A lot of what the OP says I agree with, however it seems that Rift has attracted one of the worst sort of gamers. The elite niche that are so fanatical about their viewpoint that no logical and rational discussion can be had about its short comings. This is a dangerous combo. It drives people away from the game, not too it.
Please, we all know by now each game attracts its fanatics. Both in positive sense (fanboys) as negative (haters).
You should allways take their opinions with a pinch of salt. I sure throw a can of salt over your opinion of this game each time I see one.
But lets be honest here. The amount and the vigure of fanboys seems quite normal in Rifts case. People tend to be nice, we seem to be able to have descent conversations all the time, flamewars are in the low numbers.
To give you a reference ... look at the FFXIV fanboys a while back. Each and every thread resulted in a flamewar, namecalling, banning, removal of threads, etc. It was allmost impossible to have descent conversations.
So Imho Rift fans aren't that bad. So you can shelve your remark for now, don't you think?
Are you going to broadly assume all fanatics are the same? To do so would be silly. Different games attract DIFFERENT player bases and groups. You cannot really disagree with that logically. If you have ever worked in or with a marketing department (for games as well) you know they specifically name and target specific player groups and audiences.
> We are talking in a forum about mmo's, so yes I regard those fanatics the same. Don't really understand why you had to broaden this. Each game has haters and fans, don't need a marketing degree to be able to come to that conclusion.
There is really no reason to hate Rift UNLESS you were formerly attracted to Rift and realized the misrepresentation sponsored by Trion. Is this my opinion? No. I was at E3. Were you? I was at their booth, listening to their leads directly. I reported on a lot of their claims and was geniunely impressed with the concept of the game. Then I was given an opportunity to test the game, including these beta's and what I found was not a AAA Premium NEXT GEN title they were aggressively marketing, but an under developed generic game which featured a lot of weakly executed design choices.
> Why are you telling me this? Did anything in my post urge you to enlighten me on this subject? If so please tell me which part.
How can I talk about design choices? Because I work with game design. Both educational backround and skill sets. I know how games work, how they are made from the ground up. Design, both analog and digital theory, implimentation, the behavioral science based means to create immersion through emotional response. I have, in my past descriptions of Rift, layed out many concrete details that are not opinions but observations and explainations on how it works. The result is that many have ignored the concrete details and began attacking the person or going off on tangents instead.
> Again why are you telling me this? Did I make a remark about design choice and behavioral science?
This means no rational dialog can be had between the two as one side is choosing to be block headed and ignorant. Its not coming from the "haters" from what I am seeing in this thread. In fact, to just lump everyone who has a not so positive outlook on rift as "haters" is just irresponsible and silly.
> I've seen a lot of rational discussions, except this one from you now. It's starting to scare me really.
I think this thread is a testement as to how "bad" some of these rift fanboys are. So you can take your elitist attitude and as you said "shelf it" for now. I mean you have to agree that kind of confrontational attitude you are taking is a bit rude and it borders on flame baiting.
> This thread is one of the very few which has some flaming in it, still not excessive in my book compared to other games. And to be honest the one that is going of his rockers the most is you.
Funny that you call me elitist and having a rude confrontational attitude.
At least it took you 2 lvl 27's, running all active dungeons multiple times, exploring rifts, doing a crapload of quests before coming to the conclusion Rift is not for you. Much better then the people yelling the game is "crap" based on the appearance of the game's desktop shortcut. Hope you find your fix.
Thanks, I am sure I will, Arche Age is looking very interesting and will probably suit me better I think from what i see so far :)
Thanks for the pointer to Arche Age which had completely passed me by. Sounds interesting, definitely worth checking out further. Would be nice to see more news of it here on mmorpg.com.
Thanks for posting a rather elusive response as to why you don't like a AAA MMO that offers what most other MMOs offer, with a little more, and a little less.
If Rift, or other MMOs for that matter, do not offer the kind of game you are looking for, I am starting to wonder if MMO's are really your kind of game or if you are just jaded so much that you actually do not even know what you really want. You state you don't like something, but do you even know what you do want?
"I don't know what I want, but I know I don't want that" <-- This is not a very valid argument
Expect to get attacked. They want to defend the game. The fact that you took time to post can be considered in itself a form of attack
Don't be ridiculous. In fact, this attitude, the one where everyone's opinion that dosent agree with yours in an 'attack', is exactly the problem with these boards. Percieving the need to 'defend' against every one that dosent like your favourite game is a siege mentality and just breeds conflict, something that you would hope most adults have grown past. I stated opinions and put them up for discussion, thats all. I wasnt rude and didnt troll. Responding in a hostile way can't be justified.
Disagree, sure, tell me why, sure, share your own opinion, sure, but aggressively attack me for having different ones? No.
Tbh, this one simple statement above made me stop reading and dismiss everything else you said out of hand, which is a shame because you may have made some decent points.
You are condoning personal attacks in a thread thats talking about a game, which to me is the opposite of what it was started for.
If people feel the need to defend the game by making personal attacks that says more about them then I, and I don't accept this attempt to shft responsibility for that on to the poster. It's just a juvenile way of thinking.
Anyhow, enough derailment of you talking about me (another juvenile way of posting), lets get back to the game and chatting about our opinions of it.
Its not juvenile its the way of this forum.
One dosent exclude the other. Stop rationalising it.. just because 'others do it' dosent mean you have to, or excuse you when you do.
If you post looking for a fight you will get one.
Stating an opinion on a game is looking for a fight? No.
Your telling me in 2000+ post here you really dont get it?
I get how to act on a forum yes, better then most it would seem.
I don't start every thread to have a fight or engage in conflict. I don't percieve that everyone who dosent like my game is 'attacking me'.
Look, you carry on, it's obvious that I am not going change your siege mentallity 'everyone who likes something else is an enemy' worldview in a thread on a gaming forum, and tbh I have no need to. You carry on fighting with everyone, seeing everyone as an enemy... thats fine and means little to me.
Please now, stop derailing this thread with your sermons to me on how 'forums work', and lets talk about what we are here for.
I agree, this game is super casual friendly. It is mostly solo, easy to master, and requires little thinking to play, exactly the kind of virtual knitting simulator a certain section of MMOers are looking for after a day at work.
I am disappointed, it took less than a day for you too cut to straight up trolling.
Not that you were ever convincing to start with.
What exactly is he doing that results in trolling. Telling someone they were not convincing to start with IS trolling, it is baiting someone to respond in a negative manner without even staying on topic.
The OP layed out his observations about the game.
1. It is very friendly to casual players. This is true. Listen to the Podcasts, read IRC, see for yourself what the developers think.
2. You can solo most of the game if you pick the right class. I played mostly a cleric and outside of dungeons needed no help what so ever. The cleric is a class that needs some balancing thats for sure.
3. It is easy to master so far. The skills in each tree are not that unique nor are they that varied and deep. You only need a small combo set of a dps skill and two others to compliment it with buff or debuff and cc.
Good game design dictates the escalation of challenge, as well as a balance between what we call anxiety and boredom. Rift is imbalanced in its design as many are in the realm of boredom, yet none have actually crossed over to the opposite side of anxiety. I study and work with game design, so if you try to dismiss this as a "normal users" opinion, then thats your loss. Just saying.
A lot of what the OP says I agree with, however it seems that Rift has attracted one of the worst sort of gamers. The elite niche that are so fanatical about their viewpoint that no logical and rational discussion can be had about its short comings. This is a dangerous combo. It drives people away from the game, not too it.
Thanks for the effort Raben, I appreciate it, but you won't get far with people that see as anyone disagreeing them as 'trolling'... I wouldnt bother trying if I was you. I don't care what he calls me tbh.
I feel like I stated some pretty valid views as well though tbh;
super casual friendly: It is, and thats exactly what Trion are aiming for. Look at their target audience with their adverts... They are chasing the millions of casual WoW players. People who consider me trolling for stating this obviously have an issue with super casual friendly games, which makes me wonder why they are playing Rift in the first place. Rift will sell a lot of boxes aiming for this play type.
It is mostly solo: It is. Scott Hartsman himself has stated this. The journey to 50 is very solo play orientated, as demonstrated by the vast number of players in the betas... soloing. People who consider me trolling for stating this obviously have an issue with solo games, which makes me wonder why they are playing Rift in the first place. Rift will sell a lot of boxes aiming for this play type.
Easy to master, and requires little thinking to play: It is easy to master, and it is easy to play. It isnt heavy on new play systems and tactics. People who consider me trolling for stating this obviously have an issue with easy to master games, which makes me wonder why they are playing Rift in the first place. Rift will sell a lot of boxes aiming for this play type.
Exactly the kind of virtual knitting simulator a certain section of MMOers are looking for after a day at work: It is. all of the above defines it as this, and thats fine... Trion has obviously gone for this market, and done it well, and thats ok. It just isnt the type of game I am going for personally.
It just isnt the type of game I am going for personally.
So if I was brand new to the MMORPG market, what would you recommend playing if I asked, "Hey, I hear people talking about this game Rift, should I try it?"
And what are you playing now>?< I asked you before, think your answer was buried somewhere.
No, the forums are not used the way they should and the OP is using it as intended.
He is looking to voice his opinion and these forums are to facilitate on that.
Just because most people have the wrong idea of what a discussion is and what the rules of discussing are is not the OP's fault in any way.
No, the OP does not by definition have to follow the childish and ridiculous behaviour that makes up the current standard of these forums.
No that is not true at all, he is entering a meta-discussion because the invalid points and intentions of other poster force him to.
It is ridiculous that when i try to have a civil discussion that i should keep in mind that other people are incapable of doing so.
And even more ridiculous that because of this I should leave and not the people who do not know what a discussion is, even though we are on a discussionboard.
Thanks for getting it Impiro, but I fear your wasting your breath. But thanks for trying
The funniest thing about you, is that Arche Age . .
1. Is WoW with housing.
2. One of its main draws is "deep" crafting, which means it will actually be a "virtual knitting simulator".
Anyway have fun pretending to be a Martyr, knitting a pair of curtains for your house, playing its "slightly different" PvE grind, QQ in its BGs and if your lucky it wont totally flop so you can troll its forums too.
It just isnt the type of game I am going for personally.
So if I was brand new to the MMORPG market, what would you recommend playing if I asked, "Hey, I hear people talking about this game Rift, should I try it?"
And what are you playing now>?< I asked you before, think your answer was buried somewhere.
hrm, thats a good question... My honest answer is to try WoW, and I don't even play WoW. A few years ago it would have been to try EQ2, but as you may see by my sig I am not a fan of double dip cash shop revenue models in the least, so I wouldnt now recommend SOE to anyone.
Right now we have started playing GW (I have actually answered this a couple of times before in this thread ) as a duo, and thats going fine. it offers a stunning amount of play content for £15. The only MMORPG I am now waiting for is Arche Age though... if that dosent work out? Well, Im not sure... lol, I usually only wait for 1 MMORPG at a time
The funniest thing about you, is that Arche Age . .
1. Is WoW with housing.
2. One of its main draws is "deep" crafting, which means it will actually be a "virtual knitting simulator".
Anyway have fun pretending to be a Martyr, knitting a pair of curtains for your house, playing its "slightly different" PvE grind, QQ in its BGs and if your lucky it wont totally flop so you can troll its forums too.
I don't really care what your opinion on Arche Age is, what it looks like it is offering right now appeals to me. Anyone can see for themselves with the minimum of youtube videos and whatever it isnt what you think it is.
This thread isnt about Arche Age, I have only mentioned it once as a side remark and then a couple of times in direct answers to others questions, I have not compared Rift to it in any way, this isnt a thread of Arche Age vs Rift, but it's clear you have found a hook you think you can troll me on.
The funniest thing about you, is that Arche Age . .
1. Is WoW with housing.
2. One of its main draws is "deep" crafting, which means it will actually be a "virtual knitting simulator".
Anyway have fun pretending to be a Martyr, knitting a pair of curtains for your house, playing its "slightly different" PvE grind, QQ in its BGs and if your lucky it wont totally flop so you can troll its forums too.
I don't really care what your opinion on Arche Age is, what it looks like it is offering right now appeals to me.
He obviously doesnt know anything about ArcheAge, nor what key features and design choices separate theme park from sandbox much less their similarities.
It just isnt the type of game I am going for personally.
So if I was brand new to the MMORPG market, what would you recommend playing if I asked, "Hey, I hear people talking about this game Rift, should I try it?"
And what are you playing now>?< I asked you before, think your answer was buried somewhere.
hrm, thats a good question... My honest answer is to try WoW, and I don't even play WoW. A few years ago it would have been to try EQ2, but as you may see by my sig I am not a fan of double dip cash shop revenue models in the least, so I wouldnt now recommend SOE to anyone.
Right now we have started playing GW (I have actually answered this a couple of times before in this thread ) as a duo, and thats going fine. it offers a stunning amount of play content for £15. The only MMORPG I am now waiting for is Arche Age though... if that dosent work out? Well, Im not sure... lol, I usually only wait for 1 MMORPG at a time
Sorry, I know it got buried amongst the hate. LOL. I have GW, not into it right now, playing CoH. GW is cheap, no sub fee. Anyways, good luck and sorry Rift did'n't work out for you. I've been watching Funcom's Secret World and so far its looks promising.
The funniest thing about you, is that Arche Age . .
1. Is WoW with housing.
2. One of its main draws is "deep" crafting, which means it will actually be a "virtual knitting simulator".
Anyway have fun pretending to be a Martyr, knitting a pair of curtains for your house, playing its "slightly different" PvE grind, QQ in its BGs and if your lucky it wont totally flop so you can troll its forums too.
I don't really care what your opinion on Arche Age is, what it looks like it is offering right now appeals to me.
He obviously doesnt know anything about ArcheAge, nor what key features and design choices separate theme park from sandbox much less their similarities.
He just thinks it's something to attack me on, don't worry about it. Lets get back to Rift
The funniest thing about you, is that Arche Age . .
1. Is WoW with housing.
2. One of its main draws is "deep" crafting, which means it will actually be a "virtual knitting simulator".
Anyway have fun pretending to be a Martyr, knitting a pair of curtains for your house, playing its "slightly different" PvE grind, QQ in its BGs and if your lucky it wont totally flop so you can troll its forums too.
I don't really care what your opinion on Arche Age is, what it looks like it is offering right now appeals to me.
He obviously doesnt know anything about ArcheAge, nor what key features and design choices separate theme park from sandbox much less their similarities.
He just thinks it's something to attack me on, don't worry about it.
Vesavius, Vesavius .... then why did you make this thread?
The funniest thing about you, is that Arche Age . .
1. Is WoW with housing.
2. One of its main draws is "deep" crafting, which means it will actually be a "virtual knitting simulator".
Anyway have fun pretending to be a Martyr, knitting a pair of curtains for your house, playing its "slightly different" PvE grind, QQ in its BGs and if your lucky it wont totally flop so you can troll its forums too.
I don't really care what your opinion on Arche Age is, what it looks like it is offering right now appeals to me.
He obviously doesnt know anything about ArcheAge, nor what key features and design choices separate theme park from sandbox much less their similarities.
He just thinks it's something to attack me on, don't worry about it.
Vesavius, Vesavius .... then why did you make this thread?
To give my opinions on a game that I have tried and have a discussion on it. I thought you got that.
So far though, there have been few reasonable counter points to what i have said, with the vast bulk of Rift fans choosing instead to say either I must hate all MMORPGS (I obviously don't) or just calling me names.
I can only assume thats because they actuslly have no counterpoints, and so are just left with making personal attacks.
I am hoping at some point we can get back to actually talking about the game, rather then talking just about me.
The funniest thing about you, is that Arche Age . .
1. Is WoW with housing.
2. One of its main draws is "deep" crafting, which means it will actually be a "virtual knitting simulator".
Anyway have fun pretending to be a Martyr, knitting a pair of curtains for your house, playing its "slightly different" PvE grind, QQ in its BGs and if your lucky it wont totally flop so you can troll its forums too.
I don't really care what your opinion on Arche Age is, what it looks like it is offering right now appeals to me.
He obviously doesnt know anything about ArcheAge, nor what key features and design choices separate theme park from sandbox much less their similarities.
He just thinks it's something to attack me on, don't worry about it.
Vesavius, Vesavius .... then why did you make this thread?
To give my opinions on a game that I have tried and have a discussion on it. I thought you got that.
So far though, there have been few reasonable counter points to what i have said, with the vast bulk of Rift fans choosing instead to say either I must hate all MMORPGS (I obviously don't) or just calling me names.
I can only assume thats because they actuslly have no counterpoints, and so are just left with making personal attacks.
I am hoping at some point we can get back to actually talking about the game, rather then talking just about me.
But you don't care what other people think of your game ... so why should we care what you think of ours (I was alluding to your post in yellow, the rest I allready knew).
You have posted 57 times in your thread which is now at this moment standing at 200 posts. Not a criticism merely pointing out the percentage of posts that make up the volume .I understand that you were responding to others but just to get some perspective to the size of the thread.
You say that this is your opinion and that very few have responded to dispute your opinion or to say otherwise. Fact is your opinion is based on your experiences with other games that you have played before this and hence you came to a conclusion of Rift based on those experiences. You would be lying if you say otherwise because everyone makes their judgements and decisions based on past experiences if they have any on the matter.
There would be no point in me trying to dissuade you from your opinion or to argue otherwise because it is by definition an opinion. How can my own experiences from being a player from Everquest onwards and I have seriously played almost every MMORPG since then argue with an opinion.
My own experience with the game has echoes of what you have pointed out but I have a different opinion about them. Hence it would be difficult for me to say otherwise because just as your opinion can be disagreed with so can mine. So you should not be surprised that not many people are willing to spend their time trying to post a different opinion because in the grand scale of things it is of no consequence as each of us makes up our own mind and will not suddenly change ours based on your opinion and similarly you will not either.
You say you have experienced the game till level 27 and have made your opinion based on those experiences which you are entitled to .I am glad that your experience in this game does not reflect my own.I found the rifts exhilarating and looked forward to them and at times they did seem excessive but that could have been because they were beta testing them. I found the fact that people were working together and the camaraderie that such interaction fostered was a welcome change and yes it reminded me of the first few weeks of Warhammer.
I am not sure I agree with your analysis of the size of the game because having many things to do in a small space still makes a game busy to me. While I loved Telon and wandering about it was depressing that so much of Vanguard had just wide open spaces but Vanguard is a wonderful game that I enjoyed and loved but have since left. I also loved the soul system that echoed FFXI in its job gameplay with a more limited scope.
I could explain that the game has this interesting lore where you pick up and open books or read up on which I did and I loved those little machines and how they were powered and even if they do remind me of other games I try very hard not to let games that I have already played diminish my enjoyment of a current one. I know it is very hard to divorce our experiences but we will be slaves to repetition and boredom if we do not try.
Although I don't share your point of view about many of your criticisms I do hear and to a large extent share your frustration about the the lack of originality in MMOs in general these days... heck, the whole gaming industry has become big business just like Hollywood where the producers just want to milk more money from proven, profitable, safe formulas and are afraid to take risks with true innovation.
This past beta was my 1st and I have several characters in the 18-21 range so I'm coming from a slightly different place than you and perhaps for that reason the game still seems fresher and more exciting to me.
If this game seems familiar to MMO veterans it's because it incorporates refinements of what has become standard MMO features. I think you're right in characterizing it as "the end product of the last generation." It benefits from all MMOs that have come before it and refines the proven winning formulas almost to perfection.
Let's talk about the namesake rifts. They are very similar to PQs in WAR in that they reward partial participation by solo and grouped players with instant loot or tokens that can be used to get loot. Just like PQs they have stages of escalating difficulty. The innovations and refinements here have to do with the semi-random location and timing of these events and the fact that, if left alone, they will periodically spawn groups of elite mobs that will leave the area and make a beeline for quest hubs where they will kill all the NPCs... including quest givers. This last bit is a very clever means of heavy-handedly "encouraging" participation by casual questers nearby who have no choice other than to join the group fight against the rift and elite mobs if they want to turn-in or get the next quests in the chain... At this point in my experience, this still feels new and random enough that it creates excitement and simulates the unpredictability and randomness that most jaded MMO vets crave.... However I can definitely see how this could become old and a major PITA especially if you're in a sparsely populated area where your only choice is to wait-out the event before you can continue going about your business.
And then there is the innovative "soul" character development system. Kudos to them for the tremendous variety of combinations that almost achieves a sandbox-like feel in character customization... unfortunately the vast majority of abilities are severely clamped-down for balancing purposes so there are very few "wow that's so cool!" abilities and quite a bit of duplication in the abilities available with other "souls" within the same stream (for the uninitiated...4 streams: cleric, mage, warrior, rogue.)By level 20 I found myself having about 12 Justicar/Shaman abilities to use but using only 3 or less in most fights.
I've already bought the game so I will definitely play it for a few months. However that's just par for the course as far as I'm concerned. I think a 6-month lifespan is about all we can reasonably expect from all of these derivative MMOs that inevitably turn into raiding (PvE, or PvP...choose one or both) grinds at the end.
Imho, you could edit your OP a bit, post it in the general section and it would read as a reasonable criticism of any and all MMOs these days.
I keep hoping to be thrilled and surprised by the new MMO on the block but I don't really expect it any more. I think it will take some crazy ballsy geniuses with little regard for their financial well being before we see someone move MMOs into the "next gen." They're all currently focused on cosmetics or refining the familiar and expected with some "New and improved!" gimmick thrown in to attract us.
Rift is no exception but a worthwhile MMO to play for a while nevertheless.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
The funniest thing about you, is that Arche Age . .
1. Is WoW with housing.
2. One of its main draws is "deep" crafting, which means it will actually be a "virtual knitting simulator".
Anyway have fun pretending to be a Martyr, knitting a pair of curtains for your house, playing its "slightly different" PvE grind, QQ in its BGs and if your lucky it wont totally flop so you can troll its forums too.
I don't really care what your opinion on Arche Age is, what it looks like it is offering right now appeals to me.
He obviously doesnt know anything about ArcheAge, nor what key features and design choices separate theme park from sandbox much less their similarities.
He just thinks it's something to attack me on, don't worry about it.
Vesavius, Vesavius .... then why did you make this thread?
To give my opinions on a game that I have tried and have a discussion on it. I thought you got that.
So far though, there have been few reasonable counter points to what i have said, with the vast bulk of Rift fans choosing instead to say either I must hate all MMORPGS (I obviously don't) or just calling me names.
I can only assume thats because they actuslly have no counterpoints, and so are just left with making personal attacks.
I am hoping at some point we can get back to actually talking about the game, rather then talking just about me.
But you don't care what other people think of your game ... so why should we care what you think of ours (I was alluding to your post in yellow, the rest I allready knew).
The funniest thing about you, is that Arche Age . .
1. Is WoW with housing.
2. One of its main draws is "deep" crafting, which means it will actually be a "virtual knitting simulator".
Anyway have fun pretending to be a Martyr, knitting a pair of curtains for your house, playing its "slightly different" PvE grind, QQ in its BGs and if your lucky it wont totally flop so you can troll its forums too.
I don't really care what your opinion on Arche Age is, what it looks like it is offering right now appeals to me.
He obviously doesnt know anything about ArcheAge, nor what key features and design choices separate theme park from sandbox much less their similarities.
He just thinks it's something to attack me on, don't worry about it.
Vesavius, Vesavius .... then why did you make this thread?
To give my opinions on a game that I have tried and have a discussion on it. I thought you got that.
So far though, there have been few reasonable counter points to what i have said, with the vast bulk of Rift fans choosing instead to say either I must hate all MMORPGS (I obviously don't) or just calling me names.
I can only assume thats because they actuslly have no counterpoints, and so are just left with making personal attacks.
I am hoping at some point we can get back to actually talking about the game, rather then talking just about me.
But you don't care what other people think of your game ... so why should we care what you think of ours (I was alluding to your post in yellow, the rest I allready knew).
Your doing exactly what I have just described.
Well I guess you don't get my point. Thought it was clear.
You have posted 57 times in your thread which is now at this moment standing at 200 posts.
So what? I pay attention and participate in threads I make... whats your point?
You say that this is your opinion and that very few have responded to dispute your opinion or to say otherwise. Fact is your opinion is based on your experiences with other games that you have played before this.
No, this is my opinion on Rift.
There would be no point in me trying to dissuade you from your opinion or to argue otherwise because it is by definition an opinion.
Opinions can be debated and discussed. I am confused you think they can't.
Again though, you are a Rift fan that insists on talking about me.
My own experience with the game has echoes of what you have pointed out but I have a different opinion about them. Hence it would be difficult for me to say otherwise because just as your opinion can be disagreed with so can mine.
Except I havent disregarded Fift fans opinions... I have debated against them based on my experience, but thats not the same thing at all.
I would be very interested in hearing your replies to the opinions I voice.
You say you have experienced the game till level 27 and have made your opinion based on those experiences which you are entitled to .I am glad that your experience in this game does not reflect my own.I found the rifts exhilarating.
Can I ask how many betas you have played and to what level?
Comments
Thanks for the pointer to Arche Age which had completely passed me by. Sounds interesting, definitely worth checking out further. Would be nice to see more news of it here on mmorpg.com.
Thanks for posting a rather elusive response as to why you don't like a AAA MMO that offers what most other MMOs offer, with a little more, and a little less.
If Rift, or other MMOs for that matter, do not offer the kind of game you are looking for, I am starting to wonder if MMO's are really your kind of game or if you are just jaded so much that you actually do not even know what you really want. You state you don't like something, but do you even know what you do want?
"I don't know what I want, but I know I don't want that" <-- This is not a very valid argument
6 months and it will turn F2P.
Thanks for the effort Raben, I appreciate it, but you won't get far with people that see as anyone disagreeing them as 'trolling'... I wouldnt bother trying if I was you. I don't care what he calls me tbh.
I feel like I stated some pretty valid views as well though tbh;
super casual friendly: It is, and thats exactly what Trion are aiming for. Look at their target audience with their adverts... They are chasing the millions of casual WoW players. People who consider me trolling for stating this obviously have an issue with super casual friendly games, which makes me wonder why they are playing Rift in the first place. Rift will sell a lot of boxes aiming for this play type.
It is mostly solo: It is. Scott Hartsman himself has stated this. The journey to 50 is very solo play orientated, as demonstrated by the vast number of players in the betas... soloing. People who consider me trolling for stating this obviously have an issue with solo games, which makes me wonder why they are playing Rift in the first place. Rift will sell a lot of boxes aiming for this play type.
Easy to master, and requires little thinking to play: It is easy to master, and it is easy to play. It isnt heavy on new play systems and tactics. People who consider me trolling for stating this obviously have an issue with easy to master games, which makes me wonder why they are playing Rift in the first place. Rift will sell a lot of boxes aiming for this play type.
Exactly the kind of virtual knitting simulator a certain section of MMOers are looking for after a day at work: It is. all of the above defines it as this, and thats fine... Trion has obviously gone for this market, and done it well, and thats ok. It just isnt the type of game I am going for personally.
Thanks, I will enjoy Rift alot.
So if I was brand new to the MMORPG market, what would you recommend playing if I asked, "Hey, I hear people talking about this game Rift, should I try it?"
And what are you playing now>?< I asked you before, think your answer was buried somewhere.
Thanks for getting it Impiro, but I fear your wasting your breath. But thanks for trying
The funniest thing about you, is that Arche Age . .
1. Is WoW with housing.
2. One of its main draws is "deep" crafting, which means it will actually be a "virtual knitting simulator".
Anyway have fun pretending to be a Martyr, knitting a pair of curtains for your house, playing its "slightly different" PvE grind, QQ in its BGs and if your lucky it wont totally flop so you can troll its forums too.
hrm, thats a good question... My honest answer is to try WoW, and I don't even play WoW. A few years ago it would have been to try EQ2, but as you may see by my sig I am not a fan of double dip cash shop revenue models in the least, so I wouldnt now recommend SOE to anyone.
Right now we have started playing GW (I have actually answered this a couple of times before in this thread
) as a duo, and thats going fine. it offers a stunning amount of play content for £15. The only MMORPG I am now waiting for is Arche Age though... if that dosent work out? Well, Im not sure... lol, I usually only wait for 1 MMORPG at a time 
I don't really care what your opinion on Arche Age is, what it looks like it is offering right now appeals to me. Anyone can see for themselves with the minimum of youtube videos and whatever it isnt what you think it is.
This thread isnt about Arche Age, I have only mentioned it once as a side remark and then a couple of times in direct answers to others questions, I have not compared Rift to it in any way, this isnt a thread of Arche Age vs Rift, but it's clear you have found a hook you think you can troll me on.
You havent.
Get back on topic. We are talking about Rift.
He obviously doesnt know anything about ArcheAge, nor what key features and design choices separate theme park from sandbox much less their similarities.
Sorry, I know it got buried amongst the hate. LOL. I have GW, not into it right now, playing CoH. GW is cheap, no sub fee. Anyways, good luck and sorry Rift did'n't work out for you. I've been watching Funcom's Secret World and so far its looks promising.
He just thinks it's something to attack me on, don't worry about it. Lets get back to Rift
Vesavius, Vesavius .... then why did you make this thread?
Seems like a sandy point for the both of you. I suppose as they say, ignorance is bliss.
To give my opinions on a game that I have tried and have a discussion on it. I thought you got that.
So far though, there have been few reasonable counter points to what i have said, with the vast bulk of Rift fans choosing instead to say either I must hate all MMORPGS (I obviously don't) or just calling me names.
I can only assume thats because they actuslly have no counterpoints, and so are just left with making personal attacks.
I am hoping at some point we can get back to actually talking about the game, rather then talking just about me.
But you don't care what other people think of your game ... so why should we care what you think of ours (I was alluding to your post in yellow, the rest I allready knew).
You have posted 57 times in your thread which is now at this moment standing at 200 posts. Not a criticism merely pointing out the percentage of posts that make up the volume .I understand that you were responding to others but just to get some perspective to the size of the thread.
You say that this is your opinion and that very few have responded to dispute your opinion or to say otherwise. Fact is your opinion is based on your experiences with other games that you have played before this and hence you came to a conclusion of Rift based on those experiences. You would be lying if you say otherwise because everyone makes their judgements and decisions based on past experiences if they have any on the matter.
There would be no point in me trying to dissuade you from your opinion or to argue otherwise because it is by definition an opinion. How can my own experiences from being a player from Everquest onwards and I have seriously played almost every MMORPG since then argue with an opinion.
My own experience with the game has echoes of what you have pointed out but I have a different opinion about them. Hence it would be difficult for me to say otherwise because just as your opinion can be disagreed with so can mine. So you should not be surprised that not many people are willing to spend their time trying to post a different opinion because in the grand scale of things it is of no consequence as each of us makes up our own mind and will not suddenly change ours based on your opinion and similarly you will not either.
You say you have experienced the game till level 27 and have made your opinion based on those experiences which you are entitled to .I am glad that your experience in this game does not reflect my own.I found the rifts exhilarating and looked forward to them and at times they did seem excessive but that could have been because they were beta testing them. I found the fact that people were working together and the camaraderie that such interaction fostered was a welcome change and yes it reminded me of the first few weeks of Warhammer.
I am not sure I agree with your analysis of the size of the game because having many things to do in a small space still makes a game busy to me. While I loved Telon and wandering about it was depressing that so much of Vanguard had just wide open spaces but Vanguard is a wonderful game that I enjoyed and loved but have since left. I also loved the soul system that echoed FFXI in its job gameplay with a more limited scope.
I could explain that the game has this interesting lore where you pick up and open books or read up on which I did and I loved those little machines and how they were powered and even if they do remind me of other games I try very hard not to let games that I have already played diminish my enjoyment of a current one. I know it is very hard to divorce our experiences but we will be slaves to repetition and boredom if we do not try.
Although I don't share your point of view about many of your criticisms I do hear and to a large extent share your frustration about the the lack of originality in MMOs in general these days... heck, the whole gaming industry has become big business just like Hollywood where the producers just want to milk more money from proven, profitable, safe formulas and are afraid to take risks with true innovation.
This past beta was my 1st and I have several characters in the 18-21 range so I'm coming from a slightly different place than you and perhaps for that reason the game still seems fresher and more exciting to me.
If this game seems familiar to MMO veterans it's because it incorporates refinements of what has become standard MMO features. I think you're right in characterizing it as "the end product of the last generation." It benefits from all MMOs that have come before it and refines the proven winning formulas almost to perfection.
Let's talk about the namesake rifts. They are very similar to PQs in WAR in that they reward partial participation by solo and grouped players with instant loot or tokens that can be used to get loot. Just like PQs they have stages of escalating difficulty. The innovations and refinements here have to do with the semi-random location and timing of these events and the fact that, if left alone, they will periodically spawn groups of elite mobs that will leave the area and make a beeline for quest hubs where they will kill all the NPCs... including quest givers. This last bit is a very clever means of heavy-handedly "encouraging" participation by casual questers nearby who have no choice other than to join the group fight against the rift and elite mobs if they want to turn-in or get the next quests in the chain... At this point in my experience, this still feels new and random enough that it creates excitement and simulates the unpredictability and randomness that most jaded MMO vets crave.... However I can definitely see how this could become old and a major PITA especially if you're in a sparsely populated area where your only choice is to wait-out the event before you can continue going about your business.
And then there is the innovative "soul" character development system. Kudos to them for the tremendous variety of combinations that almost achieves a sandbox-like feel in character customization... unfortunately the vast majority of abilities are severely clamped-down for balancing purposes so there are very few "wow that's so cool!" abilities and quite a bit of duplication in the abilities available with other "souls" within the same stream (for the uninitiated...4 streams: cleric, mage, warrior, rogue.)By level 20 I found myself having about 12 Justicar/Shaman abilities to use but using only 3 or less in most fights.
I've already bought the game so I will definitely play it for a few months. However that's just par for the course as far as I'm concerned. I think a 6-month lifespan is about all we can reasonably expect from all of these derivative MMOs that inevitably turn into raiding (PvE, or PvP...choose one or both) grinds at the end.
Imho, you could edit your OP a bit, post it in the general section and it would read as a reasonable criticism of any and all MMOs these days.
I keep hoping to be thrilled and surprised by the new MMO on the block but I don't really expect it any more. I think it will take some crazy ballsy geniuses with little regard for their financial well being before we see someone move MMOs into the "next gen." They're all currently focused on cosmetics or refining the familiar and expected with some "New and improved!" gimmick thrown in to attract us.
Rift is no exception but a worthwhile MMO to play for a while nevertheless.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Your doing exactly what I have just described.
Obviously its to post constructive and thought provoking comments like . . .
"LoLz you like knitting?!"
Well I guess you don't get my point. Thought it was clear.
Peace.