Always fun to have some coward jump you after you almost finish a really hard pve fight and you are low on health. I hope they all die from dick cancer.
Well maybe if you weren't unfriendly, people wouldn't kill you
Also don't get why people play games when they don't like the basic mechanics.
"I got killed in a game that has PVP, this is stupid!" Perfect logic.
Want fair/balanced/safe competition, play one of many that does just that.
They are expecting other players to exhibit a sense of honor, fair play, civility and restraint, in order to keep it fun for everyone.
What they get are the morally bankrupt, disreputable sociopaths who would rather disrupt others fun and enjoy seeing the world burn.
And here is the problem we have with some pve players , who take what happens to them in game too seriously. Trust me you might think a person who gank you is a basement dwelling psychopath but reality is it could be a teenage girl half paying attention to the game and not taking it as seriously as some of you. Watch Twitch, plenty of examples there of what I wrote.
Simple rule of pvp , if you are red, you are dead. Everyone who plays on pvp servers/games knows this.
I don't think anyone here doubts their knowledge that their characters are constantly at risk of being killed in a PvP game. It's not so easy as saying red = dead because of simple game design. When I was in the Army, I couldn't just walk around killing the "enemy" because of ROE. There are no ROE's in online games, which is the entire argument against griefing / ganking. Now, if the Karma system doesn't get altered too much in NA / EU version, I'm sure everything would be fine, but guess what. Those griefers / gankers complained about repercussions being too hard.
As it was, murdering 3-5 people in BDO put that player at a 100% risk of dropping gear loot. They complained there was no incentive then because the people they killed only have a chance of dropping loot. So, a game designs a fair and realistic approach to dealing with murderers and the supposed "PvP elites" complain it's too much challenge? Please. Griefers / gankers don't want challenge, they want the satisfaction of devaluing other peoples entertainment.
You injecting real life morality in a game , where a lot pvp players don't do that, they don't take what they do in a game serious. Force pvp is not really a thing anymore , there is plenty of options in onlineverse now. If you going to play on a server or game with pvp, just by being there you give consent to be attack at anytime. Pvp players don't see anything wrong with that, and if someone is getting too mad about it , they don't belong in the type of gameplay. BD is not hiding the pvp rules of the game , if you going to play at max level, you are agreeing to play with those rules for pvp.
I can give you list of twitch/youtube gamers that are perfectly nice people in real life , but they will happily gank you in game.
Always fun to have some coward jump you after you almost finish a really hard pve fight and you are low on health. I hope they all die from dick cancer.
Well maybe if you weren't unfriendly, people wouldn't kill you
Also don't get why people play games when they don't like the basic mechanics.
"I got killed in a game that has PVP, this is stupid!" Perfect logic.
Want fair/balanced/safe competition, play one of many that does just that.
They are expecting other players to exhibit a sense of honor, fair play, civility and restraint, in order to keep it fun for everyone.
What they get are the morally bankrupt, disreputable sociopaths who would rather disrupt others fun and enjoy seeing the world burn.
And here is the problem we have with some pve players , who take what happens to them in game too seriously. Trust me you might think a person who gank you is a basement dwelling psychopath but reality is it could be a teenage girl half paying attention to the game and not taking it as seriously as some of you. Watch Twitch, plenty of examples there of what I wrote.
Simple rule of pvp , if you are red, you are dead. Everyone who plays on pvp servers/games knows this.
I don't think anyone here doubts their knowledge that their characters are constantly at risk of being killed in a PvP game. It's not so easy as saying red = dead because of simple game design. When I was in the Army, I couldn't just walk around killing the "enemy" because of ROE. There are no ROE's in online games, which is the entire argument against griefing / ganking. Now, if the Karma system doesn't get altered too much in NA / EU version, I'm sure everything would be fine, but guess what. Those griefers / gankers complained about repercussions being too hard.
As it was, murdering 3-5 people in BDO put that player at a 100% risk of dropping gear loot. They complained there was no incentive then because the people they killed only have a chance of dropping loot. So, a game designs a fair and realistic approach to dealing with murderers and the supposed "PvP elites" complain it's too much challenge? Please. Griefers / gankers don't want challenge, they want the satisfaction of devaluing other peoples entertainment.
You injecting real life morality in a game , where a lot pvp players don't do that, they don't take what they do in a game serious. Force pvp is not really a thing anymore , there is plenty of options in onlineverse now. If you going to play on a server or game with pvp, just by being there you give consent to be attack at anytime. Pvp players don't see anything wrong with that, and if someone is getting too mad about it , they don't belong in the type of gameplay. BD is not hiding the pvp rules of the game , if you going to play at max level, you are agreeing to play with those rules for pvp.
I can give you list of twitch/youtube gamers that are perfectly nice people in real life , but they will happily gank you in game.
Real and virtual life aren't completely separate. You spend real life time in a virtual environment and most people want maximize their enjoyment.
Some pvp players don't take what they do to other people seriously. They most certainly take what happens to them seriously, else they wouldn't have whined and cried to get Karma penalties reduced.
There are different attitudes to pvp. In the Americas/EU it seems more that players like ffa pvp with little consequences. They kill for no reason other than to PK. In Korean pvp games I've played the players won't hesitate to PK another, but they generally have a reason for it.
That's okay, but generally why I don't play western ffa pvp games. Mindless ganking doesn't interest me.
Some people do want to keep virtual life and real life separate , its just a difference of opinion. The players that are whiners are ridiculed by other pvp players. Personally I don't see the difference between a pvp player crying on the forums about class balance and a "elite" raider crying about the same thing on the pve side of things. The karma system is too harsh for NA/EU players, it is being change to make pvp more fun for us. After all it is pvp game , pve is not really the focus.
Except there is already plenty of access to PvP via the guild war system. The only PvP being hindered by the Karma system is a very specific type of PvP that deters 90% of people from playing those games. I guarantee you, if BDO favored that type of PvP game play and removed all their PvE features, BDO would be dead in the water before it even launched. This is nothing more than the vocal minority asking for a well designed game to be more ganker / griefer friendly. It's that simple.
The karma system has already been change, the bounty system gives back karma when you need to get rid of some and you don't lose gear in this version. Also this not a run of the mill pve game with pvp added , pvp is the "endgame" pve is mostly there to supplement the pvp, there is not much there to keep a hadrcore pve player in the game. A lot people that are buying the founder packs and active on the BD forums are pvp players, they don't want BD turning into a pve game. If you want to be max level then you have to deal with pvp or you can stay at 49 and not be touch at all. By the time you hit 50 you should know your class and stand a better chance against same level players, camping of lowbies won't be a issue here.
Anyone that buys it, installs, and logs in will be agreeing to participate.
Every single online game I've ever played that allows one person to interact with another has morons. Be it those that are immature, just trolling and doing it for the lulz, to those a little off in the head.
If anyone has ever played a game with zero foolish people in it, I'd like to know what games those are.
BDO offers many outlets for PVP, much of which is structured.
However, in a game where individuals/groups are fighting to get a head of others, attacking people "randomly" might not be so "random."
PVE hot spots will be contested and people will kill others so they can PVE themselves.
For those that want to run around randomly killing others without a lot of reason beyond the entertainment value, the Karma/Bounty system seems like a decent middle ground.
No system will be perfect for everyone or anyone really.
Those that can't handle being killed once in a while should simply stay away if their pixels mean that much to them.
If someone is going above and beyond into the offensive realm, they should be reported if they are violating rules. Same goes if they are exploiting the PVP system.
Beyond that, buckle up and enjoy the ride.
Edit: Just to add that while I can see why people dislike being "ganked" or attacked in what they see as an unfair setup, OW PVP reminds me of going to the arcade when I was young.
I'd be doing my thing playing Street Fighter or whatever and someone would come along, slap in some quarters and now we were fighting. I didn't ask for it, but there it was.
If I lost, game over for me or I could come back and try again. If I simply wasn't as good, maybe I learned a few things. If I won, yay good for me.
It was an entirely different experience than just mashing buttons at the AI.
I'm sure there are some that would simply walk away from the machine as soon as someone else joined or better yet not go to the arcade to begin with, but these games are designed how they are for a reason.
If people were meant to play BDO in a safe bubble, they would make a no flag PVP option, but they didn't. People can either accept the dev vision/design or play something else. Would suck to spend so much time/energy/money into creating such a product for people to come along and go "NO NO NO, I don't want that." Looks like Daum has at least tried to reason with these folks, but still pretty silly.
I know it goes against politically correct culture, but we aren't all winners all of the time. Sometimes losing is simply what happens.
Always fun to have some coward jump you after you almost finish a really hard pve fight and you are low on health. I hope they all die from dick cancer.
Well maybe if you weren't unfriendly, people wouldn't kill you
Also don't get why people play games when they don't like the basic mechanics.
"I got killed in a game that has PVP, this is stupid!" Perfect logic.
Want fair/balanced/safe competition, play one of many that does just that.
They are expecting other players to exhibit a sense of honor, fair play, civility and restraint, in order to keep it fun for everyone.
What they get are the morally bankrupt, disreputable sociopaths who would rather disrupt others fun and enjoy seeing the world burn.
And here is the problem we have with some pve players , who take what happens to them in game too seriously. Trust me you might think a person who gank you is a basement dwelling psychopath but reality is it could be a teenage girl half paying attention to the game and not taking it as seriously as some of you. Watch Twitch, plenty of examples there of what I wrote.
Simple rule of pvp , if you are red, you are dead. Everyone who plays on pvp servers/games knows this.
I'd have little problem if they ganked once. There are literally games with open world pvp where there are roving deathsquads of gankers that will repeatedly and systematically continually kill you because they know the quests in an area and they know the spawn points too. It's the people that repeatedly kill you over and over and over and over and over that are a problem and they do it to cause grief frequently to try and get players to rage quit a game. No one enjoys this happening and it's hard to shrug it off when the same asshat kills you 20 times in 10 minutes.
Gankers are not something that is "nice" and they breed a shitty community around them because most of the time they are trolls. It's not often a teenage girl half paying attention to the game that is walking around lowbie areas looking for low level players to gank, it is trolls and while it might be a teenage girl she knows full well what she is doing.
It's not like I was pulling shit out of thin air. Just because game designs change constantly, doesn't mean EVERYONE keeps up to date. The last thing I read about the Karma system was their update from CBT1 posted less than 3 weeks ago and their indecisiveness to find an answer to the problem. So forgive me for my lack of research skills. This is the point of forums. So people can be given up to date information. Thanks for expressing your expert knowledge earlier in the thread when it was first brought up, or did you not know about it either?
Guess my smiley didn't do his job today.
Wasn't a personal attack against your person, but rather a comment about the absurdity of forum discussions as a whole.
Funny thread went off the rails only 2 comments in.
My expert knowledge comes from the same source as anyone else paying attention trying to make informed comments. Obviously I only knew what was available at that time, but wasn't trying to get into some serious SJW discussion.
Although I do like this comment of mine: "I love PVP, but find attacking those that won't fight back to be pointless and zero challenge. Fun? Sure, but I'd rather have a challenge than just lulz."
Anyone that buys it, installs, and logs in will be agreeing to participate.
Every single online game I've ever played that allows one person to interact with another has morons. Be it those that are immature, just trolling and doing it for the lulz, to those a little off in the head.
If anyone has ever played a game with zero foolish people in it, I'd like to know what games those are.
BDO offers many outlets for PVP, much of which is structured.
However, in a game where individuals/groups are fighting to get a head of others, attacking people "randomly" might not be so "random."
PVE hot spots will be contested and people will kill others so they can PVE themselves.
For those that want to run around randomly killing others without a lot of reason beyond the entertainment value, the Karma/Bounty system seems like a decent middle ground.
No system will be perfect for everyone or anyone really.
Those that can't handle being killed once in a while should simply stay away if their pixels mean that much to them.
If someone is going above and beyond into the offensive realm, they should be reported if they are violating rules. Same goes if they are exploiting the PVP system.
Beyond that, buckle up and enjoy the ride.
Edit: Just to add that while I can see why people dislike being "ganked" or attacked in what they see as an unfair setup, OW PVP reminds me of going to the arcade when I was young.
I'd be doing my thing playing Street Fighter or whatever and someone would come along, slap in some quarters and now we were fighting. I didn't ask for it, but there it was.
If I lost, game over for me or I could come back and try again. If I simply wasn't as good, maybe I learned a few things. If I won, yay good for me.
It was an entirely different experience than just mashing buttons at the AI.
I'm sure there are some that would simply walk away from the machine as soon as someone else joined or better yet not go to the arcade to begin with, but these games are designed how they are for a reason.
If people were meant to play BDO in a safe bubble, they would make a no flag PVP option, but they didn't. People can either accept the dev vision/design or play something else. Would suck to spend so much time/energy/money into creating such a product for people to come along and go "NO NO NO, I don't want that." Looks like Daum has at least tried to reason with these folks, but still pretty silly.
I know it goes against politically correct culture, but we aren't all winners all of the time. Sometimes losing is simply what happens.
The problem with this is that there is an unfair system in many games. Someone has way better gear, someone is massively higher in level etc. Ganking isn't competitive nor is it a system where you can come back and do better in the time frame that that person is around. The problem with ganking is you will get groups of high levels targeting a person or group with REPEATED deaths. It's not a once and done thing. They will continually kill you left and right until you stop playing for the evening. Most games started to implement the flagging system to combat this that only people that actively wanted to particpate in PVP would do so. Something like blade & soul has or SWG before it.
Someone can like competitive pvp, but hate gankers. PVP'ing where you are guaranteed a win isn't pvp nor is it competitive. A one sided fight is literally just that one sided, if the person cannot fight back they aren't going to come back in an hour able to. Leveling takes time and energy. People doing pve content do not want to be repeatedly killed by the same group of gankers constantly for an hour of their lives and those things do happen FREQUENTLY in open world pvp games.
I'd have little problem if they ganked once. There are literally games with open world pvp where there are roving deathsquads of gankers that will repeatedly and systematically continually kill you because they know the quests in an area and they know the spawn points too. It's the people that repeatedly kill you over and over and over and over and over that are a problem and they do it to cause grief frequently to try and get players to rage quit a game. No one enjoys this happening and it's hard to shrug it off when the same asshat kills you 20 times in 10 minutes.
Gankers are not something that is "nice" and they breed a shitty community around them because most of the time they are trolls. It's not often a teenage girl half paying attention to the game that is walking around lowbie areas looking for low level players to gank, it is trolls and while it might be a teenage girl she knows full well what she is doing.
While I don't disagree with your assessment of such individuals, this is also a mmo and I can only assume that the devs assume we will be playing with others.
Not to say you need to roam around with 50 people at all times, but if someone kills you more than once, time to call in some help or do something else for a while.
At the same time, BDO is very gear/grind dependent and if someone is spending their time mindlessly killing, they aren't being very productive. At some point the victims will out level/gear/power that attackers.
I also assume that with a bounty system and simply all those that dislike the riff raff messing with others, we'll see anti-deathsquad squads running around mopping the floor with them as well.
Some people (myself) love PVP, but want a challenge. I have little enjoyment in attacking someone weaker or that doesn't want to engage. Hunting the hunters is quite fun.
The problem with this is that there is an unfair system in many games. Someone has way better gear, someone is massively higher in level etc. Ganking isn't competitive nor is it a system where you can come back and do better in the time frame that that person is around. The problem with ganking is you will get groups of high levels targeting a person or group with REPEATED deaths. It's not a once and done thing. They will continually kill you left and right until you stop playing for the evening. Most games started to implement the flagging system to combat this that only people that actively wanted to particpate in PVP would do so. Something like blade & soul has or SWG before it.
Someone can like competitive pvp, but hate gankers. PVP'ing where you are guaranteed a win isn't pvp nor is it competitive. A one sided fight is literally just that one sided, if the person cannot fight back they aren't going to come back in an hour able to. Leveling takes time and energy. People doing pve content do not want to be repeatedly killed by the same group of gankers constantly for an hour of their lives and those things do happen FREQUENTLY in open world pvp games.
As I said above, strength in numbers.
BDO is also a huge game so there isn't one spot to do XYZ outside of specific quests. Even quest mobs can be found over large/multiple areas.
As I also said, those spending great amounts of time attacking people aren't going to have the time to grind for power. At some point there will be good guy grinders outpacing them and able to wipe them away. Maybe not day zero, but will happen.
Typically the "good guys" far outnumber the "bad guys" in these games. Unfortunately the small minority are what people remember.
If an individual/group gets to a certain high point and then goes after weaker targets, I have no respect for them, but it simply can't last forever. Nature of the design.
Dying repeatedly implies the victim isn't changing their tactics.
In a game that has OW PVP, people have to be able to adapt to the situation. It isn't either rage quit or be killed over and over.
In a game that offers multiple ways to play, I don't see it as PVE vs PVP. Players are simply players in a larger design.
If someone wants to limited themselves to XYZ, that's on them. There are options available and refusing to use them because they have tunnel vision falls back to their side of the court.
Either suck it up and accept death as a PVEr or adapt and play the game as intended (multi faceted).
If people want fair PVP, playing something like BDO is a mistake. Almost every other mmo has some form of structured/fair PVP. BDO itself has several outlets for this. They've simply gone with OW PVP as well and are offering yet another form of gameplay. It clearly isn't for everyone and that is just fine. Every game doesn't need to be balanced around the least common denominator. Some games simply appeal to particular types and anyone buying in has to accept that.
OP back. Wow, I almost drown in the river of salty tears on here.
Thanks for all the replies, though. I enjoyed reading it all.
Since the karma system has been revamped, and it won't be long until the outlaw town is implemented I think I'll be right at home ganking the unsuspecting in BDO.
I'm thinking Ranger and Witch, or maybe even Valk for the CC. I really don't want to run with more than three people at once so it's easier to escape.
I think having a bounty on my head and people trying to come kill me (so unfair!) sounds really exciting. I hope a lot of you have the same in game name as your forum name - if not, feel free to leave it in the response.
This thread is a prime example of why open world PvP games never last. Look at all these PVP essays, novels and walls of text typed in this thread. People clearly feel strongly about it, it's a game breaking issue for many. It sucks for me though because I'm big on OW PvP. Oh well.
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
This thread is a prime example of why open world PvP games never last. Look at all these PVP essays, novels and walls of text typed in this thread. People clearly feel strongly about it, it's a game breaking issue for many. It sucks for me though because I'm big on OW PvP. Oh well.
Some of us have too much free time and or can't condense our thoughts/opinions into one liners. Probably why I don't use twitter/FB/youtube comments, etc. Just not witty enough.
OW PVP will be a big part of BDO if you haven't been reading up on launch plans and what they would like to do later on. However, OW PVP doesn't mean killing everything that moves just because without consequences. I plan to have a good time hunting down PKs and hope the bounty/reward system for doing so gets fleshed out more over time.
The problem is that the ganker has no player run city your guild can either destroy or siege and take from him. This is a system of complete randomness. At least in ffa pvp full loot you have you eye out for everyone. Here it will be 90% normal players with random ganker guy mixed in. Luckily you only lose 1% exp when ganked. Utimately 1% exp isn't enough to really care too much and with no rewards to the ganker they will go find something else to do.
To OP bring it to a real pvp game with something on the line. Im guessing pvp with risk vs reward would not be to your liking.
Always fun to have some coward jump you after you almost finish a really hard pve fight and you are low on health. I hope they all die from dick cancer.
Well maybe if you weren't unfriendly, people wouldn't kill you
Also don't get why people play games when they don't like the basic mechanics.
"I got killed in a game that has PVP, this is stupid!" Perfect logic.
Want fair/balanced/safe competition, play one of many that does just that.
They are expecting other players to exhibit a sense of honor, fair play, civility and restraint, in order to keep it fun for everyone.
What they get are the morally bankrupt, disreputable sociopaths who would rather disrupt others fun and enjoy seeing the world burn.
And here is the problem we have with some pve players , who take what happens to them in game too seriously. Trust me you might think a person who gank you is a basement dwelling psychopath but reality is it could be a teenage girl half paying attention to the game and not taking it as seriously as some of you. Watch Twitch, plenty of examples there of what I wrote.
Simple rule of pvp , if you are red, you are dead. Everyone who plays on pvp servers/games knows this.
I'd have little problem if they ganked once. There are literally games with open world pvp where there are roving deathsquads of gankers that will repeatedly and systematically continually kill you because they know the quests in an area and they know the spawn points too. It's the people that repeatedly kill you over and over and over and over and over that are a problem and they do it to cause grief frequently to try and get players to rage quit a game. No one enjoys this happening and it's hard to shrug it off when the same asshat kills you 20 times in 10 minutes.
Gankers are not something that is "nice" and they breed a shitty community around them because most of the time they are trolls. It's not often a teenage girl half paying attention to the game that is walking around lowbie areas looking for low level players to gank, it is trolls and while it might be a teenage girl she knows full well what she is doing.
There are going to be 9 channels so this scenario could never actually happen (unless for some reason you liked it and refused to change channels to stop it).
Because of the channels, PVP is quasi-consensual. If you don't want to ever PVP you're unlikely to encounter it much, and when you do it will be a fleeting nuisance for you.
Between the channels and the karma penalties, I really don't expect much random ganking. Very little payoff for someone interested in messing with other people.
There are going to be 9 channels so this scenario could never actually happen (unless for some reason you liked it and refused to change channels to stop it).
Because of the channels, PVP is quasi-consensual. If you don't want to ever PVP you're unlikely to encounter it much, and when you do it will be a fleeting nuisance for you.
Between the channels and the karma penalties, I really don't expect much random ganking. Very little payoff for someone interested in messing with other people.
Boredom and lulz are great motivators when actual incentives aren't in place.
My guess is early on there will be some decent amount of random killing and as the game matures, people will figure out ways to either play with or around the system.
Those going out with a bang will also be roaming until they are so red they can't come back probably as well.
Will be fun either way. Those that want to play in 100% safety shouldn't go on the internet.
In other words....no good reason. You just like being a griefer....
Those are good reasons to me, lol. I like to PvP, I like to kill other players.
Yeah Valk would nice to have a long for all the CC/knockdowns she has.
Ganking people has nothing to do with pvp, you are just a bully that wants to annoy people. If you want to pvp look for opponents and not victims buddy.
To be fair, it sort of does.
The idea is that "the bad guy" kills someone and they then get their clan/guild involved. War is declared and then they fight until one or both sides agree to a cease fire.
While I don't really see the joy of killing players for the heck of it I do support the idea of games that allow open pvp and even enjoy it as it makes the world seem more real. Clearly, once again, the issue here is that players who don't like this type of play or who just can't tolerate it just don't belong in these games.
Fully agree. Adds an element of danger to the world that many games are missing. I am more into PVE, but PVE has changed a lot over the years. I used to be nervous about attacking a certain mob in earlier games, but now most open world mobs are not a challenge. I loved having elites walking the open world. I am not sure if I will get this game because of some other questions, but if it turns out to be a good community I might decide to add this to ESO.
Comments
I can give you list of twitch/youtube gamers that are perfectly nice people in real life , but they will happily gank you in game.
Some people do want to keep virtual life and real life separate , its just a difference of opinion. The players that are whiners are ridiculed by other pvp players. Personally I don't see the difference between a pvp player crying on the forums about class balance and a "elite" raider crying about the same thing on the pve side of things. The karma system is too harsh for NA/EU players, it is being change to make pvp more fun for us. After all it is pvp game , pve is not really the focus.
Anyone that buys it, installs, and logs in will be agreeing to participate.
Every single online game I've ever played that allows one person to interact with another has morons. Be it those that are immature, just trolling and doing it for the lulz, to those a little off in the head.
If anyone has ever played a game with zero foolish people in it, I'd like to know what games those are.
BDO offers many outlets for PVP, much of which is structured.
However, in a game where individuals/groups are fighting to get a head of others, attacking people "randomly" might not be so "random."
PVE hot spots will be contested and people will kill others so they can PVE themselves.
For those that want to run around randomly killing others without a lot of reason beyond the entertainment value, the Karma/Bounty system seems like a decent middle ground.
No system will be perfect for everyone or anyone really.
Those that can't handle being killed once in a while should simply stay away if their pixels mean that much to them.
If someone is going above and beyond into the offensive realm, they should be reported if they are violating rules. Same goes if they are exploiting the PVP system.
Beyond that, buckle up and enjoy the ride.
Edit: Just to add that while I can see why people dislike being "ganked" or attacked in what they see as an unfair setup, OW PVP reminds me of going to the arcade when I was young.
I'd be doing my thing playing Street Fighter or whatever and someone would come along, slap in some quarters and now we were fighting. I didn't ask for it, but there it was.
If I lost, game over for me or I could come back and try again. If I simply wasn't as good, maybe I learned a few things. If I won, yay good for me.
It was an entirely different experience than just mashing buttons at the AI.
I'm sure there are some that would simply walk away from the machine as soon as someone else joined or better yet not go to the arcade to begin with, but these games are designed how they are for a reason.
If people were meant to play BDO in a safe bubble, they would make a no flag PVP option, but they didn't. People can either accept the dev vision/design or play something else. Would suck to spend so much time/energy/money into creating such a product for people to come along and go "NO NO NO, I don't want that." Looks like Daum has at least tried to reason with these folks, but still pretty silly.
I know it goes against politically correct culture, but we aren't all winners all of the time. Sometimes losing is simply what happens.
Gankers are not something that is "nice" and they breed a shitty community around them because most of the time they are trolls. It's not often a teenage girl half paying attention to the game that is walking around lowbie areas looking for low level players to gank, it is trolls and while it might be a teenage girl she knows full well what she is doing.
Wasn't a personal attack against your person, but rather a comment about the absurdity of forum discussions as a whole.
Funny thread went off the rails only 2 comments in.
My expert knowledge comes from the same source as anyone else paying attention trying to make informed comments. Obviously I only knew what was available at that time, but wasn't trying to get into some serious SJW discussion.
Although I do like this comment of mine: "I love PVP, but find attacking those that won't fight back to be pointless and zero challenge. Fun? Sure, but I'd rather have a challenge than just lulz."
Someone can like competitive pvp, but hate gankers. PVP'ing where you are guaranteed a win isn't pvp nor is it competitive. A one sided fight is literally just that one sided, if the person cannot fight back they aren't going to come back in an hour able to. Leveling takes time and energy. People doing pve content do not want to be repeatedly killed by the same group of gankers constantly for an hour of their lives and those things do happen FREQUENTLY in open world pvp games.
Not to say you need to roam around with 50 people at all times, but if someone kills you more than once, time to call in some help or do something else for a while.
At the same time, BDO is very gear/grind dependent and if someone is spending their time mindlessly killing, they aren't being very productive. At some point the victims will out level/gear/power that attackers.
I also assume that with a bounty system and simply all those that dislike the riff raff messing with others, we'll see anti-deathsquad squads running around mopping the floor with them as well.
Some people (myself) love PVP, but want a challenge. I have little enjoyment in attacking someone weaker or that doesn't want to engage. Hunting the hunters is quite fun.
BDO is also a huge game so there isn't one spot to do XYZ outside of specific quests. Even quest mobs can be found over large/multiple areas.
As I also said, those spending great amounts of time attacking people aren't going to have the time to grind for power. At some point there will be good guy grinders outpacing them and able to wipe them away. Maybe not day zero, but will happen.
Typically the "good guys" far outnumber the "bad guys" in these games. Unfortunately the small minority are what people remember.
If an individual/group gets to a certain high point and then goes after weaker targets, I have no respect for them, but it simply can't last forever. Nature of the design.
Dying repeatedly implies the victim isn't changing their tactics.
In a game that has OW PVP, people have to be able to adapt to the situation. It isn't either rage quit or be killed over and over.
In a game that offers multiple ways to play, I don't see it as PVE vs PVP. Players are simply players in a larger design.
If someone wants to limited themselves to XYZ, that's on them. There are options available and refusing to use them because they have tunnel vision falls back to their side of the court.
Either suck it up and accept death as a PVEr or adapt and play the game as intended (multi faceted).
If people want fair PVP, playing something like BDO is a mistake. Almost every other mmo has some form of structured/fair PVP. BDO itself has several outlets for this. They've simply gone with OW PVP as well and are offering yet another form of gameplay. It clearly isn't for everyone and that is just fine. Every game doesn't need to be balanced around the least common denominator. Some games simply appeal to particular types and anyone buying in has to accept that.
Lets assume a squad of three people- I would want a heavy cc class and two burst damage builds, how about a wizard and 2 rangers? Too squishy?
Thanks for all the replies, though. I enjoyed reading it all.
Since the karma system has been revamped, and it won't be long until the outlaw town is implemented I think I'll be right at home ganking the unsuspecting in BDO.
I'm thinking Ranger and Witch, or maybe even Valk for the CC. I really don't want to run with more than three people at once so it's easier to escape.
I think having a bounty on my head and people trying to come kill me (so unfair!) sounds really exciting. I hope a lot of you have the same in game name as your forum name - if not, feel free to leave it in the response.
Look at all these PVP essays, novels and walls of text typed in this thread.
People clearly feel strongly about it, it's a game breaking issue for many.
It sucks for me though because I'm big on OW PvP.
Oh well.
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
OW PVP will be a big part of BDO if you haven't been reading up on launch plans and what they would like to do later on. However, OW PVP doesn't mean killing everything that moves just because without consequences. I plan to have a good time hunting down PKs and hope the bounty/reward system for doing so gets fleshed out more over time.
To OP bring it to a real pvp game with something on the line. Im guessing pvp with risk vs reward would not be to your liking.
Because of the channels, PVP is quasi-consensual. If you don't want to ever PVP you're unlikely to encounter it much, and when you do it will be a fleeting nuisance for you.
Between the channels and the karma penalties, I really don't expect much random ganking. Very little payoff for someone interested in messing with other people.
My guess is early on there will be some decent amount of random killing and as the game matures, people will figure out ways to either play with or around the system.
Those going out with a bang will also be roaming until they are so red they can't come back probably as well.
Will be fun either way. Those that want to play in 100% safety shouldn't go on the internet.
Why would anyone want to pvp in a rpg is beyond me,crap maps,poor weapon selection,no zaxis,movement doesn't matter etc etc ,why bother.
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