they aren't really a motorcyle but they aren't a car either but if I had to put them in one of the two categories I'd go with motorcyle because they have the most similarities. Kind of like how LoL is really more like an RTS then MMORPG.
I've never heard before that a game should have certain type of gameplay to qualify as a mmorpg, but I've heard constantly that most people take a game as mmorpg when it has a large number of people simultaneously in a game world that is large/massive, where they advance their char, do crafting etc, basically are in a "living" big world.
Modern Warfare has millions of players too where people join instanced scenarios in small groups, yes it's FPS even though gameplay does not define if it's a massive multiplayer online (roleplaying) game. Firefall is FPS too and it will be mmorpg since it has a large open world where a lot of people can set foot simultaneously and you gain levels, gear etc. I dont know why it should not be called a mmorpg for being a shooter.
"LoL is a strictly PvP game, if you take just the PvP portions of most MMOs today (most are instanced, RvR and world PvP is pretty rare) what do you have other than instanced content with a set number of players, ranging from small arenas to somewhat larger battlefronts?" If you take only pvp and only the instanced pvp, then it's not a mmorpg at all, you'll just get angry customers if you tell them they are buying a mmorpg and when they enter the game they find out there's only pvp and only in closed scenarios.
If I buy a mmorpg I expect it to have a big world to explore and a lot of other players in it too, as it has been so far, untill recently games like World of Tanks are being called mmorpgs, a game which is basically like scenario based FPS but with tanks.
What I dont understand is why games like these should be called mmorpgs? It's just misleading, what's the purpose? Why cant they be just called multiplayer-whatevergenretheyare so people dont get confused who just wants a new actual mmorpg. Basically it's not a big deal, I'm not mad or anything like that about it, I just see it as misleading and confusing, if it's just for marketing I doubt the benefits are that big to lie at people's face just to make them try the product.
Its obvious that mmorpg.com is trying to bend the definition of what an mmo is so that they can add an extremely popular game to their site and generate additional traffic. It's the only reason I could see why it would be added.
Insult for RTS genre right there.
Why is that? It's not like LoL isn't a good game. I don't think anyone here is claiming it's insulting to be classified as an MMORPG they are saying it's not very logical. LoL has always been described by me and friends as being like Warcraft but just with the heroes and no pawns.
Yesterday I sat down to play LoL to see what all the fuss is about.. and I didnt get it..! You grind and grind to take inches of mapcontroll. A close match should take hours to play.. just back and forth. Don't mean to be negative.. it wasnt a game for me. I much more prefer Bloodline Champions which takes the essence of LoL (Hero combat) to the table with out delay! Here is your heroes.. mash them in a arena = instant slaughter!
Ok, I really like to rpg aspect of LoL to build and develop your hero.. And the difference between heroes is way better than BC! I would love a mix of them both! ^^
Bloodline Champions is a very good game, but much prefer the map control of League of Legends and Heroes of Newerth. I enjoyed this same aspect in Warcraft III, having your Heroes level up and finding/buying gear for them, but I never did play DOTA. The trouble with Bloodline Champions is that the games are over in minutes, whereas in LoL/HoN they can last a good 20-50 minutes, with plenty of Heroes and abilities and items, there's always plenty to do in a match.
I can see why some games are marked as MMORPGs and covered as such because they provide a similar community, online interactivity, and ongoing service with content patches. You are right though, by that logic HoN and Bloodline Champions should be on here as well.
Me, personally though, I do not feel like those games are MMORPGs just in the same way I do not feel as though the original Guild Wars was an MMORPG.
To me an MMORPG is: A large world with atleast a few hundred to a few thousand players playing simultaniously together. You could argue that instances are still part of the world -- and that I should include "non instanced" as part of my statement, but that really only covers Guild Wars.
Typically in an MMO, a very healthy server can house around 2500-3500 players, but so much as have a couple hundred inside your zone and you'll get hit by lag, griefers or there's no spawns. So what happens in an MMO ? You grab a handful of players, ignore the rest of the 3000+ players and focus on that quest/dungeon/grind inside that instance which those 3000+ players cannot enter. Even in an MMO which doesn't use instances, players will still ignore everyone else around them as they try and complete an objective.
Saying LoL/HoN isn't an MMO because you can't play in the same world together is a silly thing to say as you've all no doubt played an MMO in such a way....
Ok someone has ot ask this, might as well be me....
Why in the name of all that is holy DOES THIS MATTER?!
Does it affect anything at all how it is classified by this site?
It matters because if I ask a friend to recommend a good MMO and they say LoL I might just end up kicking him in the nuts for such a stupid answer.
The term MMO has been used to refer to games that have very specific elements to them. For instance, a large persistant world. I don't see the point of changing the definition of MMO to mean "all online games" which is what adding LoL to the genre would do.
If you put it this way, then I guess every game out there with a online-function is an MMO? Even if its a racing, strategy, FPS or a DOTA.. it may have a large population and is played in smaller groups online. Is ALL this games an mmo? No! The definition is meant to be on a large population on single server, a living breathing world where anybody could meat anybody.. It doesnt matter if you quest with the same group of people every day.. you are still a part of the greater MMO-World.
What I'm saying is, MMO's don't feel like MMO's these days because they are too casual where the content is spoonfed to you in large quantities. PVP centric players get to the endgame as quickly as possible, then stand around in the main city using LFG tools to teleport into battlegrounds/dungeons teaming up with strangers or guild mates. This is exactly the same process with LoL/HoN/BC, rather than standing in a city, you're inside a hub where you can chat and read up on the news in these games, LoL/HoN/BC offers the best of what the endgame in MMORPG's offer, straight up PVP.
LoL/HoN/Bloodline Champions/World of Tanks aren't MMORPG's ofcourse, DotA spawning a new genre of MOBA games. But LoL/Wot specifically offer persistence with stats, levelling things up and unlocking new abilities. You go to bed at night and like an MMO, the game continues in your absence, it continually evolves with new patches and content, new players arrive to challenge your skills and clan mates, these were the qualities which only MMORPG's used to offer, but more and more online games with a competitive scene now offer all this, so ofcourse MOBA games are in a comfy position to be listed on MMORPG.com, and rightly so.
It matters because people that are uninformed come to sites like this for suggestions on getting a MMO or not.
Well this site is now very misleading since it includes non MMORPG as well.
LoL is clearly not a MMO. Guild Wars is not a MMO, its a graphical 3D lobby Diablo clone. So is DDO.
Also many games are now including the word "Online" in the title to appear to be a MMO. for example, Age of Empires Online, Dynasty Warrior: Online, Dungeon and Dragons Online, etc.
they are not MMO, yet they are listed here.
Very Misleading. this site even calls Neverwinter a MMO, when clearly its been stated already by development thats its not a MMO. Again very misleading for a site like this.
I remember when I first got Guild Wars. I could never get over the disapointment. I learn about it from a friend, and was doing some research on it from a site called MMOorc.com or something like that. was so long ago.
But they listed it as a Free to Play MMORPG. I believed them, because thats what it was listed as all over the net reviews. But when I picked it up and played it. I couldnt believe it. I was so disapointed. I went back to playing Runescape, because clearly I can see, Guild Wars wasnt a MMO. Its something else. If Anet removed the Online Requirement to play, I am sure you wouldnt notice a difference.
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
It's a popular game, so it's on this site.
Maybe they should rename mmorpg.com into mmorpgaoswalf.com (massive multiplayer online roleplaying games and other stuff with a large fanbase).
Let's play Fallen Earth (blind, 300 episodes)
Let's play Guild Wars 2 (blind, 45 episodes)
I agree with you, MOBA games shouldn't be on this site, but if they are going to be included the least they should do is include the other ones as well. Guess it pays to receive a little stipend from riot games.
True dat. Can't blame a man for trying to earn a dollar.
Man Of Constant Sorrow