I don't understand people that complain about ganking.IT IS PART OF WHAT FUN MEANS, isn't much more fun and exciting when you know that danger might always lurk around and not just some shitty NPCs standing in place that will not move a finger unless you get into their aggro range.
I've been ganked A LOT throughout my gaming time but i never cried about it.ANd yes i died over and over again,not just once and then been left alone.You can always overcome such problems but hey,crying is easier than thinking.
JUST A BUNCH OF CRY BABIES calling themselves gamers meh.
Yeah, you're my hero.
For me, the only masochism I'm interested in involves a tall, brunette I address as Mistress. Being ganked is about as interesting to me as having my game crash repeatedly. Ooh, the danger .
Kudos to BW for taking a small step towards keeping the (well named) 'sociopaths' in check.
I find it funny there is actually a discussion here.
OP points out facts about this game - in the quote the game dev says pretty much "if you don't like this, this game is not for you."
The people who don't like this STILL come to the thread and try and insult people and/or convince others that they are right and the OP/game devs are wrong.
This is like quite a few threads here (what it turned into)
It doesn't matter if you think its "fun" or "unfun"
It doesn't matter if you support it, don't support it or don't care
You can make all the snarky comments you want about "cry baby gamers" it won't change anything.
Companies want to make money. They've decided this is the way to make more money by retaining a player base.
Just the same as UO is still what I'd say is my favorite MMO ever (the first few years). Nobody has ever really tried to make UO2 because they have decided that's not how to make money.
So we can debate and call each other names all we want here.. its not going to change game design. Simply because we don't dictate how the games are designed. I say this mainly becuase I don't really get into why people think insulting others here, is going to help gets games designed some other way.
The only way to change development and allow open world ganking.. is to convince a company they will make a big profit by making "that game".
Bad Spok is correct. War is often not fair, but please remember this is a game post WoW, so there is no war. Tensions are high, war could break out, the fragile peace is threatend ect ect..Nothing wrong with being attacked by like lvled uneven numbers. if you are good, you could still have a chance. The problem is high lvl guys greifing low lvl guys, yeilding no experience or reward is stupid, and nothing but griefing by absolute cowards who wont fight people their own lvl because they suck.
What if I went to your kids school and beat him up after he left the protection of the staff, and then went around bragging about how much ass I kick because I am a grown man beating up elementry school kids? You guys wouldn't be saying your kid was a cry baby or war is often unfair.
Gankers are carebears because they need higher levels and better gear to actually kill an opponent in PvP.
Huge chickens.
Real men fight fairly.
That's not how real war goes though. Most fights are unfair.
It depends what you want out of your pvp content: competition style restrictions / e-sports or open world realism / unbalanced conflict.
There are also real stakes in real war and real morality. Games = not real.
Games try to emulate an alternative reality. Without that they wouldn't immerse.
Most people don't slaughter women and children IRL because.... it's morally wrong.
Sadly this isn't true. And you probably know it.
Most people don't kill unarmed and defenseless civilians in war because it's morally wrong.
Sadly this also isn't true at all. They say that in war the first casualty is truth, ... which is a delightfully paradoxal statement because the only reason why truth would be a victim is because morals were already butchered and lying in the gutter and they didn't want the public to know about it.
It is a game - in a game, cowards slaughter noobs who can't fight back - cowards and people who are bored.
It's a game which might emulate rl conflict with open world pvp options; ranks and differences aren't important: "if its red its dead".
Unbalanced conflict sounds great - if you are on the winning side.
That's the whole purpose of "the art of warfare", doing your best to be on the winning side and getting your ass in a favorable position .... and if you can't: getting the hell out and live to fight another day.
I am all for open world balanced conflict, thank you.
Good luck with finding that. Even if you match up two players against eachother with a similar level there will still be players with better gear, better knowledge of their opponents, better understanding of their class, faster reflexes, etc. Even sports aren't fair, with top clubs having huge budgets to attract the best players, etc.
(The bold text was not intended but can't be unbolded V_V)
Ganking new players and random strangers that look weaker than you has never been part of the fun in MMO gaming. It's just an exercise in silliness where some one wants to be able to say "oh lookie at how good I am" while bullying an easy taget. Really, the attitude behind it is one of the cancers in gaming culture. It's childish.
It's not part of the fun. I've never looked at gaming as a way to feel better about me... I always liked a good competitive fight in PVP for the sheer pleasure of butting heads. Doing away with newbie gank options earns a plus one in my rating booklet.
This is like quite a few threads here (what it turned into)
It doesn't matter if you think its "fun" or "unfun"
It doesn't matter if you support it, don't support it or don't care
You can make all the snarky comments you want about "cry baby gamers" it won't change anything.
Companies want to make money. They've decided this is the way to make more money by retaining a player base.
Just the same as UO is still what I'd say is my favorite MMO ever (the first few years). Nobody has ever really tried to make UO2 because they have decided that's not how to make money.
So we can debate and call each other names all we want here.. its not going to change game design. Simply because we don't dictate how the games are designed. I say this mainly becuase I don't really get into why people think insulting others here, is going to help gets games designed some other way.
The only way to change development and allow open world ganking.. is to convince a company they will make a big profit by making "that game".
Good luck with that.
+1 for this..its all about money money money ..thus the lack of good mmos out there in the past 10+yrs because of the wow factor
I play these games for the PvP aspect. I rarely (if ever) raid, and only occasionally do dungeon runs. Been playing since the original NWN, and played through the first 5 years of UO (and loved it).
I supported this in Warhammer and i certainly support it in TOR. "Ganking newbs" is not why i pay $15 a month.
Games try to emulate an alternative reality. Without that they wouldn't immerse.
Sadly this isn't true. And you probably know it.
Sadly this also isn't true at all. They say that in war the first casualty is truth, ... which is a delightfully paradoxal statement because the only reason why truth would be a victim is because morals were already butchered and lying in the gutter and they didn't want the public to know about it.
It's a game which might emulate rl conflict with open world pvp options; ranks and differences aren't important: "if its red its dead".
That's the whole purpose of "the art of warfare", doing your best to be on the winning side and getting your ass in a favorable position .... and if you can't: getting the hell out and live to fight another day.
Good luck with finding that. Even if you match up two players against eachother with a similar level there will still be players with better gear, better knowledge of their opponents, better understanding of his class, faster reflexes, etc. Even sports aren't fair, with top clubs having huge budgets to attract the best players, etc.
I think games try to be fun and immersion is not tied to reality but instead, I believe, how well they make you accept THEIR reality, their world and their truths.
Again we are talking about the real world and war, and we all know how terrible it can be.
Normal people, outside of crazy people, don't walk around shooting children in the head.
I don't think TOR is trying to emulate RL conflict in any way, shape, or form to be honest. It's trying to emulate the conflict from the movies, which itself is pretty much an emulation of the conflicts in ancient greek mythology as well as WW2 Britain (underdog) against the mighty German empire. So in a strange 3rd party kind of way.. maybe?
Because it is a game, that art of war doesn't matter because the STAKES don't matter.. because it's a game. The motivation is winning and fun not "holy shit i'm about to lose my life."
Good luck with that indeed... closest I ever saw was 10+ years ago with UO factions PvP in post-Trammel/Felucca split.
Still though, I appreciate your perspective and you make good points sir, touche.
I find it funny there is actually a discussion here.
OP points out facts about this game - in the quote the game dev says pretty much "if you don't like this, this game is not for you."
The people who don't like this STILL come to the thread and try and insult people and/or convince others that they are right and the OP/game devs are wrong.
It's so... pointless and silly.
Well...one can always bring into the account of how they're breakin the lore all open!
Obi-Wan Kenobi: I have seen a security hologram... of him... killing Younglings.
Firstly SWTOR is not, by any stretch of the imagination, a PvP game by design, even meaningfully game-play casually. Secondly players will still be ganked, even by PvE; the new definition of gank is when you lose to an opposition. One of those words that used to have meaning, but now is used to defend entitlement and welfare in a Socialist-slanted mmorpg game-play mechanics platform.
The discussion here is quite relatable to the one is Star Wars too
Haha so Anakin was a PK who liked to gank noobs.
He also ruined the game for all Jedi for like... 20+ years until he got all old and some noob that was able to run away from his gank came back and pwnd him.
Oh and his Guild Leader betrayed him, what a tool.
Hah! I'm actually rather pleased that ganking won't be possible on the starter planets.
As others have said (in this very entertaining thread) there's nothing leet about pwning newbies on a level 30.
I remember laughing my ass off on in WoW when a level 30 kept following my level 6 mage around looking for a duel and calling me chicken. I got bored, relogged on my level 70 and went to ask him to duel, and then chased him around calling him chicken til I was bored. Turnabout is fair play.
And there's nothing at all 1337 about rofl-stomping players who have only a handful of skiils and a huge level disadvantage.
If you want to pwn newbies, do it in a warzone where at least they'll have some bolstering and skill can actually be a factor.
This is why I'd like to see more mmorpgs, even themepark, that has no levels and gear upgrades would be only marginal. The current lvl1 player = a little kid, and lvl100 player = a god, is just old and bad design. Tons of ways to "level" without levels, like the often used ranking/leveling system in other games today where you get XP and gain ranks/levels to unlock perks and traits but nothing world changing.
When lvl50 is killing players that are lvl5 is like a big biker dude is beating a 5 year old kid, that's some seriously bad game design, the 5 year old has very little chances of defending himself. There's nothing carebear about disliking big bikers murdering children, especially when I'm totally fine by them getting it on with a rival gang, just leave the babies out of the picture, it's just wrong.
You can have tons of ways to progress in games without the "from a child to god" leveling cycle, also getting rid of it makes players better at games when the currently useless child molesters need to learn to actually play to get anything done in these games.
Often when I level an alt in a mmorpg I park my max level char at the zone I go, and when some other max level dude comes and one shots me, and I log onto my high level char and go hunt the ganker, they are always ridicilously crap at pvp, I've yet to meet even one of them who can stand toe to toe with me at same level, they also leave the area usually after being trampled, anyone has explanation for all this?
I do agree that the high level gankers going after lowbies are carebears, because carebears are scared of a fight and killing lowbies is the same as avoiding a fight, or they are just frustrated for being crappy in PvP, in that case I kind of understand their pain but the only way to get better is fighting other players of equal status.
Games try to emulate an alternative reality. Without that they wouldn't immerse.
Sadly this isn't true. And you probably know it.
Sadly this also isn't true at all. They say that in war the first casualty is truth, ... which is a delightfully paradoxal statement because the only reason why truth would be a victim is because morals were already butchered and lying in the gutter and they didn't want the public to know about it.
It's a game which might emulate rl conflict with open world pvp options; ranks and differences aren't important: "if its red its dead".
That's the whole purpose of "the art of warfare", doing your best to be on the winning side and getting your ass in a favorable position .... and if you can't: getting the hell out and live to fight another day.
Good luck with finding that. Even if you match up two players against eachother with a similar level there will still be players with better gear, better knowledge of their opponents, better understanding of his class, faster reflexes, etc. Even sports aren't fair, with top clubs having huge budgets to attract the best players, etc.
I think games try to be fun and immersion is not tied to reality but instead, I believe, how well they make you accept THEIR reality, their world and their truths.
Again we are talking about the real world and war, and we all know how terrible it can be.
Normal people, outside of crazy people, don't walk around shooting children in the head.
I don't think TOR is trying to emulate RL conflict in any way, shape, or form to be honest. It's trying to emulate the conflict from the movies, which itself is pretty much an emulation of the conflicts in ancient greek mythology as well as WW2 Britain (underdog) against the mighty German empire. So in a strange 3rd party kind of way.. maybe?
Because it is a game, that art of war doesn't matter because the STAKES don't matter.. because it's a game. The motivation is winning and fun not "holy shit i'm about to lose my life."
Good luck with that indeed... closest I ever saw was 10+ years ago with UO factions PvP in post-Trammel/Felucca split.
Still though, I appreciate your perspective and you make good points sir, touche.
I appreciate your points as well. I'm opposed to killing noobs "for the lulz" just the same and I have shown a lot of people mercy in my mmorpg carreer as killing them would often pose no challenge and thus, no satisfaction.
But the grim realism of imbalanced situations in world pvp is what I really like about it:
- Faction A might stage an assault on faction B's territory:
- Faction B get's roflstomped initially: people complain in local chat, "OMG I can't complete ma quest!", others start a raid and call friends to help out
- Faction B gets reinforcements in and the battle goes back and forth for a while
- Faction B's mothers, monkeys and their friends join the fun, Faction A gets hunted down and destroyed
^^^ Just your average world pvp scenario with loads of imbalanced situations but a lot of fun for everyone at the end of the day.
Also the unpredictability is such a great thing, you never really know what's going to happen out there and you need to be on your guard. Really love that personally. What's the fun of totally predictable AI and aggro range being your only concerns out there in the world? Gets very stale eventually I think. ^_^
Non-consensual PvP would be fine if the game were built around people being relatively similar in power either through sheer head count or through skill. Take a look at WoW -- a few level 40s at one point could take a level 60 out with some finesse. Now that the stats and numbers have been inflated, it's absolutely never going to happen. Hell, a level 80 stands zero chance against an 85 and I can tell from the numbers alone without even having played Cataclysm. 5 levels difference!
An unfair fight is fine if there are at least some odds in favor of the underdog. Most games are so black and white when it comes to a fight, though.
Dark I'd say that scenario is rather balanced and a perfect example of balanced open world PvP.
Every single fight doesn't have to be perfectly balanced 5vs5 etc. but I'm talking over-all balance over the course of time.
Not one group getting rofl-stommped every day for weeks and weeks until they just quit and BEG the devs for more battlegrounds...
Yes but that is exactly where strategy and planning comes in.
I don't want to boats too much but in my WOW days I played on a horde dominated rp pvp server on alliance side, I think the server population was 2:1 in their favor.
They regularly raided our capitals and we were always on the defense in random groups and could hardly fend them off, so I started this "coalition" to put a stop to that; got all the interested guild leaders together for RP'd "war council" sessions. We organized our defenses and made a quick response channel to get our defenses up quicker.
Finally it culminated in a raid of at least 250 people to Ogrimmar at 20:00 servertime. Organized to perfection with all participating guild members only informed at the very last moment by their leaders, we rushed through Ashenvale, jumped in the river, swam down to the Barrens entrance and stormed through their back door, we managed to kill their racial npc leaders and wrecked havoc, slaying horde for half an hour untill we were routed. Best time ever and our horde adversaries couldn't believe that we managed that and at prime time too.
This invigorated the whole server: the alliance side because they felt they weren't powerless anymore and the horde side because they felt they finally had some worthy opposition.
TLDR: Planning and strategy can compensate for quite a bit of population imbalance and make your server a better place ^_^
"there will be no ganking of newbie players in The Old Republic as all Origin Worlds are sanctuaries that can not be invaded by the other faction. We have no interest in allowing high level players to choke off the supply of new players into the game by ganking them over and over before they have learned the ropes of their class.
Hard to find a game out there where the new player starting area isn't protected so honestly not surprising.
I don't understand people that complain about ganking.IT IS PART OF WHAT FUN MEANS, isn't much more fun and exciting when you know that danger might always lurk around and not just some shitty NPCs standing in place that will not move a finger unless you get into their aggro range.
I've been ganked A LOT throughout my gaming time but i never cried about it.ANd yes i died over and over again,not just once and then been left alone.You can always overcome such problems but hey,crying is easier than thinking.
JUST A BUNCH OF CRY BABIES calling themselves gamers meh.
Yeah, you're my hero.
For me, the only masochism I'm interested in involves a tall, brunette I address as Mistress. Being ganked is about as interesting to me as having my game crash repeatedly. Ooh, the danger .
Kudos to BW for taking a small step towards keeping the (well named) 'sociopaths' in check.
Games try to emulate an alternative reality. Without that they wouldn't immerse.
Sadly this isn't true. And you probably know it.
Sadly this also isn't true at all. They say that in war the first casualty is truth, ... which is a delightfully paradoxal statement because the only reason why truth would be a victim is because morals were already butchered and lying in the gutter and they didn't want the public to know about it.
It's a game which might emulate rl conflict with open world pvp options; ranks and differences aren't important: "if its red its dead".
That's the whole purpose of "the art of warfare", doing your best to be on the winning side and getting your ass in a favorable position .... and if you can't: getting the hell out and live to fight another day.
Good luck with finding that. Even if you match up two players against eachother with a similar level there will still be players with better gear, better knowledge of their opponents, better understanding of his class, faster reflexes, etc. Even sports aren't fair, with top clubs having huge budgets to attract the best players, etc.
I think games try to be fun and immersion is not tied to reality but instead, I believe, how well they make you accept THEIR reality, their world and their truths.
Again we are talking about the real world and war, and we all know how terrible it can be.
Normal people, outside of crazy people, don't walk around shooting children in the head.
I don't think TOR is trying to emulate RL conflict in any way, shape, or form to be honest. It's trying to emulate the conflict from the movies, which itself is pretty much an emulation of the conflicts in ancient greek mythology as well as WW2 Britain (underdog) against the mighty German empire. So in a strange 3rd party kind of way.. maybe?
Because it is a game, that art of war doesn't matter because the STAKES don't matter.. because it's a game. The motivation is winning and fun not "holy shit i'm about to lose my life."
Good luck with that indeed... closest I ever saw was 10+ years ago with UO factions PvP in post-Trammel/Felucca split.
Still though, I appreciate your perspective and you make good points sir, touche.
I wanna be able to emulate skywalker then by going into the new area and killing all the level 1 jedis like he did in the movie. Now would you call that griefing or ganking? Either way looked like it was fun. Pretty sure he stood no chance of dieing in there.
How many delicate flowers have you met in Counterstrike?
I got a case of beer and a chainsaw waiting for me at home after work.
Also the easiest way to stop ganks is not show the level of players to the gankers. How many people would attack another if they were not sure of the level. Now i know you could just wait to see them attack a mob and see how difficult it was for them to kill it, but most griefers or gankers only look at lvls to kill.
How many delicate flowers have you met in Counterstrike?
I got a case of beer and a chainsaw waiting for me at home after work.
If they allowed it, I could care less. It's an inevitable reality of PvP Servers in most games.
If they disallow it, so be it. I don't gank low level players anyways, so I lose nothing.
Lowbie gankers are pretty trash players tbh though. I have yet to meet one who ended up being any type of competitive player at endgame. The majority of them are simply mediocre players looking for an easy egoboost and a quick false sense of superiority, imho.
I don't understand people that complain about ganking.IT IS PART OF WHAT FUN MEANS, isn't much more fun and exciting when you know that danger might always lurk around and not just some shitty NPCs standing in place that will not move a finger unless you get into their aggro range.
I've been ganked A LOT throughout my gaming time but i never cried about it.ANd yes i died over and over again,not just once and then been left alone.You can always overcome such problems but hey,crying is easier than thinking.
JUST A BUNCH OF CRY BABIES calling themselves gamers meh.
There are plenty of single player RPGs.
What do single player RPG's have to do with this? Second, who said anything about " no ganking" if there is world PVP (there is) ganking will exist, it just won't be a lvl 50 vs a lvl 1.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Comments
Yeah, you're my hero.
For me, the only masochism I'm interested in involves a tall, brunette I address as Mistress. Being ganked is about as interesting to me as having my game crash repeatedly. Ooh, the danger .
Kudos to BW for taking a small step towards keeping the (well named) 'sociopaths' in check.
I find it funny there is actually a discussion here.
OP points out facts about this game - in the quote the game dev says pretty much "if you don't like this, this game is not for you."
The people who don't like this STILL come to the thread and try and insult people and/or convince others that they are right and the OP/game devs are wrong.
It's so... pointless and silly.
This is like quite a few threads here (what it turned into)
It doesn't matter if you think its "fun" or "unfun"
It doesn't matter if you support it, don't support it or don't care
You can make all the snarky comments you want about "cry baby gamers" it won't change anything.
Companies want to make money. They've decided this is the way to make more money by retaining a player base.
Just the same as UO is still what I'd say is my favorite MMO ever (the first few years). Nobody has ever really tried to make UO2 because they have decided that's not how to make money.
So we can debate and call each other names all we want here.. its not going to change game design. Simply because we don't dictate how the games are designed. I say this mainly becuase I don't really get into why people think insulting others here, is going to help gets games designed some other way.
The only way to change development and allow open world ganking.. is to convince a company they will make a big profit by making "that game".
Good luck with that.
Bad Spok is correct. War is often not fair, but please remember this is a game post WoW, so there is no war. Tensions are high, war could break out, the fragile peace is threatend ect ect..Nothing wrong with being attacked by like lvled uneven numbers. if you are good, you could still have a chance. The problem is high lvl guys greifing low lvl guys, yeilding no experience or reward is stupid, and nothing but griefing by absolute cowards who wont fight people their own lvl because they suck.
What if I went to your kids school and beat him up after he left the protection of the staff, and then went around bragging about how much ass I kick because I am a grown man beating up elementry school kids? You guys wouldn't be saying your kid was a cry baby or war is often unfair.
My brand new bloggity blog.
Ganking new players and random strangers that look weaker than you has never been part of the fun in MMO gaming. It's just an exercise in silliness where some one wants to be able to say "oh lookie at how good I am" while bullying an easy taget. Really, the attitude behind it is one of the cancers in gaming culture. It's childish.
It's not part of the fun. I've never looked at gaming as a way to feel better about me... I always liked a good competitive fight in PVP for the sheer pleasure of butting heads. Doing away with newbie gank options earns a plus one in my rating booklet.
+1 for this..its all about money money money ..thus the lack of good mmos out there in the past 10+yrs because of the wow factor
I play these games for the PvP aspect. I rarely (if ever) raid, and only occasionally do dungeon runs. Been playing since the original NWN, and played through the first 5 years of UO (and loved it).
I supported this in Warhammer and i certainly support it in TOR. "Ganking newbs" is not why i pay $15 a month.
Fantastic!
Ganking of newbs should only go with games that have full loot, like Darkfall. I support this 100% even though I consider myself a "PvP'er".
Make us care MORE about our faction & world pvp!
I think games try to be fun and immersion is not tied to reality but instead, I believe, how well they make you accept THEIR reality, their world and their truths.
Again we are talking about the real world and war, and we all know how terrible it can be.
Normal people, outside of crazy people, don't walk around shooting children in the head.
I don't think TOR is trying to emulate RL conflict in any way, shape, or form to be honest. It's trying to emulate the conflict from the movies, which itself is pretty much an emulation of the conflicts in ancient greek mythology as well as WW2 Britain (underdog) against the mighty German empire. So in a strange 3rd party kind of way.. maybe?
Because it is a game, that art of war doesn't matter because the STAKES don't matter.. because it's a game. The motivation is winning and fun not "holy shit i'm about to lose my life."
Good luck with that indeed... closest I ever saw was 10+ years ago with UO factions PvP in post-Trammel/Felucca split.
Still though, I appreciate your perspective and you make good points sir, touche.
Well...one can always bring into the account of how they're breakin the lore all open!
Obi-Wan Kenobi: I have seen a security hologram... of him... killing Younglings.
Padmé: No! Not Anakin! He couldn't...
Padmé: He said... you turned to the Dark Side. That you... killed Younglings!
Anakin Skywalker: Obi-Wan is trying to turn you against me.
The discussion here is quite relatable to the one is Star Wars too
Firstly SWTOR is not, by any stretch of the imagination, a PvP game by design, even meaningfully game-play casually. Secondly players will still be ganked, even by PvE; the new definition of gank is when you lose to an opposition. One of those words that used to have meaning, but now is used to defend entitlement and welfare in a Socialist-slanted mmorpg game-play mechanics platform.
Haha so Anakin was a PK who liked to gank noobs.
He also ruined the game for all Jedi for like... 20+ years until he got all old and some noob that was able to run away from his gank came back and pwnd him.
Oh and his Guild Leader betrayed him, what a tool.
Hah! I'm actually rather pleased that ganking won't be possible on the starter planets.
As others have said (in this very entertaining thread) there's nothing leet about pwning newbies on a level 30.
I remember laughing my ass off on in WoW when a level 30 kept following my level 6 mage around looking for a duel and calling me chicken. I got bored, relogged on my level 70 and went to ask him to duel, and then chased him around calling him chicken til I was bored. Turnabout is fair play.
And there's nothing at all 1337 about rofl-stomping players who have only a handful of skiils and a huge level disadvantage.
If you want to pwn newbies, do it in a warzone where at least they'll have some bolstering and skill can actually be a factor.
Ya know, skill? The thing that really matters.
This is why I'd like to see more mmorpgs, even themepark, that has no levels and gear upgrades would be only marginal. The current lvl1 player = a little kid, and lvl100 player = a god, is just old and bad design. Tons of ways to "level" without levels, like the often used ranking/leveling system in other games today where you get XP and gain ranks/levels to unlock perks and traits but nothing world changing.
When lvl50 is killing players that are lvl5 is like a big biker dude is beating a 5 year old kid, that's some seriously bad game design, the 5 year old has very little chances of defending himself. There's nothing carebear about disliking big bikers murdering children, especially when I'm totally fine by them getting it on with a rival gang, just leave the babies out of the picture, it's just wrong.
You can have tons of ways to progress in games without the "from a child to god" leveling cycle, also getting rid of it makes players better at games when the currently useless child molesters need to learn to actually play to get anything done in these games.
Often when I level an alt in a mmorpg I park my max level char at the zone I go, and when some other max level dude comes and one shots me, and I log onto my high level char and go hunt the ganker, they are always ridicilously crap at pvp, I've yet to meet even one of them who can stand toe to toe with me at same level, they also leave the area usually after being trampled, anyone has explanation for all this?
I do agree that the high level gankers going after lowbies are carebears, because carebears are scared of a fight and killing lowbies is the same as avoiding a fight, or they are just frustrated for being crappy in PvP, in that case I kind of understand their pain but the only way to get better is fighting other players of equal status.
I appreciate your points as well. I'm opposed to killing noobs "for the lulz" just the same and I have shown a lot of people mercy in my mmorpg carreer as killing them would often pose no challenge and thus, no satisfaction.
But the grim realism of imbalanced situations in world pvp is what I really like about it:
- Faction A might stage an assault on faction B's territory:
- Faction B get's roflstomped initially: people complain in local chat, "OMG I can't complete ma quest!", others start a raid and call friends to help out
- Faction B gets reinforcements in and the battle goes back and forth for a while
- Faction B's mothers, monkeys and their friends join the fun, Faction A gets hunted down and destroyed
^^^ Just your average world pvp scenario with loads of imbalanced situations but a lot of fun for everyone at the end of the day.
Also the unpredictability is such a great thing, you never really know what's going to happen out there and you need to be on your guard. Really love that personally. What's the fun of totally predictable AI and aggro range being your only concerns out there in the world? Gets very stale eventually I think. ^_^
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Dark I'd say that scenario is rather balanced and a perfect example of balanced open world PvP.
Every single fight doesn't have to be perfectly balanced 5vs5 etc. but I'm talking over-all balance over the course of time.
Not one group getting rofl-stommped every day for weeks and weeks until they just quit and BEG the devs for more battlegrounds...
Non-consensual PvP would be fine if the game were built around people being relatively similar in power either through sheer head count or through skill. Take a look at WoW -- a few level 40s at one point could take a level 60 out with some finesse. Now that the stats and numbers have been inflated, it's absolutely never going to happen. Hell, a level 80 stands zero chance against an 85 and I can tell from the numbers alone without even having played Cataclysm. 5 levels difference!
An unfair fight is fine if there are at least some odds in favor of the underdog. Most games are so black and white when it comes to a fight, though.
Yes but that is exactly where strategy and planning comes in.
I don't want to boats too much but in my WOW days I played on a horde dominated rp pvp server on alliance side, I think the server population was 2:1 in their favor.
They regularly raided our capitals and we were always on the defense in random groups and could hardly fend them off, so I started this "coalition" to put a stop to that; got all the interested guild leaders together for RP'd "war council" sessions. We organized our defenses and made a quick response channel to get our defenses up quicker.
Finally it culminated in a raid of at least 250 people to Ogrimmar at 20:00 servertime. Organized to perfection with all participating guild members only informed at the very last moment by their leaders, we rushed through Ashenvale, jumped in the river, swam down to the Barrens entrance and stormed through their back door, we managed to kill their racial npc leaders and wrecked havoc, slaying horde for half an hour untill we were routed. Best time ever and our horde adversaries couldn't believe that we managed that and at prime time too.
This invigorated the whole server: the alliance side because they felt they weren't powerless anymore and the horde side because they felt they finally had some worthy opposition.
TLDR: Planning and strategy can compensate for quite a bit of population imbalance and make your server a better place ^_^
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Hard to find a game out there where the new player starting area isn't protected so honestly not surprising.
There are plenty of single player RPGs.
I wanna be able to emulate skywalker then by going into the new area and killing all the level 1 jedis like he did in the movie. Now would you call that griefing or ganking? Either way looked like it was fun. Pretty sure he stood no chance of dieing in there.
How many delicate flowers have you met in Counterstrike?
I got a case of beer and a chainsaw waiting for me at home after work.
Also the easiest way to stop ganks is not show the level of players to the gankers. How many people would attack another if they were not sure of the level. Now i know you could just wait to see them attack a mob and see how difficult it was for them to kill it, but most griefers or gankers only look at lvls to kill.
How many delicate flowers have you met in Counterstrike?
I got a case of beer and a chainsaw waiting for me at home after work.
Doesn't bother me either way.
If they allowed it, I could care less. It's an inevitable reality of PvP Servers in most games.
If they disallow it, so be it. I don't gank low level players anyways, so I lose nothing.
Lowbie gankers are pretty trash players tbh though. I have yet to meet one who ended up being any type of competitive player at endgame. The majority of them are simply mediocre players looking for an easy egoboost and a quick false sense of superiority, imho.
Thanks for posting OP.
What do single player RPG's have to do with this? Second, who said anything about " no ganking" if there is world PVP (there is) ganking will exist, it just won't be a lvl 50 vs a lvl 1.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson