Maybe the Ivory Tower can discuss the ideas on tonight's Twitch Stream with Dleatherus. It will be interesting to see if they take the chance to look at things realistically or if it's going to be a repeat of the last interview where anything Caspien said was met with "Great point!"
Sigh... The Ivory Tower literally described this as a "win/win"... and said "we don't know why they let the employees go, maybe they were late a few times".
Compared "Naysayers" of CoE to Jeff Bezos getting turned down by Warren Buffet for investment. And that Caspien shares many of the same traits as Bezos.
Even I am totally stunned by their ability to ignore reality.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Maybe the Ivory Tower can discuss the ideas on tonight's Twitch Stream with Dleatherus. It will be interesting to see if they take the chance to look at things realistically or if it's going to be a repeat of the last interview where anything Caspien said was met with "Great point!"
Sigh... The Ivory Tower literally described this as a "win/win"... and said "we don't know why they let the employees go, maybe they were late a few times".
Compared "Naysayers" of CoE to Jeff Bezos getting turned down by Warren Buffet for investment. And that Caspien shares many of the same traits as Bezos.
Even I am totally stunned by their ability to ignore reality.
These crowdfunded projects, intentionally or not, rely heavily on the sunk cost fallacy.
Maybe the Ivory Tower can discuss the ideas on tonight's Twitch Stream with Dleatherus. It will be interesting to see if they take the chance to look at things realistically or if it's going to be a repeat of the last interview where anything Caspien said was met with "Great point!"
Sigh... The Ivory Tower literally described this as a "win/win"... and said "we don't know why they let the employees go, maybe they were late a few times".
Compared "Naysayers" of CoE to Jeff Bezos getting turned down by Warren Buffet for investment. And that Caspien shares many of the same traits as Bezos.
Even I am totally stunned by their ability to ignore reality.
These crowdfunded projects, intentionally or not, rely heavily on the sunk cost fallacy.
I mean... it took awhile but even Scrooge eventually heeded the Harbingers when he saw what the future held. They just got a preview by the company laying off developers and it still hasn't sunk in.
I dunno. My Harbinger skills must be lacking.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Maybe the Ivory Tower can discuss the ideas on tonight's Twitch Stream with Dleatherus. It will be interesting to see if they take the chance to look at things realistically or if it's going to be a repeat of the last interview where anything Caspien said was met with "Great point!"
Sigh... The Ivory Tower literally described this as a "win/win"... and said "we don't know why they let the employees go, maybe they were late a few times".
Compared "Naysayers" of CoE to Jeff Bezos getting turned down by Warren Buffet for investment. And that Caspien shares many of the same traits as Bezos.
Even I am totally stunned by their ability to ignore reality.
These crowdfunded projects, intentionally or not, rely heavily on the sunk cost fallacy.
I mean... it took awhile but even Scrooge eventually heeded the Harbingers when he saw what the future held. They just got a preview by the company laying off developers and it still hasn't sunk in.
I dunno. My Harbinger skills must be lacking.
I'd say the emotional attachment would make influencing their opinions largely an effort in futility no matter how effective the explanation.
If the majority of these endeavors fall flat, I can see consumer faith in any upcoming MMORPG project to be unusually low. For this genre, that's saying something significant. The higher the ride, the harder the fall.
#1 Do NOT make promises,especially without having much money to even guarantee a game. #2 Be honest from day 1,sure it might not get what you want/need but you will at least garner more positive attention and more people that might be willing to follow your game and eventually play it even though you likely won't get any FREE money from them. #3 maybe should be number 1,do NOT attempt to make a game you cannot guarantee with solid finances,solid knowledge and a solid team.If you think your attempt is very suspect,then you should not be making that game.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
What have they actually accomplished to this point?
In terms of development? I keep saying it, but so far they've 'allegedly' (it's in private testing) produced a MUD which may or may not be the basis for some aspect of the code of the final game or.... something ridiculous like that.
What have they actually accomplished to this point?
In terms of development? I keep saying it, but so far they've 'allegedly' (it's in private testing) produced a MUD which may or may not be the basis for some aspect of the code of the final game or.... something ridiculous like that.
I read what Slapp said at the top of this page. I can only pick my jaw up off the floor. I mean, to speak of the obviousness of this situation is an understatement. This has gone beyond willful ignorance int abject fanaticism.
I'm sitting here, and I have no words to describe the level of disbelief and the extent of the disconnect from reality.
Do we have any example ever anywhere, that we could even hint to that shows any of the recent announcements in even a silver lined cloud of a win/win scenario?
Maybe the Ivory Tower can discuss the ideas on tonight's Twitch Stream with Dleatherus. It will be interesting to see if they take the chance to look at things realistically or if it's going to be a repeat of the last interview where anything Caspien said was met with "Great point!"
Sigh... The Ivory Tower literally described this as a "win/win"... and said "we don't know why they let the employees go, maybe they were late a few times".
Compared "Naysayers" of CoE to Jeff Bezos getting turned down by Warren Buffet for investment. And that Caspien shares many of the same traits as Bezos.
Even I am totally stunned by their ability to ignore reality.
maybe the naysayers can start their own livestream and discuss it?
basically for me i don't have an issue with the naysayers - you can say what you want
to me it is like an explorer raising funds in the mid 1800's - people know it's risky, people know there's a chance they won't succeed, or come back etc
some folks will passionately support it
some folks will passionately naysay against
the vast majority will either not care, or wait to read about if and when the explorers return
What have they actually accomplished to this point?
In terms of development? I keep saying it, but so far they've 'allegedly' (it's in private testing) produced a MUD which may or may not be the basis for some aspect of the code of the final game or.... something ridiculous like that.
I read what Slapp said at the top of this page. I can only pick my jaw up off the floor. I mean, to speak of the obviousness of this situation is an understatement. This has gone beyond willful ignorance int abject fanaticism.
I'm sitting here, and I have no words to describe the level of disbelief and the extent of the disconnect from reality.
Do we have any example ever anywhere, that we could even hint to that shows any of the recent announcements in even a silver lined cloud of a win/win scenario?
Yet these people.............
Watch for yourself. Jump right to 36:00 for the "Nothing but a Win/Win situation at the moment"
Or to 37:30 for the "People want to make a negative out of a positive" and "They may have shown up to work late a few too many times" comment... https://www.twitch.tv/videos/219991464##
Simply callous and utterly stunning. I mean the guy even says "literally less than a handful" of employees were laid off...
Hard to believe that the Harbinger has more compassion than these guys.
They need to read the OP in this thread. Then read it again. Then convince Caspien to follow it.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
What have they actually accomplished to this point?
In terms of development? I keep saying it, but so far they've 'allegedly' (it's in private testing) produced a MUD which may or may not be the basis for some aspect of the code of the final game or.... something ridiculous like that.
I read what Slapp said at the top of this page. I can only pick my jaw up off the floor. I mean, to speak of the obviousness of this situation is an understatement. This has gone beyond willful ignorance int abject fanaticism.
I'm sitting here, and I have no words to describe the level of disbelief and the extent of the disconnect from reality.
Do we have any example ever anywhere, that we could even hint to that shows any of the recent announcements in even a silver lined cloud of a win/win scenario?
Yet these people.............
Watch for yourself. Jump right to 36:00 for the "Nothing but a Win/Win situation at the moment"
Or to 37:30 for the "People want to make a negative out of a positive" and "They may have shown up to work late a few too many times" comment... https://www.twitch.tv/videos/219991464##
Simply callous and utterly stunning. I mean the guy even says "literally less than a handful" of employees were laid off...
Hard to believe that the Harbinger has more compassion than these guys.
They need to read the OP in this thread. Then read it again. Then convince Caspien to follow it.
I honestly expected the comments to be taken out of context, but they aren't ... At all.
I don't think they will survive long........... unless some changes are made and they become more realistic. I think they were dreaming TOO BIG for their wallets to handle (predictions). Layoffs = Vaporware?
Proud MMORPG.com member since March 2004! Make PvE GREAT Again!
What have they actually accomplished to this point?
In terms of development? I keep saying it, but so far they've 'allegedly' (it's in private testing) produced a MUD which may or may not be the basis for some aspect of the code of the final game or.... something ridiculous like that.
I read what Slapp said at the top of this page. I can only pick my jaw up off the floor. I mean, to speak of the obviousness of this situation is an understatement. This has gone beyond willful ignorance int abject fanaticism.
I'm sitting here, and I have no words to describe the level of disbelief and the extent of the disconnect from reality.
Do we have any example ever anywhere, that we could even hint to that shows any of the recent announcements in even a silver lined cloud of a win/win scenario?
Yet these people.............
Watch for yourself. Jump right to 36:00 for the "Nothing but a Win/Win situation at the moment"
Or to 37:30 for the "People want to make a negative out of a positive" and "They may have shown up to work late a few too many times" comment... https://www.twitch.tv/videos/219991464##
Simply callous and utterly stunning. I mean the guy even says "literally less than a handful" of employees were laid off...
Hard to believe that the Harbinger has more compassion than these guys.
They need to read the OP in this thread. Then read it again. Then convince Caspien to follow it.
I honestly expected the comments to be taken out of context, but they aren't ... At all.
Talk about being tone deaf.
Geez.
Nope that’s exactly what the tone was... that’s why I linked it for anyone to see.
Instead of compassion for the folks that were laid off... it’s apparently more important to rally around the game. You would think that the folks who support the Elyria Assistance Program to buy copies of the game for people that can’t afford it... might think about fundraising for the folks that were laid off but nope. How about the next sale is to get those folks health insurance for 6 months?
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
This game has been vaporware from the start. Ridiculous featurelist, luring in whales with promises of potentially becoming some kind of special snowflake(You!) in a world full of serbs (the rest).
I know predicting the fail of a new MMO isn't really something special, but I have never before felt so suspicious about a new project as I was about this "Star Citizen" wannabe(but for Fantasy).
Fleecing the Dreamers.
(Yes, it will fail. It *always* starts with layoffs).
The way forward isn't backwards. If they release a shell of a game (taking out all the unique features promised) it may make it to launch, but it won't last much beyond that. See every other MMO that released unfinished and the drop in users immediately after launch.
What they need to do is get to a playable demo state as fast as possible (like Pantheon did -- they created the base game up to level 10 content). Then use that demo to land a publisher/investor.
You can't go to a publisher without a working prototype and just a stack of papers.
That's the only way forward I see. And it's not going to be easy.
The suggestions you're making OP are too drastic. I doubt any developer can take such bold steps and not face complete failure. Yes FFXIV did it but they are Square Enix and they can absorb the loss. Don't even dream about this solution it is totally impossible.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Honestly, IMO, The way forward.........is individualized. Every one of those "employees" should be looking for new jobs and realize this dream is about to end. COE isn't going to happen and if their livelihoods are on the line, then they would need to be thinking about a move now.
The suggestions you're making OP are too drastic. I doubt any developer can take such bold steps and not face complete failure. Yes FFXIV did it but they are Square Enix and they can absorb the loss. Don't even dream about this solution it is totally impossible.
The idea that these guys can still pull off the ambition they started out with seems, to anyone looking objectively, just as impossible.
Maybe they should scrap the MMORPG and stop at the MUD. They might get that working.
The suggestions you're making OP are too drastic. I doubt any developer can take such bold steps and not face complete failure. Yes FFXIV did it but they are Square Enix and they can absorb the loss. Don't even dream about this solution it is totally impossible.
The idea that these guys can still pull off the ambition they started out with seems, to anyone looking objectively, just as impossible.
Maybe they should scrap the MMORPG and stop at the MUD. They might get that working.
Right, because making a MUD is such a good idea that they are the only company doing it...
OR
"You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Comments
Compared "Naysayers" of CoE to Jeff Bezos getting turned down by Warren Buffet for investment. And that Caspien shares many of the same traits as Bezos.
Even I am totally stunned by their ability to ignore reality.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
I dunno. My Harbinger skills must be lacking.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
If the majority of these endeavors fall flat, I can see consumer faith in any upcoming MMORPG project to be unusually low. For this genre, that's saying something significant. The higher the ride, the harder the fall.
#2 Be honest from day 1,sure it might not get what you want/need but you will at least garner more positive attention and more people that might be willing to follow your game and eventually play it even though you likely won't get any FREE money from them.
#3 maybe should be number 1,do NOT attempt to make a game you cannot guarantee with solid finances,solid knowledge and a solid team.If you think your attempt is very suspect,then you should not be making that game.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
I can only pick my jaw up off the floor.
I mean, to speak of the obviousness of this situation is an understatement.
This has gone beyond willful ignorance int abject fanaticism.
I'm sitting here, and I have no words to describe the level of disbelief and the extent of the disconnect from reality.
Do we have any example ever anywhere, that we could even hint to that shows any of the recent announcements in even a silver lined cloud of a win/win scenario?
Yet these people.............
basically for me i don't have an issue with the naysayers - you can say what you want
to me it is like an explorer raising funds in the mid 1800's - people know it's risky, people know there's a chance they won't succeed, or come back etc
some folks will passionately support it
some folks will passionately naysay against
the vast majority will either not care, or wait to read about if and when the explorers return
deal with it
Or to 37:30 for the "People want to make a negative out of a positive" and "They may have shown up to work late a few too many times" comment...
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/219991464##
Simply callous and utterly stunning. I mean the guy even says "literally less than a handful" of employees were laid off...
Hard to believe that the Harbinger has more compassion than these guys.
They need to read the OP in this thread. Then read it again. Then convince Caspien to follow it.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Talk about being tone deaf.
Geez.
Proud MMORPG.com member since March 2004! Make PvE GREAT Again!
Instead of compassion for the folks that were laid off... it’s apparently more important to rally around the game. You would think that the folks who support the Elyria Assistance Program to buy copies of the game for people that can’t afford it... might think about fundraising for the folks that were laid off but nope. How about the next sale is to get those folks health insurance for 6 months?
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Also https://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/comment/7116954/#Comment_7116954
I know predicting the fail of a new MMO isn't really something special, but I have never before felt so suspicious about a new project as I was about this "Star Citizen" wannabe(but for Fantasy).
Fleecing the Dreamers.
(Yes, it will fail. It *always* starts with layoffs).
What they need to do is get to a playable demo state as fast as possible (like Pantheon did -- they created the base game up to level 10 content). Then use that demo to land a publisher/investor.
You can't go to a publisher without a working prototype and just a stack of papers.
That's the only way forward I see. And it's not going to be easy.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I thought that repeating it wouldn't have much sense, but some of the reactions are pure comedy gold!
James Goblin likes this.
Maybe they should scrap the MMORPG and stop at the MUD. They might get that working.
OR
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer
Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/