this is for kal-tard.u might want to check the 4000+ mythic banned for attempting to sell gold in WAR.mythic will ban anyone that is a reported goldspammer.i seriously doubt that mythic needs them to keep the company running.they made plenty from DAoC.
This may be the way you view it... but I think it was intended to be the other way around. The WAR launch would keep WoW WotLK people away. I mean... isn't there already half a million subscribers already? And I bet half of thoose or more (came from WoW) Thats 250k or more people not playing WotLK, but playing WAR instead. I could be entireally wrong... but this is the way I see it. -Rauge
And when WoTLK releases, about half of those that left are gonna be back.
That's just my opinion, I could be wrong.
Well... maybe about 1/4. The PvE lovers. Most people with common sense and a taste in PvE wouldn't touch this game with a ten foot pole. And thoose are the people going back to WoW.
You know when WoW came out how much problems there was with stats and how much tweaking they had to do? Mages had horrible itemization, spirit was useless, every mage wanted lock set pieces, blue gear had some really messed up stats. It's was really bad. +spell damage gear was also scaling very badly to a point where no casters wanted it at the start till they tweaked it the exact opposite way. If you were there at the start you would have realised how messed up itemisation was in WoW. You assume too much. I've been playing WoW since beta. I was there for the start and I'm still there. It wasn't really bad, it was OK and it's gotten a lot better. And there was still more variety than there is in War right now. It was bad, the a lot of the stats were horrid. Spell damage was terribly broken. WoW's forte is itemisation anyways since it's an item centric game. Besides WoW is more item centric than WAR, you just run in and RvR in WAR for fun not only doing the same stuff for rehashed gear. WAR's PvP also revolves around renown and realm war. I guess if you want a more item-centric PvP BG/Arena grind tho, WoW is a better game for you, just don't complain if different people like different things because that's the nature of things. Me I find WAR a blast, items matter somewhat but it's just fun to PvP and RvR in WAR. That doesn't mean they can just forget about itemization. It's still a big part of the game. Maybe not as big as WoW, but lets not kid ourselves, who doesn't want a nice new shiny piece of equipment from time to time? And I'm not complaining, I'm giving my honest opinion in a thread that was started by someone else about a topic that has been a huge source of opinions from everyone from WoW fanboi's to War fanboi's and everyone in between. I'm just trying to add my 2 cents (OK, more like a quarter's worth....sorry). Feel free to ignore me. You're missing the point of WAR i think, it's not solely focused on itemisation. So far the equipment is fine to me, the stats work the way they are supposed to and it's on par with wow from launch with less broken stuff. I don't think they are forgetting about it, you are presuming too much, it will improve just as WoW's improved. PvP renown items need work but besides that I'm happy with it as most of the gear is transient and the fun is in the PvP. Your opinion just differs from mine that's all as I was from WoW at the start on my mage and the itemisation was terrible.
Well I agree with the OP pretty much. I tried just about every class and couldn't even bare to get any of them past level 20. The pve was pretty dull except the PQs but there is so many times you can run PQs for loot before getting bored. The scenarios were fun for awhile but they were just so unorganized and waiting to get in one was ridiculous wait times, I tried serveral different servers to see if that would make difference and honestly it didn't. I tried rolling as shaman on the Vortex server and the wait times for scenarios was an hour. Noone does open RVR on the servers because the faction imbalance is just too lopsided. Destruction just out numbers Order too significantly. Oh and playing a greenskin just horribly reminded myself that i was playing WOW again. Took me 2 weeks (including OB) to get bored and wipe it off my pc. The ironic thing is though that AOC was way more fun but just way too buggy to play. Eventually I just had enough of that and wipe that off my pc as well. Oh well another year of disappointment yet again.
Interesting that you bring up AOC. As much as i think AOC was a flawed failure to the mmo genre i kinda agree that the time i spent in AOC was more fun and interesting than WAR and i only got one character up to 32 in AOC and i got 4 characters to 10 in war.
I am not saying AOC is better than WAR but i had more fun personally with AOC. Also AOC actually had a feel to it and an interesting story, honestly i would have quit wow for AOC if it hadn't uber failed with bugs and lies.
Hype is my nemesis. i will fight it til the day i die whether i take it down or it takes me down. So depressing, Yes?
damn i wish people would stop compairing war and wow like its a fact that the 2 games look alike, cuz they dont..
Why dont you get it ? its not the same ? if you loved wow, chances are you wont get WAR, WAR is not a PVE game its RvR at its core.
ts fine if you dont wanna play it or dont like it, but im getting sick of seeing " its not doing this and that as good as wow .." NO its doesnt AND you know why ? its not supposed to.. .
Go play some seriuos RVR with your mind on PVP, and if you dont like that well, fine go back to Arena and BG´s in WOW ..
I know this was not the topic here, but i just saw alot of people doin the comparisson in this thread and its starting to make me sick..
I will just list the two biggest problems for me as a level 24 witchhunter on Dark Crag, one of the most populated servers.
- Lag. It wasn't really a problem the first week. Only a few hiccups here and there. Now, playing in tier 2 scenarios, its horrible. Fix yur shit blizz......er....mythic.
-Animation bugs . These are SO constant that you need to play AROUND them rather then try and ignore them. I was trying to describe what they are exactly but that was too hard. Basically, the character animation, the cooldown timers, and the casting bar aren't always in sync which can be annoying as hell.
Now there are obviously more problems out there but the two listed above are really breaking the game for me. If they are not fixed in a couple of months at the latest then myself and my guild will be quitting.
damn i wish people would stop compairing war and wow like its a fact that the 2 games look alike, cuz they dont.. Why dont you get it ? its not the same ? if you loved wow, chances are you wont get WAR, WAR is not a PVE game its RvR at its core. ts fine if you dont wanna play it or dont like it, but im getting sick of seeing " its not doing this and that as good as wow .." NO its doesnt AND you know why ? its not supposed to.. .
Go play some seriuos RVR with your mind on PVP, and if you dont like that well, fine go back to Arena and BG´s in WOW ..
I know this was not the topic here, but i just saw alot of people doin the comparisson in this thread and its starting to make me sick..
See this what i don't understand about WAR the people that drool over this game just think that others don't get it that were too simple to understand the beauty and the grandness of this design.
How many times have i read "at its core its not a pve game its rvr" to many to count. I think we get it by now war fanboys. I don't go around doing quests thinkin i am fighting other people and vice versa and i don't wish i was either. People think there is something special about the RVRness of this game and that we should be impressed or something.
its just world pvp with objectives that reset after a certain amount of time. this isn't special many games have demostrated this at some level of this for some time. WoW has world pvp objectives and they have been around for a while. When you kill city booses last time i checked you got some honor and rep, the game just doesn't hold your hand and make you aware of everything you have to go and discover these things for yourself.
As for comparing wow to war based on looks honestly war more reminds me of a darker version of lotro in terms of style and feel than it does wow.
Hype is my nemesis. i will fight it til the day i die whether i take it down or it takes me down. So depressing, Yes?
I guess when Wotlk comes out I'll be back in there. I played War for a little over a week now. It's not bad but, it's also not that good either. The graphics look nice but, the gameplay isn't nearly as smooth and the gold spammers are frikkin all over that game and unlike WoW there is no program to automatically remove and ignore them.
That's just your opinion I'm afraid. I'm having a blast in WAR and it plays very smooth for me on average. One thing that helped is putting the OS page file on a separate solid state drive for increased read and access times. Par that with low latency ram and two other solid state drives in a Raid 0 it really does a good job to widen those typical bottlenecks for data flow within Pc's.
Normal HDD are still held back by the mechanical side. Even 10k RPM HDD can't keep up with a solid state drive read/write times. This is second generation solid state drives I'm using. They're not officially on the market yet, but I work in the industry so can get them. They've got non of the teething issues of first generation solid state drives with stuttering and they will be cheaper.
As for gold spammers I've got a war addon that's blocks and reports the gold spammer automatically called SpamMeNot.
damn i wish people would stop compairing war and wow like its a fact that the 2 games look alike, cuz they dont.. Why dont you get it ? its not the same ? if you loved wow, chances are you wont get WAR, WAR is not a PVE game its RvR at its core. ts fine if you dont wanna play it or dont like it, but im getting sick of seeing " its not doing this and that as good as wow .." NO its doesnt AND you know why ? its not supposed to.. .
Go play some seriuos RVR with your mind on PVP, and if you dont like that well, fine go back to Arena and BG´s in WOW ..
I know this was not the topic here, but i just saw alot of people doin the comparisson in this thread and its starting to make me sick..
See this what i don't understand about WAR the people that drool over this game just think that others don't get it that were too simple to understand the beauty and the grandness of this design.
How many times have i read "at its core its not a pve game its rvr" to many to count. I think we get it by now war fanboys. I don't go around doing quests thinkin i am fighting other people and vice versa and i don't wish i was either. People think there is something special about the RVRness of this game and that we should be impressed or something.
its just world pvp with objectives that reset after a certain amount of time. this isn't special many games have demostrated this at some level of this for some time. WoW has world pvp objectives and they have been around for a while. When you kill city booses last time i checked you got some honor and rep, the game just doesn't hold your hand and make you aware of everything you have to go and discover these things for yourself.
What you don't understand is people are having fun in WAR unlike you. Not everyone is the same, some like to grind the same BGs in wow but some like world pvp and rvr. Let the people play the game they like. If you don't like RvR it's your choice other people do.
The "something special" is there is world PvP and there is more than 4 BGs. WoW's PvP objectives are a joke and everything is pve or loot centric. Kill city bosses? lmao. It's a lagfest in the cities on city raids and there is really no point to them. How many city raids have you been to? Yeah that's what i figured.
What you don't understand is people are having fun in WAR unlike you. Not everyone is the same, some like to grind the same BGs in wow but some like world pvp and rvr. Let the people play the game they like. If you don't like RvR it's your choice other people do. The "something special" is there is world PvP and there is more than 4 BGs. WoW's PvP objectives are a joke and everything is pve or loot centric. Kill city bosses? lmao. It's a lagfest in the cities on city raids and there is really no point to them. How many city raids have you been to? Yeah that's what i figured.
Wow PvP objectives is to let players have FUN while they can at the same time have a new shiny weapon and gear.
That's the biggest motivation our society has btw: evolve your person or character (like you better yourself constantly in RL and go out shopping for new pants or game or whatever.)
What's the motivation of War. Dying for the realm pride, dying for the fatherland? No thanks.
In Wow I have choices, In War I can only do 1 thing after leveling up: die.
How satisfying.
RvR is just a gimmick. Stratego is RvR.
And I don't bash because WAR has some great ideas, I bash it because it doesn't meet the standards set by Blizzard in MANY ways (from real 3D worlds you can fly over to polished real dynamic fights with staggering differences in crowd control).
From epic dungeons, raids and boss encounters to new standards to be set out in the new WotLK open world PvP:
Just have a look again at thes videos: THAT is the new industry standard in speed and execution of fights:
What you don't understand is people are having fun in WAR unlike you. Not everyone is the same, some like to grind the same BGs in wow but some like world pvp and rvr. Let the people play the game they like. If you don't like RvR it's your choice other people do. The "something special" is there is world PvP and there is more than 4 BGs. WoW's PvP objectives are a joke and everything is pve or loot centric. Kill city bosses? lmao. It's a lagfest in the cities on city raids and there is really no point to them. How many city raids have you been to? Yeah that's what i figured.
Wow PvP objectives is to let players have FUN while they can at the same time have a new shiny weapon and gear.
That's the biggest motivation our society has btw: evolve your person or character (like you better yourself constantly in RL and go out shopping for a new pance or game or whatever.)
What's the motivation of War. Dying for the realm pride, dying for the fatherland? No thanks.
In Wow I have choices, In War I can only do I thing after leveling up: die.
How satisfying.
RvR is just a gimmick. Stratego is RvR.
At max level there are things to do besides die. There are Dungeons to Raid, and stuff you can unlock when taking over Cities. Go adventuring to see hidden stuff unlock stuff in the ToK. WoW's pvp sucks, why anyone would want to sit in an battleground over and over again is beyond me. In WOTLK you can only control keeps for 4 hours then it switches what a Joke, In WAR you can conrtol a keep as long as you keep the enemy at bay. But I guess thats my opinion If you like the game thats cool by me. I just got tired of that game with the quickness.
So quick overview, WoW=gear is good based upon +Damage/Healing/Def/Resistance/Bonus (for completing Sets) War=Gear is good based upon +stats/Resitance/Bonus (for completing sets) Just because its different doesn't mean it is crap or there is a lack of variety. Lack of variety would be something on lines of there are only 2 different helms/bracers/chest/pants/etc between lvl 9-20 which is not the case for either game.
No, it doesn't mean it's crap, but it IS less variety. I don't see how anyone can argue it's not. If it were as you said, only 2 different helms that's NO variety and not what I'm saying. I'm saying there's less variety.
And the reason there isn't more variety at level 40 in WoW is because the lvl 40 gear has not changed much since the game went live almost 4 years ago. The only started adding to some of these stats with BC. Now, I figure you're going to counter with, well WoW has had 4 years to add all these new stats. Yes, they have. AND WAR HAS BEEN ABLE TO SEE WHAT THEY DID AND INCORPORATE INTO THEIR GAME AS WELL. No one lives in a bubble. All the developers get the benefit of seeing what the other developers have done and have a chance to incorporate into their own game. That's all I'm saying. I've seen it now with WoW and I like it. Anyone who doesn't incorporate this or something equally as good feels like a step back rather than a step forward.
And even at lvl 29 in WoW you'll see more variety than at level 17 in War which is pretty close to the same level respectively.
Take a look at my crappy geared lvl 29 in WoW (And you won't find a much more crappily geared toon in the game). You'll see + to health (an enchant even...hmm.....). + to Nature spell damage. + to Armor (Profession....hmmmm....). + to damage and healing.
These types of things make the itemization in WoW better than in War. It's not crap in War, but it's not as good as WoW and in my opinion it should be at least as good if not better for a game that's released 4 years later.
So, you're wanting extra + to different stats because of variety? My bank in WAR is overflowing with gear - two pieces of which are part of two separate sets (the sets you were talking about in this thread, that you asked if they were hard to get. The answer is no, they're not.) I have variety coming out of my ears. I choose to wear the things I wear because they give me + to Toughness, + to Strength and + to Weapon Skill.
In turn, that lets me ignore incoming dps (toughness, -29.6 dps), it lets me ignore armor and parry better (+ weapon skill) and it lets me hit harder both with abilities and with auto-attack. Now, I could set up my system like WoW and instead of saying + weapon skill, I could say, + To Hit + to Parry + [insert arbitrary stat here]. But unlike WoW, the game really isn't gear based. It is more realm-based. So, WAR doesn't need 100 different sets from 1-40. They don't need to cover parry, and weapon skill and strength and healing. They have a few base stats for that.
But even those people that would like to worry about those things (as you seem to). They have things called Tactics. Now, you get 4 career tactics, 2 renown tactics and 1 tome tactic. Now, guess what these things do? +5% parry. +5% renown gain when you kill dwarf players. +10% Ballistic Skill. etc. etc. - there's tons of them. You can even switch out tactic sets mid-battle. So, now you have your armor which lumps all these arbitrary stats into one stat that you can adjust by finding one piece of armor, not running around, finding 30 different pieces to get your stats exactly right, then enchanting it to get what you couldn't seem to find. So, you get your armor, then you get your tactics. Now you get your +% to nearly whatever you want (since you seem to need the variety).
This is exactly what gets to me. The breed of gamers that WoW has spawned. Greedy, item-mongering elitists that can't let others enjoy their game of choice. Think about it - why make resilience, haste, and all the other stats that they made? To make more items. Why do they need to make more items? To fill in the lulls of crap that the rest of the game has become. In WoW, you're either going after an item of some sort (which is 90% of the time) or you're standing around a city, letting people oogle you (10%).
And as if that wasn't enough, you have a glorified item mall in the form of a TCG. <shakes head> One of my guildmates in WAR today said that he was asking some of his WoW friends to come to WAR. All I could do was cringe and pray that they would say no.
What you don't understand is people are having fun in WAR unlike you. Not everyone is the same, some like to grind the same BGs in wow but some like world pvp and rvr. Let the people play the game they like. If you don't like RvR it's your choice other people do. The "something special" is there is world PvP and there is more than 4 BGs. WoW's PvP objectives are a joke and everything is pve or loot centric. Kill city bosses? lmao. It's a lagfest in the cities on city raids and there is really no point to them. How many city raids have you been to? Yeah that's what i figured.
Wow PvP objectives is to let players have FUN while they can at the same time have a new shiny weapon and gear.
That's the biggest motivation our society has btw: evolve your person or character (like you better yourself constantly in RL and go out shopping for new pants or game or whatever.)
What's the motivation of War. Dying for the realm pride, dying for the fatherland? No thanks.
In Wow I have choices, In War I can only do 1 thing after leveling up: die.
How satisfying.
RvR is just a gimmick. Stratego is RvR.
And I don't bash because WAR has some great ideas, I bash it because it doesn't meet the standards set by Blizzard in MANY ways (from real 3D worlds you can fly over to polished real dynamic fights with staggering differences in crowd control).
From epic dungeons, raids and boss encounters to new standards to be set out in the new WotLK open world PvP:
It wil still be the same item centric loot and scoot game. RvR is fun. Just cos you don't find it fun just means that you don't, many people do so don't try to impose your expectations on others.
Biggest motivation in society? Fatherland? Now your stretching Vicksburg/Memoir/Teamfortress/Bodypass.
I play WAR cos its fun to me and many others. Capturing points and advancing world RvR is interesting, and much better than a tired old 4 BGs and arenas. If you can prove to me that Lake Wintergrasp has a larger aspect to it other than just an item-grind and more PvE, maybe that will help.
RvR is a gimmick to you because you are blinded by hate. It was present in DAOC and it worked great.
A 3D world where there is no endgame-world pvp objectives is a dead world to PvPers.
PS: Stratego was a great game But guess what, it's not an MMO nub.
What you don't understand is people are having fun in WAR unlike you. Not everyone is the same, some like to grind the same BGs in wow but some like world pvp and rvr. Let the people play the game they like. If you don't like RvR it's your choice other people do.
The "something special" is there is world PvP and there is more than 4 BGs. WoW's PvP objectives are a joke and everything is pve or loot centric. Kill city bosses? lmao. It's a lagfest in the cities on city raids and there is really no point to them. How many city raids have you been to? Yeah that's what i figured.
So i bring up valid points and what ..... your ears and eyes actually close. Thats the kinda fanboyism that usually leads to ritual murder to appease there non existent gods.
The sad things is i have had fun doing all the world pvp i mentioned and you seem to think it doesn't even exist (something the war community likes to say), things like halaa and even raiding origimar to kill thrall have brought me loads of fun and i see lots of peopleing saying FOR THE ALLIANCE when we win if thats not REALM pride i don't know what it is. Do i get any gear from it NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. do i have fun hell ya and this is on a pvp server never mind what it might be like on an rp-pvp server.
In fact in wow you could say we need less incinative to world pvp then in war which gives you all sorts of objectives and GEAR sets. I have read numerous reviews saying that world pvp or open rvr is pretty abandoned at low tiers
So please before you post understand that the closed minded post that is pissing you off might just be your own.
Hype is my nemesis. i will fight it til the day i die whether i take it down or it takes me down. So depressing, Yes?
Originally posted by bodypass Originally posted by fuzzylojik What you don't understand is people are having fun in WAR unlike you. Not everyone is the same, some like to grind the same BGs in wow but some like world pvp and rvr. Let the people play the game they like. If you don't like RvR it's your choice other people do. The "something special" is there is world PvP and there is more than 4 BGs. WoW's PvP objectives are a joke and everything is pve or loot centric. Kill city bosses? lmao. It's a lagfest in the cities on city raids and there is really no point to them. How many city raids have you been to? Yeah that's what i figured.
Wow PvP objectives is to let players have FUN while they can at the same time have a new shiny weapon and gear. That's the biggest motivation our society has btw: evolve your person or character (like you better yourself constantly in RL and go out shopping for new pants or game or whatever.)
What's the motivation of War. Dying for the realm pride, dying for the fatherland? No thanks. In Wow I have choices, In War I can only do 1 thing after leveling up: die. How satisfying. RvR is just a gimmick. Stratego is RvR. And I don't bash because WAR has some great ideas, I bash it because it doesn't meet the standards set by Blizzard in MANY ways (from real 3D worlds you can fly over to polished real dynamic fights with staggering differences in crowd control). From epic dungeons, raids and boss encounters to new standards to be set out in the new WotLK open world PvP: Just have a look again at thes videos: THAT is the new industry standard in speed and execution of fights:
I think it will be just like the rest of WOW's PVP thats is it might be fun the first few times but it looks like it will be just as boring and repetative as the rest of wows pvp Personally i havent played my Grand Marshal sence she hit it and if i was going to pvp again i would go back to DaOC before i play either War or WoTLK
This may be the way you view it... but I think it was intended to be the other way around. The WAR launch would keep WoW WotLK people away. I mean... isn't there already half a million subscribers already? And I bet half of thoose or more (came from WoW) Thats 250k or more people not playing WotLK, but playing WAR instead. I could be entireally wrong... but this is the way I see it. -Rauge
Probably wrong since it took them launching in 3 countries to achieve that amount of people were Blizzard had half that amount from america alone..actually more then half, but either way other games out there took a hit way more then wow did. I took a break from WoW to try out WAR, i'll be back for WoTLK though
"The great thing about human language is that it prevents us from sticking to the matter at hand." - Lewis Thomas
I think it will be just like the rest of WOW's PVP thats is it might be fun the first few times but it looks like it will be just as boring and repetative as the rest of wows pvp
Personally i havent played my Grand Marshal sence she hit it and if i was going to pvp again i would go back to DaOC before i play either War or WoTLK
Wow....Grand Marshall rank was before Burning Crusade. So you're saying you haven't PvP'd at all since BC came out?
This may be the way you view it... but I think it was intended to be the other way around. The WAR launch would keep WoW WotLK people away. I mean... isn't there already half a million subscribers already? And I bet half of thoose or more (came from WoW) Thats 250k or more people not playing WotLK, but playing WAR instead. I could be entireally wrong... but this is the way I see it. -Rauge
Just so you know....a lot of those people don't intend to play after the first free month, so frankly, this discussion is a bit pointless until WAR has been out long enough for people to have to start PAYING the monthly sub to play it.
I played it because I wanted to get my money's worth out of the 50 bucks it cost me to try it. But I'm not continuing on after month one either, and I'm by FAR not the only one.
Some people will love it and stay....others will not. There will be no ACCURATE numbers assessments for quite some time.
You're making the assumption that those playing WAR right NOW...will not be playing WotLK. And guess what....SOME people will play BOTH games, as they don't see a need to just pick ONE. For godssake the subs are only 15 bucks a month, there's no reason most people can't play two games if they really LIKE them. I subscribe to SEVERAL at a time.
I played DAoC for 6 yrs.i tried wow got bored after 2 days.imo wow was made for people that enjoy pve.the pvp in DAoC still is the best imo.the keep takes are fun and the pvp dungeons are great.i also tried conan and it was as boring as wow.then again i love pvp and so far with WAR its fast paced and fun in the scenarios.
So, you're wanting extra + to different stats because of variety? My bank in WAR is overflowing with gear - two pieces of which are part of two separate sets (the sets you were talking about in this thread, that you asked if they were hard to get. The answer is no, they're not.) Let me get this straight, you have a bank overflowing with gear, that's like what 50 slots or something and 2 pieces are set pieces? 2 out of 50? And you say they are easy to come by? I think your definition of easy to come by and mine are different. But even those people that would like to worry about those things (as you seem to). They have things called Tactics. Now, you get 4 career tactics, 2 renown tactics and 1 tome tactic. Now, guess what these things do? +5% parry. +5% renown gain when you kill dwarf players. +10% Ballistic Skill. etc. etc. - there's tons of them. You can even switch out tactic sets mid-battle. So, now you have your armor which lumps all these arbitrary stats into one stat that you can adjust by finding one piece of armor, not running around, finding 30 different pieces to get your stats exactly right, then enchanting it to get what you couldn't seem to find. So, you get your armor, then you get your tactics. Now you get your +% to nearly whatever you want (since you seem to need the variety). Since you brought it up let's talk about tactics and morale and renown. I like the morale skills. I like the idea that as you participate in combat you build up your morale and then can use that morale as specials skills. You decide whether you want to use it a little bit at a time or save it up and use a more powerful skill but you have to be careful because if you stay out of combat too long your morale goes away quickly. That's a cool idea and encourages people to fight and stay in battle, so it works well for the most part. It's a little weird how there is some sort of weird timer on it as to when you can use the skills that I don't like because I haven't quite figured out how it works yet, but I like the concept. Tactics on the other hand are largely useless in my opinion. Sure, you have several tactics that you choose from, but you can only ever use 1 at any time. Yeah, it's kinda nice that you can change them in battle, but for the most part I don't find them to be that significant. I kinda look at them like a trinket that you might swap in and out in WoW based on what you think will give you the most benefit at the time. It really doesn't increase the variety, just gives you a way to modify your makeup a bit during battle. It's not a bad idea, I just don't find it to be that useful. And since we are discussing these things, let throw in renown shall we? I like that as you increase your rlvl you get access to renown gear, but renown points and the mastery trees in my opinion are not as nice. Let's compare their flexibility with WoW's tree system, shall we? In War you get 3 trees and as you put more points into a tree, you get access to better and better skills, however the skills you get access to are all determined in advance, you can't get the next higher up skill without putting enough points to get the one before it. It's a completely linear approach, which isn't bad, but compare that with WoW's approach which is a tree structure with branches. You decide which branches to go down so you don't necessarily have to get all the lower level skills to get to a higher level one, you can pick and choose which ones to get as you go higher and higher. On top of that you can put more points into certain skills that you use a lot and fewer in skills that you only use occasionally. It give you a lot of control as to how you spec yourself. I like WoW's approach better, but there I go again comparing War to WoW again, sorry. This is exactly what gets to me. The breed of gamers that WoW has spawned. Greedy, item-mongering elitists that can't let others enjoy their game of choice. Dude, if you haven't noticed you are in the WoW forums. NO ONE IS MAKING YOU COME HERE. If you don't want to talk about WoW, that's fine, there is a War forum for you to discuss the finer points of War in. This forum is for people who want to talk about things relating to WoW and currently a hot topic here is the newly released Warhammer game and what it has to offer and how it compares to WoW. We are NOT trying to keep others from enjoying their game of choice. In fact I have tried to keep my comments OUT of the War forums for just this reason. Think about it - why make resilience, haste, and all the other stats that they made? Why not? To make more items. Why do they need to make more items? For more variety. I've already made this abundantly clear, but you don't seem to understand the concept. To fill in the lulls of crap that the rest of the game has become. In WoW, you're either going after an item of some sort (which is 90% of the time) or you're standing around a city, letting people oogle you (10%). What do you care? Why don't you go enjoy your game of choice? And as if that wasn't enough, you have a glorified item mall in the form of a TCG. <shakes head> One of my guildmates in WAR today said that he was asking some of his WoW friends to come to WAR. All I could do was cringe and pray that they would say no. I'm doing my best to convince the WoW people that War isn't better than WoW. Maybe you should be thanking me instead of debating it with me? Or maybe this is just your way of keeping me talking? I'm on to you now, you're a sly one you are.
So quick overview, WoW=gear is good based upon +Damage/Healing/Def/Resistance/Bonus (for completing Sets) War=Gear is good based upon +stats/Resitance/Bonus (for completing sets) Just because its different doesn't mean it is crap or there is a lack of variety. Lack of variety would be something on lines of there are only 2 different helms/bracers/chest/pants/etc between lvl 9-20 which is not the case for either game.
No, it doesn't mean it's crap, but it IS less variety. I don't see how anyone can argue it's not. If it were as you said, only 2 different helms that's NO variety and not what I'm saying. I'm saying there's less variety.
And the reason there isn't more variety at level 40 in WoW is because the lvl 40 gear has not changed much since the game went live almost 4 years ago. The only started adding to some of these stats with BC. Now, I figure you're going to counter with, well WoW has had 4 years to add all these new stats. Yes, they have. AND WAR HAS BEEN ABLE TO SEE WHAT THEY DID AND INCORPORATE INTO THEIR GAME AS WELL. No one lives in a bubble. All the developers get the benefit of seeing what the other developers have done and have a chance to incorporate into their own game. That's all I'm saying. I've seen it now with WoW and I like it. Anyone who doesn't incorporate this or something equally as good feels like a step back rather than a step forward.
And even at lvl 29 in WoW you'll see more variety than at level 17 in War which is pretty close to the same level respectively.
Take a look at my crappy geared lvl 29 in WoW (And you won't find a much more crappily geared toon in the game). You'll see + to health (an enchant even...hmm.....). + to Nature spell damage. + to Armor (Profession....hmmmm....). + to damage and healing.
These types of things make the itemization in WoW better than in War. It's not crap in War, but it's not as good as WoW and in my opinion it should be at least as good if not better for a game that's released 4 years later.
So, you're wanting extra + to different stats because of variety? My bank in WAR is overflowing with gear - two pieces of which are part of two separate sets (the sets you were talking about in this thread, that you asked if they were hard to get. The answer is no, they're not.) I have variety coming out of my ears. I choose to wear the things I wear because they give me + to Toughness, + to Strength and + to Weapon Skill.
In turn, that lets me ignore incoming dps (toughness, -29.6 dps), it lets me ignore armor and parry better (+ weapon skill) and it lets me hit harder both with abilities and with auto-attack. Now, I could set up my system like WoW and instead of saying + weapon skill, I could say, + To Hit + to Parry + [insert arbitrary stat here]. But unlike WoW, the game really isn't gear based. It is more realm-based. So, WAR doesn't need 100 different sets from 1-40. They don't need to cover parry, and weapon skill and strength and healing. They have a few base stats for that.
But even those people that would like to worry about those things (as you seem to). They have things called Tactics. Now, you get 4 career tactics, 2 renown tactics and 1 tome tactic. Now, guess what these things do? +5% parry. +5% renown gain when you kill dwarf players. +10% Ballistic Skill. etc. etc. - there's tons of them. You can even switch out tactic sets mid-battle. So, now you have your armor which lumps all these arbitrary stats into one stat that you can adjust by finding one piece of armor, not running around, finding 30 different pieces to get your stats exactly right, then enchanting it to get what you couldn't seem to find. So, you get your armor, then you get your tactics. Now you get your +% to nearly whatever you want (since you seem to need the variety).
This is exactly what gets to me. The breed of gamers that WoW has spawned. Greedy, item-mongering elitists that can't let others enjoy their game of choice. Think about it - why make resilience, haste, and all the other stats that they made? To make more items. Why do they need to make more items? To fill in the lulls of crap that the rest of the game has become. In WoW, you're either going after an item of some sort (which is 90% of the time) or you're standing around a city, letting people oogle you (10%).
And as if that wasn't enough, you have a glorified item mall in the form of a TCG. <shakes head> One of my guildmates in WAR today said that he was asking some of his WoW friends to come to WAR. All I could do was cringe and pray that they would say no.
See this is what gets to me, you sit there and try to claim WoW has made every player an Elitist, greedy person and your full of crap, EVERY GAME HAS THOSE TYPE OF PEOPLE even in WAR i am seeing it, and it isnt very many in either game, and nobody here is saying you can't enjoy your game of choice, but you sure as hell have to come to the WoW forums and tell people they can't enjoy WoW, try not being a hypocrite, nobody forced you to come here, somebody made a post about not likeing WAR, guess what don't come here trying to change their mind they only want to play their game of choice!
Don't act stupid about the TCG because i gaurentee this much, WAR will have one too, they already did stuff like that if you bought certain magazines you got a special item, if you pre-order C&C Red Alert 3 you get a special item, what are you gonna do quit when you see them give game items for buying their new table top mini's? it'll happen just wait.
And in WoW i enjoyed the crafting, dungeon crawling, occasional PVP, exploring, RPing, Holiday stuff they put in, etc etc. having all that stuff is what makes an mmo fun i have never played WoW for the gear, yes some are like that but why are they like that? because the gear gets them through to see the next area of content, to be able to battle the bosses. Tell me who is being Elitist when you are having an issue with your friend inviting people to come and play with him, try not being hypocrite once again.
"The great thing about human language is that it prevents us from sticking to the matter at hand." - Lewis Thomas
Why is anyone bothering to argue with Pappy13? Yeah, why is anyone bothering to argue with me? I've been asking myself that same question. Pappy doesn't like WAR so what..who the hell cares his opinion shouldn't matter to anyone but him. Exactly. But by the way, I kinda like War, I just think it could be better if they fixed some of the problems I have with the game. It certaintly doesn't matter to me as far as I'm concerned WoW can jus tkeep on trucking with 10 million noobs & carrot stick lovers and I'll keep playing WAR having a good time because for once I dont have to worry about PVE raiding & dungeons to keep up. Sweet. btw Gear doesn't make variety especially when everyone goes for the same gear and it can't be dyed or enchanced to look different than the next dudes. Hold on, I thought you said it didn't matter to you and that nobody should be bothering to argue with me? Is that an argument you are making? There's little 'variety' on WoW in my opinion. Its Dungeon Raid or Die...or PvP Mini game the same couple of things over and over and Die...you'd think after 4 years they'd come up with something else. Good review. How do you feel about flying combat? Think that adds something? What about a class that starts out at lvl 55 instead of lvl 1? Think that has any merit? And what about 2 and 3 person mounts? What do think about them?
This is exactly what gets to me. The breed of gamers that WoW has spawned. Greedy, item-mongering elitists that can't let others enjoy their game of choice. Think about it - why make resilience, haste, and all the other stats that they made? To make more items. Why do they need to make more items? To fill in the lulls of crap that the rest of the game has become. In WoW, you're either going after an item of some sort (which is 90% of the time) or you're standing around a city, letting people oogle you (10%). And as if that wasn't enough, you have a glorified item mall in the form of a TCG. <shakes head> One of my guildmates in WAR today said that he was asking some of his WoW friends to come to WAR. All I could do was cringe and pray that they would say no.
See this is what gets to me, you sit there and try to claim WoW has made every player an Elitist, greedy person and your full of crap, EVERY GAME HAS THOSE TYPE OF PEOPLE even in WAR i am seeing it, and it isnt very many in either game, and nobody here is saying you can't enjoy your game of choice, but you sure as hell have to come to the WoW forums and tell people they can't enjoy WoW, try not being a hypocrite, nobody forced you to come here, somebody made a post about not likeing WAR, guess what don't come here trying to change their mind they only want to play their game of choice!
Don't act stupid about the TCG because i gaurentee this much, WAR will have one too, they already did stuff like that if you bought certain magazines you got a special item, if you pre-order C&C Red Alert 3 you get a special item, what are you gonna do quit when you see them give game items for buying their new table top mini's? it'll happen just wait.
And in WoW i enjoyed the crafting, dungeon crawling, occasional PVP, exploring, RPing, Holiday stuff they put in, etc etc. having all that stuff is what makes an mmo fun i have never played WoW for the gear, yes some are like that but why are they like that? because the gear gets them through to see the next area of content, to be able to battle the bosses. Tell me who is being Elitist when you are having an issue with your friend inviting people to come and play with him, try not being hypocrite once again.
If I could give you positive rep for that....I would.
The hypocrisy level of some posters on this site is absolutely staggering. "Quit doggin' my new toy!! 'Cause YOUR toy sux! Waaaaa!." QQ more Fanboi WAR. It's getting very OLD. And I, for one, have tried posting my positive views on Warhammer (I do have a few), as well as my negative impressions, but for the MOST part, the WAR fans tend to predominantly be WoWbashers, even though a good LOT of them got at least a couple years enjoyment out of the game themselves, now they want to just go on and on and on about how "it sux."
A lot of WAR posters are a bit like lemmings. It's "kewl" to hate WoW. It's "kewler" to hate it and spew crap about WHY you hate it all over the forums. It's NOT "kewl" to admit that you enjoyed it....EVER. Because then you will be viewed as one of the "stupid elitists" that played WoW at one time. NOT GOOD.
Pffft.
I enjoy all the things that you posted above that YOU enjoy. Sadly, about ALL of that is missing from Warhammer. End conclusion: Warhammer is just not MY kind of game. I couldn't give two sh**s and a f**k what anyone else wants to play. I hope they STAY with Warhammer, if they're bi***ing about WoW, because it's less of that whiney crap going on when I'm playing. WIN/WIN.
And yes, EVERY game has it's "greedy elitists." It's hilarious that some of the WAR fans think they're going to like EVERYONE they play with. HAHAHA...give it a few months.
Alright, I don't mind people not liking something in particular but at least they should do it with good reason. I have to defend WAR here and comment a bit on Pappy's review especially since it contains some misinformation. 1) Why would you want to go under water? There's nothing there and you would never benefit from it in combat. And what's so bad about falling damage? It's just a bit realistic. 2) What you're saying is basically true. I just don't have problems with it. 3) First off, WAR quests are very much grouped together. Check your map once more please. I agree though that quests do not give a sense of accomplishment, but then neither do WoW quests unless you're talking about the 10% drop rate ones. I wouldn't know since I don't degrade myself enough to complete them. 4) This is where I start to wonder if you played beyond level 3 or we even played the same game. You obviously never saw a level 40 character. Sure, the art style is different. It's grittier. It's for all of us who dislikes looking like the blinking christmas trees wielding almost-sword-like objects from Warcraft. The items in WAR looks slightly more as if somebody could actually wear/wield them and then go into combat. Next try not to be so hung up on WoW math and its combat system. WAR has a totally different set of stats and nothing is "missing". If you bothered to mouse-hover over your stats you would find out that Intelligence increases spell damage and.. uh... armour increases armour. Really! What were you looking at? 5) UI is highly customisable from the built-in tool. You don't like it? You can change it, but it takes more than 10 minutes so not for those with short attention span. But this is one of the areas where a lot of players are complaining, especially about linking in chat. AH filtering works fine for me. 6) "Fun factor" is not there for sure, and it's intended. Mythic didn't put any fluffy kitten crap in there since it's a game about war - not breeding kittens. There are emotes though, just not the same as in WoW. Try typing /help to get a list of all 220 commands. And why would you want fishing? To pass time? If you need to do something else just log out!
7) Yes, PvE is "lacking" if you're expecting WoW 2. But this isn't WoW 2. It's not a PvE game with some flawed PvP-system added for good measure. It's a game that totally revolves around PvP combat with a little PvE content added for diversion. Now I can't speak for the server you tried but on Burlok I'm rarely having trouble completing a PQ because of not enough players. It usually happens around 4 AM. I've never had to queue either. 8) Yes. Crafting is abysmal, and good riddance. To answer your questiong about talisman making though, you'll find those materials if you pick the scaveniging or salvaging skill. And why would you need bandages when there's potions? Bandages are just a potion with a different name and a separate cooldown. However since potions in WAR are more potent than in WoW and already on a 60 sec CD.... 9) No. ..... Okay, I'll humour you with a slightly longer response. To say that the 3 BGs in WoW are enough is just... well okay, if you settle for that it's fine I guess. The scenarios in WAR are all variations of conquer and defend, of course, since how could it not be. It's all a game of strategical conflict. There really is little you can do other than to alter the terrain. Next issue... Just because there were nobody in the RvR area when you went there on your admittedly under-populated server doesn't mean that open RvR is broken. I've had plenty of action on my mid-pop server. This is something that will even out in time though. Too bad you never got to experience a keep siege. It's really something. 10) I have 1.5 Gb RAM and have no issues with response.
1Concerning the waters it has EVERYTHING TO DO with the world's realism lvls.
2.all sensible ppl know that the best pvp system is the wow's arenas ..unless u value opinions of inmature kids that like to gang or attack from safe range in mass battles.. Skilled ppl want to fight fair fights where you are 5 ppl vs 5 ppl.. 3 ppl vs 3 ppl 2 ppl vs 2 ppl .. Nothing fun about 8 ppl getting zerged by 40 ppl as im sure its hapopening hundrends of times in almost all servers in various times of day
Real realm vs realm needs much better combat system also than the auto attacks noobish system of wow+war and clickie clickie..u want decent and fair massive battles ? prey aventurine will accomplish DF as they promished to.. Rest are just to fool each other in the forums...
2.) I nearly pee'd my pants when I red this. WoW Arenas are NOT the best PvP system. That is a JOKE. Sure.. for a game based on PvE... It has O.K. PvP. But not good. Nowhere near WARs. You may fight fair.. but PvP in WoW is lack luster. It just doesn't have that... (no pun indeeded) "Wow!" factor that War's does. Meh.. this may have changed since I last played... but from my experience WoW's PvP was a constent grind/gankfest. BG's were a good idea... but scenarios in WAR are SOOOO much better.
-Rauge
i can say 2 things
1. Trying to compare wow's pvp and war's pvp is impossible to say war has better pvp.. i can explain that.
Wow started as PVE game after 2 years all people were farming battlegrounds gathering as much possible honor ponts to raise in ranking and to become if possible grand marshal..
That was the 1st era.. after expansion of burning crusade for 1st time the arena system was implemented to the game giving the ultimate chalenge for pvpiers to try become with their friends the number 1 team in all the servers.. ARENA is giving the players a purpose .. The logic now in wow is to play battlegrounds , farm honor points , use them to buy some pvp gear ( bracers, boots, rings, waist,necklace) ..and along wiht the arena points and rating u get u can take slowly chest , legs,shoulders ,helmet,gauntlets,weapons..Most ppl wont manage to take them all cause it requires skills,and teamwork and communication in order to get high rating and get weapons or shoulders or helmet ..thats the 2 nd era in wow ..the arena era
ARENA is giving the players a purpose for end game pvp... ARENA is the ultimate challenge for the best pvpiers to try their skill it gives immerse ,agony and excitment cause if u dont play well in an arena game u loose rating and your team 's rating goeas down...if u die in arena there is no respawn and u loose..
That's the main and most essential diference between wow 's arena pvp and the other mmo's pvp
In wow's battlegrounds u dont care if u die u ll respawn ...Same goes with WAR's pvp if u die u ll respawn np.. and also it wont make huge dieference if u die in a .. uhm lets say 100 vs 100 big realm vs realm battle in war cause its simply 99 ppl left.
Now , apart pvp scenarios and realm vs realm fights outdoors, and keep battles which are good ofc and fun im sure whats the pvp end game goal in war? from what i hear its just raiding other cities but still u dont have a goal for your character from what i hear..Conclusion since in wow there is an end-game pvp purpose goal---> arena and in war all u have is battlegrounds and raids in big cities which ofc wow has maybe not that good or organised like war has done there cant be any comarison at all..
2.As for the whats going on right now in wow? all the class fixes last year and now on new talents and new skills + refixing of old taklents and skills have only one target : PVP hope to enlighted u
And btw those who say that wow= pve they never played wow..or played wow at start , or played wow before burning crusade expansion or played BC but didnt made it to 70 lvl ,or went to 70 lvl tried arena ,got pawned cause they maybe lack the skill and rexlexes to survive in arenat ...
P.S. yes i would prefer an outdoor roleplaying simulation world ,with great outdoor pvp fights at keeps castles build your own castle and defend it,guild vs guild fights over provincesfor honor and glory , huge build up character progression system unlike wow and all alike almost mmos so far...
No im not a wow fan boy played wow 3.5 years from statrt almost till now cause i liked it almost all time ,now im kinda bored with it, was hoping WAR to be what i ve dreamed didnt happened , same with AOC ,putting now my hopes in DF praying Aventurine wont lie
Gameplay above all screw graficks in mmo role playing games ,gief oblivion online
Comments
this is for kal-tard.u might want to check the 4000+ mythic banned for attempting to sell gold in WAR.mythic will ban anyone that is a reported goldspammer.i seriously doubt that mythic needs them to keep the company running.they made plenty from DAoC.
And when WoTLK releases, about half of those that left are gonna be back.
That's just my opinion, I could be wrong.
Well... maybe about 1/4. The PvE lovers. Most people with common sense and a taste in PvE wouldn't touch this game with a ten foot pole. And thoose are the people going back to WoW.
-Rauge
Well I agree with the OP pretty much. I tried just about every class and couldn't even bare to get any of them past level 20. The pve was pretty dull except the PQs but there is so many times you can run PQs for loot before getting bored. The scenarios were fun for awhile but they were just so unorganized and waiting to get in one was ridiculous wait times, I tried serveral different servers to see if that would make difference and honestly it didn't. I tried rolling as shaman on the Vortex server and the wait times for scenarios was an hour. Noone does open RVR on the servers because the faction imbalance is just too lopsided. Destruction just out numbers Order too significantly. Oh and playing a greenskin just horribly reminded myself that i was playing WOW again. Took me 2 weeks (including OB) to get bored and wipe it off my pc. The ironic thing is though that AOC was way more fun but just way too buggy to play. Eventually I just had enough of that and wipe that off my pc as well. Oh well another year of disappointment yet again.
Interesting that you bring up AOC. As much as i think AOC was a flawed failure to the mmo genre i kinda agree that the time i spent in AOC was more fun and interesting than WAR and i only got one character up to 32 in AOC and i got 4 characters to 10 in war.
I am not saying AOC is better than WAR but i had more fun personally with AOC. Also AOC actually had a feel to it and an interesting story, honestly i would have quit wow for AOC if it hadn't uber failed with bugs and lies.
Hype is my nemesis. i will fight it til the day i die whether i take it down or it takes me down. So depressing, Yes?
damn i wish people would stop compairing war and wow like its a fact that the 2 games look alike, cuz they dont..
Why dont you get it ? its not the same ? if you loved wow, chances are you wont get WAR, WAR is not a PVE game its RvR at its core.
ts fine if you dont wanna play it or dont like it, but im getting sick of seeing " its not doing this and that as good as wow .." NO its doesnt AND you know why ? its not supposed to.. .
Go play some seriuos RVR with your mind on PVP, and if you dont like that well, fine go back to Arena and BG´s in WOW ..
I know this was not the topic here, but i just saw alot of people doin the comparisson in this thread and its starting to make me sick..
I will just list the two biggest problems for me as a level 24 witchhunter on Dark Crag, one of the most populated servers.
- Lag. It wasn't really a problem the first week. Only a few hiccups here and there. Now, playing in tier 2 scenarios, its horrible. Fix yur shit blizz......er....mythic.
-Animation bugs . These are SO constant that you need to play AROUND them rather then try and ignore them. I was trying to describe what they are exactly but that was too hard. Basically, the character animation, the cooldown timers, and the casting bar aren't always in sync which can be annoying as hell.
Now there are obviously more problems out there but the two listed above are really breaking the game for me. If they are not fixed in a couple of months at the latest then myself and my guild will be quitting.
See this what i don't understand about WAR the people that drool over this game just think that others don't get it that were too simple to understand the beauty and the grandness of this design.
How many times have i read "at its core its not a pve game its rvr" to many to count. I think we get it by now war fanboys. I don't go around doing quests thinkin i am fighting other people and vice versa and i don't wish i was either. People think there is something special about the RVRness of this game and that we should be impressed or something.
its just world pvp with objectives that reset after a certain amount of time. this isn't special many games have demostrated this at some level of this for some time. WoW has world pvp objectives and they have been around for a while. When you kill city booses last time i checked you got some honor and rep, the game just doesn't hold your hand and make you aware of everything you have to go and discover these things for yourself.
As for comparing wow to war based on looks honestly war more reminds me of a darker version of lotro in terms of style and feel than it does wow.
Hype is my nemesis. i will fight it til the day i die whether i take it down or it takes me down. So depressing, Yes?
That's just your opinion I'm afraid. I'm having a blast in WAR and it plays very smooth for me on average. One thing that helped is putting the OS page file on a separate solid state drive for increased read and access times. Par that with low latency ram and two other solid state drives in a Raid 0 it really does a good job to widen those typical bottlenecks for data flow within Pc's.
Normal HDD are still held back by the mechanical side. Even 10k RPM HDD can't keep up with a solid state drive read/write times. This is second generation solid state drives I'm using. They're not officially on the market yet, but I work in the industry so can get them. They've got non of the teething issues of first generation solid state drives with stuttering and they will be cheaper.
As for gold spammers I've got a war addon that's blocks and reports the gold spammer automatically called SpamMeNot.
See this what i don't understand about WAR the people that drool over this game just think that others don't get it that were too simple to understand the beauty and the grandness of this design.
How many times have i read "at its core its not a pve game its rvr" to many to count. I think we get it by now war fanboys. I don't go around doing quests thinkin i am fighting other people and vice versa and i don't wish i was either. People think there is something special about the RVRness of this game and that we should be impressed or something.
its just world pvp with objectives that reset after a certain amount of time. this isn't special many games have demostrated this at some level of this for some time. WoW has world pvp objectives and they have been around for a while. When you kill city booses last time i checked you got some honor and rep, the game just doesn't hold your hand and make you aware of everything you have to go and discover these things for yourself.
What you don't understand is people are having fun in WAR unlike you. Not everyone is the same, some like to grind the same BGs in wow but some like world pvp and rvr. Let the people play the game they like. If you don't like RvR it's your choice other people do.
The "something special" is there is world PvP and there is more than 4 BGs. WoW's PvP objectives are a joke and everything is pve or loot centric. Kill city bosses? lmao. It's a lagfest in the cities on city raids and there is really no point to them. How many city raids have you been to? Yeah that's what i figured.
Wow PvP objectives is to let players have FUN while they can at the same time have a new shiny weapon and gear.
That's the biggest motivation our society has btw: evolve your person or character (like you better yourself constantly in RL and go out shopping for new pants or game or whatever.)
What's the motivation of War. Dying for the realm pride, dying for the fatherland? No thanks.
In Wow I have choices, In War I can only do 1 thing after leveling up: die.
How satisfying.
RvR is just a gimmick. Stratego is RvR.
And I don't bash because WAR has some great ideas, I bash it because it doesn't meet the standards set by Blizzard in MANY ways (from real 3D worlds you can fly over to polished real dynamic fights with staggering differences in crowd control).
From epic dungeons, raids and boss encounters to new standards to be set out in the new WotLK open world PvP:
Just have a look again at thes videos: THAT is the new industry standard in speed and execution of fights:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMAKODTrQ80 ( mostly PvP )
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ex02XenQME0 (first half land siege vehicals)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5K2EDD6r5N8 (knocking down walls)
Wow PvP objectives is to let players have FUN while they can at the same time have a new shiny weapon and gear.
That's the biggest motivation our society has btw: evolve your person or character (like you better yourself constantly in RL and go out shopping for a new pance or game or whatever.)
What's the motivation of War. Dying for the realm pride, dying for the fatherland? No thanks.
In Wow I have choices, In War I can only do I thing after leveling up: die.
How satisfying.
RvR is just a gimmick. Stratego is RvR.
At max level there are things to do besides die. There are Dungeons to Raid, and stuff you can unlock when taking over Cities. Go adventuring to see hidden stuff unlock stuff in the ToK. WoW's pvp sucks, why anyone would want to sit in an battleground over and over again is beyond me. In WOTLK you can only control keeps for 4 hours then it switches what a Joke, In WAR you can conrtol a keep as long as you keep the enemy at bay. But I guess thats my opinion If you like the game thats cool by me. I just got tired of that game with the quickness.
No, it doesn't mean it's crap, but it IS less variety. I don't see how anyone can argue it's not. If it were as you said, only 2 different helms that's NO variety and not what I'm saying. I'm saying there's less variety.
And the reason there isn't more variety at level 40 in WoW is because the lvl 40 gear has not changed much since the game went live almost 4 years ago. The only started adding to some of these stats with BC. Now, I figure you're going to counter with, well WoW has had 4 years to add all these new stats. Yes, they have. AND WAR HAS BEEN ABLE TO SEE WHAT THEY DID AND INCORPORATE INTO THEIR GAME AS WELL. No one lives in a bubble. All the developers get the benefit of seeing what the other developers have done and have a chance to incorporate into their own game. That's all I'm saying. I've seen it now with WoW and I like it. Anyone who doesn't incorporate this or something equally as good feels like a step back rather than a step forward.
And even at lvl 29 in WoW you'll see more variety than at level 17 in War which is pretty close to the same level respectively.
Take a look at my crappy geared lvl 29 in WoW (And you won't find a much more crappily geared toon in the game). You'll see + to health (an enchant even...hmm.....). + to Nature spell damage. + to Armor (Profession....hmmmm....). + to damage and healing.
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Nathrezim&n=Happypappy
These types of things make the itemization in WoW better than in War. It's not crap in War, but it's not as good as WoW and in my opinion it should be at least as good if not better for a game that's released 4 years later.
So, you're wanting extra + to different stats because of variety? My bank in WAR is overflowing with gear - two pieces of which are part of two separate sets (the sets you were talking about in this thread, that you asked if they were hard to get. The answer is no, they're not.) I have variety coming out of my ears. I choose to wear the things I wear because they give me + to Toughness, + to Strength and + to Weapon Skill.
In turn, that lets me ignore incoming dps (toughness, -29.6 dps), it lets me ignore armor and parry better (+ weapon skill) and it lets me hit harder both with abilities and with auto-attack. Now, I could set up my system like WoW and instead of saying + weapon skill, I could say, + To Hit + to Parry + [insert arbitrary stat here]. But unlike WoW, the game really isn't gear based. It is more realm-based. So, WAR doesn't need 100 different sets from 1-40. They don't need to cover parry, and weapon skill and strength and healing. They have a few base stats for that.
But even those people that would like to worry about those things (as you seem to). They have things called Tactics. Now, you get 4 career tactics, 2 renown tactics and 1 tome tactic. Now, guess what these things do? +5% parry. +5% renown gain when you kill dwarf players. +10% Ballistic Skill. etc. etc. - there's tons of them. You can even switch out tactic sets mid-battle. So, now you have your armor which lumps all these arbitrary stats into one stat that you can adjust by finding one piece of armor, not running around, finding 30 different pieces to get your stats exactly right, then enchanting it to get what you couldn't seem to find. So, you get your armor, then you get your tactics. Now you get your +% to nearly whatever you want (since you seem to need the variety).
This is exactly what gets to me. The breed of gamers that WoW has spawned. Greedy, item-mongering elitists that can't let others enjoy their game of choice. Think about it - why make resilience, haste, and all the other stats that they made? To make more items. Why do they need to make more items? To fill in the lulls of crap that the rest of the game has become. In WoW, you're either going after an item of some sort (which is 90% of the time) or you're standing around a city, letting people oogle you (10%).
And as if that wasn't enough, you have a glorified item mall in the form of a TCG. <shakes head> One of my guildmates in WAR today said that he was asking some of his WoW friends to come to WAR. All I could do was cringe and pray that they would say no.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
/played: EQ, EQ II, DAoC, WoW, LoTRO, AoC, CoH/CoV, WAR, Aion, Tera, Wildstar and many others that don't merit listing
/playing: Clash of Clans, Hearthstone
Wow PvP objectives is to let players have FUN while they can at the same time have a new shiny weapon and gear.
That's the biggest motivation our society has btw: evolve your person or character (like you better yourself constantly in RL and go out shopping for new pants or game or whatever.)
What's the motivation of War. Dying for the realm pride, dying for the fatherland? No thanks.
In Wow I have choices, In War I can only do 1 thing after leveling up: die.
How satisfying.
RvR is just a gimmick. Stratego is RvR.
And I don't bash because WAR has some great ideas, I bash it because it doesn't meet the standards set by Blizzard in MANY ways (from real 3D worlds you can fly over to polished real dynamic fights with staggering differences in crowd control).
From epic dungeons, raids and boss encounters to new standards to be set out in the new WotLK open world PvP:
It wil still be the same item centric loot and scoot game. RvR is fun. Just cos you don't find it fun just means that you don't, many people do so don't try to impose your expectations on others.
Biggest motivation in society? Fatherland? Now your stretching Vicksburg/Memoir/Teamfortress/Bodypass.
I play WAR cos its fun to me and many others. Capturing points and advancing world RvR is interesting, and much better than a tired old 4 BGs and arenas. If you can prove to me that Lake Wintergrasp has a larger aspect to it other than just an item-grind and more PvE, maybe that will help.
RvR is a gimmick to you because you are blinded by hate. It was present in DAOC and it worked great.
A 3D world where there is no endgame-world pvp objectives is a dead world to PvPers.
PS: Stratego was a great game
But guess what, it's not an MMO nub.
What you don't understand is people are having fun in WAR unlike you. Not everyone is the same, some like to grind the same BGs in wow but some like world pvp and rvr. Let the people play the game they like. If you don't like RvR it's your choice other people do.
The "something special" is there is world PvP and there is more than 4 BGs. WoW's PvP objectives are a joke and everything is pve or loot centric. Kill city bosses? lmao. It's a lagfest in the cities on city raids and there is really no point to them. How many city raids have you been to? Yeah that's what i figured.
So i bring up valid points and what ..... your ears and eyes actually close. Thats the kinda fanboyism that usually leads to ritual murder to appease there non existent gods.
The sad things is i have had fun doing all the world pvp i mentioned and you seem to think it doesn't even exist (something the war community likes to say), things like halaa and even raiding origimar to kill thrall have brought me loads of fun and i see lots of peopleing saying FOR THE ALLIANCE when we win if thats not REALM pride i don't know what it is. Do i get any gear from it NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. do i have fun hell ya and this is on a pvp server never mind what it might be like on an rp-pvp server.
In fact in wow you could say we need less incinative to world pvp then in war which gives you all sorts of objectives and GEAR sets. I have read numerous reviews saying that world pvp or open rvr is pretty abandoned at low tiers
So please before you post understand that the closed minded post that is pissing you off might just be your own.
Hype is my nemesis. i will fight it til the day i die whether i take it down or it takes me down. So depressing, Yes?
Wow PvP objectives is to let players have FUN while they can at the same time have a new shiny weapon and gear.
That's the biggest motivation our society has btw: evolve your person or character (like you better yourself constantly in RL and go out shopping for new pants or game or whatever.)
What's the motivation of War. Dying for the realm pride, dying for the fatherland? No thanks.
In Wow I have choices, In War I can only do 1 thing after leveling up: die.
How satisfying.
RvR is just a gimmick. Stratego is RvR.
And I don't bash because WAR has some great ideas, I bash it because it doesn't meet the standards set by Blizzard in MANY ways (from real 3D worlds you can fly over to polished real dynamic fights with staggering differences in crowd control).
From epic dungeons, raids and boss encounters to new standards to be set out in the new WotLK open world PvP:
Just have a look again at thes videos: THAT is the new industry standard in speed and execution of fights:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMAKODTrQ80 ( mostly PvP )
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ex02XenQME0 (first half land siege vehicals)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5K2EDD6r5N8 (knocking down walls)
I think it will be just like the rest of WOW's PVP thats is it might be fun the first few times but it looks like it will be just as boring and repetative as the rest of wows pvp
Personally i havent played my Grand Marshal sence she hit it and if i was going to pvp again i would go back to DaOC before i play either War or WoTLK
Probably wrong since it took them launching in 3 countries to achieve that amount of people were Blizzard had half that amount from america alone..actually more then half, but either way other games out there took a hit way more then wow did. I took a break from WoW to try out WAR, i'll be back for WoTLK though
"The great thing about human language is that it prevents us from sticking to the matter at hand."
- Lewis Thomas
I think it will be just like the rest of WOW's PVP thats is it might be fun the first few times but it looks like it will be just as boring and repetative as the rest of wows pvp
Personally i havent played my Grand Marshal sence she hit it and if i was going to pvp again i would go back to DaOC before i play either War or WoTLK
Wow....Grand Marshall rank was before Burning Crusade. So you're saying you haven't PvP'd at all since BC came out?
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club
Just so you know....a lot of those people don't intend to play after the first free month, so frankly, this discussion is a bit pointless until WAR has been out long enough for people to have to start PAYING the monthly sub to play it.
I played it because I wanted to get my money's worth out of the 50 bucks it cost me to try it. But I'm not continuing on after month one either, and I'm by FAR not the only one.
Some people will love it and stay....others will not. There will be no ACCURATE numbers assessments for quite some time.
You're making the assumption that those playing WAR right NOW...will not be playing WotLK. And guess what....SOME people will play BOTH games, as they don't see a need to just pick ONE. For godssake the subs are only 15 bucks a month, there's no reason most people can't play two games if they really LIKE them. I subscribe to SEVERAL at a time.
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club
I played DAoC for 6 yrs.i tried wow got bored after 2 days.imo wow was made for people that enjoy pve.the pvp in DAoC still is the best imo.the keep takes are fun and the pvp dungeons are great.i also tried conan and it was as boring as wow.then again i love pvp and so far with WAR its fast paced and fun in the scenarios.
No, it doesn't mean it's crap, but it IS less variety. I don't see how anyone can argue it's not. If it were as you said, only 2 different helms that's NO variety and not what I'm saying. I'm saying there's less variety.
And the reason there isn't more variety at level 40 in WoW is because the lvl 40 gear has not changed much since the game went live almost 4 years ago. The only started adding to some of these stats with BC. Now, I figure you're going to counter with, well WoW has had 4 years to add all these new stats. Yes, they have. AND WAR HAS BEEN ABLE TO SEE WHAT THEY DID AND INCORPORATE INTO THEIR GAME AS WELL. No one lives in a bubble. All the developers get the benefit of seeing what the other developers have done and have a chance to incorporate into their own game. That's all I'm saying. I've seen it now with WoW and I like it. Anyone who doesn't incorporate this or something equally as good feels like a step back rather than a step forward.
And even at lvl 29 in WoW you'll see more variety than at level 17 in War which is pretty close to the same level respectively.
Take a look at my crappy geared lvl 29 in WoW (And you won't find a much more crappily geared toon in the game). You'll see + to health (an enchant even...hmm.....). + to Nature spell damage. + to Armor (Profession....hmmmm....). + to damage and healing.
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Nathrezim&n=Happypappy
These types of things make the itemization in WoW better than in War. It's not crap in War, but it's not as good as WoW and in my opinion it should be at least as good if not better for a game that's released 4 years later.
So, you're wanting extra + to different stats because of variety? My bank in WAR is overflowing with gear - two pieces of which are part of two separate sets (the sets you were talking about in this thread, that you asked if they were hard to get. The answer is no, they're not.) I have variety coming out of my ears. I choose to wear the things I wear because they give me + to Toughness, + to Strength and + to Weapon Skill.
In turn, that lets me ignore incoming dps (toughness, -29.6 dps), it lets me ignore armor and parry better (+ weapon skill) and it lets me hit harder both with abilities and with auto-attack. Now, I could set up my system like WoW and instead of saying + weapon skill, I could say, + To Hit + to Parry + [insert arbitrary stat here]. But unlike WoW, the game really isn't gear based. It is more realm-based. So, WAR doesn't need 100 different sets from 1-40. They don't need to cover parry, and weapon skill and strength and healing. They have a few base stats for that.
But even those people that would like to worry about those things (as you seem to). They have things called Tactics. Now, you get 4 career tactics, 2 renown tactics and 1 tome tactic. Now, guess what these things do? +5% parry. +5% renown gain when you kill dwarf players. +10% Ballistic Skill. etc. etc. - there's tons of them. You can even switch out tactic sets mid-battle. So, now you have your armor which lumps all these arbitrary stats into one stat that you can adjust by finding one piece of armor, not running around, finding 30 different pieces to get your stats exactly right, then enchanting it to get what you couldn't seem to find. So, you get your armor, then you get your tactics. Now you get your +% to nearly whatever you want (since you seem to need the variety).
This is exactly what gets to me. The breed of gamers that WoW has spawned. Greedy, item-mongering elitists that can't let others enjoy their game of choice. Think about it - why make resilience, haste, and all the other stats that they made? To make more items. Why do they need to make more items? To fill in the lulls of crap that the rest of the game has become. In WoW, you're either going after an item of some sort (which is 90% of the time) or you're standing around a city, letting people oogle you (10%).
And as if that wasn't enough, you have a glorified item mall in the form of a TCG. <shakes head> One of my guildmates in WAR today said that he was asking some of his WoW friends to come to WAR. All I could do was cringe and pray that they would say no.
See this is what gets to me, you sit there and try to claim WoW has made every player an Elitist, greedy person and your full of crap, EVERY GAME HAS THOSE TYPE OF PEOPLE even in WAR i am seeing it, and it isnt very many in either game, and nobody here is saying you can't enjoy your game of choice, but you sure as hell have to come to the WoW forums and tell people they can't enjoy WoW, try not being a hypocrite, nobody forced you to come here, somebody made a post about not likeing WAR, guess what don't come here trying to change their mind they only want to play their game of choice!
Don't act stupid about the TCG because i gaurentee this much, WAR will have one too, they already did stuff like that if you bought certain magazines you got a special item, if you pre-order C&C Red Alert 3 you get a special item, what are you gonna do quit when you see them give game items for buying their new table top mini's? it'll happen just wait.
And in WoW i enjoyed the crafting, dungeon crawling, occasional PVP, exploring, RPing, Holiday stuff they put in, etc etc. having all that stuff is what makes an mmo fun i have never played WoW for the gear, yes some are like that but why are they like that? because the gear gets them through to see the next area of content, to be able to battle the bosses. Tell me who is being Elitist when you are having an issue with your friend inviting people to come and play with him, try not being hypocrite once again.
"The great thing about human language is that it prevents us from sticking to the matter at hand."
- Lewis Thomas
See this is what gets to me, you sit there and try to claim WoW has made every player an Elitist, greedy person and your full of crap, EVERY GAME HAS THOSE TYPE OF PEOPLE even in WAR i am seeing it, and it isnt very many in either game, and nobody here is saying you can't enjoy your game of choice, but you sure as hell have to come to the WoW forums and tell people they can't enjoy WoW, try not being a hypocrite, nobody forced you to come here, somebody made a post about not likeing WAR, guess what don't come here trying to change their mind they only want to play their game of choice!
Don't act stupid about the TCG because i gaurentee this much, WAR will have one too, they already did stuff like that if you bought certain magazines you got a special item, if you pre-order C&C Red Alert 3 you get a special item, what are you gonna do quit when you see them give game items for buying their new table top mini's? it'll happen just wait.
And in WoW i enjoyed the crafting, dungeon crawling, occasional PVP, exploring, RPing, Holiday stuff they put in, etc etc. having all that stuff is what makes an mmo fun i have never played WoW for the gear, yes some are like that but why are they like that? because the gear gets them through to see the next area of content, to be able to battle the bosses. Tell me who is being Elitist when you are having an issue with your friend inviting people to come and play with him, try not being hypocrite once again.
If I could give you positive rep for that....I would.
The hypocrisy level of some posters on this site is absolutely staggering. "Quit doggin' my new toy!! 'Cause YOUR toy sux! Waaaaa!." QQ more Fanboi WAR. It's getting very OLD. And I, for one, have tried posting my positive views on Warhammer (I do have a few), as well as my negative impressions, but for the MOST part, the WAR fans tend to predominantly be WoWbashers, even though a good LOT of them got at least a couple years enjoyment out of the game themselves, now they want to just go on and on and on about how "it sux."
A lot of WAR posters are a bit like lemmings. It's "kewl" to hate WoW. It's "kewler" to hate it and spew crap about WHY you hate it all over the forums. It's NOT "kewl" to admit that you enjoyed it....EVER. Because then you will be viewed as one of the "stupid elitists" that played WoW at one time. NOT GOOD.
Pffft.
I enjoy all the things that you posted above that YOU enjoy. Sadly, about ALL of that is missing from Warhammer. End conclusion: Warhammer is just not MY kind of game. I couldn't give two sh**s and a f**k what anyone else wants to play. I hope they STAY with Warhammer, if they're bi***ing about WoW, because it's less of that whiney crap going on when I'm playing. WIN/WIN.
And yes, EVERY game has it's "greedy elitists." It's hilarious that some of the WAR fans think they're going to like EVERYONE they play with. HAHAHA...give it a few months.
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club
1Concerning the waters it has EVERYTHING TO DO with the world's realism lvls.
2.all sensible ppl know that the best pvp system is the wow's arenas ..unless u value opinions of inmature kids that like to gang or attack from safe range in mass battles.. Skilled ppl want to fight fair fights where you are 5 ppl vs 5 ppl.. 3 ppl vs 3 ppl 2 ppl vs 2 ppl .. Nothing fun about 8 ppl getting zerged by 40 ppl as im sure its hapopening hundrends of times in almost all servers in various times of day
Real realm vs realm needs much better combat system also than the auto attacks noobish system of wow+war and clickie clickie..u want decent and fair massive battles ? prey aventurine will accomplish DF as they promished to.. Rest are just to fool each other in the forums...
2.) I nearly pee'd my pants when I red this. WoW Arenas are NOT the best PvP system. That is a JOKE. Sure.. for a game based on PvE... It has O.K. PvP. But not good. Nowhere near WARs. You may fight fair.. but PvP in WoW is lack luster. It just doesn't have that... (no pun indeeded) "Wow!" factor that War's does. Meh.. this may have changed since I last played... but from my experience WoW's PvP was a constent grind/gankfest. BG's were a good idea... but scenarios in WAR are SOOOO much better.
-Rauge
i can say 2 things
1. Trying to compare wow's pvp and war's pvp is impossible to say war has better pvp.. i can explain that.
Wow started as PVE game after 2 years all people were farming battlegrounds gathering as much possible honor ponts to raise in ranking and to become if possible grand marshal..
That was the 1st era.. after expansion of burning crusade for 1st time the arena system was implemented to the game giving the ultimate chalenge for pvpiers to try become with their friends the number 1 team in all the servers.. ARENA is giving the players a purpose .. The logic now in wow is to play battlegrounds , farm honor points , use them to buy some pvp gear ( bracers, boots, rings, waist,necklace) ..and along wiht the arena points and rating u get u can take slowly chest , legs,shoulders ,helmet,gauntlets,weapons..Most ppl wont manage to take them all cause it requires skills,and teamwork and communication in order to get high rating and get weapons or shoulders or helmet ..thats the 2 nd era in wow ..the arena era
ARENA is giving the players a purpose for end game pvp... ARENA is the ultimate challenge for the best pvpiers to try their skill it gives immerse ,agony and excitment cause if u dont play well in an arena game u loose rating and your team 's rating goeas down...if u die in arena there is no respawn and u loose..
That's the main and most essential diference between wow 's arena pvp and the other mmo's pvp
In wow's battlegrounds u dont care if u die u ll respawn ...Same goes with WAR's pvp if u die u ll respawn np.. and also it wont make huge dieference if u die in a .. uhm lets say 100 vs 100 big realm vs realm battle in war cause its simply 99 ppl left.
Now , apart pvp scenarios and realm vs realm fights outdoors, and keep battles which are good ofc and fun im sure whats the pvp end game goal in war? from what i hear its just raiding other cities but still u dont have a goal for your character from what i hear..Conclusion since in wow there is an end-game pvp purpose goal---> arena and in war all u have is battlegrounds and raids in big cities which ofc wow has maybe not that good or organised like war has done there cant be any comarison at all..
2.As for the whats going on right now in wow? all the class fixes last year and now on new talents and new skills + refixing of old taklents and skills have only one target : PVP hope to enlighted u
And btw those who say that wow= pve they never played wow..or played wow at start , or played wow before burning crusade expansion or played BC but didnt made it to 70 lvl ,or went to 70 lvl tried arena ,got pawned cause they maybe lack the skill and rexlexes to survive in arenat ...
P.S. yes i would prefer an outdoor roleplaying simulation world ,with great outdoor pvp fights at keeps castles build your own castle and defend it,guild vs guild fights over provincesfor honor and glory , huge build up character progression system unlike wow and all alike almost mmos so far...
No im not a wow fan boy played wow 3.5 years from statrt almost till now cause i liked it almost all time ,now im kinda bored with it, was hoping WAR to be what i ve dreamed didnt happened , same with AOC ,putting now my hopes in DF praying Aventurine wont lie
Gameplay above all screw graficks in mmo role playing games ,gief oblivion online