BC, you do understand that I am talking about how the code has been written and animations designed to perform certain things. You are telling me that changes as the game goes on?? That seems impossible.
The reason it could be feeling so "unsmooth" (not a word) could be because of the design of characters and world....they feel "big" for a game and don't appear to move very fluidly. just a guess though
Assume you know how to type letters without looking at keyboard while typing, if you want combat run fluidly, try to rebind your skills.
left hand for using A.S.W.D(direction keys), right hand for using mouse(for camera view), try to bind right button to shift key, that way you can use goose while pressing A/S/W/D and right mouse button down. all important skills should be bound to E,F,G,R,Q,X,Z keys, so that you can use your skills by typing those keys without even looking at your keyboard. the more you practice your combat, the more fluidly it become. This game requires skills, you need to practice to perfect it.
I don't usually give out tips like this, since it's Friday and I'm in such a good mood. lol..
LOL...thanks. nah, that's not what Im talking about though. Im talking about the fluidity of the graphics. I don't like them....it's a personal preference I guess.
Originally posted by fat_taddler I did however, point out that many players are looking for instant gratification and that is an unrealistic expectation for sandbox style games.
And I don't think anyone would disagree with you.
But whether or not Age of Wushu succeeds in disseminating the necessary information so that the player can learn what is needed at a reasonable pace is of question. You said it was boring. I would agree with you.
Your next move was to say that it automatically proved your point that there were players who wanted instant gratification and weren't willing to spend the time.
So your stance is that players must work through the boring. I would say that that the developers need to make it so learning the appropriate materials isn't a slog.
I definitely agree. Once a developer comes up with an effective way to marry complex in-game systems with an engaging and fun learning experience, my argument goes out the window.
Unfortunately, we're not there yet which is why I believe that sandbox games don't / won't do well in the west.
I see where you are with that statement OP and I'm with you on that. It's those types of things that are limiting the number of MMO's that truly do challenge the player in both gameplay and open "sandbox" experiences.
Reason being that developers don't see a proper avenue to build something so grand or maybe they don't feel that the NA market is willing to pay-2-play something like that. I feel that one thing to actually help those sandboxes is a subscription model. The Free-2-play model is cool and all but I'm not the biggest perpetuator of it.
Unless proper measures are in place to limit some of more "aggrevating" parts of them such as some of things that are happening in AoW..
"Anyone need Kitchen remodeling? I have a great source.. Trojan key-loggers included I'm sure.."
Even with that I think you original post may have overstepped just a bit by saying players in the NA don't WANT a "AAA" Sandbox MMO. I'd be in full support for one myself and as one who is all about game design my imagination runs amuck of the type of ideas that could be implemented to make one work.
Maybe in time I'll get to work with some like minded individuals and bring something for my and others enjoyment. You never know these days.. *Fingers Crossed*
PM before you report at least or you could just block.
So many responses that continue to prove my point. It's not a bad thing that people want instant action and to be the hero on day one. I'm not trying to debate that point.
However, these are fundamental reasons why sandboxes won't work in the west anymore. If players want a truly open environment and game systems that will promote long-term, player driven content, there's going to be a learning curve which may not translate into super exciting game play right off the bat.
Age of Wushu
No mouse invert
a 60 fps hard cap
mediocre graphics rendered at a struggle
a game introduction that even Age of Wushu fanboys will concede is poor
Your conclusion was that sandbox gameplay made this game unpopular?
I like the concept of the game, I dislike it's implementation. Not many things felt like they were particularly refined or 'smooth'.
The controls themselves was upfront what I found to be my main issue, it was a bit awkward for me and I found it to be rather combative towards my intuition.
It just doesn't present itself in a manner that I find enjoyable. If the responses felt different and the controls were chained together differently I might find it a perfectly enjoyable game.
So mostly it's not the premise of the game or the sandbox elements, but the presentation and means of implementation.
EDIT: To clarify, I don't mean 'simpler'. I mean that the manner in which I assume a chain of actions to work, I don't see working. Couple that with the fact many things are presented still in UI and reams of text, it causes me to see the game as having a degree of unfamiliarity and inconsistency.
It's a personal playstyle issue more than anything else. How I expect and prefer movement mechanics, combat mechanics, and interactive elements to work is generally different than what this game provides. Most games really fall into that problem.
If they broke game elements down based on context more often, I'd generally prefer that method. Giving a quick means to hop to something like a radial menu with the most applicable or a series of nested prompts available so that I have the most options presented in the cleanest/quickest manner possible is generally what I hope for.
And honestly, I think I've only seen one game provide something close to that. Namely Neverwinter Nights. Heavy Rain is a good example of 'clean' as far as having a very simplified presentation of available options within an environment, but it lacks the depth provided the contexts.
If they could have combined some 'action' buttons for immediate prompts to some of the more universal/common actions and couple that with a nested action prompt, I would have felt more comfortable with the game as I would have had a quick means to access a large variety of options and controls.
I want the depth, I don't want the obfuscation. The controls as they are provided I find to be rather 'unclean' and obfuscating in ways that makes actions that are theoretically simple, to be more difficult that they should be in my mind.
"The knowledge of the theory of logic has no tendency whatever to make men good reasoners." - Thomas B. Macaulay
"The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." - Daniel J. Boorstin
I support interesting games, I support innovative games, I support games that make you want to dig more into it. I support games have non button mashing combat. AOW just happened to be the one.
Once again, AOW is for elite gamers, it has an IQ requirement.
Just for the record Park, what's your IQ, oh great and mighty?
Touche.
AOW is for elite gamers = one the most ridiculous statements i have read here in the past several weeks, borderline hilarious, i wonder if all AOW players consider themselves "elite" or is it just an isolated fanboy thing.
Yeh I couldn't resist that one either. Trust me, not all AoW players are that arrogant. In my guild (the biggest on White Tiger) all of the guys and gals were pretty laid back and didn't have absurd views of themselves as "elite" gamers. At least not the ones that I talked with on raidcall daily.
No it proves a badly translated , f2p allowing gold spam chat all over the screen , rushed and ran by a small company , niche at best setting , pseudo sandbox game can't make it in the west.
Says nothing about what hopefully EQNext will be be like or do.
No it stands and been proven over and over in this thread. Over we've seen the same thing. The instant gratification crowd playing for 2 hours, then syaing the game is not a sandbox.
What's the chance that the AoW fans can state their views without stereotypes, namecalling or insults? It used to be great having discussions about the game and its features but lately the AoW fans have taken the rather arrogant stance of contending that those who don't agree with you are simply below you or have some condition that affects them from seeing your view.
Don't take my word for it, just read the responses you guys have been posting in this thread.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
The reason I never even gave this game a shot is the fact that you cant buy a permanent mount I have no problem whit items decaying and having to get new ones but having to buy a mount every 15 days is lame.
We see so many people on these forums clamoring for sandbox titles yet there is barely any support for this title. Why not?
Sandbox or not it remains an asian cash shop MMO and many sandbox lovers like myself (I imagine) won't go anywhere near it for that reason alone. Also the setting is very unconventional, most westerners aren't really into playing a virtual kung fu game in ancient China. People are used to their middle ages setting with orcs and elves and that's what they want.
We see so many people on these forums clamoring for sandbox titles yet there is barely any support for this title. Why not?
Sandbox or not it remains an asian cash shop MMO and many sandbox lovers like myself (I imagine) won't go anywhere near it for that reason alone. Also the setting is very unconventional, most westerners aren't really into playing a virtual kung fu game in ancient China. People are used to their middle ages setting with orcs and elves and that's what they want.
the cash shop is a blend between GW2 and EVE. They have to make money...
Originally posted by Dahkoht No it proves a badly translated , f2p allowing gold spam chat all over the screen , rushed and ran by a small company , niche at best setting , pseudo sandbox game can't make it in the west.
Says nothing about what hopefully EQNext will be be like or do.
Sail has over 300 employees, and is on of the largest game producers.
Wushu has been out for about a yeah in china soooo...
Wushu is just as much a sandbox as EVE. Are one of those that says EVE is not a sandbox? All the way from player formed factions, to player controlled territory, to player driven economy, too the freedom to do whatever you want, and still progress.
Originally posted by Abimor The reason I never even gave this game a shot is the fact that you cant buy a permanent mount I have no problem whit items decaying and having to get new ones but having to buy a mount every 15 days is lame.
30 days. Yeah I know a lot of misinfo running around. It's not their fault they only played the tutorial, well it could be, nevemind.
People that play this game need to just stop trying to make other people like it. The game is simply not fun and its not a sandbox by any means. Afther a week a playing you have done and seen just about everything there is to the game which is not much to begin with. The game is just low quality like Perfect World or Rappelz. I will wait for real high quality games like ArcheAge and Black Deserts.
Originally posted by Mannish People that play this game need to just stop trying to make other people like it. The game is simply not fun and its not a sandbox by any means. Afther a week a playing you have done and seen just about everything there is to the game which is not much to begin with. The game is just low quality like Perfect World or Rappelz. I will wait for real high quality games like ArcheAge and Black Deserts.
Soooo eveyone is just making stuff up?
Dude the game is not for everyone. It surely doesn't see to be for you, you don't have to lie though, mean spirited lies at that. It makes wonder why.
This coming from a guy who hates SWG. See below-
Originally posted by keithian
Originally posted by Tierless
It has 2 options, patch in everything it's missing that SWG had, OR, put this lame horse down and make a new MMO that lives up to the name Star Wars.
Please don't make it like SWG because that game sucked and failed despite how long it was standing on its last legs for years.
People that play this game need to just stop trying to make other people like it. The game is simply not fun and its not a sandbox by any means. Afther a week a playing you have done and seen just about everything there is to the game which is not much to begin with. The game is just low quality like Perfect World or Rappelz. I will wait for real high quality games like ArcheAge and Black Deserts.
If they did that, they would have no one to lord their "eliteness" over. :P Game just fails to deliver. (And LoL at AoW is as good a sandbox as EvE, not even with another 5 years of development, on its very best day.)
Originally posted by Mannish People that play this game need to just stop trying to make other people like it. The game is simply not fun and its not a sandbox by any means. Afther a week a playing you have done and seen just about everything there is to the game which is not much to begin with. The game is just low quality like Perfect World or Rappelz. I will wait for real high quality games like ArcheAge and Black Deserts.
If they did that, they would have no one to lord their "eliteness" over. :P Game just fails to deliver. (And LoL at AoW is as good a sandbox as EvE, not even with another 5 years of development, on its very best day.)
Good is subjective.
Feature for feature it's the closest thing to EVE with people. There is a reason Why Age of Wushu has been flooded by EVE guilds, like Goon Squad. I'm willing to bet 75% of Wushu population has or is playing EVE.
Reading this thread made me discouraged to even try the game. It seems like these "elite" AoW fans can't accept any valid criticism (yes some of it was bad but there was plenty of good ones too). Putting in sandbox for a title and then failing to provide points why it makes it a sandbox really confuses people who did not hear much about this game. All I see people saying is how pvp in this game has sandbox nature.. since when does pvp have anything to do with sandbox?
Originally posted by pacov Reading this thread made me discouraged to even try the game. It seems like these "elite" AoW fans can't accept any valid criticism (yes some of it was bad but there was plenty of good ones too). Putting in sandbox for a title and then failing to provide points why it makes it a sandbox really confuses people who did not hear much about this game. All I see people saying is how pvp in this game has sandbox nature.. since when does pvp have anything to do with sandbox?
It's much easier to say what's not sandbox than to say what is. You can not terra for in AoW. Everything else is there. If AoW is not, neither is EVE.
It's not just the players saying that either. It's every gaming site you can think of form mmorpg.com, to massively to ten ton hammer, to ign, to mmosite.
What more do you need? If you do need more, take a week and find out.
Here is a 38 minute video on what makes Age of Wushu a sandbox. Did you really expect people to write all of this?
Originally posted by Mannish People that play this game need to just stop trying to make other people like it. The game is simply not fun and its not a sandbox by any means. Afther a week a playing you have done and seen just about everything there is to the game which is not much to begin with. The game is just low quality like Perfect World or Rappelz. I will wait for real high quality games like ArcheAge and Black Deserts.
Soooo eveyone is just making stuff up?
Dude the game is not for everyone. It surely doesn't see to be for you, you don't have to lie though, mean spirited lies at that. It makes wonder why.
This coming from a guy who hates SWG. See below-
Originally posted by keithian
Originally posted by Tierless
It has 2 options, patch in everything it's missing that SWG had, OR, put this lame horse down and make a new MMO that lives up to the name Star Wars.
Please don't make it like SWG because that game sucked and failed despite how long it was standing on its last legs for years.
Ok, let me show you how this is supposed to be done. You don't like Star Wars? I could care less. I don't reply to every negative post like you are doing. Look at how many post you have made in this one topic and for what? If you like the game then enjoy it and stop being a rabid fanboy in full defense mode when you see a person that does not like this poor excuse for a mmo.
Originally posted by Mannish People that play this game need to just stop trying to make other people like it. The game is simply not fun and its not a sandbox by any means. Afther a week a playing you have done and seen just about everything there is to the game which is not much to begin with. The game is just low quality like Perfect World or Rappelz. I will wait for real high quality games like ArcheAge and Black Deserts.
Soooo eveyone is just making stuff up?
Dude the game is not for everyone. It surely doesn't see to be for you, you don't have to lie though, mean spirited lies at that. It makes wonder why.
This coming from a guy who hates SWG. See below-
Originally posted by keithian
Originally posted by Tierless
It has 2 options, patch in everything it's missing that SWG had, OR, put this lame horse down and make a new MMO that lives up to the name Star Wars.
Please don't make it like SWG because that game sucked and failed despite how long it was standing on its last legs for years.
Ok, let me show you how this is supposed to be done. You don't like Star Wars? I could care less. I don't reply to every negative post like you are doing. Look at how many post you have made in this one topic and for what? If you like the game then enjoy it and stop being a rabid fanboy in full defense mode when you see a person that does not like this poor excuse for a mmo.
No it's fine you don't like. I think it's really good actually, just don't lie. I just wanted people to know where your opinion is coming from.
Here is a 38 minute video talking about the Wushu sandbox.
Did the OP choose the title of this post just to be controversial ?
Because trying to prove that an entire (hard to define) genre "doesn't work in the West" just because ONE game isn't massively popular is.. well... dumb ?
Games are highly subjective experiences, just like any form of entertainment. Just because I may love sandboxes, doesn't mean I automatically love ALL games that are "sandboxy"
Comments
LOL...thanks. nah, that's not what Im talking about though. Im talking about the fluidity of the graphics. I don't like them....it's a personal preference I guess.
I see where you are with that statement OP and I'm with you on that. It's those types of things that are limiting the number of MMO's that truly do challenge the player in both gameplay and open "sandbox" experiences.
Reason being that developers don't see a proper avenue to build something so grand or maybe they don't feel that the NA market is willing to pay-2-play something like that. I feel that one thing to actually help those sandboxes is a subscription model. The Free-2-play model is cool and all but I'm not the biggest perpetuator of it.
Unless proper measures are in place to limit some of more "aggrevating" parts of them such as some of things that are happening in AoW..
"Anyone need Kitchen remodeling? I have a great source.. Trojan key-loggers included I'm sure.."
Even with that I think you original post may have overstepped just a bit by saying players in the NA don't WANT a "AAA" Sandbox MMO. I'd be in full support for one myself and as one who is all about game design my imagination runs amuck of the type of ideas that could be implemented to make one work.
Maybe in time I'll get to work with some like minded individuals and bring something for my and others enjoyment. You never know these days.. *Fingers Crossed*
PM before you report at least or you could just block.
Age of Wushu
No mouse invert
a 60 fps hard cap
mediocre graphics rendered at a struggle
a game introduction that even Age of Wushu fanboys will concede is poor
Your conclusion was that sandbox gameplay made this game unpopular?
I like the concept of the game, I dislike it's implementation. Not many things felt like they were particularly refined or 'smooth'.
The controls themselves was upfront what I found to be my main issue, it was a bit awkward for me and I found it to be rather combative towards my intuition.
It just doesn't present itself in a manner that I find enjoyable. If the responses felt different and the controls were chained together differently I might find it a perfectly enjoyable game.
So mostly it's not the premise of the game or the sandbox elements, but the presentation and means of implementation.
EDIT: To clarify, I don't mean 'simpler'. I mean that the manner in which I assume a chain of actions to work, I don't see working. Couple that with the fact many things are presented still in UI and reams of text, it causes me to see the game as having a degree of unfamiliarity and inconsistency.
It's a personal playstyle issue more than anything else. How I expect and prefer movement mechanics, combat mechanics, and interactive elements to work is generally different than what this game provides. Most games really fall into that problem.
If they broke game elements down based on context more often, I'd generally prefer that method. Giving a quick means to hop to something like a radial menu with the most applicable or a series of nested prompts available so that I have the most options presented in the cleanest/quickest manner possible is generally what I hope for.
And honestly, I think I've only seen one game provide something close to that. Namely Neverwinter Nights. Heavy Rain is a good example of 'clean' as far as having a very simplified presentation of available options within an environment, but it lacks the depth provided the contexts.
If they could have combined some 'action' buttons for immediate prompts to some of the more universal/common actions and couple that with a nested action prompt, I would have felt more comfortable with the game as I would have had a quick means to access a large variety of options and controls.
I want the depth, I don't want the obfuscation. The controls as they are provided I find to be rather 'unclean' and obfuscating in ways that makes actions that are theoretically simple, to be more difficult that they should be in my mind.
"The knowledge of the theory of logic has no tendency whatever to make men good reasoners." - Thomas B. Macaulay
"The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." - Daniel J. Boorstin
Yeh I couldn't resist that one either. Trust me, not all AoW players are that arrogant. In my guild (the biggest on White Tiger) all of the guys and gals were pretty laid back and didn't have absurd views of themselves as "elite" gamers. At least not the ones that I talked with on raidcall daily.
"If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor
Says nothing about what hopefully EQNext will be be like or do.
If you do a Premium subscription, you get +10% to all stats, including HP & MP.
Pay2win.
So yeah, no.
Help get Camelot Unchained made, a old-school MMORPG, with no hand holding!
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/13861848/camelot-unchained
thats sub 2 win, and its certainly a reasonable model
there are two *major* strikes against AoW in the west:
Its an eastern game. the only mildly successful eastern title in the west has been FFXI
Its a PvP-centric game. That cuts out at least 80% of the potential player base.
What's the chance that the AoW fans can state their views without stereotypes, namecalling or insults? It used to be great having discussions about the game and its features but lately the AoW fans have taken the rather arrogant stance of contending that those who don't agree with you are simply below you or have some condition that affects them from seeing your view.
Don't take my word for it, just read the responses you guys have been posting in this thread.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Sandbox or not it remains an asian cash shop MMO and many sandbox lovers like myself (I imagine) won't go anywhere near it for that reason alone. Also the setting is very unconventional, most westerners aren't really into playing a virtual kung fu game in ancient China. People are used to their middle ages setting with orcs and elves and that's what they want.
the cash shop is a blend between GW2 and EVE. They have to make money...
Sail has over 300 employees, and is on of the largest game producers.
Wushu has been out for about a yeah in china soooo...
Wushu is just as much a sandbox as EVE. Are one of those that says EVE is not a sandbox? All the way from player formed factions, to player controlled territory, to player driven economy, too the freedom to do whatever you want, and still progress.
30 days. Yeah I know a lot of misinfo running around. It's not their fault they only played the tutorial, well it could be, nevemind.
You buy them with ingame currancy.
Soooo eveyone is just making stuff up?
Dude the game is not for everyone. It surely doesn't see to be for you, you don't have to lie though, mean spirited lies at that. It makes wonder why.
This coming from a guy who hates SWG. See below-
------------------------------------------
and a guy who says this about SWTOR. See below-
"I have been playing this game for about a week and I don't see anything wrong with it at all."
If they did that, they would have no one to lord their "eliteness" over. :P Game just fails to deliver. (And LoL at AoW is as good a sandbox as EvE, not even with another 5 years of development, on its very best day.)Good is subjective.
Feature for feature it's the closest thing to EVE with people. There is a reason Why Age of Wushu has been flooded by EVE guilds, like Goon Squad. I'm willing to bet 75% of Wushu population has or is playing EVE.
It's much easier to say what's not sandbox than to say what is. You can not terra for in AoW. Everything else is there. If AoW is not, neither is EVE.
It's not just the players saying that either. It's every gaming site you can think of form mmorpg.com, to massively to ten ton hammer, to ign, to mmosite.
What more do you need? If you do need more, take a week and find out.
Here is a 38 minute video on what makes Age of Wushu a sandbox. Did you really expect people to write all of this?
Ok, let me show you how this is supposed to be done. You don't like Star Wars? I could care less. I don't reply to every negative post like you are doing. Look at how many post you have made in this one topic and for what? If you like the game then enjoy it and stop being a rabid fanboy in full defense mode when you see a person that does not like this poor excuse for a mmo.
No it's fine you don't like. I think it's really good actually, just don't lie. I just wanted people to know where your opinion is coming from.
Here is a 38 minute video talking about the Wushu sandbox.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=K2_2H1ASKAo#t=358
Did the OP choose the title of this post just to be controversial ?
Because trying to prove that an entire (hard to define) genre "doesn't work in the West" just because ONE game isn't massively popular is.. well... dumb ?
Games are highly subjective experiences, just like any form of entertainment. Just because I may love sandboxes, doesn't mean I automatically love ALL games that are "sandboxy"