By the time I actually got to vanguard I thought it was a great game, sadly it released so badly absolutely no one was playing it or was willing to give it another chance. Count me as one that would love to play another Vanguard type game so long as the release wasn't the same.
So you are saying that when you started playing Vanguard their was no one playing the game except you,you were the only person logged into nthe game when you were playing?
I am going by your saying: absolutely no one was playing,that means that you were the only one.I know for a fact you are lying because i have been playing non stop since beta with my guild and other guilds that still play now.
Vanguard is a thinking mans MMO,it's the kind of MMO that you really need to think and take notice of whatb you are doing,death can come quickly.It's similar to EQ in many ways,not as unforgiving as EQ but it's way more unforgiving than games like WOW and RIFT aqnd just about any MMO out today.
Hard is the wrong word to be honest,i have never found a MMO hard.Some MMO have a harder learning curve which is what Vanguard has.Knowing your class and picking your fights carefully instead of wading in knowing if you die you lose nothing is what Vanguard makes you do.
Anyone logging into Vanguard for the very first time can feel ost and will be asking many questions and looking for advice.Most people haven't got a clue how Diplomacy works or can't figure out the crafting system without help.
I don't recall Vanguard being difficult at all? Unless you're talking about the horrid bugs? I don't consider an instance "difficult" if you randomly get aggro from stuff under the floor or from rooms on other side of the wall....
Vanguard as similar to any other MMO at release, with lack of interesting content and any real "goal" to work towards.
By the time I actually got to vanguard I thought it was a great game, sadly it released so badly absolutely no one was playing it or was willing to give it another chance. Count me as one that would love to play another Vanguard type game so long as the release wasn't the same.
So you are saying that when you started playing Vanguard their was no one playing the game except you,you were the only person logged into nthe game when you were playing?
I am going by your saying: absolutely no one was playing,that means that you were the only one.I know for a fact you are lying because i have been playing non stop since beta with my guild and other guilds that still play now.
Vanguard is a thinking mans MMO,it's the kind of MMO that you really need to think and take notice of whatb you are doing,death can come quickly.It's similar to EQ in many ways,not as unforgiving as EQ but it's way more unforgiving than games like WOW and RIFT aqnd just about any MMO out today.
Hard is the wrong word to be honest,i have never found a MMO hard.Some MMO have a harder learning curve which is what Vanguard has.Knowing your class and picking your fights carefully instead of wading in knowing if you die you lose nothing is what Vanguard makes you do.
Anyone logging into Vanguard for the very first time can feel ost and will be asking many questions and looking for advice.Most people haven't got a clue how Diplomacy works or can't figure out the crafting system without help.
Right, because that's what I meant!!! And I'm lying? What a tool you are. I played it, I thought it was a good game(something you obviously didn't understand or ignored in your desire to be butt hurt and offended) but the population, especially at the low levels, was abysmally small and i got tired of playing in a well crafted ghost town. If it didn't have population issues it wouldn't be the after thought it has become, so stop with this act you've got going.
Of the more modern MMOs, Vanguard is probably the hardest (with an actual death penalty!). It is getting more development time (there were 2 patches just last week, and one a week for the past few). BUT, it is going f2p (maybe t his summer), so I know that puts a lot of people off, though I think it wil bring in some new blood.
The game still requires a group to get a lot of the "fun" stuff, though one can solo 1-51 if one wanted.
Bit offtopic.
Man if its true that Vanguard is becoming F2P this summer I am one of the first returning to it that s for sure.
I played EQ for 8 years and if some people say here that Vanguard is an easy game they either didnt play enough or didnt get into the proper areas/zones.
Vanguard was the true EQ2, Ive beta'ed it and played it in different ocassions after launch. It is true that was not an enjoyable experience at first but right now its far better optimized that back then at launch. Graphics are great even for today's standards, plenty of quests, raiding content, really customizable, fair death penalty, both solo and grouping contents, and as many said here is a total shame that Sony didnt invest a bit more of time/effort on this one. For my taste, the only lacking thing is PvP since (correct me if im wrong) there is no PvP server anymore (damn was a blast at first, go with your grp to a dungeon, find another party camping there, and fight for the spot... exciting).
I just finished betatesting GW2 and honestly after seeing that is an absolutely plain standard game with no highlight whatsoever I am greately (again) dissappointed and wouldnt mind giving Vanguard another try.
What exactly is so hard about games like EQ and Vanguard? Not a single of the games on your list is hard to play.
EVE takes a lot of time to get into so I guess and there's tons of stuff to consider so that can be considered hard. But Vanguard? EQ? Really?
the quest mobs are harder, try playing swtor, wow, eq2 , rift-you can blow right through those mobs, you cannot blow throught the mobs on Vanguard it takes some thought and you will die quite a bit if you just try to spam your buttons
I hate 90% of all mmo's. Some I played around with for more than 30 days....But the bottom line is that I really liked three mmo's.
Vanilla WoW - for me it was hard because I had no one to ask questions. No one at work, no one in my social life. I had to figure out everything myself. I had to ask in chat where to go after level 10, I had figure out trainers for abilities and how to equip them. It was very hard because I had to stick with other players to learn. Players were teaching me stuff well into the 40's. Infact I was in my mid 20's when I found out about group dungeons. I got a /tell out of the blue to do ShadowFang Keep, then bammm I was in a group of 5 running to the entrance....They were the fun days.
D&D Online - Before F2P, I made a healer and found I was good at it. Groups loved me as I was passionate about it. I knew everyone on my server.
Vanguard - Was hard, but to survive you had to make friends...IT has a community because of it.
EvE - I guess is good, but not my style.
EQ2 - I guess it could be hard, but the game is a mess, it always has been, with its nasty coding, below adv. graphics and pasted together maps.
Something tells me GW2 will be easy mode too. It looks fun and all with it's WvWvW PvP, but it also has a Rift look and feel to it. Rift was a 30 day excitement for me.
Will we ever see an extremely hard mmo ever again, where you really really need a community ?...No Dungeon finder or dynamic events to do a quickie and leave without saying a word, and think that you grouped.
I need a down and dirty, nasty hard mmo !.... I need an mmo where I need a community to survive !.....Will we ever see what I'm looking for again ?
Just plain hard? no....mmos need to appeal to the masses. you can have mmos that have hard things in them, but thats it
No they really dont need to appeal to the cancer. We did just fine without them before, things have only gone downhill for the genre as witnessed in the plethora of multi million dollar WoW clone duds.
you need a reality check. mmo developers are in it to make money...why on earth should they develop a game that will only appeal to a few?
and we did fine? like how? where?
CCP seems to do fine making a game that appeals only to "a few"
the problem are these studios are trying to hit the 2 billion dollar powerball lottery. So they put down $50 million in ticket purchases and wonder why they are flat broke 4 years later.
No one wants to make something and maintain it for the long haul, everyone wants to make their product, score their millions instantly, and run away with their money.
I hate 90% of all mmo's. Some I played around with for more than 30 days....But the bottom line is that I really liked three mmo's.
Vanilla WoW - for me it was hard because I had no one to ask questions. No one at work, no one in my social life. I had to figure out everything myself. I had to ask in chat where to go after level 10, I had figure out trainers for abilities and how to equip them. It was very hard because I had to stick with other players to learn. Players were teaching me stuff well into the 40's. Infact I was in my mid 20's when I found out about group dungeons. I got a /tell out of the blue to do ShadowFang Keep, then bammm I was in a group of 5 running to the entrance....They were the fun days.
D&D Online - Before F2P, I made a healer and found I was good at it. Groups loved me as I was passionate about it. I knew everyone on my server.
Vanguard - Was hard, but to survive you had to make friends...IT has a community because of it.
EvE - I guess is good, but not my style.
EQ2 - I guess it could be hard, but the game is a mess, it always has been, with its nasty coding, below adv. graphics and pasted together maps.
Something tells me GW2 will be easy mode too. It looks fun and all with it's WvWvW PvP, but it also has a Rift look and feel to it. Rift was a 30 day excitement for me.
Will we ever see an extremely hard mmo ever again, where you really really need a community ?...No Dungeon finder or dynamic events to do a quickie and leave without saying a word, and think that you grouped.
I need a down and dirty, nasty hard mmo !.... I need an mmo where I need a community to survive !.....Will we ever see what I'm looking for again ?
Your asking for a hard MMO but you dismiss EVE
Dude EVE is the KING QUEEN AND POPE of hard mmo. It takes time dedication and a huge risk to your sanity because if you plan on doing any kind of non carebear(eve term for striclty pve content player) activity then you risk everything that you have on you.
I would be more than glad to walk you through the never ending amount of fighting ganking pve factionVSfaction crafting mining trading etc...
Dude you have no clue on what you missing.
Some people want to be more than a space ship pewpewing through a vast, inky blackness, dude. Do EVE players really not get that?
"Forums aren't for intelligent discussion; they're for blow-hards with unwavering opinions."
By the time I actually got to vanguard I thought it was a great game, sadly it released so badly absolutely no one was playing it or was willing to give it another chance. Count me as one that would love to play another Vanguard type game so long as the release wasn't the same.
So you are saying that when you started playing Vanguard their was no one playing the game except you,you were the only person logged into nthe game when you were playing?
I am going by your saying: absolutely no one was playing,that means that you were the only one.I know for a fact you are lying because i have been playing non stop since beta with my guild and other guilds that still play now.
Vanguard is a thinking mans MMO,it's the kind of MMO that you really need to think and take notice of whatb you are doing,death can come quickly.It's similar to EQ in many ways,not as unforgiving as EQ but it's way more unforgiving than games like WOW and RIFT aqnd just about any MMO out today.
Hard is the wrong word to be honest,i have never found a MMO hard.Some MMO have a harder learning curve which is what Vanguard has.Knowing your class and picking your fights carefully instead of wading in knowing if you die you lose nothing is what Vanguard makes you do.
Anyone logging into Vanguard for the very first time can feel ost and will be asking many questions and looking for advice.Most people haven't got a clue how Diplomacy works or can't figure out the crafting system without help.
Right, because that's what I meant!!! And I'm lying? What a tool you are. I played it, I thought it was a good game(something you obviously didn't understand or ignored in your desire to be butt hurt and offended) but the population, especially at the low levels, was abysmally small and i got tired of playing in a well crafted ghost town. If it didn't have population issues it wouldn't be the after thought it has become, so stop with this act you've got going.
Only a tool would use the term tool as an insult lol,lack of imaginative thinking me thinks.
Let me remind you of what you said,not what you meant
Yeah. In fact, early PvE in Eve is very easy (more so than WOW) and BORING.
I literally just use missle at max range and finish all the missions. Come on, at least in WOW, you get to use more than 1 skill at very early levels.
And don't tell me PvP is hard .. since PVP is hard in any game (up against good players).
Yikes, I really like the PVE in EVE (Incursions, sleepers, lvl 4/5 missions, exploration, complexes/sanctums, etc.). I must be more of an oddball than I thought.
They can adjust a game all day, but they can't help the issue between the keyboard and the chair. Played: UO, DAoC, AC, WoW, EVE, TR, WAR, Aion, Rift, SWTOR, GW2, TSW, ESO, Elite:D Play EVE for free for 21 days
Vanguard wasnt really that hard of a game...The performance often made it challenging as you often died to lag, going LD, etc......I never played Eve so I cant say how hard it is, but some players dont consider it because you dont have an avatar...I think at some point, some indie company will take a chance and make a tough game again, though it might be awhile before that happens.
Yeah. In fact, early PvE in Eve is very easy (more so than WOW) and BORING.
I literally just use missle at max range and finish all the missions. Come on, at least in WOW, you get to use more than 1 skill at very early levels.
And don't tell me PvP is hard .. since PVP is hard in any game (up against good players).
Yikes, I really like the PVE in EVE (Incursions, sleepers, lvl 4/5 missions, exploration, complexes/sanctums, etc.). I must be more of an oddball than I thought.
To be fair, i am talking about PvE missions "early" in the game (where one can do in the first 10-15 hours). In this case, I find the combat mechanics extremely simple, and NOT fun, compared to almost any other MMOs i have played including but not limited to WOW, DCUO, STO, and DDO.
Furthermore, at this early stage in the game, missions are already REPEATING!!! None of the themepark MMO have NON-repeat mission for at least weeks, if not month of play.
I guess you could say, I would like hard to bring back a community....Working together, A game where if you piss someone off you should apologize and make it up to them.
An mmo where you can solo if needed or if you just not in the mood to group, but the good stuff is with others, and everyone knows it, so everyone works togeather............That kind of hard !
And " yes " EVE is not my style of mmo....Is that such a big deal ?
The best content in games should be a mix of solo and group content. Either that, or allow all content to virtually scale from solo to raid. (Which I like)
My blog is a continuing story of what MMO's should be like.
Don't forget the complaints you would get because you had to actually defeat the bosses to get new powers. Today you get new skills for figuring out how to visit the trainer. Imagine if Megaman had a cash shop. For $5 you can continue. For $10 you can buy any power you want. For $15 you can skip all the bosses and make it to the "end-game", the screen that says Game Over
This, right here, is what should happen. I want a company that will have the balls to have cash shop in an MMO that allows players to buy their way to end content. Not only will this company makes tons of money, but they will create legions of dunderheads who will invade, spend tons of cash, realize they are fools, and leave. Win/win situation for all, really.
My blog is a continuing story of what MMO's should be like.
People always say they want a hard MMO but they never stay. When EQ opened up classic servers it was the same thing...everyone said before the server opened how awesome it would be.
First thread on the forums "How come it takes 50 mobs to get to level 2? Do you expect us to have no life?"..and 1 week later the server is empty and everyone who said they wanted a hard MMO had their excuse ready, they have a job, kids, responsibilities. So do people who play Korean grinders or played EQ, they just don't have ADD.
Out of 10 people who say they want a hard MMO, 1 will stay and 9 will leave within the first week. That's why there's very few hard or slow MMO. Expectations changed, people expect, no they demand, to be max level within a few months instead of a year or more.
Chatting inside the game used to be the reason to play a game, the community, how fast you leveled didn't matter to most people, it wasn't a race, that's why it was so easy to tolerate a huge grind of a game, leveling wasn't important, it just happened.
Players used to gather just to chat with each other, it didn't matter if you wasted a whole day chatting in the city without xp, it took ages to level anyway, so you might as well get to know people right. A grind isn't really a grind anymore when you spend 90% of your time talking to other people.
Thats a very good summation of the issue. I agree with you 100% because this is exactly how EQ1 was for me. I did not grind at all in EQ1 untill I hit max lvl and needed AAs for specific raid goals I set myself.
In EQ you set your alarm clock in the middle of the night just to raid an open raid mob even if you didn't need the keys just so the other guild wouldn't be able to progress the next day. People kept doing this night after night, until the other guild gave up or they started playing in the middle of the night too.
That's not hard. That is just annoying. Setting my alarm clock is something I do everyday. It's really not hard. Its also really petty.
Comments
So you are saying that when you started playing Vanguard their was no one playing the game except you,you were the only person logged into nthe game when you were playing?
I am going by your saying: absolutely no one was playing,that means that you were the only one.I know for a fact you are lying because i have been playing non stop since beta with my guild and other guilds that still play now.
Vanguard is a thinking mans MMO,it's the kind of MMO that you really need to think and take notice of whatb you are doing,death can come quickly.It's similar to EQ in many ways,not as unforgiving as EQ but it's way more unforgiving than games like WOW and RIFT aqnd just about any MMO out today.
Hard is the wrong word to be honest,i have never found a MMO hard.Some MMO have a harder learning curve which is what Vanguard has.Knowing your class and picking your fights carefully instead of wading in knowing if you die you lose nothing is what Vanguard makes you do.
Anyone logging into Vanguard for the very first time can feel ost and will be asking many questions and looking for advice.Most people haven't got a clue how Diplomacy works or can't figure out the crafting system without help.
I don't recall Vanguard being difficult at all? Unless you're talking about the horrid bugs? I don't consider an instance "difficult" if you randomly get aggro from stuff under the floor or from rooms on other side of the wall....
Vanguard as similar to any other MMO at release, with lack of interesting content and any real "goal" to work towards.
Right, because that's what I meant!!! And I'm lying? What a tool you are. I played it, I thought it was a good game(something you obviously didn't understand or ignored in your desire to be butt hurt and offended) but the population, especially at the low levels, was abysmally small and i got tired of playing in a well crafted ghost town. If it didn't have population issues it wouldn't be the after thought it has become, so stop with this act you've got going.
Bit offtopic.
Man if its true that Vanguard is becoming F2P this summer I am one of the first returning to it that s for sure.
I played EQ for 8 years and if some people say here that Vanguard is an easy game they either didnt play enough or didnt get into the proper areas/zones.
Vanguard was the true EQ2, Ive beta'ed it and played it in different ocassions after launch. It is true that was not an enjoyable experience at first but right now its far better optimized that back then at launch. Graphics are great even for today's standards, plenty of quests, raiding content, really customizable, fair death penalty, both solo and grouping contents, and as many said here is a total shame that Sony didnt invest a bit more of time/effort on this one. For my taste, the only lacking thing is PvP since (correct me if im wrong) there is no PvP server anymore (damn was a blast at first, go with your grp to a dungeon, find another party camping there, and fight for the spot... exciting).
I just finished betatesting GW2 and honestly after seeing that is an absolutely plain standard game with no highlight whatsoever I am greately (again) dissappointed and wouldnt mind giving Vanguard another try.
Flame on.
Eth.
the quest mobs are harder, try playing swtor, wow, eq2 , rift-you can blow right through those mobs, you cannot blow throught the mobs on Vanguard it takes some thought and you will die quite a bit if you just try to spam your buttons
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
CCP seems to do fine making a game that appeals only to "a few"
the problem are these studios are trying to hit the 2 billion dollar powerball lottery. So they put down $50 million in ticket purchases and wonder why they are flat broke 4 years later.
No one wants to make something and maintain it for the long haul, everyone wants to make their product, score their millions instantly, and run away with their money.
Some people want to be more than a space ship pewpewing through a vast, inky blackness, dude. Do EVE players really not get that?
"Forums aren't for intelligent discussion; they're for blow-hards with unwavering opinions."
I still see Vanguard.
Yeah. In fact, early PvE in Eve is very easy (more so than WOW) and BORING.
I literally just use missle at max range and finish all the missions. Come on, at least in WOW, you get to use more than 1 skill at very early levels.
And don't tell me PvP is hard .. since PVP is hard in any game (up against good players).
Only a tool would use the term tool as an insult lol,lack of imaginative thinking me thinks.
Let me remind you of what you said,not what you meant
"Absolutely NO ONE WAS PLAYING VANGUARD"
Yikes, I really like the PVE in EVE (Incursions, sleepers, lvl 4/5 missions, exploration, complexes/sanctums, etc.). I must be more of an oddball than I thought.
They can adjust a game all day, but they can't help the issue between the keyboard and the chair.
Played: UO, DAoC, AC, WoW, EVE, TR, WAR, Aion, Rift, SWTOR, GW2, TSW, ESO, Elite:D
Play EVE for free for 21 days
To be fair, i am talking about PvE missions "early" in the game (where one can do in the first 10-15 hours). In this case, I find the combat mechanics extremely simple, and NOT fun, compared to almost any other MMOs i have played including but not limited to WOW, DCUO, STO, and DDO.
Furthermore, at this early stage in the game, missions are already REPEATING!!! None of the themepark MMO have NON-repeat mission for at least weeks, if not month of play.
Yeah, what he said. Difficulty is largely void in most games that are RPG-based.
My blog is a continuing story of what MMO's should be like.
The best content in games should be a mix of solo and group content. Either that, or allow all content to virtually scale from solo to raid. (Which I like)
My blog is a continuing story of what MMO's should be like.
This, right here, is what should happen. I want a company that will have the balls to have cash shop in an MMO that allows players to buy their way to end content. Not only will this company makes tons of money, but they will create legions of dunderheads who will invade, spend tons of cash, realize they are fools, and leave. Win/win situation for all, really.
My blog is a continuing story of what MMO's should be like.
Thats a very good summation of the issue. I agree with you 100% because this is exactly how EQ1 was for me. I did not grind at all in EQ1 untill I hit max lvl and needed AAs for specific raid goals I set myself.
That's not hard. That is just annoying. Setting my alarm clock is something I do everyday. It's really not hard. Its also really petty.