"Roberts is a big plus to the PR/marketing part of SC, and big negative to the development side of SC."
Where is this idea coming from?
I talk to people who worked with Roberts at Origin Systems on a weekly basis. The problems that have come up recently (poor management, sycophants, profligate spending, etc) are the same things mentioned about his time at Origin.
Roberts has skated on, as no one is really interested in torpedoing their games industry career by going public. But in private, the commentary on him is scathing.
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
Only difference now he has no one telling him what he can't do,
--> Erin Roberts. His brother. Director of Global Production.
Have fun
Yeah, I don't respect Chris much, but I haven't heard a negative word about Erin, even from the folks who really pan Chris due to their experience of working with him.
And Erin has actually helmed successfully produced games in the last two decades.
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
In fairness, man...that doesn't really help your argument or disprove the individual (Talonsin) who requested the quote. The post date from that 'Letter from the Chairmen' was July 20th of 2015...this year (according to the forum posts attached to the original CR letter). This was WAY after the time frame it should of been stated when the funds rolling in started to get serious and CR began to plan expanding the scope of his original vision.
I believe what Talonsin was asking for was something in writing from well before the original 2014 delivery deadline. Something that states the scope of SC was being expanded due to the increased revenue and the 2014 delivery and the original vision of SC was no more.
"....Roberts isn’t fooling himself. Game development is an imprecise
science to begin with, and a project of this scale is like trying to
conduct a black hole. Something can and inevitably will go wrong.
“When there’s an article about us, there’s always one person who’s
like, ‘IT’S A SCAM,'” he confessed. “[Gradually releasing each part of
the game and then combining them into one] is a conscious plan. I mean,
I’m building a really big game. If you ask people what they want,
they’ll tell you they want the best game possible. But if you take a
look at Blizzard or Valve or Irrational or Rockstar, those guys all make
games people love. But then, people are still asking where Half-Life 3
is. These companies are like, ‘It’s done when it’s done.’ When some of
the best in the business can’t run to some preordained schedule, [it
says a lot about how this stuff ends up working out].”
“My hope and goal is that, because I share the process and fans see
it happening, that when we have to make choices like that, we have
different information than we did at the start of the process. People
are like, ‘OK, I get it. I mean, it sucks and I wish I had it now, but
this is better for the final game. Plus, I’ve already got stuff and I’m
seeing what you’re doing and delivering. I’m getting new content.'”
He noted, then, that the current Star Citizen/Squadron 42 release
schedule is very tentative, and already some pieces are getting jostled
by (so far) minor patches of turbulence. The dogfighting module, for
instance, will launch at the end of 2013 no matter what, but it might
not include multiplayer until early next year. Reason being, RSI has the
option of either running CryEngine’s stock multiplayer code or
implementing Star Citizen’s full MMO-ready backend. At the moment,
Roberts is leaning toward the latter, as it’ll allow stress testing
pretty much from the get-go. So long, launch day server troubles – at
least, in theory.
“That’s the decision that, if you go for the proper system, it’s much
better for the game long-term,” he said. “But that means people aren’t
playing multiplayer dogfights by Christmas. They’ll be able to play
against AI or fly their ships around, but I think that may be the choice
that I make. It’s better for the final game.”
“But it’s hard. You have to manage a lot of expectations. When we
pushed back the Hornet [ship] commercial, we had a lot of upset
reactions. People were like, ‘How could they? They lied to us.’ But then
the commercial came out, it was fine, and many of the complaints went
away. So it’s about managing from the complaints to the point where they
get something good. Delivering something good is the all-important
thing.”
Obvious wisdom, but deceptively easy to forget when thousands of backers are banging down your doors, certain that this time
you finally, truly abandoned them. And with more backer money fueling
his game than any other crowdfunded project in history, Roberts is bound
to be suspected of that at every turn. Maybe justifiably so, maybe not.
But whether we’re talking Squadron 42 or Star Citizen, this universe is
Roberts’ new home, and he doesn’t plan on going anywhere any time soon.
“Obviously, I’m worried about consistency and quality,” he admitted.
“But I’m not the guy who goes, ‘Oh yeah, that’s good enough!’ I say,
‘Guys, this is gonna have to be scrapped or redone completely.’ I want
to play it. I’ve put all this effort in. My point is, I’m committing a
decent amount of my life to get this thing done, and I don’t want to
come out on the other end and realize I dropped the ball or it wasn’t
good enough.”
I talk to people who worked with Roberts at Origin Systems on a
weekly basis. The problems that have come up recently (poor
management, sycophants, profligate spending, etc) are the same things
mentioned about his time at Origin.
Roberts has skated
on, as no one is really interested in torpedoing their games industry
career by going public. But in private, the commentary on him is
scathing.
This kind of hearsay isn't really evidence and it isn't convincing of anything in particular. And in any case these things are hardly crimes, or even reasons for concern from fans who want to see a game launched.
Generalized grumbling about the boss wouldn't add up to a charge of bad management in any case. It's just a difference of opinion on how things should be done. Every company has suck ups, and every company has favoritism. It's the shitty nature of corporate collectivist behavior.
Why does this constant fixation with a personality called Chris Roberts seem to be the focus of the negativity directed toward Star Citizen? Supposedly if Chris Roberts leaves, certain parties will be fine with Star Citizen after that. How strange this sounds.
There wouldn't be a Star Citizen without Chris Roberts, whether you like him or not. It's not GM where you just switch out a useless figurehead CEO.
Yep and we are also entitled to all the advertising on this site about a game not even made and we may also be getting nothing but BS facts. You know what this really comes down too? The company may actually be hurting for cash and you guys need to keep advertising it to try and get more cash for a game that may never see light of day.
Actually, no, you're entitled to nothing. Your ATTITUDE is entitled. That's fine though, we see plenty of entitled attitudes. If you felt like educating yourself, I'd encourage you to see any of the various infographics illustrating the Star Citizen timeline versus any other MMORPG. Why are you not on other game forums ranting about the same things? There are plenty of crowdfunded MMORPGs with much less funding than SC that will likely run out of money. Shards Online only crowdfunded $50,000. Shroud of the Avatar only crowdfunded $2 million. Pathfinder Online crowdfunded a million, plus charged people a subscription, and is still in a horrible state. Pantheon crowdfunded hundreds of thousands and ACTUALLY used that money for personal expenses, not making the game. So why Star Citizen? Each of these games is continually crowdfunding, too. Just like SC. Of COURSE they want money. The more money they have, the better. SC is no different, only the scale is bigger. However, I've already illustrated before that on a per-user basis, the average backing is actually not far from most other KS campaigns.
Yep and we are also entitled to all the advertising on this site about a game not even made and we may also be getting nothing but BS facts. You know what this really comes down too? The company may actually be hurting for cash and you guys need to keep advertising it to try and get more cash for a game that may never see light of day.
Actually, no, you're entitled to nothing. Your ATTITUDE is entitled. That's fine though, we see plenty of entitled attitudes. If you felt like educating yourself, I'd encourage you to see any of the various infographics illustrating the Star Citizen timeline versus any other MMORPG. Why are you not on other game forums ranting about the same things? There are plenty of crowdfunded MMORPGs with much less funding than SC that will likely run out of money. Shards Online only crowdfunded $50,000. Shroud of the Avatar only crowdfunded $2 million. Pathfinder Online crowdfunded a million, plus charged people a subscription, and is still in a horrible state. Pantheon crowdfunded hundreds of thousands and ACTUALLY used that money for personal expenses, not making the game. So why Star Citizen? Each of these games is continually crowdfunding, too. Just like SC. Of COURSE they want money. The more money they have, the better. SC is no different, only the scale is bigger. However, I've already illustrated before that on a per-user basis, the average backing is actually not far from most other KS campaigns.
Lets see, Shards Online yep only made 50k don't think they ripped off people and also not selling imaginary items. Shroud of the Avatar is actually a pretty good game and I play it. Nope they didn't seem or look like they embezzled cash. Pathfinder yep Smed walked away with 45k at start and I don't like him and got on him a LOT! I already stated my feelings about SC and CR and his selling of made up ships that only are in his mind.
New Weekly Star Citizen Alpha / Star Marine Update News.
Including 2 min video (Work in Progress !) about extravehicular activity on the outside of Port Olisar Starport including some fun with zero g ragdoll physics.
More videos and nonsense, but still no game. They just keep trying desperately to show something to get people to believe this game is making progress, but nothing even approaching a complete game is anywhere in the near future. This project has been more of a fund raising operation than a game making operation. Roberts has been busy paying himself, his family, and his friends nice big salaries for years with very little to show for it. Eventually even the fanboys are going to figure out this isn't going to be what was promised. Hopefully after this goes down people will start being a bit smarter about how much money they throw at crowdfunding for these types of games.
More videos and nonsense, but still no game. They just keep trying desperately to show something to get people to believe this game is making progress, but nothing even approaching a complete game is anywhere in the near future. This project has been more of a fund raising operation than a game making operation. Roberts has been busy paying himself, his family, and his friends nice big salaries for years with very little to show for it. Eventually even the fanboys are going to figure out this isn't going to be what was promised. Hopefully after this goes down people will start being a bit smarter about how much money they throw at crowdfunding for these types of games.
They should of brought out the game they originally said they were making then add around it and put the FPS in. But too late now and now no one actually knows how much cash they have left to even make the game.
From what I see it looks like CR is still more into making movies. But time will tell.
wonder how much longer you´ll keep spreading that nonsense
No, they are not following your armchair recommendations.
No, they don´t make just the 5 million $ base game if they have 93 million $
No, FPS was a stretch goal they hit in the first week. It was not "added" a year later, two years later or today. FPS WAS RIGHT THERE FROM THE START IN THE CONCEPT.
Keep ignoring that the very first video presented had FPS elements. This was never about a cockpit-only game. Go play that somewhere else, plenty of choices.
More videos and nonsense, but still no game. They just keep trying desperately to show something to get people to believe this game is making progress, but nothing even approaching a complete game is anywhere in the near future. This project has been more of a fund raising operation than a game making operation. Roberts has been busy paying himself, his family, and his friends nice big salaries for years with very little to show for it. Eventually even the fanboys are going to figure out this isn't going to be what was promised. Hopefully after this goes down people will start being a bit smarter about how much money they throw at crowdfunding for these types of games.
LMAO! Are you serious? How is it ANY of your business what other people do with their money? I have seen you post a few times on this topic in different threads and as per usual they are the uninformed crap I am used to seeing however, that statement (highlight above) caught my eye.
So I am very curious, why does other people spending money on what they want affect you in ANY way, shape, or form?
If you want a new idea, go read an old book.
In order to be insulted, I must first value your opinion.
Yes. (When I backed and gave money it said November 2014 I believe)
When you backed this, the Nov 2014 date was obsolete by the end of the Kickstarter campaign in November 2012. That campaign brought in much more than planned and enlarged the scope of the game significantly. And THEN we backers added another 87 M$ on top of THAT.
It was only communicated about a hundred times or so by CIG that the game they are now building is much larger (and therefore will take longer to develop).
So where have you been since Nov 2012 that this is completely new and unexpected to you ?
Did you never ever check the homepage ? Did you deliberately avoid all gaming magazines and news sites ?
Have fun
No, i am also an original Backer and i was never asked if i was O.K. with them pushing back the game to develop things that where not in the original game pitch. I never got an email asking me or informing me about this.
They decided after they saw that people kept spending money on virtual non-existent ships: Let's run with this and push the dates back as far as we can. They started wasting time and money on glossy spaceship documents and ship commercials. They started to waste money on making "game shows" so the failed actress wife of him has something to list on her IMD page other than softcore porn. I never asked for any of that shit.
If they had developed the original game and then added everything else i would have been fine with it. Just like ED did. As it stands it was decided without me, i have had no say in it and i am not happy about it.
When i signed up for this on Kickstarter no one told me i would be financing the career of his failed actress wife as game show hostess, Actor in the Game and Head of Marketing. This was kept a secret on purpose until the whole controversy started. I have been lied to about this. Sure they admitted it now officially because they had to but once a liar always a liar.
"It's pretty simple, really. If your only intention in posting about a particular game or topic is to be negative, then yes, you should probably move on. Voicing a negative opinion is fine, continually doing so on the same game is basically just trolling." - Michael Bitton Community Manager, MMORPG.com
"As an online discussion about Star Citizen grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Derek Smart approaches 1" - MrSnuffles's law
"I am jumping in here a bit without knowing exactly what you all or talking about." - SEANMCAD
Well for a start, peoples spending habbits kicked of the microtransaction age where i am nickled and dimed for everything in every fucking game.
Who forces you to buy those microtranssction games ?
Have fun
Apparently the market.
Because i can't buy games of another type anymore, like its to much for everything to be included in my subscription fee or too much too much for a game to come with all the content and not cut out into dlc.
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
Because i can't buy games of another type anymore, like its to much for everything to be included in my subscription fee or too much too much for a game to come with all the content and not cut out into dlc.
How about Steam and the 10.000 games there without micro transactions and DLCs?
No, i am also an original Backer and i was never asked if i was O.K. with them pushing back the game to develop things that where not in the original game pitch. I never got an email asking me or informing me about this.
You now had 3 years to ask for a refund if you did not like the project anymore. Getting a refund is as easy as sending one or two simple e-mails, giving a reason for wanting a refund and ... presto.
Why did you not ask for a refund, if you do not like it anymore or think that CIG is not following your wishes ?
Yet we see on this site and others advertising for a game that isn't even made yet and we get over and over and over again how much he made from backers yet he won't say how much cash he actually has left.
Seriously?
CIG shall reveal their financial status because YOU, someone who has not paid them a dime, asked for it?
I have news for you mister, it doesn't work that way. Find me backers, people who paid THEIR MONEY asking CR for a financial report and maybe then i'll give your writings some credit.
CIG doesn't owe you or DS or anyone else "concerned" about crowd funding getting hurt anything. Find me a KS project where the backers have full access to the finances and again i'll give you some credit.
I am a day one backer and i want to know some ballpark figures about what they have spent and how much is left. I don't want to know what they pay the cleaning lady but an overview on how much they spend on Marketing, Development, Voice Acting, Motion Capture. You get the idea. Not asking too much is it?
If i hear Chris Roberts say something like this in the Polygon Interview i am worried:
"We managed our expenses based on the revenue we bring in. We have our development timeline and we know what we're doing. We adjust. If I'm not bringing in $3 million or $2 million a month, we aren't going to have as many people working on it."
You want an example: Double Fine Adventure disclosed their financials during the campaign on the forums. They also had a running documentary bi-monthly showing everything they do, including meetings and development. That was one of the finest kickstarters i have ever been part of in terms of transparency.
"It's pretty simple, really. If your only intention in posting about a particular game or topic is to be negative, then yes, you should probably move on. Voicing a negative opinion is fine, continually doing so on the same game is basically just trolling." - Michael Bitton Community Manager, MMORPG.com
"As an online discussion about Star Citizen grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Derek Smart approaches 1" - MrSnuffles's law
"I am jumping in here a bit without knowing exactly what you all or talking about." - SEANMCAD
Because i can't buy games of another type anymore, like its to much for everything to be included in my subscription fee or too much too much for a game to come with all the content and not cut out into dlc.
How about Steam and the 10.000 games there without micro transactions and DLCs?
Have fun
That's like me telling you that you shouldn't buy star citizen and should buy space invaders off steam instead because the age of space sims is dead.
The games I LIKE are no longer available in a format that's value for money and marketed in a way that makes customers pay MORE for content.
My point being, People voting with their wallets does impact the gaming community and can potentially make demand for practices that might not be good in the long run.
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
Comments
I talk to people who worked with Roberts at Origin Systems on a weekly basis. The problems that have come up recently (poor management, sycophants, profligate spending, etc) are the same things mentioned about his time at Origin.
Roberts has skated on, as no one is really interested in torpedoing their games industry career by going public. But in private, the commentary on him is scathing.
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
Yeah, I don't respect Chris much, but I haven't heard a negative word about Erin, even from the folks who really pan Chris due to their experience of working with him.
And Erin has actually helmed successfully produced games in the last two decades.
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
Roberts has skated on, as no one is really interested in torpedoing their games industry career by going public. But in private, the commentary on him is scathing.
This kind of hearsay isn't really evidence and it isn't convincing of anything in particular. And in any case these things are hardly crimes, or even reasons for concern from fans who want to see a game launched.
Generalized grumbling about the boss wouldn't add up to a charge of bad management in any case. It's just a difference of opinion on how things should be done. Every company has suck ups, and every company has favoritism. It's the shitty nature of corporate collectivist behavior.
Why does this constant fixation with a personality called Chris Roberts seem to be the focus of the negativity directed toward Star Citizen? Supposedly if Chris Roberts leaves, certain parties will be fine with Star Citizen after that. How strange this sounds.
There wouldn't be a Star Citizen without Chris Roberts, whether you like him or not. It's not GM where you just switch out a useless figurehead CEO.
"OK, I get it. I mean, it sucks and I wish I had it now, but this is better for the final game."
Have fun
Weekly Development Update for Star Citizen and Star Marine.
Including Video of the Port Olisar location.
Have fun
Crazkanuk
----------------
Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
----------------
Star Citizen – The Extinction Level Event
4/13/15 > ELE has been updated look for 16-04-13.
http://www.dereksmart.org/2016/04/star-citizen-the-ele/
Enjoy and know the truth always comes to light!
New Weekly Star Citizen Alpha / Star Marine Update News.
Including 2 min video (Work in Progress !) about extravehicular activity on the outside of Port Olisar Starport including some fun with zero g ragdoll physics.
Have fun
Do not forget to bring a nuke.
Have fun
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3271546/Have-researchers-alien-MEGASTRUCTURE-Researchers-reveal-bizarre-star-say-huge-unknown-object-blocking-light.html
THAT would be a cool thing to find in Star Citizen.
Have fun
No, they are not following your armchair recommendations.
No, they don´t make just the 5 million $ base game if they have 93 million $
No, FPS was a stretch goal they hit in the first week. It was not "added" a year later, two years later or today. FPS WAS RIGHT THERE FROM THE START IN THE CONCEPT.
Keep ignoring that the very first video presented had FPS elements. This was never about a cockpit-only game. Go play that somewhere else, plenty of choices.
"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"
So I am very curious, why does other people spending money on what they want affect you in ANY way, shape, or form?
If you want a new idea, go read an old book.
In order to be insulted, I must first value your opinion.
Well for a start, peoples spending habbits kicked of the microtransaction age where i am nickled and dimed for everything in every fucking game.
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
Have fun
They decided after they saw that people kept spending money on virtual non-existent ships: Let's run with this and push the dates back as far as we can.
They started wasting time and money on glossy spaceship documents and ship commercials. They started to waste money on making "game shows" so the failed actress wife of him has something to list on her IMD page other than softcore porn. I never asked for any of that shit.
If they had developed the original game and then added everything else i would have been fine with it. Just like ED did. As it stands it was decided without me, i have had no say in it and i am not happy about it.
When i signed up for this on Kickstarter no one told me i would be financing the career of his failed actress wife as game show hostess, Actor in the Game and Head of Marketing. This was kept a secret on purpose until the whole controversy started. I have been lied to about this. Sure they admitted it now officially because they had to but once a liar always a liar.
"It's pretty simple, really. If your only intention in posting about a particular game or topic is to be negative, then yes, you should probably move on. Voicing a negative opinion is fine, continually doing so on the same game is basically just trolling."
- Michael Bitton
Community Manager, MMORPG.com
"As an online discussion about Star Citizen grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Derek Smart approaches 1" - MrSnuffles's law
"I am jumping in here a bit without knowing exactly what you all or talking about."
- SEANMCAD
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
Because i can't buy games of another type anymore, like its to much for everything to be included in my subscription fee or too much too much for a game to come with all the content and not cut out into dlc.
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
Have fun
Why did you not ask for a refund, if you do not like it anymore or think that CIG is not following your wishes ?
Have fun
I am a day one backer and i want to know some ballpark figures about what they have spent and how much is left. I don't want to know what they pay the cleaning lady but an overview on how much they spend on Marketing, Development, Voice Acting, Motion Capture. You get the idea. Not asking too much is it?
If i hear Chris Roberts say something like this in the Polygon Interview i am worried:
"We managed our expenses based on the revenue we bring in. We have our development timeline and we know what we're doing. We adjust. If I'm not bringing in $3 million or $2 million a month, we aren't going to have as many people working on it."
You want an example: Double Fine Adventure disclosed their financials during the campaign on the forums. They also had a running documentary bi-monthly showing everything they do, including meetings and development. That was one of the finest kickstarters i have ever been part of in terms of transparency.
"It's pretty simple, really. If your only intention in posting about a particular game or topic is to be negative, then yes, you should probably move on. Voicing a negative opinion is fine, continually doing so on the same game is basically just trolling."
- Michael Bitton
Community Manager, MMORPG.com
"As an online discussion about Star Citizen grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Derek Smart approaches 1" - MrSnuffles's law
"I am jumping in here a bit without knowing exactly what you all or talking about."
- SEANMCAD
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The games I LIKE are no longer available in a format that's value for money and marketed in a way that makes customers pay MORE for content.
My point being, People voting with their wallets does impact the gaming community and can potentially make demand for practices that might not be good in the long run.
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development