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Why all of the new mmorpgs made to be single player games?
ricsi046
Member UncommonPosts: 34
A game played by millions is a perfect example: WOW. The guys who ever played vanilla or bc(maybe lk too) know that it was rewarding to play with groups(lots of quest that needed like 5 players,instances[no rdf crap],battlegrounds etc).We could say that you was forced to communicate and work together.(I know that vanilla had things that every1 hated)
Now all you do in the mmorpgs is solo questing,solo instances,or use some kind of instance finder,its basically easier to lvl up alone.The same goes for end game,maybe team work has a bigger role there,but you still have pugs with what you can clear endgame content(mostly) without even greeting your group.
Ok,we still have guilds,but that doesnt help the factthat you are forced to lvl up alone,and in the guild some prefer pve,other pvp,other doesnt have time atm,other is busy helping a friend,other is crafting etc.And what if you don't have any friends in the game?I don't think its easy to make friends nowadays,you can join a guild,but it still takes weeks or even months to befriend with someone.
But the point is that,i don't understand why developers go in this way.Why not boost exp if you grind or quest with others?Or remove those dungeon finder things,make it harder to play alone or idk.
And tbh people now play mmorpgs as a single player game,becouse of this crap trend... Enough to check a vanilla private server for example.
I guess it wont stop becouse someone is crying on a forum,but some explanation would be nice.Maybe most of you prefer this way of playing mmorpgs.
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"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
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Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
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"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
i'm not too convinced about the mass appeal.. but they do genreate a lot of money though as people visit and throw some cash around while they check it out.
the lack of anything really interesting has a lot of desperate players moving from game to game looking for that 1 game they can call their home again.
devs know this so they make some crap games for easy money and throw it their way.
I had fun once, it was terrible.
Its all about longevity of the game.
Group content is great. I'm a grouper, I love questing, exploring dungeons, raiding, pvping with other people. Not only is it more social, its more fun, generally more challenging and makes you a better player.
However, I play from launch. I play during standard peak hours. My leveling rate is the same as the main "pack". This means its always easy for me to find groups.
The same cannot be said for everyone. Slow gamers, casual gamer, late joiners, solo-orientated gamers all have a hard time finding groups because the vast majority of people have moved on. Groups also require leaders and these are also harder to find amoungst casual gamers.
All this means is that if you put lots of group content into the leveling process, you are placing massive barriers in the way of non-core gamers in the future, reducing the likelihood of casuals / soloers / later joiners staying with the game. This kills income and basically says that the size of your population after 6 months is the biggest it will ever get. Making content solo right from the start removes this obstacle and ensures content is playable well into the future. Of course, it introduces a host of other problems, such as turning leveling into a boring grind, dumbing down content so no1 knows how to play when they hit max level, and putting off some core gamers.
The solution, of course, is scaling content, but this is hard to do, hence why virtually no1 has done it.
Because the majority of players:
Once grouping becomes optional, the majority will avoid it, because progressing on your own is always more efficient if the rewards are equal.
Playing solo is also a far more enjoyable way of playing for a great many people, because the group they land in will quite often play either faster or slower than they themselves would like to. I play very slowly, because in ESO, I like to look behind every tree and rock to see what's there. I like to try climbing every ridge or cliff just to see what I can see from the top of it.
I enjoy being in a game world filled with other people and watching what they get up to. Sometimes there's even people that like to chat or RP a bit. But I would hate it if I couldn't wander around aimlessly just picking flowers for potions and admiring the view...
Like others above pointed out: Demand and supply. That's what it boils down to.
^This.
PLUS: many players do not want to devote their valuable playing time to some raging self entitled jobless guild/raid leader demanding them to play how it suits the 'leader'.
"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"
Interesting revision of history there. WOW was easy mode when it came out. You didn't need to talk to anyone, grouping for instances was done right at the entrance and accomplished through spamming, and you never had to do a single raid. The majority never set foot inside a raid instance, and only a single-digit percentage of the player base ever actually fought a raid boss.
And you are correct that older MMOs were rewarding to play in groups (just like the new ones are) but you didn't have to group to play them.
In many of the older MMOs there wasn't even a grouping mechanic to facilitate that, let alone provide any benefit for it. Players of AC, Neocron, Planet Entropia, Furcadia, UO, EVE, and most other early MMOs often spent a good portion of their game time socializing in towns or soloing in the game world.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
WoW saw the start of what we now think of as MMOs becoming solo games and the dumbing down of MMO gameplay. But it was an initial step, early WoW was still a game where grouping played a really important part of the game, even if only because old habits die hard. Top end was extremely group focused.
WoW was not really the problem, it was the direction of travel that became the problem. MMO's were made to broaden appeal as was said. They were made to suit solo gamers and those who liked grouping just had to put up with it. This made for a much larger potential audience. But it is an audience who have increasingly done just that, play them like solo games. That means you play for one or two months and go, speak to no one and do not join a guild.
Today we have other issues. Solo play is long entrenched, P2W in cash shops is now entrenched and the need of games that still call themselves MMOs is being questioned. Who needs a MMO when you can make a MOBA for less money and risk, but with similar returns?
I am not saying the current incarnation of "MMOs" will die out, but I think it may well change yet again. And so far we have lost more than we have gained.
I haven't played any MMOs that were made to be single player games.
You can chat with others.
You can trade with others.
There are many quests/dungeons that require some teamwork, in some.
You can group up and adventure together.
In many you can fight one another.
In many you can join guilds to help each other out.
In some, choices you make, can affect others.
....
Just because some people choose to play it single player, doesn't mean that it was designed that way. Also, I believe that very few people play these games that don't interact with others to some extent.
I self identify as a monkey.
+1 Most games don't force you to do stuff. You have options based on your play-style and time. Groups can take a lot of time to put together and for someone it may be their first time and not everyone has the patience to walk others through. A lot of players complain about not being able to watch the cut scene because others in the group have played through lots of times before so aren't interested in looking at them again. Nothing wrong with grouping or playing solo. The problem is making a game only grouping, which not many do.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
I think allot of gamers been gamers before internet became mainstream and much more accessable. Those gamers where used to singleplayer games, many of them even with RPG's. Those people expect something similar with the only difference there are more people playing around you in the same world.
So today's games give you more story instead of ingame tools. Just look at end game in most of today's MMO's they are quite similar to what you can find in regular multiplayer games and most people seem to rush to it.
It's not so much that new mmorpg's are made to be singleplayer games, it's more that this genre is trying to satisfied the largest group of gamers.
I am in that minority that rather wants us gamers to be the soul of the game, build that community, have options, freedom, with nothing forced in a virtual fantasy/sci-fi world but I know it's not what the masses want...else this genre would have been different and less singleplayer aspects.
It wasn't WOW it was actually EQ2, coming from EQ you were thrown into a game that you describe above.
EQ2 came before WOW, only thing was nine months later WOW had millions of B.Net fans playing it instead of mostly gamer's from other mmo's
want 7 free days of playing? Try this
http://www.swtor.com/r/ZptVnY
Actually several years ago SE's ffxi added a feature called level synch. When you formed a party you could choose a person to synch down to and everyone would end um matched that level, well unless a person was lower level the the synch then they would stay the same.
That helped a ton in ffxi after it was out for over a year.
No one else has ever tried to recreate the level synch feature from ffxi?
It really doesn't matter if you are convinced about it.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
totally revision of history he did there. Wow was recognized for solo play. To quote Gordon Walton, the co-studio director at BioWare Austin (at time of quote).
Lesson Four
One thing that WoW is frequently recognized for is its solo play. Walton's fourth lesson was: support this, because gamers want it. According to Walton, older games that forced players into groups missed the point: "[the] truth is that people soloed every game to the best they could and when they couldn't anymore, they quit. Embracing solo play that was a true innovation for WoW."
It was pointed out that players who hit the level cap are pretty much forced to group in WOW; Walton still felt like the game "feels like it's a level playing field for all people at that level" and thus isn't quite as sinful as it could be. He offered a Blizzard quote on the solo issue -- "We look at soloing as our casual game." Given the weight of the phrase "casual game" in 2007, you can bet the audience was scribbling that one down.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
The answer is surprisingly simple.
A huge segment of the most affluent mmorpg players are now aging into the bracket where they need to dedicate time to jobs, family, etc... This means less play time, and less consistent play time. If I have an hour to play and it takes me 30-40 minutes to find a group, that is bad. If I have an hour to play and the content takes a minimum of 90 minutes to play, then either I will have to drop out of the group partway through or else I can't even start it... If I can play on and off over the next 5 hours, no one wants to have a group sitting there waiting for them while they go afk after afk...
Games now are being designed to cater to people with RL obligations.
I really miss the days of vanilla WoW or even earlier(If they remade DAOC with more modern interface and graphics, I would jump on it in a second)... But I can honestly say that I can't dedicate the time or attention to it now that I did back then, and I wouldn't be able to play it the same way.
That being said, WoW could be maxed solo very quickly pre-BC... And it is even faster now with the insta-90.
Did you miss a cliché there?
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
I played both, from a couple of months after launch. EQ2 was certainly going in "the WoW" direction compared to AC and DAOC (never played EQ) but it did seem to be built more on old school values than WoW. EQ2 was a fine game, but was just blown out of the water like everything else was when WoW appeared.