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Why Firefall and Dust514 won't touch PS2...
tkoreaper
Member UncommonPosts: 412
Let me start by saying I am a 8 year vet of planetside. I have played it since it's inception and always find myself going back because nothing else can fill that void. Planetside, in a good way, ruined other FPS game for me. No other game has ever come close to touching what truly makes Planetside what it is. At it's core, it's a massive FPS skirmish for power. And, as if that wasn't enough, it offers the customizability of RPGs and the freedom to do what you want. (There's no quests here... or game-given missions)
I'd be a fool to disagree that PS had died over the years because it has. With the creation of BFRs, dual core hackers, and just hackers in general PS definitely had seen better days. In spite of all that, it still maintained a very strong following and SOE did everything they could to combat these issues. Some of them could not be helped from a development standpoint simply because the game was horribly coded and it was said that the person who worked on it, that left some time ago, left a giant cluster-fuck of code that was extremely hard to work with. But enough about Planetside's past... lets get to the future.
Games like Firefall and Dust514 (CCP's future PS3 game which I just heard about) simply do not offer what planetside does. NPC battles are a dead giveaway here. No one wants to play an FPS against NPCs... Where's the challenge in that? These games won't offer the awesome teamwork that is capable in PS. If you want to go kill big monsters and dumb AI NPCs then go right ahead... Just know full well that the big boys won't be playing it.
Words simply cannot explain the epicness that is Planetside... it is truly an experience that one must partake themselves to fully grasp. Even trying to explain everything the game has to offer... all the depth, gameplay, ect... takes quite a bit of time. I've known people who's minds were literally blown simply because I tried to explain the game... they couldn't comprehend it. I would just tell them to try it, which they did... and addicted they became.
I could go on and on to explain every single minor detail why PS is better, but I do not have the time. You'll just have to take my word for it. Everything from micromanaging your character with custom loadouts for a whole slew of different situations, to coordinating truly massive atacks with armor columns and air craft, to the very teamwork, skill, and comradery that the game inforces... nothing can touch that.
And if you haven't already...
Comments
Agreed, the game was really ahead of it's time. Maybe too far ahead for the market, but as far as NPC's and AI being included I disagree.
At it's core I think any game like PS should push people to want to play against other players not some NPC, however I also think that NPC's and PVE can be used to make PS or PS2 that much better of a game. I always hated when some stealther or solo player took an entire continent uncontested because everyone else was fighting on another continent. I wouldn't mind bases having some NPC defenses to at least slow this down or stop it that solo player all together. Make it so you need at least a full squad to take a base. This way you buy the defending faction some time to respond/defend and it's also not so boring for those that would rather skirmish then fight a huge battle.
I think it also would enhance the game and make the world feel more alive rather then having empty bases on any continent that didn't have active battles. Bottom line I don't think it hurts anything to add the NPC's as long as you make sure the best XP/rewards are only given to players that partake in PVP. Something like capturing 20 NPC defenced bases being the equivalent of taking 1 player defended base is a pretty good balance, scaling it higher for larger battles.
Same thing for killing NPC's I would make it count even less, so killing an NPC would be like 1 xp vs killing an average player would net you 100 xp.
I was a big fan of PS, I was always disappointed that they never really developed the game further other then Core Combat (crap) and BFR's (even bigger crap). So much they could have done with the game especially since they literally owned the MMOFPS market, hopefully SOE doesn't make the same mistake with PS2.
Dust 514 will fail because it's a PS3 only title, tied to a PC title that 99.9% of PS3 owners have never heard of. Making it just another in the glut of FPS's that are released every year on the console. It'll disappear from memories in a couple months, when the next COD or Battlefield hits RedBox, only to be found in bargain bins from then on.
Wow, you sure take fanboyism to a whole new level.
Why not keep an open mind and wait with the doom and gloom until you actually get to try the games?
If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe. - Carl Sagan
Firefall and PS2 are two different games entirely, not even sure why someone would think to compare them. Firefall is a Borderlands-type small team size COFPS title with optional small scale skirmish matches, and Planetside is all about territory control with massive battles. Not even close enough to one another to be mentioned in the same sentence, really.
Dust could be compared more to Planetside than Firefall, but then again Dust is just going to be Playstation vaporware.
Afaik Firefall was supposed to have territory control for resources too?
honestly SOE would have to seriously screw up the game to not do better than DUST... which even now has been pretty much ruled out as being of any consequence (even by Eve players who could care less about it as its not on the PC anyway..) and firefall just isnt in the same category anyway.. as long as PS2 avoids the pitfalls that SOE created in PS1 then it will be a good enough game to outshine any other FPS multiplayer game out there... just hope theres no BFR's this time.. that would be ... bad..
From what I've read/seen, the only territory control involves dropping mining machines onto the open world and defending it from NPC insects that try to swarm the thing. Though they've said there will be more types of open world events at launch, they are all PVE-only. The only actual PVP takes place in instanced, ranked matches.
Hm, didn't know that, I was honestly expecting large-scale open world PVP from that very first video they showed. I mean the carrier-ships were flying over large stretches of land I thought would have been for the territory-control.
Oh well, more reason to wait for PS2 then.
Then again, Firefall is f2p, so you can't expect much in the way of engaging gameplay. Kind of begs the question: how is Planetside 2 going to be screwed up by its f2p system?
I can tell you've never played Planetside in it's prime. I'm a fan, yes... But everything I said is true and I'm sure anyone who has played can back me up on it. I've watched those "other" games and they're missing so much stuff. Like I said... Planetside ruined FPS games for me... or opened my eyes rather.
Kind of short sighted, isn't it? Suggesting that all FPS titles should be nothing but large scale territory control?
What else would you suggest you have people do in a MMOFPS against other players? CTF? DM? KotH? Those are all incorporated into planetside already. CTF - LLU Runs. KotH - Waiting for a hack to go through. DM - Self explanatory. And it doesn't stop there, but before you bring up somethign about competitive play let me tell you that they did a tournament once before in PS1 and have mentioned that they would do some more in PS2.
The state that most FPSs are in they are time based or objective based... once it's over with all you have are scoreboards, there's nothing else to give that sense of achievement.
People call them MMOFPS when really they're not... 64 people max isn't MMO. So if they really want to consider themselves an MMO, then they better bring more of the MM.
You're more than welcome to have your doubt and opinions... But believe me when I say you don't know what you'll be missing if you choose not to try the game. And saying it's just "large scale territory control" would be a HUGE understatement.
tko, while I very well understand where your coming from, and I do agree that Planetside 2 is going to knock the socks off of many FPS games, I don't think you can really so quickly judge Firefall and Dust 514 just yet.
Lets start with Firefall. From what i've seen, this game is a MMOFPS with open world exploration, resource controlling and a form of PvP. While I know its not open world pvp, it still has an interesting element to bring to the table, and we currently have no idea where the game is going at the moment (Mostly due to the fact that not many people are in the game, and IMO the whole "get in the game through friends" is going to take forever).
And now Dust 514: This game, by far is probably the most complex and mind blowing FPS idea I have ever seen. The game directly connects with EVE online, letting corporations in EVE hire out mercenaries to take over different planets and structures for them on the planets, so that the corporations can sucessfully control the resources of the planets to fuel their wars/invenstments/etc. Honestly, I think its a great idea, and if Dust 514 were to come out on the PC, I think I would be playing that a whole lot.
So yeah, I agree with you, PS2 is definitley going to be awesome, however I don't think we can persay knock off the other two just yet.
I'm a tester for firefall, and thats all I can say, literally.
But personal opinion wise, I am quite convinced Red5 are listening to every voice they can, and are actively avoiding the pitfalls many mmo's have thus far plummeted into.
Dust514 jumped the shark at the instant they settled on a PS3 exclusive to tie into the most back stabbey espionage ridden franchise in modern history.
And PS2, while technically promising, is born of a corporation with a batting average in the single digits. I have positive hope, but not expectation.
Just stoked that 3 titles in a 'similar' niche all look awesome/add something new/fresh to the mix.
Enjoyed the link!
Firefall looks a bit like starship troopers killing bugs in mmo form, that's gotta be fun. Dust has an awesome complementary/community-linking concept and PS2 has tons of armoured vehicles ie dual/multi avatar manifestations (why is this not done more?). Awesome.
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
all i can say about Firefall without this post vanishing is that it's very good, and they are doing a great job working on the game. PS2 looks good and all, but the truth(or what should be accepted as truth by now) is that Sony will bungle it, somehow they will screw it up.
keep in mind that Dust and Firefall are trying a new approach.
PS2 is mostly just the same old thing that (financially) failed the FIRST time.
i assume by "touch" you're talking about financials.
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Planetside didn't financially fail, they made a bad move that they couldn't fully recover from among other things that I mentioned in my first post. The code for the game is a giant clusterfuck according to some reliable sources so it's no wonder that there wasn't a whole lot of development after the people who worked on it left.
I too have been a hater for Sony games, but it seems as though that they're realizing the error of their ways and hoping to do things differently this time around. I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt based apon their recent actions such as dropping all projects and solely working on EQ and PS. It shows that they know there's some serious potential to these titles and they're not going to fuck it up this time around. They cancelled the realease of their Agency game that was almost finished... If they weren't confident in what the future holds for PS and EQ then I doubt they would have made such a move.
I must also add that from what I've seen from their new forgelight engine, these games are going to be absolutely beautiful and are going to bring some new capabilities that other games in the mmo genre simply can't do.
Pretty much breaks down like this. If you like MMOFPS genre you will be playing one of these three games. If you primarily like PvE you will play Firefall. If you like open end World PVP! You will play planetside. If you cant afford a computer and already own a playstation, you will be playing dust 514.
That said. I love planetside and I count the days until this games release. I will most likely buy a new computer and cancel many dates with friends in the name of the New Conglomerate.
DUST514 is limited by being a pS3 only game. THAT takes it out fot he equation when it comes to competition for PS2. The console FPS market is ruled by Call of Duty and call of duty alone.
people really need to stop playing nostradamus and stop the predictions. It only makes yall feel a bit silly at the end of the day when things turn the other way around. When Rift first entered Beta, WoW was about to die. When Swtor started its campaign, the same thing happened, WoW was going to fall flat on its face. At the end of the day.... BANG!!! WoW killed 2 birds in one shot....
How do you guys know the future of PS2, DUST514, Firefall, etc? ... seriously, sharing ideas and opinions with the community is one thing very different than predicting the "unavoidable demise" of certain mmos by the hands of other mmo when none have even been released.
Just saying
I'm going to play Firefall and Dust514. PS2 isn't even on my radar. Not interested in it.
My theme song.
TKOReaper, love ya, me to, always, and loved PS.
I will say this however, I just learned AMS'es will still be in the game, but in a galexy, anyone go read my post here about the absolute sadness as this is what I remembered was great, and will never be again. Let alone Gal pilots not being able to drop their birds into people/tanks/watch failling, or join the fight, because now u have to park it as a super big AMS *sad face*
As for anyone talking about Firefall, I did not see if anyone corrected all the posts, but I just want to chime in. Red5 is super f***ing awsome, and OPEN WORLD PVP has been planned from day one. Watch some of their Q&A's and Dev feedback. Best beta experince of my life, they are so well organized and respond to the community as everyone votes things in. They go with their community, not against it. And the open world looks freakin amazing, not like anything i've ever seen. Go troll the forums and get a key, they are bumping in alot of new testers.
Sure I have been waiting for a freaking game you had to AIM and not faceroll keyboards, that does not follow an 8 year old gaming model, that is an MMO. I found this in Plantside, once my previous FPS/Close 3rd person Cyberpunk MMORPG Neocorn sadly fizzled due to understaffing, but was the best freaking mmo ever and well free now through a glitch, I have always wanted games like this for like 8 freaking years.
But all my eggs are in Firefall however, I will certainly wait to hear about this so sad AMS situation, and mini-sancturary, wtf is that anyways. Pfft, staging ftw, not.
PS. As for Dust, pfft, as a huge EVE Online fan I will not play ps3 mmo, I understand they are doing it so people do not fight between EVE Online, or DUST514, because you cant on seperate platforms, but man, that sucks for all of us.
and ya Rojo, ppl ruin games before they even have a chance. Dammit, and here I am doing it...anways
I want to play a fps against npc's and against people as well,Sorry that I am not a "big boy" like you are.I am actually playing one of the said games you decided to diss with your elitist "my game is going to be better than your game attitude" and I find it quite enjoyable.
Then why are you here? To talk about dust? Its gotta be on your radar a tad?
Anyways i would love to play dust and would prob sub/pay for it ,but i dont do consoles so.....(I used my ps2 like 5 times)
Firefall looks like a cartoon and im not big on that either.....Im sure it will do fine though some people like that style i just dont.
Planetside though seems like a great fit for me, and I dont really think they are that similar to worry about each other. Look how many mmorpgs are almost exactly the same. I really hope they all do well for more mmofps come to the market!
Own, Mine, Defend, Attack, 24/7